I'm feeling 7.0 is the end

[Savej]

Damn you beat me to it.. I can't keep track of the amount of doomsayers I've seen on these forums through the years. Remember how 6.0 was a pipe dream and never gonna happen? People would literally laugh you off the forums for mentioning it, thinking they knew everything lol.

 

Just because they don't like the game anymore, doesn't mean it's in trouble necessarily.

 

And to the OP, I can have your stuff then yeah? Credit transfer, cheers!

 

Makeb and SOR were hopeful until they released and were buggy as hell and very underwhelming. They were our first introduction to the fact that class stories were over and expansion stories were going to be short and small compared to class story chapters. That took time to process.

 

4.0 had people complaining about the lack of endgame content and the exclusive focus on solo play. People came in for the initial story and because it was SW's 25th anniv and because TFA was a success and because of Blur's trailer. Then, after a few months, they left. I would say the current devs agree with the 4.0 complainers, in 7.0 they have phased out everything they could have from that patch.

 

5.0 had people complaining about command crates. BW eventually got rid of them so I guess BW agrees? But the damage was done, 5.0 was not good for swtor. More people left.

 

6.0 there wasn't much doom for that but the new gearing system did have people concerned. BW is getting rid of almost all of 6.0s gearing changes so they must agree?

 

The best thing BW did for their game since fixing 3.0's bugs was the server merges that many players were loudly asking for since before 4.0's launch ("better than x-server" was a meme).

 

In each of these cases, 4.0, 5.0 and 6.0, BW could have saved themselves a lot of money and effort and failure if they had listened to their loudest complainers.

 

But say what you want, SWTOR hasn't seen this much backlash against an expac pre release. This is new. Youtube, Discord, Reddit and on these boards - almost no one is excited for most of the changes coming with BW's 10-year anniversary. And many are dead set against them.

Edited December 6, 2021 by Savej

[ralphieceaser]

Just realized another way that 7.0 could harm the game.

 

 

But, if I understand correctly after I hit level 80, there's no real point in doing it anymore I won't get anything off the initial missions except credits

Yep this change now makes a lot of old content now completely worthless when before we out least got some renown out of it.

[DarthArturus]

Maybe of the game, maybe not; but definitely for me.

I've been here since beta and from the sounds of it, 7.0 will end the last vestiges of the game I started with. They're nerfing conquest - the best addition they've made in the game in a long time, PvP has long since been killed off, crafting will now be worse than the joke it already is, people are already complaining about the new gearing system, etc.

I really think once 7.0 comes out I will have to ask, is it any fun to play this game anymore.

And yes, I know Bioware doesn't care.

 

Nope. In fact, both my adult son and myself have resubbed for 7.0. I left at the beginning of Onslaught and my son in the middle of Knights of the Fallen Empire. We are both excited for combat styles.

[Shwarzchild]

Nope. In fact, both my adult son and myself have resubbed for 7.0. I left at the beginning of Onslaught and my son in the middle of Knights of the Fallen Empire. We are both excited for combat styles.

 

Have you played through onslaught completely? I found the story of it quite good surprisingly.

[oslek]

Have you played through onslaught completely? I found the story of it quite good surprisingly.

 

It's not bad, but make sure you are up to speed on where you were with some of your companions.

 

Hardest part for me was leaving the game for awhile, coming back, and then trying to remember which of my characters was with whom.

[EllieAnne]

100% agree. Imagine if Apple announces a new phone that is faster, but at the laat minute, change their mind. This is not freaking Shakespearean literature, where we can just sit down and try to think about how the words "implied".

 

More like: We are adding more functionalities to our iPhones. New phones get all of the new features. Current iPhones only get half of them.

[EduardoJN]

I play this game since Beta and if there's one thing I've already learned is that Bioware simply doesn't care about you, your time and your efforts in this game.

 

That is why I strongly recommend that you don't sink much of your time in SWTOR.

 

This game simply doesn't reward or gives you respect for the amount of hours you put into it.

 

At any moment everything can change and your "grinding" go down the toilet.

 

So choose wisely if you wanna spend your time grinding for whatever it is in swtor, specially gear

[Strathkin]

But who is LOL?

 

Story players? You could say that with KOTFEET, but now? The story moves at a glacial pace nowadays, lacks any fresh ideas or new memorable characters and just rehashes same old stuff (Malgus for the 29374th time). 7.0 will be the shortest story "expansion" ever, with barely 1 planet and 1 Flashpoint.

 

OPS players? It would SEEM that way but 7.0 won't even have a new op released in December lol... (and you can bet its gonna get delayed even further multiple times till like spring '22)

 

PVP? GSF? Obviously not.

 

I actually do wonder who Bioware thinks they're "targeting" with this cause it seems like absolutely NO ONE lol

 

I mean I'm trying to be HOPEFUL, yet still a large part of me is concerned! I mean removing 3 former abilities in each Class, to give but 1 back based on Discipline? Should have been 2 based on same criteria!

 

Discipline One: Ability A1 & A3

Discipline Two: Ability A2 & A3

Discipline Three: Ability A1 & A2

 

That doesn't account for loss of Combat Proficiency, that makes everyone virtually the same; and many Class feel slower and less fun to play. They could make it up based on Discipline, awarding a few as Passive of the former 9 too? Yet still be less choice to choose!

 

▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬

Still the least they should have done, to REVISE all Weekly Missions at least for VET/MASTER Flashpoints or Operations. Even if it limited the Content to Level 75 - 80 Content, it then focus on RECENT content!

 

♦ Even if 75 level content still drops 306 or < gear, the weekly could have given 1 Level 80 Crate at least.

♦ With Renown we used to get several (10 - 20) unless you were 999, or could switching to ALT--that's gone.

♦ So 4 up to 80 Level Crates based on Item Level is far less; aside from any specific 80 Content you run.

♦ 80 Content will also be too limited at least for another year!

 

People have 8, 16, possibly far more TOONs they want to see progress! Everyone wants to see slight progress on each toon, as it shows progression!

▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬

Edited December 8, 2021 by Strathkin

[Lucas_Sorrell]

I play this game since Beta and if there's one thing I've already learned is that Bioware simply doesn't care about you, your time and your efforts in this game.

 

That is why I strongly recommend that you don't sink much of your time in SWTOR.

 

This game simply doesn't reward or gives you respect for the amount of hours you put into it.

 

At any moment everything can change and your "grinding" go down the toilet.

 

So choose wisely if you wanna spend your time grinding for whatever it is in swtor, specially gear

 

I've also been playing since beta, following it since first announced, etc, etc... And I have to agree with you. It has been a busted game and underperforming ever since launch--I mean how long did it take them to get the legacy system working properly? Granted the game has had some ups, but it has been had a lot more downs. For a time, after watching players leave for greener pastures or just growing too tired of all the failings to keep putting time into it, I hoped the game would die and we could get something new that didn't start behind the 8 ball, but seeing the direction that not only the game itself has taken but also the general attitude of gaming over the past ten years, I don't really think that's likely.

 

I've more or less moved past trying to play this as an MMO, especially after they started working Korean-styled grinding into general progression, and now just use it to fill the niche that is a multiplayer Star Wars game. It scratches the itch, and if I ever want to really sink time into MMO again, well there are alternative games. But there is no point in ever expecting or hoping that it will ever shift into a more content/player focused game.

[EllieAnne]

Bumping this to answer my own question: YES

BW just went into overdrive to take everything away from the player. With capping all of the stats and the ability pruning, all the toons are cookie cutter. What's the difference between gunslinger and scoundrel now? No longer does it matter if you make a consistent power healer or a OG-when-it-hits crit healer.

 

Remember the money you spent to get your companion to level 50? Gone.

Remember how gearing actually meant something? Gone.

Remember when Conquest was an enjoyable diversion? Gone.

 

 

Looking at the thread it is clear that a lot of people are unhappy. As for me, my goal was to get the Imperial Fleet Apartment which should happen this coming week. After that, I'm going to pass leadership of my guilds to a subscriber and drop to preferred. Despite all the complaining I've done since beta the reality is that it wasn't until 7.0 that I stopped having fun.

 

Here is food for thought. I know you will all be sad I can't post anymore but think about this: since non-subscribers can't post in the forums and there is this much blowback on 7.0, just imagine the real number of people that dropped subscriptions or FTP players that won't subscribe because of 7.0 and can't make their voice heard here to explain why so BW can (theoretically) see what 7.0 has resulted in.

[iphacles]

Bumping this to answer my own question: YES

BW just went into overdrive to take everything away from the player. With capping all of the stats and the ability pruning, all the toons are cookie cutter. What's the difference between gunslinger and scoundrel now? No longer does it matter if you make a consistent power healer or a OG-when-it-hits crit healer.

 

Remember the money you spent to get your companion to level 50? Gone.

Remember how gearing actually meant something? Gone.

Remember when Conquest was an enjoyable diversion? Gone.

 

 

Looking at the thread it is clear that a lot of people are unhappy. As for me, my goal was to get the Imperial Fleet Apartment which should happen this coming week. After that, I'm going to pass leadership of my guilds to a subscriber and drop to preferred. Despite all the complaining I've done since beta the reality is that it wasn't until 7.0 that I stopped having fun.

 

Here is food for thought. I know you will all be sad I can't post anymore but think about this: since non-subscribers can't post in the forums and there is this much blowback on 7.0, just imagine the real number of people that dropped subscriptions or FTP players that won't subscribe because of 7.0 and can't make their voice heard here to explain why so BW can (theoretically) see what 7.0 has resulted in.

 

I feel the same way. I've played a lot of MMO's over the years and this is the first time that an expansion/update has made me quit/unsubscribe from a game. I've seen some garbage expansions in other games, but this one is by far the worst. All the fun/enjoyment I used to get from the game has been stripped away so completely it's actually impressive.

[Demonicterran]

I played World of Warcraft between 2005 until late 2020 and I can tell you, that every new expansion there were doomsayers saying "this expansion will be the end of the game". Still the game has endured and in fact grew after The Burning Crusade and Wrath of the Lich King expansions, but since then the playerbase has slowly declined. I don't know how it is today as I haven't played it for 1½ years, but judging by how few watches World of Warcraft videos from content creators that were once thriving in views, I don't think it goes very well for the game when it comes to the amount of players but it's merely a theory.

 

The point is that doomsayers will continue to say that "X expansions will destroy the game" every time a new expansion is released.

[Ruvalie]

I hope it's not the end. I still have a lot of stuff I want to do in the game. I am a bit concerned because the content releases get smaller and smaller every time - I mean, I don't personally care because I play for the class stories, but it's a bad sign. If it dies, it will be because Bioware/EA didn't bother to put enough money/manpower into it to keep it going. It would be sad to see such a waste.

[Lord_Morgul]

Bumping this to answer my own question: YES

BW just went into overdrive to take everything away from the player. With capping all of the stats and the ability pruning, all the toons are cookie cutter. What's the difference between gunslinger and scoundrel now? No longer does it matter if you make a consistent power healer or a OG-when-it-hits crit healer.

 

Remember the money you spent to get your companion to level 50? Gone.

Remember how gearing actually meant something? Gone.

Remember when Conquest was an enjoyable diversion? Gone.

 

 

Looking at the thread it is clear that a lot of people are unhappy. As for me, my goal was to get the Imperial Fleet Apartment which should happen this coming week. After that, I'm going to pass leadership of my guilds to a subscriber and drop to preferred. Despite all the complaining I've done since beta the reality is that it wasn't until 7.0 that I stopped having fun.

 

Here is food for thought. I know you will all be sad I can't post anymore but think about this: since non-subscribers can't post in the forums and there is this much blowback on 7.0, just imagine the real number of people that dropped subscriptions or FTP players that won't subscribe because of 7.0 and can't make their voice heard here to explain why so BW can (theoretically) see what 7.0 has resulted in.

 

You've captured exactly how I feel, but I doubt this is the end of the game. However, it is the end of the game for me or will be once the last 30 days of my six-month sub expire. After completing 7.0 on one toon I uninstalled the game and cancelled my sub. It's just not worth it to me any more to grind, only to get back to the point I was before without additional benefit. The only thing that kept me playing for past 10 years was my love of Stars Wars, it's no longer enough.

Edited March 13, 2022 by Lord_Morgul

[OlBuzzard]

I doubt very seriously "it's the end" !

 

That said I do believe that an old fashion evaluation is in order.

 

Reset to 6.0? Probably not! (Developers will never do that... so no need to pretend that either).

 

CQ's "similar" to 6.0. I can see that!

 

Better gear acquisition... DEFINATELY!

 

Get "moded gear" where it's working again ...

 

BUT most of all: Will SOMEBODY PLEASE just fix the stupid BUGS !!!

[DWho]

I doubt very seriously "it's the end" !

 

That said I do believe that an old fashion evaluation is in order.

 

Reset to 6.0? Probably not! (Developers will never do that... so no need to pretend that either).

 

CQ's "similar" to 6.0. I can see that!

 

Better gear acquisition... DEFINATELY!

 

Get "moded gear" where it's working again ...

 

BUT most of all: Will SOMEBODY PLEASE just fix the stupid BUGS !!!

 

The end: Probably not. Though, 7.0 has done some serious damage to the game and to what was left of Bioware's reputation. The sheer number of bugs is inexcusable. Having your story climax flashpoint, the crown jewel of 7.0, be so bugged that a substantial number of players can't even complete it without resorting to "cheese" mechanics is inexcusable. That doesn't bode well for future "Patches".

[EllieAnne]

For those that don't believe 7.0 is the end of SWTOR <gasp>, based on what you've seen as

the direction the developers are going and:

the fact that this 10th Anniversary is a yawnfest

their complete silence on bugs and issues with 7.0 (aka business as usual)

ignoring any sort of player feedback even back to it being tested on the PTS

the simplification of the game (less abilities, nuking stats to try to make levelsync work, one style of gameplay being favored, etc.)

non-moddable end gear

etc.

Would it be fair to say that 7.0 is the beginning of the end? Are they starting to move to maintenance mode? Can they just not sustain the game anymore due to lack of EA funds and BW workers?

Edited March 13, 2022 by EllieAnne

[Toraak]

All of the bugs are the main issue I see with 7.0, however they've already stated that bug fixes are already on the PTS ready to come out when 7.0.1 hit live. I'm sure we'll see more bug fixes soon enough.

 

They've already said they are aiming for 3/22/22 for 7.0.1.

 

As for this being the end of the game. No it won't be. People are always claiming that and the game keeps going. Eventually it'll shut down, but listening to the Doomsayers is generally a bad idea.

[OlBuzzard]

The end: Probably not. Though, 7.0 has done some serious damage to the game and to what was left of Bioware's reputation. The sheer number of bugs is inexcusable. Having your story climax flashpoint, the crown jewel of 7.0, be so bugged that a substantial number of players can't even complete it without resorting to "cheese" mechanics is inexcusable. That doesn't bode well for future "Patches".

 

This is definitely a part of the process. But also, is getting the community re-engaged in actually playing the game.

** The initial 7.0 story was good.

** The art department did their job.

** additional content needed

** Reinitializing at least a part of what made SWTOR ... well SWTOR is (IMO) also important.

 

Some have suggested that a game needs to follow the desires of a particular group: BAD idea! There is plenty of room for a larger group with multiple points of contact to an audience with a huge variety of likes and dislikes many of which have some form of emotional attachments (yes even for the Jedi). That is NOT the dark side. It IS, however, very human.

 

Right now, the game seems to have managed to become disconnected from a large portion of its audience.

** PvP

** PvE

** Solo

** Guilds ( both large and small)

** Raid groups

All of these have been a part of the SWTOR community. Unfortunately, over the last few years only one portion (or group) seems to have been "featured" in the development (different groups from time to time) ... and thereby leaving certain aspects of the game to either fall by the wayside or to become a point of disillusionment. (IMO PvP was one such area). For the record I'm not a PvP player.

 

I guess what I'm trying to say is that there are MANY aspects of this game. And still a great deal of potential to be explored. It's very expensive. It's time consuming to develop. BUT .. if that connection is ever made again.. OH MY!

 

IMO this same issue is what Disney was faced with. The last "trilogy" flopped (for the most part) because it failed to connect with it's audience. If it were not for the new "Mandalorian" and Boba Fett series Star Wars future would be a ghost at best. Dave Faloni and Jon Favreau are heading up a fantastic team ( there are several others) . But now (if I'm not careful) will go a little OT. BUT this does (IMO) illustrate how even the "best" can get disconnected from the fan base and nearly self destruct.

 

Hopefully we will see a strong reconnection (not just from one point of view) and once again move forward.

[LordPaulusCobris]

I agree...

The lack of engagement is staggering for this game...

The age of the MMO´s is closing to an end, and many ppl are past from this timesink of a game...

Like it was said, the game don´t really reward you with the time wasted on it...

 

About the story, many casuals wanted an KOTOR 3, but got this Wanna be of a game...

Being SW, there where no choice... and many went to it just for the story (class and planet stories).

 

After 50, the story started to be weaker and weaker... but it was kinda revitalized with the Eternal Empire Story Arc.

Many winned about the content... and because wanted more MP out of this game...

So Part 3 of the Story Arc was canned, and even less story content where released...

 

The last "expansions" have been a joke, story wise... nothing really have move at all... No more companion storys... No more interesting and complex writing... just plain sad and not interesting Imps vs Rep tug...

 

And then 7.0 came... and its horrible... For so much time waiting the lack of content is unnaceptable...

The changes are questionable, and to me is just a way of them spitting on the playerbase.

 

Many try to suggarcoat the dev team... you owe them NOTHING and no simpaty is needed to such an incompetent bunch...

 

Starting by the higher hierarquy, to the publisher, all of them are responsable for this miserable state, this game is in...

 

They don´t really care... and if they don´t care should we care?

Like i said before, vote with your wallet and money...

 

Any other game that didn´t have the SW name, would allready be dead and burried...

 

Best Regards,

 

LPC

Edited March 13, 2022 by LordPaulusCobris

[GeneralGyro]

I agree...

The lack of engagement is staggering for this game...

The age of the MMO´s is closing to an end, and many ppl are past from this timesink of a game...

Like it was said, the game don´t really reward you with the time wasted on it...

 

About the story, many casuals wanted an KOTOR 3, but got this Wanna be of a game...

Being SW, there where no choice... and many went to it just for the story (class and planet stories).

 

After 50, the story started to be weaker and weaker... but it was kinda revitalized with the Eternal Empire Story Arc.

Many winned about the content... and because wanted more MP out of this game...

So Part 3 of the Story Arc was canned, and even less story content where released...

 

The last "expansions" have been a joke, story wise... nothing really have move at all... No more companion storys... No more interesting and complex writing... just plain sad and not interesting Imps vs Rep tug...

 

And then 7.0 came... and its horrible... For so much time waiting the lack of content is unnaceptable...

The changes are questionable, and to me is just a way of them spitting on the playerbase.

 

Many try to suggarcoat the dev team... you owe them NOTHING and no simpaty is needed to such an incompetent bunch...

 

Starting by the higher hierarquy, to the publisher, all of them are responsable for this miserable state, this game is in...

 

They don´t really care... and if they don´t care should we care?

Like i said before, vote with your wallet and money...

 

Any other game that didn´t have the SW name, would allready be dead and burried...

 

Best Regards,

 

LPC

 

there are many MMOs now that are the best atm. ffxiv, lost ark etc. the old games like this and wow are dying though

[Nefla]

Yeah it really seems like they aren't being given the resources to make anything of substance, certainly not anything waiting a year+ and $180+ subscription fees for. Before I always just dismissed claims of the game no longer being worked on or updated but this time I feel it too. I would love for our characters to get a proper and definitive ending before that happens but it feels like it will just be cut off mid-plot and never finished.

[Totemdancer]

there are many MMOs now that are the best atm. ffxiv, lost ark etc. the old games like this and wow are dying though

 

Mainly because the dev leaders of both swtor and wow are disconnected with the wider player bases needs and wants. As well as not playing their own game enough to understand any feedback back they do read. It comes across as not caring or arrogance that they know best 100% of the time.

 

FF14 is going gang busters and still climbing since they rebuilt the initial game and listened to the players wants and needs. It dwarfs all other MMOs now by a massive margin because the lead producer and dev team care about making the best game possible for player enjoyment. That’s why they are successful and with that success comes lots of money.

Edited March 14, 2022 by Totemdancer

[Totemdancer]

Yeah it really seems like they aren't being given the resources to make anything of substance, certainly not anything waiting a year+ and $180+ subscription fees for. Before I always just dismissed claims of the game no longer being worked on or updated but this time I feel it too. I would love for our characters to get a proper and definitive ending before that happens but it feels like it will just be cut off mid-plot and never finished.

 

It’s not that they aren’t getting enough funds, it’s that they mismanage the funds they do get by reinventing the wheel constantly. They could have used the funds they got to make more content instead of reinventing the UI, the gear system, pruning class abilities and trees, which meant rebalancing content from lvl 1-80, nerfing companions into the ground.

 

All of their stated reasons for doing that don’t add up if you have limited funds. They said they redesigned the gearing to make it simpler and get rid of RNG. But the RNG is still as bad and it’s even more complicated to gear. All they needed to do to fix the RNG was get rid of 70% of the useless mods that dropped and allow people to buy min max mods from a vendor. RNG and complexity solved with a weeks worth of work.

 

None of what BioWare’s done makes any sense if they have such limited funds. People want content to play more than anything else. Why waste 12 months of development on what they did. Especially when so many hate it and it’s driven so many from the game. It’s mismanagement from the very top.

Edited March 14, 2022 by Totemdancer

[OlBuzzard]

If I'm not mistaken FF14 suffered a near death experience at one point. BUT someone decided to turn things around, and it worked. I would also suggest that some of the "featured changes" SWTOR is experiencing right now is in order to accommodate console games (ie PS-4 and PS-5).

 

I refuse to believe that their team (FF-14) is the only one capable of that kind of determination and work. Granted SWTOR needs an infusion of cash and the right team motivation to make some things happen. BUT until the last chapter is written I wouldn't write this game off just yet.