Is RE broke?

[Gemin]

I happen to enjoy crafting for simply the crafting. The issue is that my Synthweaver and Armormech have absolutely no use now that I'm lvl 50. The only reason I'd even craft now is for the gambling-like additction of getting a new schematic. LvL 50 seems to negate crafting for all professions except for BioChem, Cybertech and possibly Armstech- I currently have an Armstech in training solely to get to lvl 400 so I can craft Techblades for my companions who need them because for some stupid reason several companions in the game are stuck using the only weapon that doesn't come in a modable version.

Modable weapons and armours already make these professions end-game obsolete. I have two lvl 50 characters and the whole thing now is getting Hard Mode drops for better gear etc.

 

If the dev's say RE "isn't working as intended" I'm not going to argue. I don't NEED better RE rates. I was already upping my stock of Drasteel, Zal Alloy and Ciridium to 1k each because it was too damn frustrating watching hundreds of mats vanish into thin air with zero return before the announcement of the potential changes to the RE system. Sure, that makes things a bit easier for me but it still isn't the changes I'd like to see.

 

What I'd like to see is a return to Beta days when you could RE green loot and get a schematic. Or even mats. All loot now is just turned into credits. It seems like the "Junk Loot" from Dragon Age 2 all over again. It makes our characters glorified middle-men. If we could at least RE the stuff for the paltry amount of mats things tend to give for REing then at least we'd have the CHOICE to sell or RE. Personally, when I loot a crappy green armour piece that I like the look of, I'd like the opportunity to RE it for a schematic. I don't need 100% success on it, but I'm a bit of a collector of schematics and I would like to do it.

 

Another thing I'd like to see is the chance to RE something into an Orange schematic. More options to dress how you want with the stats that you want are always good.

 

Finally, I'd like to see Crit on Orange gear not only give an augment slot but a chance at adding another stat as well. Might actually create some market competition. As it is right now, high-lvl players just get their orange gear and then armoursmiths and Synthweavers are never heard from again.

 

Of course high-lvl players who raid or PvP can bypass the crafting professions completely.

[BloodbathNBeyond]

Honestly, I'm disheartened at the difficulty of trying to earn credits using a crafting skill for gear, especially considering most of the gear isn't even viable for anyone at level 50 (or at least modification type items are not compared to crafted level 50 purples which require items that drop from hardmodes).

 

Pretty much this - I've been finding that as you creep closer to endgame, everybody makes a rush for PVE/PVP gear and crafting goes out the door as a viable option for any kind of equipment.

 

Now, I realize that "endgame is endgame" but making tangible rewards for those who have a crafting skill maxed to outfit themselves/others with something that can't be achieved simply by grinding dailies would go a long way towards making crafting an attractive proposition for more than some quick cash while levelling (and that's even if you can make a profit after you waste so much money gathering mats and burning them for RE's).

[Larkie]

Of course it isn't.

 

Do you really think they would come out and say its broken?

 

Do you think any company would admit to their product being broken if they don't have to?

 

its obvious you are a very naive person if you think gaming companies ever come out and say their games are broken.

 

I guess all the recent failed MMOs isn't proof of that. All those games are fine and it was the players who didn't know better.....rofl.

 

Whats the colour of the sky in your world?

 

Sooo you went from falsely accusing me of calling the dev a liar, to calling the dev a liar yourself? Really?

 

Let's try and look at it logically then. Tell me, which patch do you believe it broke on, which level of items did it break and for which professions? Or do you believe it's all the items?

[Pureblade]

Personally I think the RE rate should NOT be increased. The REAL issues are the lack of utility in the items that get produced, the multitude of RE recipes that are useless, etc. Make a BETTER system, where bugs like duplicate RE success is fixed, make the resulting items better, i.e. 2x RE on a starting blue should get a SECOND stat increase on the 2nd RE from purple (1st level) to purple (2nd level), etc.

 

DON'T make it so RE is easier. Having every crafter who does not care about hard work and dedication be able to get the best recipes is a TERRIBLE idea. Improve the products and results from being a dedicated crafter, DON'T dilute the value of dedication by making it easier.

[Amiracle]

Sooo you went from falsely accusing me of calling the dev a liar, to calling the dev a liar yourself? Really?

 

Let's try and look at it logically then. Tell me, which patch do you believe it broke on, which level of items did it break and for which professions? Or do you believe it's all the items?

 

You are the one saying nothing is wrong when a dev has said different.

 

Its obvious you cannot see past your own nose.

 

And you are the one disagreeing with the dev.

 

Please prove the dev wrong.

 

You seem to be the only one who doesn't see an issue.

 

Proof below. Please tell the devs how you are right and they are wrong.

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by PatrickMalott

The reverse engineering return rate is not currently working as intended. In an upcoming patch, we are improving the reverse engineering rates – especially for the higher-level items. We are also looking into the issue where a player receives "You already know that schematic" instead of learning a new research variation.

 

Patrick Malott

Systems Designer

Edited February 10, 2012 by Amiracle

[Larkie]

You are the one saying nothing is wrong when a dev has said different.

 

Its obvious you cannot see past your own nose.

 

And you are the one disagreeing with the dev.

 

Please prove the dev wrong.

 

You seem to be the only one who doesn't see an issue.

 

Proof below. Please tell the devs how you are right and they are wrong.

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by PatrickMalott

The reverse engineering return rate is not currently working as intended. In an upcoming patch, we are improving the reverse engineering rates – especially for the higher-level items. We are also looking into the issue where a player receives "You already know that schematic" instead of learning a new research variation.

 

Patrick Malott

Systems Designer

 

****, seriously?

Okay, let me say it for the 101st time – saying “not working as intended” is not the same as saying it broke on a specific patch. What it means is that they’ve decided to change the RE rate.

 

You said the devs are lying, RIGHT HERE:

Of course it isn't.

 

Do you really think they would come out and say its broken?

 

Do you think any company would admit to their product being broken if they don't have to?

 

its obvious you are a very naive person if you think gaming companies ever come out and say their games are broken.

 

I guess all the recent failed MMOs isn't proof of that. All those games are fine and it was the players who didn't know better.....rofl.

 

Whats the colour of the sky in your world?

 

 

WHAT patch do you think it broke on? Which levels of schems broke or do you think it's all of them? All professions or just some? You are COMPLETELY INCAPABLE OF ANSWERING THESE THREE QUESTIONS.

 

I would think you were being deliberately obtuse if I thought you were capable of it. The devs want to change the rate. They didn’t say it broke on so-and-so patch. YOU HAVE NO POINT except “something is wrong somewhere and anyone who thinks differently is wrong”.

 

This is like debating with a brick wall only you’re less capable of understanding than a brick wall would be because at least the brick wall knows it has no ability to argue its way out of a paper bag.

 

Answer the three questions I asked. Simple as that. Which patch. Which level of schems. Which professions. Prove that you have SOMETHING that you are actually arguing for.

 

PS Read the post right above yours. And many others. I'm not the only person that doesn't think that the RE rate has changed.

[Dezeit]

Please, Please , Please seperate the issue of RE crit rates and the market being flooded with purple items.

 

All crafters know that purple items need purple mats to make. As long as purple mats are rare then the market will not be saturated.

 

Crafting was one thing I really liked about SWTOR, but the RE rates are out of sync with the game. I am predominantly a crafter (just not hard core). My companions are always out gathering and I harvest all the nodes I find. 100 RE's of a blue for no crit is not "as intended"

 

The issue is that in the 40's even concentrating on crafting, I level past the items before I get a crit to purple, or blue for some. If I do get a purple then most of the time it is not an item I want. A mercenary with Shield stat items is just so useful - NOT.

 

I am now 49 just to make 50, so my ArmorMech is now going to be virtually useless. For me this needs fixing but its getting to late for me to care. SWTOR was launched when it was not ready (yes I was in Beta or should I say Alpha, this is more like Beta).

 

Lost my love with the game. The patch notes for 1.1.3 have no fix for this, developers need to state a timeline as I have about a week before I cancel my subscription for this beta game.

[Amiracle]

First Post by Bio.

01.20.2012 , 12:55 AM

 

Report Post

The rates associated with reverse engineering these items should be the same as it was before the patch, and it should be possible to learn the blue to purple recipes.

 

 

Second post by Bio.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by PatrickMalott

The reverse engineering return rate is not currently working as intended. In an upcoming patch, we are improving the reverse engineering rates – especially for the higher-level items. We are also looking into the issue where a player receives "You already know that schematic" instead of learning a new research variation.

 

Patrick Malott

Systems Designer

 

You can argue semantics all you want. Just point your gun at Bio because they seem to not agree with you.

 

And its not the fact that no one has said or given you their failure rate, there are quite a few people posting their failure rates.

 

You just refuse to believe it because you think you know better.

[Amiracle]

I'm sorry, do you actually believe that some people are lucky at RE and others are unlucky? It's random. There aren't people running around with lucky rabbits feet. Unless you believe the video game gods are smiling on certain people...

 

This pretty much shows that you do not understand what it means to be lucky.....rofl.

 

The fact that the success is based on the RNG and you don't think its luck.....rofl

Edited February 10, 2012 by Amiracle

[Metalmac]

I wrote software for years and Random Number Generators are NOT RANDOM AT ALL.

 

Every single one ever created follows a pattern every time.

 

You can use a supercomputer you still will see they are not random at all.

 

Every single time you restart the computer it resets to the same pattern.

 

How you get random is timing the number generation with key press from the user.

 

No two users will ever press the buttons exactly at the same time in micro seconds.

 

But apparently those at Bio Ware do not know this fact.

[Aeryl]

I think both sides are full of it. I don't see why everyone thinks they need to RE every single schematic to purple.

 

First, buy schematics for stuff you will use. RE the things you make to level up. If you happen to get a blue schematic out of it, great. If not, just try from the next stuff you make to level your crafting. Trying to get a purple to use as you level your character is a waste of money. If you get the blue schematics quickly, branch out and learn a different one. Don't feel the need to learn everything because equipment is way too easy to upgrade and gear lasts you several levels.

 

I've had things that didn't take many attempts and I've had things that took a lot of attempts. That's not broken, it's random. That's exactly how it's supposed to work. "Fixing" the RNG would only mean raising the rate of RE success.

[malspeed]

I think they stealth nerfed it in the last patch.

 

I have broken over 100 barrels with no new patterns and they are all blues below level 49.

 

I have broken 56 blue level 49 implants with no new pattern. I know implants are bad, but this sucks.

 

I guess they want to slow down the crafting engine and pull gobs of cash out of the system.

 

One more nail in the coffin. This is the same nonsense they did in Everquest. And you can see how that worked out for Sony. This is so frustrating. I was getting a new barrel every 10 or so breaks before the patch. I can understand difficultly scaling with level but this is silly.

 

I'm just going to stop trying as it seems pointless. I make the few purples I have and count myself lucky I got the patterns before the stealth nerf.

 

I just read the last pages. They really should have let us know, I wastes so many mats.

Edited February 10, 2012 by malspeed
read the last page

[dgrigo]

I have Broken 140 Blue Implants and got only 1 at the 10th.

I dont understand, none wants to buy crafted cause they get Raid or PVP gear and the cost to RE HUGE.

Also i had run 20 Diplomacy missions (purple) and half was failed.. ffs it feels like punishment cause i want to crit.. an item.

 

 

Oh btw i believe they changed the champ bags and by doing that, they used the same rng for all the lvl 49 recipes so we get nothing or have a very small chance anyway.

 

Sorry but i feel ripped of in this game from every aspect i see it.

It doesn't worth a subscription at all.

Edited February 11, 2012 by dgrigo

[FourTwent]

The reverse engineering return rate is not currently working as intended. In an upcoming patch, we are improving the reverse engineering rates – especially for the higher-level items. We are also looking into the issue where a player receives "You already know that schematic" instead of learning a new research variation.

 

Patrick Malott

Systems Designer

 

I'm kinda sad about this response.

 

Come on, it's gotta be 1 line of code(even if it's one line of code for each crafting skill) that has the RE success rate in it.

 

Basically you're telling me to not craft anything and cause my toons to be undergeared because you want to deploy the patch later rather than sooner?

 

I continue crafting even though my toons are insanely low on credits and each time I do, it pains me to think that its just going to be yet another failed RE because you guys are taking your time. Just go in and edit the code and increase the rate a little bit. Let live do the testing and increase it again if you feel the results aren't good enough.

 

You changing the drop rate from .1 to .2(or whatever the rates were and will be) isn't going to break any code.

[NicWester]

My question for the people saying that this is just bad luck is, have you tried since the patch?

 

It's definitely possible to get blues and purples post-patch.

 

I hit 50 the day of the patch and started working on the highest tier (purchasable) gear. It took probably 10 green Hyper-Battle Skill Stims to get a blue recipe, and while I wasn't counting, it took probably another 15-20 blues to get the purple this morning.

 

I fared a little better with the Skill Implant, getting the blue (Critical variety) on the first RE of a green. I then had the bad-good luck enough to get a purple on the second blue RE, except that it was Shield rating so I've been crafting more in search of a better result. Since then I've crafted maybe 10 or so and have had no further purples. I've got another batch of 10 being crafted right now and I will check the results when I'm done with dinner.

 

I've also gotten blue recipies with Ultimate Medpac (no purple), though I'm not sure if that was before or after the patch.

[malspeed]

It's definitely possible to get blues and purples post-patch.

 

I hit 50 the day of the patch and started working on the highest tier (purchasable) gear. It took probably 10 green Hyper-Battle Skill Stims to get a blue recipe, and while I wasn't counting, it took probably another 15-20 blues to get the purple this morning.

 

You are definitely a lucky person; go buy a lottery ticket because you are putting the rest of to shame.

 

It was not this bad when the game came out (but was still awful); it was definitely a stealth nerf, like several others they have slipped in. The game is struggling as it is; these sorts of things really make people look for the next best game to come out as it generates negative loyalty when you make an unpleasant crafting system even worse. I'm just glad I got some purple recipes before they did this nonsense. My wife stopped playing as have a few guild mates. It seems this game is atrophying faster than Rift did.

[FourTwent]

You are definitely a lucky person; go buy a lottery ticket because you are putting the rest of to shame.

 

It was not this bad when the game came out (but was still awful); it was definitely a stealth nerf, like several others they have slipped in. The game is struggling as it is; these sorts of things really make people look for the next best game to come out as it generates negative loyalty when you make an unpleasant crafting system even worse. I'm just glad I got some purple recipes before they did this nonsense. My wife stopped playing as have a few guild mates. It seems this game is atrophying faster than Rift did.

 

There was no stealth nerf, and I highly doubt they changed code somewhere which in turn broke this. Get serious, take the tin foil hat off.

 

I've RE'd into multiple different purples since launch(even after the 'mysterious stealth nerf patch'). Some take a couple tries, others can take dozens, but its not like its beyond unreasonable.

 

I find myself waiting on more gathering missions for those purple mats than specifically REing items. Then again, maybe it's effecting specific professions differently. I only have toons with Biochem, Cybertech, and Artifice.

Edited February 11, 2012 by FourTwent

[Balenndin]

I have Broken 140 Blue Implants and got only 1 at the 10th.

I dont understand, none wants to buy crafted cause they get Raid or PVP gear and the cost to RE HUGE.

Also i had run 20 Diplomacy missions (purple) and half was failed.. ffs it feels like punishment cause i want to crit.. an item.

 

 

Oh btw i believe they changed the champ bags and by doing that, they used the same rng for all the lvl 49 recipes so we get nothing or have a very small chance anyway.

 

Sorry but i feel ripped of in this game from every aspect i see it.

It doesn't worth a subscription at all.

 

So your claiming you have made and broken all those items plus 20 diplomacy of what level, because the time it takes to get all those matts plus time taken to craft blues and yet alone 20 diplomecy and all this since the last patch surely thow speak out there ***. I curently craft artiface,biochem and cybertech all at 400 with very few problems AT ALL going from blue to purple or getting other varients of the base schematic. Why dont you just say you want your candy for free and be done with it.

 

This isnt just at your post i laughed alot of others as well, i just picked you for the 140 items RE'd due to the amount of matts needed.

[Wyrdstar]

44 blue level 50 sniper rifle REs and counting.

[Jamiehex]

Yeah,it's not broke,messed up or actually not working as designed which is why a Bioware employee took time to post in this thread that the drop rate and RE'ing a recipe you already know isn't how they intended it to be and it will be fixed in an upcoming patch.The word fixed kinda implies it was broken,to me anyway.

 

[EDIT]Sorry if I sound mean but it's early and I'm only halfway through my first coffee and haven't had a cigarette yet

 

It doesn't say "fixed" anywhere in his post. It says "improved" which means much like when a jedi dies and cries a nerf has to happen.

[dgrigo]

So your claiming you have made and broken all those items plus 20 diplomacy of what level, because the time it takes to get all those matts plus time taken to craft blues and yet alone 20 diplomecy and all this since the last patch surely thow speak out there ***. I curently craft artiface,biochem and cybertech all at 400 with very few problems AT ALL going from blue to purple or getting other varients of the base schematic. Why dont you just say you want your candy for free and be done with it.

 

This isnt just at your post i laughed alot of others as well, i just picked you for the 140 items RE'd due to the amount of matts needed.

 

I normaly never post in forums , so normaly i am not replying to smart ones like you.

 

So same as its imposible to get at 50 in 5 days, or max a proffession from scratch in 24 hours, or get 500k per day and buy all materials that exist at server for tier 6( the ones you need).

Laugh as much as you want Smartie.

Signing off / goodbye and if you want my stuff its yours , just ask bioware.

[Squeeges]

Took me about 60 to get my first purple earpiece, of course I got the one with presence on it. I'm running a bunch of crafting missions now trying to get more mats. I am at 38 RE'd blues on a different pattern and counting. This would be awesome if there weren't better items out there. If we were truly going after the best items this would be perfect. As it is it's fun and challenging but not sure it's worth it in the long run.

[FourTwent]

This would be awesome if there weren't better items out there. If we were truly going after the best items this would be perfect. As it is it's fun and challenging but not sure it's worth it in the long run.

 

And this is what bugs me about the system, not the number of times it takes me to get the purple I want, but this.

 

I can only hope that they're saving up a bunch of new changes and additions for a big 'update to crafting' patch. But to think it out, how would they make it balanced if it were better or on par with pvp/pve gear?

 

Multiple Alloys per piece? BoP, so you can't sell them? Only 1 uber useful crafted item per profession(i hope it's not this one)? 30+ of the grade 6 purple mats?

 

There has to be a major grind factor/time sink if they start allowing crafters to make gear that beats or is on par with the pvp/pve gear. Else, it will just flood the economy and take 2 major aspects of the game out of the equation. The way it is now just doesn't seem to be /that/ grindy when you're making your companions do the mission and just hope for a crit for the purple mats you need.

[iResist]

Yesterday I got:

 

 

1 level 32 purple reusable stim (took only about 5 RE's in total from green to purple)

1 level 32 purple reusable med pack (took only about 6 RE's in total from green to purple)

1 level 32 purple reusable adrenal (took only 3 RE's in total from green to purple)

 

 

1 level 37 epic implant recipe (took about 11 RE's to get)

2 level 33 epic implant recipes (took about ~25 RE's in total to get both)

 

 

RE'ing seems perfectly fine to me.... maybe even a little TOO easy.

[Squeeges]

My post is only in response to level 50 items, it is easier for lower lvl items.