The weird people you meet in Group Finder.

[Kingsbount]

In my book that means you're not doing your job. The way I see it healers should keep everyone alive while doing maximum DPS, otherwise they just stand there and fiddle their thumbs. Only in NiM operation there are phases in fights where every global is important and you might be unable to DPS, in SM, HM and certainly in all FP's you should practise keeping you dots uptime and such while healing and sustaining resources for high damage spikes.

 

Keyphrase is - "The way i see it".

The only healer job is keep everyone alive. DPS or not to DPS is a personal decision (and a matter of resourses).

[Fazaani]

I had the pleasure of meeting a wierd healer few nights back.

 

Was doing som achi/datacrondeco hunt and qued for hm fb:s to get 10uc daily. Soon got a gf pop Cademimu and was like "weeeelll why not" i join in and other dps and tank was around 30k, heal was about 36k and i over 41k.

 

Everything was goin swell, didnt need to sweat for anything and every one did their part. I was amused as allways since ppl like to pull/push/bug with the mobs and often end up losing time than saving any. Near first shortcut i said smth like "you don't need to push/pull them all since killing is faster " (with the smiley)

 

tank didn't say anything and healer was either havin a bad day or being sarcastic... saying smth like "damage target faster pls", i asked that what does he mean since everything was goin fine. He just repeated the same...

 

We got to the first boss and it and the bot was dead before the first "boxing" phase is over.

 

I was feeling like this troll is ruining my mojo/run and again i ask can the heal pls say again what he ment since i wasn't sure was he trolling or not... Again he says were not doing enough damage with bad english.

 

For the first time i felt how "pug'ing since the start"nerves just parted me and i politely told: "i'm sorry if you feel the damage output is not enough for this fp, i ofc can leave and you can find a better dps. Thanks for the run guys and bb." left the fp and ignored the bugger.

 

Also got like 0.5 reallife darkside points since it felt good! (and rest of my night was more usefull on since got my correlia 100% )

[JouerTue]

 

TL;DR get used to healing on the move, because people expect it and you should be able to handle it.

 

while this might be even true, i wouln't and i don't pull packs that could kill me..ok if you do it and you know that with your cds you will survive the fight, but i don0t think this is the case

 

on the other side, at 55 i saw long ago i can heal more than stupid and undergeared so i couldn't care less about what the other folks do and if we wipe during a fp i'll exit the instance if i don't see kicks flying

[Kymerous]

In my book that means you're not doing your job. The way I see it healers should keep everyone alive while doing maximum DPS, otherwise they just stand there and fiddle their thumbs. Only in NiM operation there are phases in fights where every global is important and you might be unable to DPS, in SM, HM and certainly in all FP's you should practise keeping you dots uptime and such while healing and sustaining resources for high damage spikes.

 

Way I see it is I am a healer...not your babysitter, nor your personal regen device.

[Cox_The_Beast]

Had an interesting run of CZ Core Meltdown (TFP) today. Oh, the marvelous 12x Exp Boost from Class Missions! I was on my Sorc DPS, around 35k HPs, and the team was made of an Assassin Tank at 21k, Sorc Healer 19k, Mara 20k. All in 96-100 rating gear, which unless I'm mistaken is lvl 39-41.

 

We get to the first mob and burn them down in moments - gotta love Lightning spec there.

This proceeds for the whole FP, with the tank pulling - I'm polite, so I let him do it - and mobs dying fast and smooth. Bosses are another matter, however.

 

The Desert one I am constantly "tanking" - not a problem, mind you, I can get quite a beating in a Tactical - but the tank keeps timing taunts so the boss goes away from the green shining thing he's supposed to destroy... One of them dies, the Sorc Healer throws a battle rez and from that moment on I manage to get the boss where needed when needed. I did say what to do before the fight, just in case, though, so no excuse for not knowing. We down him and roll on the willpower focus that dropped. I win it because everyone greeds. Seeing at how the Healer has more need than me for it, I trade it to her.

 

The second boss is more and less the same, me being favored "tank", positioning hte boss properly... And hte tank taunting it away from the exploding fungus. We down the boss without using them, which takes ages seeing at how basically I'm almost solo DPSing it down. We roll on the willpower shield that drops and I win that too because everyone greeds... Now I'm a bit annoyed, but I trade it to the tank regardless. He's quite surprised the drop is better than what he has. 96 rating shield? Not hard to find better at 55, you know.

 

Now the final boss was interesting. As we arrived to it, I entered the cutscene thing and asked to wait to pull, bio break and such. When I am back, they not only pulled, but are attacking the cores at random, one each! I do my best to even things out, and call them to the first core to the left, marking it to make it easier. They don't mind, and destroy two of them. 4 adds spawn and jump at me, while I'm almost done with that core. I switch target to them to down them, but as I do so they destroy the other two cores in the middle of the arena, so another 4 adds come and get to me. After that, they just stand there, not attacking the 4 cores on the balconies. And not even helping me, I would have understood if they ignored them in favor of the adds... But they didn't.

I destroy the adds and focus one of hte cores on the balcony. The others come close and look. No attacks, no nothing. I know there's some LoS issues with those 4 cores, but... They just remained there, standing.

Basically, the whole fight I spent the time DPSing things down and selfhealing, since for some reason they weren't even able ot dodge the AoE lightning things and needed the Sorc Healer's support 100% of time.

As the Vigilant came down, I did what I do best: throw lightnings at it. Every time hte tank taunts off me, I'm free to throw a heal on myself, otherwise hte boss is on me 100% of time.

 

The fight took much longer than I'm used to, and while I don't mind it in itself - never died, no risks of wipes and the like - I spent a few moments after the boss was down to recommend them to gear properly before queuing and to follow tactics, especially when that severely undergeared.

 

Still, I felt epic there, basically carrying them through the FP with my mostly 180 rating gear, and my Prototype Resolve Stim.

Edited October 15, 2014 by Cox_The_Beast

[Heezdedjim]

tl;dr

Edited October 15, 2014 by Heezdedjim

[BigBreakfast]

I had the pleasure of meeting a wierd healer few nights back.

 

Why didn't you just ignore the guy and finish the fp, since everyone was at least doing their role and things were going smooth?

 

I posted something way back about a FP I was in (Cademimu too if I recall) where one weirdo dps was basically saying to the other dps, "stop killing things so well, let me get the final hit on things. and don't help me kill them". In broken english as well. And even if it was properly spoken, it was clearly a loony thing to say. But the dps actually took offense and left on his own. If you are doing the right thing and you know it, you shouldn't listen to some weirdo's critique.

Edited October 15, 2014 by BigBreakfast

[ZeroPlus]

tl;dr

 

That summary is awesome beyond words!

[Tech_Greek]

Did Cademimu HM 55 the other day.

 

Everyone was "ok" in the gear level (with some lower level stuff that should have been replaced to be on that one), no big deal it happens - we all start somewhere.

 

I ask if anyone has done it yet? No response, not a single response until someone tells me to kill the normal enemies before the strong - I replied I am, you probably saw it auto target a gold after I dropped one of the normal mob trash since I drop them so fast I have to hit the next target quite often in comparison to a melee dps or tank. He said, oh it's the idiot shadow then...I just shook my head and moved on.

 

I pulse covered a gold to the edge, and then went to ambush him off, and then someone force pushes the gold back into center. This happens multiple times, whatever, easy kills just means longer times in the FP.

 

Get yelled at to SB, even though everyone was (this is a pet peeve of mine, if you want to skip the animations ask nicely at the start or during, don't be a ***** about it because I'll be that guy that sits there and draws everyone out if you yell at me to do it - learn manners).

 

Get to the wookie, with the Ugnaughts. I assumed by their terrible navigation of the FP they don't know to keep them close to the boss instead of trying to DPS them afterwards or during so I announced, as soon as I went to type the tank pulls without doing a ready check whatsoever, I run towards the boss (as a sniper this is counter to my normal stance but it works) so I tell them to come inward multiple times, instead they run off to the ships trying to kill the mini wookies. Finally killed the boss and the Ugnaughts and I announced "fyi next time if everyone stands next to the boss you can do that part a whole lot faster and not have to worry about the Ugnaughts"; the terrible melee dps who was running around pvp circiling the Ugnaughts goes "..." and says for me to hurry up and get up there...I was literally 10m behind them in my normal spot, because I have a 35m range. I just face palmed...

Edited October 15, 2014 by Tech_Greek

[rawtravel]

Keyphrase is - "The way i see it".

The only healer job is keep everyone alive. DPS or not to DPS is a personal decision (and a matter of resourses).

 

Agreed. I won't ask you to heal, so don't ask me to DPS or tank. If tanks are solid and DPS know kill order (i.e. my sorc is not taking loads of damage), then I will happily DPS to the best of my power. Alas, in full corruption tree, my DPS is a joke! I can crit-heal for 13K in one pop, and near 25K if I have 4 seconds, but it could take me 20 seconds for me to kill a weak bot by myself! Damage=Sad.

 

Heck, on some fights, I will literally stand and do nothing for several seconds in a row. At beginning of fight, I give tanks and DPS 5 seconds to grab aggro on everything, because if I use bubble and aoe heals from the 1st GCD then I'm taking damage for sure. In the middle of a fight, if all is going well and there is no damage spike pending, I might stand still for a few seconds, as this offers fastest force and HP regen. Let my CDs advance a bit more, then jump back in.

 

Sometimes, it is more efficient for a healer to just sit for a few seconds and do nothing, rather than using up all force to do 200-300 damage with my puny Shock, and burn up 60 force.

 

Now, if the group finds that they are lacking DPS, and enrage timers are likely to expire, then I will of course do as much DPS as I can, for what that's worth. I am a team player after all. However, this almost never happens because it would require DPS to admit their relative lameness!

 

Bottom line is if no one dies then you may not complain to healz. Full stop!

Edited October 15, 2014 by rawtravel

[Fazaani]

Why didn't you just ignore the guy and finish the fp, since everyone was at least doing their role and things were going smooth?

 

Cuz i wanted to make a statement, and that was actually more the point and the fun part of my post.

 

Annoying players that talk trash, don't know their job or lack skill are trivial. Matter itself was trivial... I was amused ofmy reaction "NO SIR!! I will not tolerate this" as i usually dont care about basic******** if the job get's done.

Edited October 16, 2014 by Fazaani

[AAAAzrael]

Agreed. I won't ask you to heal, so don't ask me to DPS or tank. If tanks are solid and DPS know kill order (i.e. my sorc is not taking loads of damage), then I will happily DPS to the best of my power. Alas, in full corruption tree, my DPS is a joke! I can crit-heal for 13K in one pop, and near 25K if I have 4 seconds, but it could take me 20 seconds for me to kill a weak bot by myself! Damage=Sad.

 

Heck, on some fights, I will literally stand and do nothing for several seconds in a row. At beginning of fight, I give tanks and DPS 5 seconds to grab aggro on everything, because if I use bubble and aoe heals from the 1st GCD then I'm taking damage for sure. In the middle of a fight, if all is going well and there is no damage spike pending, I might stand still for a few seconds, as this offers fastest force and HP regen. Let my CDs advance a bit more, then jump back in.

 

Sometimes, it is more efficient for a healer to just sit for a few seconds and do nothing, rather than using up all force to do 200-300 damage with my puny Shock, and burn up 60 force.

 

Now, if the group finds that they are lacking DPS, and enrage timers are likely to expire, then I will of course do as much DPS as I can, for what that's worth. I am a team player after all. However, this almost never happens because it would require DPS to admit their relative lameness!

 

Bottom line is if no one dies then you may not complain to healz. Full stop!

 

OK I see your argument but I still disagree. If I heal I will DPS to maximum of my ability until someone needs healing (I have both Sorc and Mando healers at NiM ops level). If healer pulls aggro by DPSing then tank should uninstall the game probably. Then when there is more heals required I will heal as needed while trying to at least keep dot uptime, in lower damage phases I will use abilities that have high damage per energy or cast time depending on situation. In my opinion everyone is responsible for maximising their output and just standing there is not a solution.

In case the tank is really bad it's sometimes easier to just kill stuff then face tank it - at least on commando healer it's usually better. Sorc can also kill, stun, cc or kite stuff instead of standing there and doing nothing. If you're not doing something your not contributing.

Once again - don't blame others think what more you could have done to make that fight go easier/faster.

[Sinapus]

I'm not really understanding the whole "healer must heal all times" since the out-of-combat heal takes a whole whopping 15 seconds maximum to complete.

 

I haven't been doing flashpoints lately, but I do I will have my scoundrel put slow-release medpacs on the party so long as it doesn't drain energy too much. When I do I'm not trying to do their healing for them, I'm stacking/maintaining upper hands for the next fight. (It's nice to have some available, at least...)

[Fazaani]

Or the jesuslike healer could aslo give some pointers to unexperienced tank(or guide change to dps) because he/she is such a pro and all... and not to tell "uninstal the game"...

[AAAAzrael]

Or the jesuslike healer could aslo give some pointers to unexperienced tank(or guide change to dps) because he/she is such a pro and all... and not to tell "uninstal the game"...

 

Some people can be helped and I'm very happy to help them, some people can't be helped and there is nothing I can do about that. In this thread I complain about attitude - "I am just standing there and doing nothing as there is no damage incoming".

I main a tank, play all 3 tank classes, and I have explained strategies, fights, rotations and tricks of the trade to lots of people. I walked people through tanking most L55 ops and I really don't have anything to prove in that area.

[AAAAzrael]

I'm not really understanding the whole "healer must heal all times" since the out-of-combat heal takes a whole whopping 15 seconds maximum to complete.

 

Of course out of combat heal should be used when needed, no argument about that. I specifically commented on "I won't waste my energy on doing deeps" not on out of combat healing.

[Zipacnaa]

Enough already with the boring 'heal this way, fight this way, tank this place' responses.

 

Please get back on topic, I want to hear about weird people, not you lame-arses whining about each other

[BobFredJohn]

I haven't been doing flashpoints lately, but I do I will have my scoundrel put slow-release medpacs on the party so long as it doesn't drain energy too much. When I do I'm not trying to do their healing for them, I'm stacking/maintaining upper hands for the next fight. (It's nice to have some available, at least...)

 

I have had people assuming im happy to take over out-of-combat heals with my merc simply because I was maintaining 30-stack superchraged

 

As for whats his name saying a healer stood still is a waste of space....If the dps can't keep up with enrage timers thats not the healers fault. If 1k dps is going to sway the fight to the extent it prevents a wipe, thats a bad group.

 

And before I get some sarcy comment about how bad I am, I do "dps" (lmao, healer dps) when no damage is coming out. But expecting it to be the norm is ridiculous. Especially if mr. tank is going to chain pull with no out-of-combat heals and no DCD's. Then a sorc/sage has no option but to preserve their resource.

Edited October 16, 2014 by BobFredJohn

[DalekTheCat]

I'm not really understanding the whole "healer must heal all times" since the out-of-combat heal takes a whole whopping 15 seconds maximum to complete.

 

Stand around for 15 seconds after each stupid trash encounter.

 

- OR -

 

Learn to heal on the go to make everyone's life -- including your own -- easier.

 

A conundrum!

 

Be a pro: heal on the go!

[rawtravel]

OK I see your argument but I still disagree. If I heal I will DPS to maximum of my ability until someone needs healing (I have both Sorc and Mando healers at NiM ops level). If healer pulls aggro by DPSing then tank should uninstall the game probably. Then when there is more heals required I will heal as needed while trying to at least keep dot uptime, in lower damage phases I will use abilities that have high damage per energy or cast time depending on situation. In my opinion everyone is responsible for maximising their output and just standing there is not a solution.

In case the tank is really bad it's sometimes easier to just kill stuff then face tank it - at least on commando healer it's usually better. Sorc can also kill, stun, cc or kite stuff instead of standing there and doing nothing. If you're not doing something your not contributing.

Once again - don't blame others think what more you could have done to make that fight go easier/faster.

 

Allow me to clarify....I will "stand still and regen" only rarely. Most times, I make sure to stand close enough to the boss that I can stun with Electrocute, which is the only effective offensive spell I have. Seriously, my force lightning, shock, etc. are so weak as to not even be worth the force they cost.

 

Having said that, if tank and dps are not solid and I start taking damage, I will usually stop healing anyone and just focus on trying to kill whatever mob(s) are hitting me. This is a joke, of course, due to my amazingly low dps, but the real purpose is to get the mobs off me! So, I run to the tank or nearest dps, you know, to get their attention, if for some reason their falling health, with no healz, does not make them look around and see what's up with the poor squishy healer. That works most times, but not always.

 

LOOK A STORY!

 

I popped GF and got the Mannan tactical mission. It was me on my sorc healer (36K HP and mostly 180's), 1 "tank" who was really DPS but queued as tank, and 2 DPS, all of whom were at around 25-28K HP. They all absolutely ignored me. It actually became humorous really early. Being so over geared than the rest, I ripped agro right away on the first pull. Even my aggro drop did not help. The low dps meant that mobs did not go down quickly at all, but focused on me and I died. First pull on a tactical??!!

 

Here's the really weird part....it was my first time ever doing Mannan and was very excited to finally be doing this mission. I wanted to really check it out and look around a bit. I watched all of the cut scenes and no one complained. Cool. It could have been all of their first time on ANY FP for all I knew.

 

I'm a teacher not a rage-quitter, so I tried to explain that they need to hold aggro (um...Mr. Tank....hello?) off me, and dps from weakest to strongest, but they never really got it. I think I died on just about every pull, and we wiped many times during the whole mission. As I said, I wanted to see the mission, and after a few deaths I decided to stick it out to the end, just to see how many time I would die. 13 times all told. Beyond ridiculous starts to get laughable. Repair bill was 6 figures, but who cares.

 

In the end I was laughing at the incompetence, and lack of awareness my group possessed. But hey, I did finally get to check out Mannan! We ended with "Nice run" and "Thanks for group". I don't think they had any idea how badly it really went.

[Flintfire]

I mean every class that can heal has 1 or two powerful attacks they can use off cooldown to help:

Mercenary: Fusion missile, Death From Above, Railshot, Unload

Sorcerer: Affliction, Crushing Darkness, Force Lightning

Operative: Corrosive Dart, Orbital Strike, Explosive Probe, backstab.

 

But expecting heals to throw out constant dps after every heal is wrong. Because I never see a dps throwing off heals unless the healer sucks, which is a different problem.

[AAAAzrael]

I mean every class that can heal has 1 or two powerful attacks they can use off cooldown to help:

Mercenary: Fusion missile, Death From Above, Railshot, Unload

Sorcerer: Affliction, Crushing Darkness, Force Lightning

Operative: Corrosive Dart, Orbital Strike, Explosive Probe, backstab.

 

But expecting heals to throw out constant dps after every heal is wrong. Because I never see a dps throwing off heals unless the healer sucks, which is a different problem.

 

 

Problem with this logic is that you can always have more raid DPS, but you don't need more HPS. There is one fight however - Cartel Warlords in NiM where having a DPS off-heal in phase 1 was normal practise at one point. Normally it's more DPS you need not more heals.

[idnewton]

Most times, I make sure to stand close enough to the boss that I can stun with Electrocute, which is the only effective offensive spell I have. Seriously, my force lightning, shock, etc. are so weak as to not even be worth the force they cost.\

 

Um, what? You can't stun ops bosses, you can't stun flashpoint bosses, what kind of content are you talking about?

 

Besides, if you're either Sorc DPS tree and you're not using Force Lightning, you're pretty sad.

[Memo-]

Um, what? You can't stun ops bosses, you can't stun flashpoint bosses, what kind of content are you talking about?

 

Besides, if you're either Sorc DPS tree and you're not using Force Lightning, you're pretty sad.

 

He's under the illusion that because Electrocution doesn't cost any Force, it's a better dps option than all the worthwhile dps attacks.

 

But anyway: if you pump up dps with Affliction, Crushing Darkness, Force Lightning, Shock and Lightning Strike (you can do a stable rotation if you aren't being hit (no pushback), where you alternate Shock, Force Lightning and Lightning Strike, and substitute LS for Affliction and Crushing Darkness when dot falls off / on cooldown) you can easily maintain a dps of 1,5k to 2k, even while healing (Resurgence+Innervate is mostly enough for single target healing + you get Force Surge buffs and thus off-the-gcd Consumption).

[Kingsbount]

Seriously, guys. Do your job.

Healers - healing. Tanks - tanking. And DPS are damaging...

Simple as that.

All of your "healers must DPS too becouse of... reasons" is silly. Really.

 

Three simple words:

DO. YOUR. JOB.

And everyone is happy.