Caelrie Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 That's why a lot of people hate it. The attitude of people who just want to run in and get their reward without any concern for teamwork is what causes griefing and harassment and causes some people to never want to group again. Just because one ha limited time doesn't entitle one to anything. You can't actually GET the reward without teamwork, so that seems like a pretty senseless thing to worry about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 So my point still stands even with giving away a free diabo 3 and mob beta they still lost 100k subs and that says it all (: So whats your point? 1% of people left the game that is 7 years old? So what about +15% that left ToR? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ditched Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 FFS. Cross server LFG IS FINE. There are plenty of other things you could be complaining about. This is NOT one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaphik Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 ?? Just because you get to the dungeon fast doesn't make it instant gratification............easy as heck instances with epic loot would do that. I find it interesting that people have so much time that they can wait an hour in fleet to find other players and then travel etc. making it unbearable to even do one FP a day. Teamwork is still required, that is actually dungeon dependant and harassment and griefing can be found in any dungeon or raid. With guilds and pugs and without any LFG tool. The attitude of "I have little time so I need to get my reward" is what causes the problem. Maybe not in you but in many players. How many groups have you been in where DPS is rushing the tank along, or tanks pulling when the healer isn't ready, etc.? That's the attitude I'm talking about. I find it interesting that people don't make friends in these online games, then schedule times to run group content. Not just raids, but regular instances or even leveling up together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaphik Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 You can't actually GET the reward without teamwork, so that seems like a pretty senseless thing to worry about. So you've never, ever been in a group that didn't complete the instance because of infighing or selfish play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harpuax Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 ?? I find it interesting that people have so much time that they can wait an hour in fleet to find other players and then travel etc. The travel thing is funny. That is a non issue since EVERY flashpoint starts at the fleet or on Ilum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ostmensch Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 FFS. Cross server LFG IS FINE. There are plenty of other things you could be complaining about. This is NOT one of them. Its a modern MMORPG witchhunt, features that "destroy" the community. Every game and community instantly becomes bad with LFG and damage meter........and that is a fact..........or not...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mothear Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 So every wow player can in fact get diablo 3 free if they wanted if they stayed subbed. Unfortunately not all countries get this option because of contract law issues so technically she is correct, however accusing you of lying is rather inappropriate I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lorelthesecond Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I'm trying to find the source. Was an interview. You better find that source. You dont want to get court out lying do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seuria Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 That's why a lot of people hate it. The attitude of people who just want to run in and get their reward without any concern for teamwork is what causes griefing and harassment and causes some people to never want to group again. Just because one ha limited time doesn't entitle one to anything. The problem with this sort of reasoning is that, historically, LFG tools have brought more people into dungeons then they have chased away. The best data we have is from WoW, and MMO-C points out that 34% of the active lvl 85 population has completed Dragon Soul on LFR while only 18% of the active population completed regular Firelands throughout the entire tier's life as current content. Blizzard has stated over and over that LFG has brought far, far more people into instances then anything else they've tried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ostmensch Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 The attitude of "I have little time so I need to get my reward" is what causes the problem. Maybe not in you but in many players. How many groups have you been in where DPS is rushing the tank along, or tanks pulling when the healer isn't ready, etc.? That's the attitude I'm talking about. I find it interesting that people don't make friends in these online games, then schedule times to run group content. Not just raids, but regular instances or even leveling up together. Getting into a dungeon is not a reward.......and never has been. I want to get a group quickly, I dont want to rush through the dungeon and get epixx. Big difference. And people have lives, friends can be offline or they work shifts or whatever.........you cannot except people to always have friends ready for a dungeon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Depredator Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I don't get this hatred towards LFG tools. Just make a tool where you can add people as friends independed on which server they play and everytime you meet someone nice BAM you can do another instance with him later. Or just make a carbon copy of wows system, I rarely encounter bad people there. Classic WoW was full of brats and it was annoying as hell being the only one at the summoning stone and it taking 1 hour for everyone to get to the instance. And then there was a jerk ninja looting and someone had to go to the city to find a new player...... ......stuff like this will be gone in futures mmos with multiple servers, I have limited time and do not want to waste it with boring waiting. On my part, it's not so much a hatred as it is a moderate aversion. I know full well that when they implement the LFD I will use it until I'm sick of it. If BW were able to implement a tool that incorporates the much maligned community aspect of the game, I probably wouldn't protest. There has to be a way to establish a "favorites" list or something of that nature. Something that gives priority to individuals that you've enjoyed running with from other servers. This would enable cross-server relationships to be established. While I'm flexible on certain aspects of the approach, I'm very much opposed to a WoW style LFD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mcstuffnstuff Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 If you let people cross server join groups they will ninja 9/10 times as lets face it... your not on their server when are they going to see you again why should they care. Currently we have no vote kick feature either so if your group leader turns out to be a dick your boned. Basically it kills the zones look at wow and I can level a tank from 15-85 without ever leaving ogri and you know what i'll never even have to run to the start of dungeons people don't even know how to get into mara but they still run it like 25+ times. Wow I can think of so many reasons why I hate a cross server lfg tool Please if you don't like waiting heres the things your gonna actually have to socalize abit instead of sitting around hoping you could just be pushing a button to join a group then join a group never say anything and leave I know madness right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaphik Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 The problem with this sort of reasoning is that, historically, LFG tools have brought more people into dungeons then they have chased away. The best data we have is from WoW, and MMO-C points out that 34% of the active lvl 85 population has completed Dragon Soul on LFR while only 18% of the active population completed regular Firelands throughout the entire tier's life as current content. Blizzard has stated over and over that LFG has brought far, far more people into instances then anything else they've tried. That's a bit faulty in your conclusion. The LFR raid is tuned down compared to the regular version, which is why so many people have completed it. Guilds were using it as a training, or to get some easy gear for themselves before doing the "real" version, instead of going to the PTR to practice. The LFR raid is basically an easy mode, and there would probably have been close to the same success rate or even higher if it were not restricted to 25 man pugs, but available to any raid group either 10 or 25 man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vulgarr Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 ?? Just because you get to the dungeon fast doesn't make it instant gratification............easy as heck instances with epic loot would do that. I find it interesting that people have so much time that they can wait an hour in fleet to find other players and then travel etc. making it unbearable to even do one FP a day. Teamwork is still required, that is actually dungeon dependant and harassment and griefing can be found in any dungeon or raid. With guilds and pugs and without any LFG tool.people that came from wow forget the importance /ignore use to have before the LFG system. if someone was griefing you all you had to do is say in trade who it was and what they were doing and 100 people on the server would /ignore them because they wouldnt want a griefer in their group. this would blackball the player and he would have limited people that would group with him or he would have to switch servers. the power of this "community" thing you kids dont remember having that we relied on in the old everquest days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kourage Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Nobody's going to force you to use it. You need to spend less time worrying about how someone else plays a game. No, you would be forced to use it. It turns the whole server into lazy drones who will complain about the people they got grouped with, but never stop using the stupid thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dvsxxx Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I'm pro cross server lfg and would like to think im quite pleasant lol. Since my general play hours with my wife and i are from 12am to 4am and have seen the pop in my area be a massive 2 me and her this would pretty much make it impossible to ever get a group lol. Though amusing at times to have a whole zone to ourselves it isn't very conducive to finding groups and such lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JumperPenn Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Unfortunately this will probably lead to griefing where people will vote others down 'for the lulz' so to speak. It can be mitigated by requiring your 'vote' to be a sum of all the other party member's ratings so if most rated you okay or good and one rates you poor their rating has less power, maybe none if most rate you 8-10 and one rates you 0. A rating history can have your vote become weaker the more you spam perfect 10 and horrible 0's even keeping you from voting for a time. Any system where people have 'power' over others is open to being abused. The point is to keep it from barring people from having fun. IE requiring that you maintain a perfect rating to join a group would be a worthless metric but plenty will think they only want 'perfect' rated players nevermind that rating is just an opinion. The rating I mentioned was more a way to have people have some small measure to account for in the instance where they can roam servers being a ****** to other people in the group. So if you went around exploiting the LFG tool to be a ****** people could have some warning. Random groups would minimize everyone rating people up or down for the lulz. It is either have something like that or have people be ***** whenever they want because they can and can just group with others from different servers when they decide to be 'good'. Which opens the idea of not having cross server LFG tools to stop that kind of behavior. I'd rather the option to group with others from other servers and never use it, limit myself to my server, over not having that option and not being able to find people on my server. Yeah there is a risk I'll get some people who are ***** but I'd take the risk over not playing the game at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaphik Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Getting into a dungeon is not a reward.......and never has been. I want to get a group quickly, I dont want to rush through the dungeon and get epixx. Big difference. And people have lives, friends can be offline or they work shifts or whatever.........you cannot except people to always have friends ready for a dungeon. A lot of people with lives, as you say, also do plenty of scheduled activities such as softball leagues, tabletop rpg sessions, meetings, whatever. They schedule their entertainment around their other activities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ostmensch Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 The travel thing is funny. That is a non issue since EVERY flashpoint starts at the fleet or on Ilum. cherry picking arguments is bad rhetoric, I was generally speaking and do not have much expierence with grouping in SWTOR. Play republic on a dead server in 3 months and try to find a group for a lowbie instance.............good........luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kourage Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 (edited) This is all I need http://web.archive.org/web/20091107221055/http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/burningcrusade/townhall/lookingforgroup.html This is what a LFG tool is. What some people here think a LFG tool is is actually a Dungeon Finder. BioWare never said they would auto group you. They are looking to introduce a LFG tool similar to this. We have 3 people from guild and all we need is a healer. We open up the LFG tool and locate a list of DPS looking for group for the same thing using the filters. We don't have to search by planet or read all their comments, we use the filters. We can talk to them to make sure they speak English before we invite him. We can even ask him if he has experience. These dungeon finder auto grouping tools are only going to lead to whining about how long the queue is because there's no tanks or healers. Then you'll want incentives for the tank or healer. Then tanks or healers won't run it without the tool because they want the incentive item. Then you guys will get mad you're getting people with the wrong gear, or just really bad gear. BioWare will have to start doing an item level check, but wrong gear won't be checked. You'll get mad people are kicking you out after you waited 45 minutes to get in, so they'll have to alter the system to prevent kicking. you'll get mad at that too after a few people afk on you. Just say no to dungeon finders. Say yes to LFG tools. Edited February 11, 2012 by Kourage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romiz Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 (edited) I am disappointed to see the cross realm LFG tool being talked about as a future addition to the game. I was really hoping to keep that out of TOR just because of it's ability to destroy community in a game. I would be all for LFG server wide but cross realm is a no go for me. I take it you DID NOT take the time to read the 10 answers of the week. That was answered in them. Edited February 11, 2012 by Romiz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Umbral Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 When they implement the cross-server LFG tool, myself, and 8 guild members that have quit playing because of the pain it is finding groups will be re-subscribing. Not having one in the game at release was the single biggest mistake Bioware made with SWTOR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ostmensch Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 A lot of people with lives, as you say, also do plenty of scheduled activities such as softball leagues, tabletop rpg sessions, meetings, whatever. They schedule their entertainment around their other activities. I cannot schedule when I find a group, this is gambling with my time. And then I cannot garuantee that the group wont fall apart after 3 minutes into the instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaphik Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I cannot schedule when I find a group, this is gambling with my time. And then I cannot garuantee that the group wont fall apart after 3 minutes into the instance. Well, that's what a friends list or a guild is for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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