Blasphemerr Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) If you want to educate the few thousand players per sever on the proper function of their mini-map ... you go right ahead. But until there is a compass for every choob to read clearly I'm going to use the words they understand. That is my only goal, it's not to be smarter or even more efficient it's just to communicate that I need help <there> we can call snow cat turd and grass paper watermelon for all I care as long as people show up when help is requested. It's silly of you people that are projecting you're smarter than the community because you come equipped with cardinal directions, but you fail to realize consistently using ineffective communication makes you the inferior. Edited June 21, 2012 by Blasphemerr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razacc Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Snow/mid/grass...keep it simple. Visualization is important in a chaotic warzone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitsinni Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I guess the simplest way to put it is, if you don't automatically know where snow and grass is by now you are only dragging down your PvP team and should probably focus on PvE from here out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cempa Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Grass & Snow have my vote, on ToFN its exclusively Grass or Snow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryRow Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 If you own one turret and somebody calls Inc, they mean the one you own. If you own two turrets and the one you are at is fine, and someone calls Inc, they mean the other one. If you own two turrets and you are at the enemy turret, and someone calls inc, well, what were you doing trying to Rambo a 3 cap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sock_Bramson Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I said this in another thread already, but here it goes again: The easy visualisation aspect of grass/snow only happens when you're actually standing on either grass or snow. Then sure, you can tell where you are and what the other side is. Calling grass/snow becomes counter-productive once you're in/under mid or respawning , though. Yes, most people and I know that snow=east and grass=west, but why take the extra time to make that connection? A call for east/west will always simpler and will always be effective no matter where you are on the map. Plus, east/west is the best way to orient your defense in the other WZs. For consistency's sake, why can't we all use the universally useful method? Cardinal directions are your friends, people; don't neglect your friends. -Hedley Melange <Dynamic>, Dreshdae --> The Shadowlands- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HelinCarnate Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I've always called snow,mid,grass...makes the most sense and everyone knows exactly where to go. Sure you could use east and west but not everyone will know for sure immediately. I don't understand this argument, do you feel smarter because you say east and west?? Do you feel dumber if you can't figure out which way is east or west? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOGFelix Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Of course east and west are constant that is the entire basis of the words east and west and the concept of a map. East being left or right from the start area is going to change depending on where you start. The point is you can say grass and no one needs to look at where they are and compare that to the map they know exactly where the help is neeeded. This, and you had better get used to this fast as 1.3 will introduce same faction fights on this map. You keep calling E & W & see how many times you lose the node when that happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitsinni Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Do you feel dumber if you can't figure out which way is east or west? Apparently you feel really special based on your mastery of direction. WE ALL KNOW which is East and West, you just eliminate error more often by saying Grass or Snow. Some noob can run East thinking they are running West and not have a clue, but when you realize you are in a field of grass and they yelled snow you know you went the wrong way before taking your first step. You have someone play starting from the same side fifty times in a row and they get East = Left stuck in their head, then they start from the other side and get confused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glower Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Minimaps LEFT + RIGHT! L# R# F geographic directions! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tokesnjokes Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Snow/grass is better because of the multitude of derps that need to hold a rock in their hand to remember left from right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonoku Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 left/right those directions means from the chracters perspective the way they are looking not the minimap or map.East/West is more accurate because that's the map's perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaodon Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I said this in another thread already, but here it goes again: The easy visualisation aspect of grass/snow only happens when you're actually standing on either grass or snow. This is false, unless you are one of the 3 people playing SWTOR in 1st person camera mode. The rest of us zoom the camera all the way out, and can see the entire battlefield from any spot. There is no issue knowing where grass and snow are from mid. You can just turn 45 degrees and look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YanksfanJP Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 This is false, unless you are one of the 3 people playing SWTOR in 1st person camera mode. The rest of us zoom the camera all the way out, and can see the entire battlefield from any spot. There is no issue knowing where grass and snow are from mid. You can just turn 45 degrees and look. You are wrong, because of how the structure is, you can't zoom out enough to see the snow and grass if you're standing next to the turret. You have to randomly pick a side, run up the ramp, and look over the wall and hope you chose wisely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YanksfanJP Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 This, and you had better get used to this fast as 1.3 will introduce same faction fights on this map. You keep calling E & W & see how many times you lose the node when that happens. Because east and west change? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kentontudor Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 The OP is just completely wrong about his argument. Many of us play both factions. Therefore (depending on how much you flip-flop between characters) the mini-map changes and is different for the Empire. Yes, I know which way East and West are... but when I'm playing my Bounty Hunter (when I think I might be playing a Republic character) I might start off running the wrong direction which kills a few CRUCIAL seconds that can make or break a cap. If you don't want to jump on board with the rest of the population, then it's not our fault. You are wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearasite Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Please dont use Right/Left anywhere. Cause then people will use Right Left in Voidstar. Right Left is all based on perspective and is inconsistent. If you're defending in Voidstar someone will die and then as they look out the respawn window they will say "LEFT!" So they mean that they want people to go Left as they exit the spawn area. Too bad this is actually Right if your brain assigns Right and Left based on the minimap. Right-Left is bad communication. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaar Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I use grass/snow, it works. What I normally see in warzones is this "HELP!!", with absolutely no clue as to where that help is required lol It's normally followed by a rage statement along the lines of "Why did no one help me defend!! noobs!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkDruidSS Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) 1. I think it's pretty safe to say that grass and snow or both universally understood as well. Also safe to say that more people on this planet recognize grass as being green and snow being white than people that are familiar with a compass or map. (If you don't believe me ask the tribes of south Africa) Novarre Coast excluded since the nodes are actually named by "south. east and west) 2. Right and Left on voidstar are and should be based on direction from spawn and always have been. I have had very little problems with this on my servers. 3. Both of the above are probably easier and quicker for MOST people to recognize as unfortunately many people are not so familiar with it that they can recognize it in split seconds where as EVERYONE IS familiar with their right and left, grass and snow since being a small child. 4. I feel these options are possibly better for the fact that even though in some cases and in some people's opinions they may be less "accurate"... they are however more recognizable and can be computed by the brain faster by most people giving an even quicker reaction time. 5. WHO CARES???? This post pretty much nails it. If you are running a premade then you guys can use whatever call tags you want, but the simple truth is that most PUGs can understand grass/snow and left/right faster than east/west. I use grass/snow, it works. What I normally see in warzones is this "HELP!!", with absolutely no clue as to where that help is required lol It's normally followed by a rage statement along the lines of "Why did no one help me defend!! noobs!" I usually see HALP!!! HALP!! inc!! Totally get what you are saying. haha. Edited June 21, 2012 by DarkDruidSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sock_Bramson Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Like yank said, all the camera zoom in the world won't let you see the sides from the middle/ under the middle. You can kinda see them from the respawn ship, but I find it quicker to glance at the minimap as I run to the speeders, rather than running to the edge to look over the field. For everyone who plays both factions who says that they get confused by flip-flopping sides: If you get momentarily confused, grass/snow is not gonna help you any more than east/west. Just as east/west never change, grass/snow never change. If you forget which end of the map you started on, you have forgotten what each side is. I'm not saying grass/snow can't work; they do. I'm just saying that east/west is better, since it is effective in literally any scenario; all it takes is a quick glance at your minimap. Besides, most of the grass/snow proponents have said themselves that they equate snow/grass with east/west, they just call grass/snow. Why wouldn't you just call east/west? Yes, you can easily tell that you've gone to the wrong side when you step on snow after someone called grass. However, at that point you've already wasted much more time than it takes to check your minimap after hearing a call for east/west. Hell, if you go the wrong way in either case, you should realize it as soon as you round the corner and see no enemies. Basically, the "visualization" aspect of calling snow/grass does not make the system better, because by the time you've seen your mistake, you've already wasted too much time. Please, use east/west, and when you hear the call, don't be dumb; take 1 second (probably less than a second, really), look at your minimap, and go help the correct side. -Hedley Melange <Dynamic>, Dreshdae-->The Shadowlands- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkDruidSS Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Like yank said, all the camera zoom in the world won't let you see the sides from the middle/ under the middle. You can tell by looking at which spawn you are facing. It's not hard. You guys are trying to make it much harder than it is which is why it works for PUGs... because it isn't hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vedano Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 This argument is null as using east and west would only be helpful to someone new to the warzone itself. They would have no idea as to where grass or snow was and would need an explanation considering they are new. However, most of us have played civil war enough to complain about the use of grass and snow and know which side is which so it is an effective means of communication. Changing grass/snow to east/west only helps someone that has no idea about the terminology of the map. If you don't know where grass and snow are at this point with 6 months of playing this game, then you really shouldn't be playing this game at all, as deciphering the difference between which side is snow and which side is grass is pretty elementery. Further more, who gives a rats ***** about what its called? If it's called just go there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YanksfanJP Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) You can tell by looking at which spawn you are facing. It's not hard. You guys are trying to make it much harder than it is which is why it works for PUGs... because it isn't hard. One of the spawns is grass. The other spawn is snow. It's not split in half with snow on the snow side and grass on the grass side. There's a reason it's easy to tell what is where in Arathi Basin and Eye of the Storm, and it's because you can see everything you need to see in order to determine all the nodes no matter where you are. Heck, you can usually see most of the nodes themselves. Edited June 21, 2012 by YanksfanJP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WmongerCZ Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) Useless thread I am used to snow/grass. I will use snow/grass. Get used to it or die on my We are not "yogurt" nation. We all are from different servers, different environments. We have our history, our habits. Do not push us to use your language because it is the most "true" for you. DO NOT HOMOGENIZE US! It is not fun! Snow/grass rulez! Edited June 21, 2012 by WmongerCZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancaglon Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) If you own one turret and somebody calls Inc, they mean the one you own. If you own two turrets and the one you are at is fine, and someone calls Inc, they mean the other one. If you own two turrets and you are at the enemy turret, and someone calls inc, well, what were you doing trying to Rambo a 3 cap? Good call I think a lot of the debate here is because MOST players PVP on just 1 faction and don't realize that (on Voidstar and Civil War at least) the map is flipped the other way up for the other faction, so the "natural" "North = Up, so West = Left and East = Right" doesn't apply everywhere. I haven't yet done any PVP on the PTS this test cycle, so I haven't experienced a same-side Civil War game to see if that map is flipped, can anyone confirm/deny? Edited June 21, 2012 by Ancaglon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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