Mar/Sents

[GrandMike]

you rage on BAD marauders and sents cause EVEN BAD ONES can finaly do some damage?

 

no need to l2p

 

Fixed that for ya.

[MenechUK]

I think the bad PvP argument works both ways, I can't tell you how many times a bloody sorcerer has tried to out DPS me toe to toe in battle.

 

Honestly if your standing right next to a sentinel trying to out DPS them with two lightsabers your abit of a fool that most likely deserves to die.

 

Sentinels do have their weaknesses, I have been playing one constantly since launch and I know them only too well. We have garbage CC's and if your a Sentinel worthy of note like I am on my server you send half the Warzone stun-locked.

 

That being said I have had an easier time killing sages/sorcerers since 1.2, I don't currently think I would ever lose to one 1 on 1.

 

However Powertechs still have a much easier time taking them out then I do. That 4 second stun-lock pretty much means game over for any sage/sorcerer. To be honest pre-1.2 the rest of the sentinels on my server where garbage and bordering useless in WZ's.

 

I found a way to be pretty effective still but I still never did amazing on medals (like sentinels never have) now it seems sentinels at least have a chance.

 

People just need to developer new styles to counter sents, if your still trying to go toe to toe with them unless your a tank then your the one playing poorly.

 

Cant tell you the amount of times I have seen players attack me head on after I just hit all my defence buffs and used relic/adrenal combo, that's not my class being OP'ed that them being utter morons...

Edited April 13, 2012 by MenechUK

[Raansu]

All DPS got increased, not just marauders. I noticed it instantly yesterday that I was losing health WAY faster then normal. I was down to 30% in just a few hits. I also noticed I was hitting like a truck to. They changed expertise and damage to make fights go faster. Commandos I pvp with were getting all giddy because demolition rounds was hitting people for an insane amount of damage.

[iDubstep]

I think the bad PvP argument works both ways, I can't tell you how many times a bloody sorcerer has tried to out DPS me toe to toe in battle.

 

Honestly if your standing right next to a sentinel trying to out DPS them with two lightsabers your abit of a fool that most likely deserves to die.

 

Sentinels do have their weaknesses, I have been playing one constantly since launch and I know them only too well. We have garbage CC's and if your a Sentinel worthy of note like I am on my server you send half the Warzone stun-locked.

 

That being said I have had an easier time killing sages/sorcerers since 1.2, I don't currently think I would ever lose to one 1 on 1.

 

However Powertechs still have a much easier time taking them out then I do. That 4 second stun-lock pretty much means game over for any sage/sorcerer. To be honest pre-1.2 the rest of the sentinels on my server where garbage and bordering useless in WZ's.

 

I found a way to be pretty effective still but I still never did amazing on medals (like sentinels never have) now it seems sentinels at least have a chance.

 

People just need to developer new styles to counter sents, if your still trying to go toe to toe with them unless your a tank then your the one playing poorly.

 

Cant tell you the amount of times I have seen players attack me head on after I just hit all my defence buffs and used relic/adrenal combo, that's not my class being OP'ed that them being utter morons...

 

There is a spell check here did you know that?

 

I'll assume you are as good at playing as you are at spelling.

 

Could you explain why a DPS class has so many "defence" cool downs?

Edited April 13, 2012 by iDubstep

[mikedee]

Don't exaggerate! It's more like 3 shot.

 

Good marauders killed anything before the patch. Now good marauders are godly and crappy ones are good.

 

That is correct the attack does hit in 3 parts...Last part hitting for 6-7.5k first two for about 4k...I feel bad for the ones that don't have their gear/spec right and complain about it not being correct. More like 14-15k on 3 crits no 10k...

[Edryk]

People just need to developer new styles to counter sents, if your still trying to go toe to toe with them unless your a tank then your the one playing poorly.

 

Cant tell you the amount of times I have seen players attack me head on after I just hit all my defence buffs and used relic/adrenal combo, that's not my class being OP'ed that them being utter morons...

 

So no melee classes should be able to kill a marauder? Even tanks have trouble. Stun when? During your channels? During your mitigation CDs? I only have 1, can't interrupt your channels anymore.

 

Kite you? As a melee? Oh wait I have to get in melee range to slow you, at which point you also apply a slow. I run away, Force charge.

 

Yeah I have a Marauder too, and they are crazy atm.

[MenechUK]

There is a spell check here did you know that?

 

I'll assume you are as good at playing as you are at spelling.

 

Could you explain why a DPS class has so many "defence" cool downs?

 

Why yes I can *** hat, too keep us alive since we don't last 10 seconds without them. Can you explain why your so poor at PvP that you have to cry bout it on the forums?

[Scoloplastic]

Ravage is a melee channeled ability, the only one in the game - making it the hardest ability to execute correctly in the game.

 

In addition to that, the big numbers you are seeing are usually from Carnage marauders - due to their gore 100% armor penetration. This is a buff they have for 4.5 seconds (it's mentioned as 6 seconds but gore itself is on the GCD, so it leaves 4.5 seconds).

 

Basically, the marauder needs to gore you, then he has a 4.5 second window to perform a 3 second melee channeled attack - if he manages to do that, you will, and should, pay a heavy price.

 

It is extremely easy to avoid this attack combination, just knock the the marauder back the second he gores you (you can easily tell who is a carnage marauder by looking at the ataru form buff) and that's it, he can't perform the extreme damage ravage on you. Or, obviously, just wait till he starts his ravage rotation and then knock him back.

 

Don't have a knockback?

 

You're either:

 

a marauder\sentinel - you have obfuscate (pacify) - completely negates the damage from this ability.

scoundrel - flash grenade

powertech - you got an additional stun on a short CD...

 

This is in addition to the stun each class gets and the numerous defensive CDs available to all of the classes.

 

Honestly, assassin harnessed darkness force lightning can do 8k easily over the same period of time, and is on a 10m to 30m range (if you have recklessness on) and on a much shorter cooldown (not to mention it's on a freaking tank spec).

 

I've played a few WZs with this spec, usually i get a full 100% AP ravage once or twice a match if I'm lucky - I guess I'm playing against smarter players...

 

Learn to adapt.

[Alonick]

Considering how many Sorcerer players blatantly started attacking all things Sentinel or Marauder the second that 1.2 was announced then yes, we have every reason to believe that you are making this up. Also we, Sentinels that is, know that normally all 3 hits combined from Master Strike only hit for around 6,000 - 6,500 damage. Each individual hit landing for around 2,150 damage give or take. On a crit these hits individually land for around 3,150 damage.

 

So, while it is possible that three consecutive crits in a row can deal around 9,450 damage, you are also talking about 3 critical hits, over the course of 3 seconds, from a channeled ability.

 

 

Man, I play a tank specced Vanguard with full BM gear and was being taken down in 4 seconds. I was getting hit for 5k+ from Maras and Jugs, if you think that's okay, well that's your opinion but the whole purpose of a tank is to be able to take damage and survive so the the squishier players (healing and DPS) can do their thing.

 

It isn't just Sorcs and Sages coming on here, it's everyone even other mara/sents complaining about how easy it is to kill now... and like I eluded to, if you think it's some sort of conspiracy, I'm sorry you missed our cross-server, cross-class conference call.

[GrandMike]

since we don't last 10 seconds without them.

 

Oooohhh, you mean you are like everyone else without them.

 

Yah, thats a shocker, i suggest every class gets those CDs since, you know, they need them just like maruders/sentinels do.

[exphryl]

Ravage is a melee channeled ability, the only one in the game - making it the hardest ability to execute correctly in the game.

 

In addition to that, the big numbers you are seeing are usually from Carnage marauders - due to their gore 100% armor penetration. This is a buff they have for 4.5 seconds (it's mentioned as 6 seconds but gore itself is on the GCD, so it leaves 4.5 seconds).

 

Basically, the marauder needs to gore you, then he has a 4.5 second window to perform a 3 second melee channeled attack - if he manages to do that, you will, and should, pay a heavy price.

 

It is extremely easy to avoid this attack combination, just knock the the marauder back the second he gores you (you can easily tell who is a carnage marauder by looking at the ataru form buff) and that's it, he can't perform the extreme damage ravage on you. Or, obviously, just wait till he starts his ravage rotation and then knock him back.

 

Don't have a knockback?

 

You're either:

 

a marauder\sentinel - you have obfuscate (pacify) - completely negates the damage from this ability.

scoundrel - flash grenade

powertech - you got an additional stun on a short CD...

 

This is in addition to the stun each class gets and the numerous defensive CDs available to all of the classes.

 

Honestly, assassin harnessed darkness force lightning can do 8k easily over the same period of time, and is on a 10m to 30m range (if you have recklessness on) and on a much shorter cooldown (not to mention it's on a freaking tank spec).

 

I've played a few WZs with this spec, usually i get a full 100% AP ravage once or twice a match if I'm lucky - I guess I'm playing against smarter players...

 

Learn to adapt.

 

So wastes stuns on a Damaging attack, rather than hold stuns on the immunity shield.

 

Seems to be a lose lose.

[MenechUK]

So no melee classes should be able to kill a marauder? Even tanks have trouble. Stun when? During your channels? During your mitigation CDs? I only have 1, can't interrupt your channels anymore.

 

Kite you? As a melee? Oh wait I have to get in melee range to slow you, at which point you also apply a slow. I run away, Force charge.

 

Yeah I have a Marauder too, and they are crazy atm.

 

No idea what your talking about all my channelling moves can be cancelled easily. Master Strike becoming interruptible is a focus tree perk... And Focus is a bad PvP tree.

 

All my attacks I use are instant attacks anyway, I use Master Strike when am low on focus but it normally gets cancelled right away...

 

And sentinels have extremely long CD's in WZ's Shadows are stronger like 80 percent the time 1 on 1. But when you meet a sentinel who has all his CD's ready and you attempt to 1 on 1 them except to lose.

 

All you have to do is stealth or run away for 15 seconds and we back to normal strength, instead idiots try to take us head on die then cry about it on here.

[Marisblood]

All new sistem is done for the War Hero Gear stats. When all players will have this gear then and only then we can see if it is a good balance or not.

I am confused too, killing ppl in 4 sec and geting killed in 4 seconds. All is lame.

Look to JKG HP, 16k as tank. Look to operatives HP, 17k as healers/dps spec. They are not nerfed, they rule like before. Why? Because their stuns wich put characters down are bugin them so from 4 sec stun u need 6 sec in reality to recover and stay on y feet. Wich is too late to survive. I reported this many times and is sill there. I also reported since launch that Operatives can cap gates from stelth or by using 2 Operatives who stick one on top of another, so if u do aoe dmg to hit them both u will hit only one, cause is a bug.

1.2 most lame patch ever in a MMO.

Devs seems lost out of space.

 

 

LOL, now and forever.

[RahlLegacy]

Which is why you should move 5 meters away, or knockback, or cc

 

1st of all, if you dont have the Mara targeted you may not see it coming in time, especially if you are in a heated battle with one or more people.

 

2nd of all, I have to wonder if maybe you just never noticed that when you are in an all out, up close, melee brawl your speed is probably so hampered that you cant get out of range by the time the ravage is over.

 

Excessive slows and roots in PvP is what will be the real end of the fun.

[iiell]

So no melee classes should be able to kill a marauder? Even tanks have trouble. Stun when? During your channels? During your mitigation CDs? I only have 1, can't interrupt your channels anymore.

 

Kite you? As a melee? Oh wait I have to get in melee range to slow you, at which point you also apply a slow. I run away, Force charge.

 

Yeah I have a Marauder too, and they are crazy atm.

 

Stop trying to 1v1 in a team oriented warzone?

[Zbus]

They hit hard no doubt about it but Im haveing alot more sucess than I thought I would against mara/sent and guard/jug with my tactics spec vanguard.

 

I dont win every time but i can be sure they are close to 10 to 15% health at the end of the fight. Slow on gut is a nice tactic against them allows me some distance to get my damage off.

[Veeius]

If you stand there long enough for a full ravage/MS to go off you've got what's coming to you. And I don't even play a Sent/Mara.

 

Not for nothing, but charge immobilizes you for 2/3rds of the channel, and you can't get far enough away to avoid the last third before it comes off.

 

you CAN do any kind of knockback you have. But if those are on cd, you're eating that full ravage/master strike.

[VainEldritch]

/popcorn

 

This thread delivers.

 

Carry on!

[Edryk]

No idea what your talking about all my channelling moves can be cancelled easily. Master Strike becoming interruptible is a focus tree perk... And Focus is a bad PvP tree.

 

All my attacks I use are instant attacks anyway, I use Master Strike when am low on focus but it normally gets cancelled right away...

 

And sentinels have extremely long CD's in WZ's Shadows are stronger like 80 percent the time 1 on 1. But when you meet a sentinel who has all his CD's ready and you attempt to 1 on 1 them except to lose.

 

All you have to do is stealth or run away for 15 seconds and we back to normal strength, instead idiots try to take us head on die then cry about it on here.

 

Hi, I have cooldowns too. You pop yours, I pop mine, you end with 75% health, I'm dead. Why?

 

Run away? Then I can't hit you. And you charge me. Wait, that's your solution? Run away? LOL. Why should a marauder be the god of 1v1? You absolutely need a friend to have even a chance against them BY YOUR OWN ADMISSION.

 

On my marauder I can easily 2v1 people as Rage/Focus, which is weak apparently.

 

Stop trying to 1v1 in a team oriented warzone?

If you think 1v1 never happens in a team WZ you are delusional. Sorry, I'm not going to run into the deathtrap mid node full of the enemy team. I'm going where the enemy is weakly defending.

Edited April 13, 2012 by Edryk

[mikedee]

Hi, I have cooldowns too. You pop yours, I pop mine, you end with 75% health, I'm dead. Why?

 

Run away? Then I can't hit you. And you charge me. Wait, that's your solution? Run away? LOL. Why should a marauder be the god of 1v1? You absolutely need a friend to have even a chance against them BY YOUR OWN ADMISSION.

 

On my marauder I can easily 2v1 people as Rage/Focus, which is weak apparently.

 

The truth will set up free!

[Alonick]

They hit hard no doubt about it but Im haveing alot more sucess than I thought I would against mara/sent and guard/jug with my tactics spec vanguard.

 

I dont win every time but i can be sure they are close to 10 to 15% health at the end of the fight. Slow on gut is a nice tactic against them allows me some distance to get my damage off.

 

I switched to tactics because with a tank spec I couldn't last very long. I'm still dying fast but at least I'm taking someone down with me.

[VainEldritch]

According to the CS forum, the new patch reverted a bunch of stuff.

 

Check it out.

 

*looks at free-spinning wheel on bridge as the good ship BioWare lurches from side to side*

[Ravashakk]

Tired of seeing maras and sents defending this class. None of us should be surprised, it happens everytime a class gets overbuffed. Just natural that ppl want their class to be strong and keep it that way.

 

I read through most of the posts and saw a lot of trash. To clear some things up let me explain a few things. I have pvped as every marauder spec prior to the change. I did the most as annihilation because I didn't want to faceroll as rage. The ONLY class that gave me issues was a well played op/scoundrel who got the opener with c/ds. Anything else became a corpse in short order. I stopped playing my mara in favor of rolling a healer, mainly because of the influx of maras I saw due to patch notes.

 

Whoever said ravage hasn't been buffed is blind. It got a straight 15% buff, in addition to a talent in the first tier of rage being retooled to buff ravage damage by 8%. Add this to the exp dmg buff and ravage is now around a 30% buff.

 

Since my healer is ridiculously hard to play in this PVP environment right now (outside of premades) I got on my mara to try out carnage and rage since those trees saw significant changes. I did not pvp at all, because I'd just be adding to the problem, but I did try some things out. As rage, on a guy w/o pvp gear on, but I didn't pop warzone adrenal, I crit for over 6k on smash. I tried out ravage despite it not being as potent as carnage. The first hit was 3.6k, second was almost 3k non crit, the last was 5200. That's well over 11k dmg from a channeled melee in RAGE spec. Carnage gives you 100% armor pen through gore. Having the warzone adrenal would almost cancel out the fact that my opponent didn't have pvp gear (full bm gives like 16% dmg reduction, adrenal gives 15% dmg)

 

The other thing I can't stand is reading how many ppl suggest ways to get around ravage and that it is a L2P issue. Yes in theory every move has a counter, but we all know in practice that sometimes your counters are on cooldown or maybe....just maybe someone stunned you before the mara ravaged you and your 1 escape is on cooldown (very common). On my mara, hitting ppl with ravage (before it was uninterruptable) was not too difficult and I chained with with a big hit afterwards like annihilate or massacre/force scream/smash depending on spec.

 

On a side note, I'd like to say that I despise the fact that an aoe attack is by far the hardest hitting single target attack for marauders.

[iiell]

Hi, I have cooldowns too. You pop yours, I pop mine, you end with 75% health, I'm dead. Why?

 

Run away? Then I can't hit you. And you charge me. Wait, that's your solution? Run away? LOL. Why should a marauder be the god of 1v1? You absolutely need a friend to have even a chance against them BY YOUR OWN ADMISSION.

 

On my marauder I can easily 2v1 people as Rage/Focus, which is weak apparently.

 

Interesting, you're claiming that you 1v2 people and pop your cooldowns and still have 75% life? You do realize that Sent/Mara's "5 second god mode" instantly reduces their current health by 50%....right?

[NommNomm]

So I am full BM and yesterday with the release of 1.2 I get 1 shot now with master strike/ravage abilities. .

 

LOL whats your HP 4k dont bulls**t me lets be realistic