PTS: GSF added to PvP Season 3 track

[Stradlin]

On 5/17/2023 at 8:28 PM, DakhathKilrathi said:

Yeah. It's still baffling. None of the reasons given make any sense at all and the more I think it over the less sense it makes. I was hoping to get clarification, because I do understand that they're not doing it for no reason at all. I know we're not owed that, but again, the way this thread went just feels pretty bad. 

This is the only thread about latest TC iteration that generates any wider interest from community at all. One would think that sends even some kind of a message to BW.

[phalczen]

On 5/10/2023 at 11:39 AM, BryantWood said:

Hey everyone, thanks for your feedback regarding the addition of Galactic Starfighter to the PvP Season track! The team has taken a look at the issues you’ve raised surrounding the current state of Galactic Starfighter such as the medals, objectives, skill gap, and bugs. After evaluating this feedback we’ve come to the conclusion that GSF is not in a good position to be added to the PvP Seasons track at this time.

Thank you again for your constructive feedback regarding this change! We will continue to monitor PvP Seasons and your feedback to improve PvP Seasons going forward.

I know I'm coming to this response quite late, and I know the thread's been unpinned.  But add my voice to the list of people disappointed by this change.  There were more responses AFTER you nixed the proposed feature than before, interestingly enough.  Maybe that should tell you something about the feedback you evaluated and your conclusions.

At least you said "at this time," leaving open the possibility that there might be some consideration of GSF within the next 5 years.  It's actually hard to imagine that its been over 5 years since GSF got some love, and how much the world and the main game has changed since then.  Still, I'm disheartened that your best move was to throw in the towel.

"Bugs"

• We know that medal tracking works just fine for conquest and for Galactic Seasons.  The leaderboard display bug couldn't have possibly stopped you from implementing this, as clearly the medals are still being tracked.
• I haven't seen this bug in a few months:  https://forums.swtor.com/topic/923036-gsf-bug/  but while game-breaking actually doesn't directly impact this feature addition.
• The tier 4-5 component deselect bug is well known and well-worked-around so that can't possibly be the bug blocking this feature.

"Skill gap"

The skill gap is the same issue now as it was, well, 5 years ago.  All it does is that it means highly skilled pilots can earn an 100 extra pvp season points translating into that much less in terms of the ground game, which is like 3 warzones or 6 arenas' worth of points.  Your original post's proposal has already limited the impact of the skill gap, because its only a single optional seventh objective augmenting the original six.

The skill gap issue is also only minimally relevant to pvp season participation overall.  If players remain incapable of getting that weekly objective done, through lack of skill or some other attribute that prevents them from doing well in GSF, they still have the original six other objectives.  And let's face it, even if one hates Arenas one still must participate in them for:

• galactic seasons weekly objectives, such as this very week of May 30-June 5
• if one wanted to hit that 4/4 weekly objectives completed
• if one wanted to ensure they earned enough medals for the 2000 medal achievement
• if one wanted to complete the 12 weekly arena missions achievement
• or any combination of the above.

So, full participation in a pvp season has always required a player to step outside their comfort zone and do things for which they may not be highly skilled.

"Medals and objectives"

Ramalina and Dakhath did an excellent job outlining the medals for you.  There is no shortage of potential medals.  I'm not sure how this became an obstacle to implementation.  By your own original post, there was never an intent to tie this into match participation/completions or wins, which makes the proposal of medals a solid preempting of the AFK/self-destructor concern.  That's not to say the AFK/self-destructor issue isn't real or worthy of being addressed.  Rather, that issue serves as an obstacle to implementing a larger set of potential objectives or even a GSF season structure on its own ... but not your proposed optional addition.

Executive Summary:

"It's too hard, so we're not going to do it now."  I mean, that's basically what your response boils down to.  I totally get that team resources are thin, and that there may not even be personnel familiar with the GSF code left on the team.  I'm one of the first forum-posters to admit that limited resources are often best spent on content everyone can enjoy rather than niche areas.  So, I understand that you've decided the obstacles were too much to handle in the 7.3 development window.  I just don't buy your arguments though, for the reasons above.  None of the things you mentioned would have stopped you from doing this, even the leaderboard bug.  I don't have a tremendous amount of optimism that a feature like this will ever be implemented, but I guess you haven't said it will never happen, so there's that.

[Stradlin]

33 minutes ago, phalczen said:

 

"It's too hard, so we're not going to do it now."  I mean, that's basically what your response boils down to.  I totally get that team resources are thin, and that there may not even be personnel familiar with the GSF code left on the team.  I'm one of the first forum-posters to admit that limited resources are often best spent on content everyone can enjoy rather than niche areas.  So, I understand that you've decided the obstacles were too much to handle in the 7.3 development window.  I just don't buy your arguments though, for the reasons above.  None of the things you mentioned would have stopped you from doing this, even the leaderboard bug.  I don't have a tremendous amount of optimism that a feature like this will ever be implemented, but I guess you haven't said it will never happen, so there's that.

 

I'm also afraid that's the case. Just that I suppose integration of PvP Seasons and GSF  prolly wouldn't even really  require familiarity with GSF code. Just familiarity with how reward systems happen. Which they still can clearly manage. I fear the issue is with GSF being kinda alien to the remaining BW devs. Nevermind the code and development, , but it is prolly  just unknown even  as a game mode. I recon  none of them " knows" GSF in a way some normal player  who has done 20 matches knows it.

I still wonder what on earth they heard and from whom that made them cut feedback gathering short after TWO DAYS.This whole initiative was announced and ended long before most people even heard of it.

None of the reasons BryantWood listed makes any sense to anyone familiar with GSF.

 

 

 

Edited June 3, 2023 by Stradlin

[LordBladewind]

On 5/8/2023 at 4:20 PM, JackieKo said:

EDIT: Adding for clarification that this will only be a weekly Subscriber objective. 

It would be nice if GSF can reduce some arena grinding... but why is it a sub only objective?
If BW is not going to do anything meaningful, then don't touch it.
The last thing we need is to force players to grind more stuff, so they just come in to GSF and mimic ignoring the huttball.

[DakhathKilrathi]

I think a lot of our questions were answered indirectly: https://forums.swtor.com/topic/929816-an-update-on-the-development-of-swtor/

They don't have the resources and I imagine we can just forget about GSF updates in the future if this happens. At best it just won't get broken. 

[Stradlin]

On 6/14/2023 at 5:38 AM, DakhathKilrathi said:

I think a lot of our questions were answered indirectly: https://forums.swtor.com/topic/929816-an-update-on-the-development-of-swtor/

They don't have the resources and I imagine we can just forget about GSF updates in the future if this happens. At best it just won't get broken. 

 

Maybe. More optimistic take is ripe for pickings  too,though:  It seems very likely to me that any future content with  fully voiced playerchar is soon a thing no more. Been extremely costly, difficult and borderline unfeasable for years.  Once that is over and  the coming budget and devving muscle... changes are in,perhaps they'll be forced to  highlight   stuff that is cheaper to dev.  Perhaps they give attention to  things that stand repetition and come with sick amount of longevity. Such as GSF.

 

In general the whole story based mmo thing is such a nasty catch 22. Most people are here for the story and want more of it.  When they get 15 mins of story it remains fresh and exciting for....15 mins. Then it kinda  stops being content that keeps subs subbing.  15 mins after its release,  people want more.  Something like new GSF game mode would last years or decades...for those who enjoy GSF.

 

Solution: make more people enjoy GSF.

 

Ofc, far as I know,  none of  the brilliant devs who made GSF even work for SWTOR anymore. How well current devs even know  GSF(as players or as devs) is anyone's guess I guess.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Stradlin

[Stradlin]

Very few threads posted on PTS forums have generated as much interest as this did. 

Even folks who care nothing of GSF have come to recognize how ..unfair it is that  GSF has been completely ignored for years. Dear BS, re you ever gonna do anything at all to GSF?

Even including it to pvp seasons would go a long way.

 

[Lord_Janosch]

I would like that the devs think about the idea of adding GSF to PVP-Seasons again. In the last months I have noticed a clear decrease in GSF pops (Tulak Hord). It mostly only pops when there are galactic season goals linked to GSF. By adding GSF to PVP-seasons (optional) there would be more incentive for people to queue GSF.

I would love if the devs discuss anew about it.

[Toraak]

I see no mention of GSF added to PvP season 5 still. Clearly GSF players are the red headed step child of Swtor.

[Darkestmonty]

22 hours ago, Toraak said:

I see no mention of GSF added to PvP season 5 still. Clearly GSF players are the red headed step child of Swtor.

it's kind of a good thing. GSF is so isolated from normal development it will never get canceled like Ranked PvP.

[Stradlin]

@BryantWood

Would it be possible to hear some thoughts of dev team about this? Why was GSF not added to PvP seasonal reward track? Do you have plans to do so in future? Any other GSF related plans?