Itemization in 7.0

[Pricia]

I noticed something on the PTS, which I put a comment on the PTS forums on this as well.

 

In this build there is a weekly cap of 600 Medals of Commendations (In this build we get 200 per character we complete conquest on)

 

As well as an 800 weekly cap on the new Aquatic Resource Matrix (in this build each daily area gives 100 when you complete the weekly, and each daily gives 3 as well).

 

Both of these caps are legacy wide, not per character, so this will slow down the gearing process. Not to mention give us less of an incentive to do conquest on many of our alt characters.

 

Seriously??? That SUCKS.

Did not find your post on the pts forum.

Edited November 14, 2021 by Pricia

[Sychonoxis]

I noticed something on the PTS, which I put a comment on the PTS forums on this as well.

 

In this build there is a weekly cap of 600 Medals of Commendations (In this build we get 200 per character we complete conquest on)

 

As well as an 800 weekly cap on the new Aquatic Resource Matrix (in this build each daily area gives 100 when you complete the weekly, and each daily gives 3 as well).

 

Both of these caps are legacy wide, not per character, so this will slow down the gearing process. Not to mention give us less of an incentive to do conquest on many of our alt characters.

 

Oh come on, now there's deliberate time padding to make what content there is feel longer? Timegating content would be tolerable if there was at least plenty of new content, but this is going to be rather lacking to say the least. Oh, we can theoretically still run "old content" that's blocked off for the week (i.e. not in the weekly pool), just without getting any gearing upgrades.

 

I'm really hoping that 7.0 isn't as deliberately time-capped as all the posts seem to suggest, SWTOR used to be one of the best MMOs in terms of letting you grind through everything at your pace.

[Pandoras_Jar]

Just want to say that the LEGACY currency caps* currently on the PTS, especially for PvP, are unacceptable. I discussed this on my last stream. But let me give you all an overview of how dire the situation is for PvPers here.

 

*Testing by other players on the PTS has confirmed that the currency caps are unfortunately legacy.

 

These are the current legacy currency caps:

 

- Medal of Commendation (Conquest) - 600 = 3 conquest completions per week.

- Aquatic Resource Matrix (Heroics/Dailies) - 800 (each heroic area weekly & daily hub weekly = 100)

- Thyrsian Production Accelerant (PvP) - 500

- Decurion Isotope Stabilizer (Flashpoints/Uprisings?) - 950

- Hazardous Matter Catalyst (Operations) - 950

 

These caps will slow down gearing significantly and make even doing weeklies (we don't yet know how much the PvE weeklies will give yet) not worthwhile.

 

Let's look more closely at PvP gear vs. Conquest gear.

 

The PvP dailies and weeklies give the following amounts of currency:

 

Unranked PvP Daily - 75 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

Unranked PvP Weekly - 450 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

Solo Ranked PvP Daily - 150 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

Solo Ranked PvP Weekly - 1,000 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

Group Ranked PvP Daily - 300 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

Group Ranked PvP Weekly - 2,000 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

GSF Daily - 120 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

GSF Weekly - 720 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

 

As you can see, players have many options for easily earning more than 500 Thyrsian Production Accelerants per week...

 

The total cost of a full set of basic PvP gear (316) is: 2,480 Thyrsian Production Accelerant + 21,000 Credits

 

2480/500 = 4.96

 

Yes, this means that unless the currency cap is removed it will take a PvPer FIVE WEEKS to get a full set of 316 gear. This is only the first tier of gear! There are hypothetically several more tiers up to 326 (which is likely the cap based on recent dev posts). Not to mention that upgrading PvP gear is going to cost PvE currency too?!????

 

This is beyond a joke and quite frankly incredibly disrespectful to PvPers.

 

Unfortunately, it gets worse...

 

To add insult to injury, let's look at Conquest gear (reminder weekly caps are 600 Medal of Commendation & 800 Aquatic Resource Matrix).

 

Here's the full upgrade costs for each gear tier:

 

320 - 480 Medal of Commendation + 247,100 Credits

322 - 960 Medal of Commendation + 1,400 Aquatic Resource Matrix + 266,800 Credits

324 - 960 Medal of Commendation + 1,540 Aquatic Resource Matrix + ? Credits

326 - 960 Medal of Commendation + 1,680 Aquatic Resource Matrix + ? Credits

 

Total = 3,360 Medal of Commendation + 4,620 Aquatic Resource Matrix + 1,047,500+ Credits

 

3360/600 = 5.6

 

This means it will take you just under 6 weeks to max out your conquest gear...

 

See the discrepancy here??!?!?!?????? 5 weeks to get a full set of the first tier of PvP gear (316) and 6 weeks to get your conquest gear maxed at 326?

 

Are you *********** kidding me??!?!?!?????? :mad::mad::mad::mad:

 

All I can say is I hope this is some kind of mistake cause it's really really ****ed that not only is it going to take a PvPer 5 weeks to get a full set of basic gear (AGAIN because of the currency caps). But we'll be able to get a full set of max tier conquest gear (326) in almost the same amount of time?????

 

That is completely and utterly ****ed.

 

Seriously?

 

Another disappointing thing about the cap is that it is a missed opportunity to encourage Ranked PvP participation. A player could earn quite a lot of Thyrsian Production Accelerant in a week (see above) without a cap. I'm sure a lot of PvPers would jump into ranked at launch if it meant getting gear faster (assuming it's offseason which it probably will be). Hell, I would consider jumping into ranked for faster gearing... It would still likely take a few weeks to max out gear depending on how many tiers there are. So PvP gearing would probably end up being at a similar pace to conquest gearing if the cap was removed.

 

But anyway, I guess the TLDR of this post is:

 

- Can the devs please explain why there are weekly caps on currencies? Are the caps even correct? How are they supposed to work? Are they supposed to be legacy caps or character caps?

- Assuming it is intentional and not some kind of mistake (**** I hope it's some kind of mistake), why the hell do the devs think it's a good idea to make it take us 5 weeks to get a full set of first-tier PvP gear? How could anyone possibly justify this? It's obscene and needs or be changed immediately.

 

No ifs or buts. Fix it NOW. Increase the damn cap at the very least!

Edited November 15, 2021 by Pandoras_Jar

[Eli_Porter]

I assume those caps are far from final, obviously it makes no sense for a 500 cap when one of the weeklies rewards 2000.

 

Also, each of the weekly missions give an upgrade crate containing an upgrade to your lowest equipped gear slot. So unless there's a legacy cap on weekly rewards as well, if you pass your entire gear around a bunch of alts you should theoretically be able to 326 gear one character in one week without using any tokens.

Edited November 15, 2021 by Eli_Porter

[ceryxp]

- Medal of Commendation (Conquest) - 600 = 3 conquest completions per week.

 

Everything else in your post aside, of which I completely agree, the wheels on my mental bus came to a screeching halt when I read this. Compare this to something David Staats said in the Conquest changes post.

 

...promoting a playstyle of interruptive play as players hit their Conquest target and then swap out their characters...

 

I know that the real point of that line was the preceding part about the rate of acquisition of things that BW says should be long-term goals, but put those two quotes together.

 

To them, completing Conquest on multiple characters is such a bad thing that not only are they increasing the personal Conquest target but also disincentivizing players from completing Conquest with more than three characters by placing a cap on the amount of gear currency one receives per week.

 

Trying to get as many characters through Conquest per week as possible == interruptive play.

 

Disincentivizing people from playing after they have completed Conquest on three characters == their fix to interruptive play.

[Pricia]

Just want to say that the LEGACY currency caps* currently on the PTS, especially for PvP, are unacceptable. I discussed this on my last stream. But let me give you all an overview of how dire the situation is for PvPers here.

 

*Testing by other players on the PTS has confirmed that the currency caps are unfortunately legacy.

 

These are the current legacy currency caps:

 

- Medal of Commendation (Conquest) - 600 = 3 conquest completions per week.

- Aquatic Resource Matrix (Heroics/Dailies) - 800 (each heroic area weekly & daily hub weekly = 100)

- Thyrsian Production Accelerant (PvP) - 500

- Decurion Isotope Stabilizer (Flashpoints/Uprisings?) - 950

- Hazardous Matter Catalyst (Operations) - 950

 

These caps will slow down gearing significantly and make even doing weeklies (we don't yet know how much the PvE weeklies will give yet) not worthwhile.

 

Let's look more closely at PvP gear vs. Conquest gear.

 

The PvP dailies and weeklies give the following amounts of currency:

 

Unranked PvP Daily - 75 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

Unranked PvP Weekly - 450 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

Solo Ranked PvP Daily - 150 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

Solo Ranked PvP Weekly - 1,000 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

Group Ranked PvP Daily - 300 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

Group Ranked PvP Weekly - 2,000 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

GSF Daily - 120 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

GSF Weekly - 720 Thyrsian Production Accelerant

 

As you can see, players have many options for easily earning more than 500 Thyrsian Production Accelerants per week...

 

The total cost of a full set of basic PvP gear (316) is: 2,480 Thyrsian Production Accelerant + 21,000 Credits

 

2480/500 = 4.96

 

Yes, this means that unless the currency cap is removed it will take a PvPer FIVE WEEKS to get a full set of 316 gear. This is only the first tier of gear! There are hypothetically several more tiers up to 326 (which is likely the cap based on recent dev posts). Not to mention that upgrading PvP gear is going to cost PvE currency too?!????

 

This is beyond a joke and quite frankly incredibly disrespectful to PvPers.

 

Unfortunately, it gets worse...

 

To add insult to injury, let's look at Conquest gear (reminder weekly caps are 600 Medal of Commendation & 800 Aquatic Resource Matrix).

 

Here's the full upgrade costs for each gear tier:

 

320 - 480 Medal of Commendation + 247,100 Credits

322 - 960 Medal of Commendation + 1,400 Aquatic Resource Matrix + 266,800 Credits

324 - 960 Medal of Commendation + 1,540 Aquatic Resource Matrix + ? Credits

326 - 960 Medal of Commendation + 1,680 Aquatic Resource Matrix + ? Credits

 

Total = 3,360 Medal of Commendation + 4,620 Aquatic Resource Matrix + 1,047,500+ Credits

 

3360/600 = 5.6

 

This means it will take you just under 6 weeks to max out your conquest gear...

 

See the discrepancy here??!?!?!?????? 5 weeks to get a full set of the first tier of PvP gear (316) and 6 weeks to get your conquest gear maxed at 326?

 

Are you *********** kidding me??!?!?!?????? :mad::mad::mad::mad:

 

All I can say is I hope this is some kind of mistake cause it's really really ****ed that not only is it going to take a PvPer 5 weeks to get a full set of basic gear (AGAIN because of the currency caps). But we'll be able to get a full set of max tier conquest gear (326) in almost the same amount of time?????

 

That is completely and utterly ****ed.

 

Seriously?

 

Another disappointing thing about the cap is that it is a missed opportunity to encourage Ranked PvP participation. A player could earn quite a lot of Thyrsian Production Accelerant in a week (see above) without a cap. I'm sure a lot of PvPers would jump into ranked at launch if it meant getting gear faster (assuming it's offseason which it probably will be). Hell, I would consider jumping into ranked for faster gearing... It would still likely take a few weeks to max out gear depending on how many tiers there are. So PvP gearing would probably end up being at a similar pace to conquest gearing if the cap was removed.

 

But anyway, I guess the TLDR of this post is:

 

- Can the devs please explain why there are weekly caps on currencies? Are the caps even correct? How are they supposed to work? Are they supposed to be legacy caps or character caps?

- Assuming it is intentional and not some kind of mistake (**** I hope it's some kind of mistake), why the hell do the devs think it's a good idea to make it take us 5 weeks to get a full set of first-tier PvP gear? How could anyone possibly justify this? It's obscene and needs or be changed immediately.

 

No ifs or buts. Fix it NOW. Increase the damn cap at the very least!

 

So... 6 weeks for one set. So 6 weeks per character. I'll still be grinding this next year at this time to get my characters their sets.

 

Worst expansion EVER.

[Toraak]

Everything else in your post aside, of which I completely agree, the wheels on my mental bus came to a screeching halt when I read this. Compare this to something David Staats said in the Conquest changes post.

 

 

 

I know that the real point of that line was the preceding part about the rate of acquisition of things that BW says should be long-term goals, but put those two quotes together.

 

To them, completing Conquest on multiple characters is such a bad thing that not only are they increasing the personal Conquest target but also disincentivizing players from completing Conquest with more than three characters by placing a cap on the amount of gear currency one receives per week.

 

Trying to get as many characters through Conquest per week as possible == interruptive play.

 

Disincentivizing people from playing after they have completed Conquest on three characters == their fix to interruptive play.

 

I do conquest on a lot of alts myself, and based on the caps thought. 3 characters will be done with conquest on Tuesday, 800 resource matrix's can be acquired on tuesday as well. Rest of the week doing non game activities, except during guild raid times.

[ceryxp]

So... 6 weeks for one set. So 6 weeks per character. I'll still be grinding this next year at this time to get my characters their sets.

 

Worst expansion EVER.

 

If I gear all of my characters, ~40, with this time table it will take me ~4.62 years.

[Toraak]

If I gear all of my characters, ~40, with this time table it will take me ~4.62 years.

 

Just make 1 set, and keep it in legacy bank. Only things you'll need to upgrade then are Legendary items for each class.

[Eli_Porter]

Just make 1 set, and keep it in legacy bank. Only things you'll need to upgrade then are Legendary items for each class.

 

We don't know how loadouts work, if they allow you to "imprint" a piece of gear into a loadout then you might get by with just 3 or so fully upgraded gear sets for your legacy.

 

We also don't know which weekly missions grant a gear upgrade crate, and whether the 3 times limit to getting gear crates applies to the same objective and/or legacy.

[ceryxp]

Just make 1 set, and keep it in legacy bank. Only things you'll need to upgrade then are Legendary items for each class.

 

Why would I, as a solo player, do that if all of my characters are already in tuned stat, fully augmented 306 gear, which will be more important with 7.0's level sync than having higher stats?

 

Why would I even participate in this gear scheme now and not just wait until the floor gets raised and access to mods become available (if they ever do become available for Conquest, their messaging is contradictory).

 

For players like me it makes more sense to ignore 7.0's itemization, focus solely on acquiring and upgrading two legendary items, and then bide our time until the floor gets raised to a point were it makes sense to upgrade our gear or mods become available.

[Spikanor]

@JackieKo

 

that there going to remove the renown system in update 7.0 is in my eye's more point less.

and is it not better to inprove it better then remove it all with something else again.

 

since first there add the Galactic Command system but later there remove it and replace it with the Renown System.

and now for the 3th time we get something else again thats going to replace the Renown system.

 

is it not better to inprove it and keep it then always keep removing it and replace it with something else each time.

since its getting then more anoying if thats going to happing always then let it stay and inprove it more.

[eabevella]

Why would I, as a solo player, do that if all of my characters are already in tuned stat, fully augmented 306 gear, which will be more important with 7.0's level sync than having higher stats?

 

Why would I even participate in this gear scheme now and not just wait until the floor gets raised and access to mods become available (if they ever do become available for Conquest, their messaging is contradictory).

 

For players like me it makes more sense to ignore 7.0's itemization, focus solely on acquiring and upgrading two legendary items, and then bide our time until the floor gets raised to a point were it makes sense to upgrade our gear or mods become available.

 

Exactly my thought.

 

It's not like I'll start playing NiM stuffs just for that 6 or something higher i-rating gears lol

If anything it will make me less inclined to try hardcore stuffs because I will be under geared.

[TrixxieTriss]

 

Disincentivizing people from playing after they have completed Conquest on three characters == their fix to interruptive play.

 

Disincentivizing people from completing conquest on more than three characters == people playing less == players unsubscribing == less revenue == less profit for EA shareholders == cost cutting (BioWare jobs lost) == less content == less players…. And we go round and a round until EA can’t cost cut anymore to make a profit == game shuttered

 

That’s why a large part of 7.0 changes are a massively bad idea. BioWare are either naively unaware of what these changes will do to the population or they are fully aware and doing it anyway.

 

If it’s number 2 then it’s probably the dumbest business decision I’ve ever come across. And when it fails, someone’s head should roll.

If it’s number one, then I’m sorry to say it, the wrong people are in charge of the business and they need to be replaced too because the rest of us can see where this is headed and they should too. It’s not rocket science.

 

You piss off the player base or make the game really un-fun or have less to do and people leave. I can’t for the life of me understand how BioWare have never ever figured this out in the 9 years of the game. Now we are going into the 10th year and they are repeating all their old mistakes. Is it for nostalgia’s sake?

 

Neither scenario is good. The many dumb changes to so many parts of the game is just excessive, even for BioWare. It’s why it feels like someone near the top is purposely sabotaging the game cause I don’t think the devs are stupid.

Edited November 16, 2021 by TrixxieTriss

[TrixxieTriss]

I honestly feel more depressed then anything. The silence form the devs, the community in a civil war destroying itself, only a few good changes and a lot more bad changes.......

 

That’s how I feel too, it’s deeply depressing. It’s like losing an old friend to a wasting sickness or they are dying and the doctors won’t help them.

 

I can’t even bring myself to play the game with all this bad news of what they are doing. It completely over shadows the few good things they’ve announced.

[Augustus]

I noticed something on the PTS, which I put a comment on the PTS forums on this as well.

 

In this build there is a weekly cap of 600 Medals of Commendations (In this build we get 200 per character we complete conquest on)

 

As well as an 800 weekly cap on the new Aquatic Resource Matrix (in this build each daily area gives 100 when you complete the weekly, and each daily gives 3 as well).

 

Both of these caps are legacy wide, not per character, so this will slow down the gearing process. Not to mention give us less of an incentive to do conquest on many of our alt characters.

 

WoW, they really went there and plucked a 100 year old tree into every player's hole who has more than 3 characters on same server?

 

Seriously, when you'd think they cannot go any lower, they pull an old GTA release 3x straight!

[TheVoyant]

That’s how I feel too, it’s deeply depressing. It’s like losing an old friend to a wasting sickness or they are dying and the doctors won’t help them.

 

I can’t even bring myself to play the game with all this bad news of what they are doing. It completely over shadows the few good things they’ve announced.

 

Your posts are refreshing whenever I'm on here. Bc its like "See basic common sense and logic." It is beyond baffling what they're doing.

 

I've had the opposite. I'm playing 6.0 religiously before they downgrade it into 7.0, its hard to find games that pull off what 6 does. That action/fast paced strategic gameplay will be sorely missed.

 

The impression is indeed that they're looking for profit thru cheap means vs. providing quality content & an actual gameplan.

Edited November 16, 2021 by TheVoyant

[robwettengel]

I think we're seeing why we no longer get any kind of roadmap anymore.

[corsacalin]

I am so excited about 7.0 update. Ty for this awesome news.

[corsacalin]

Disincentivizing people from completing conquest on more than three characters == people playing less == players unsubscribing == less revenue == less profit for EA shareholders == cost cutting (BioWare jobs lost) == less content == less players…. And we go round and a round until EA can’t cost cut anymore to make a profit == game shuttered

 

That’s why a large part of 7.0 changes are a massively bad idea. BioWare are either naively unaware of what these changes will do to the population or they are fully aware and doing it anyway.

 

If it’s number 2 then it’s probably the dumbest business decision I’ve ever come across. And when it fails, someone’s head should roll.

If it’s number one, then I’m sorry to say it, the wrong people are in charge of the business and they need to be replaced too because the rest of us can see where this is headed and they should too. It’s not rocket science.

 

You piss off the player base or make the game really un-fun or have less to do and people leave. I can’t for the life of me understand how BioWare have never ever figured this out in the 9 years of the game. Now we are going into the 10th year and they are repeating all their old mistakes. Is it for nostalgia’s sake?

 

Neither scenario is good. The many dumb changes to so many parts of the game is just excessive, even for BioWare. It’s why it feels like someone near the top is purposely sabotaging the game cause I don’t think the devs are stupid.

 

I think you may overestimating the conquest. Actually not so many people are into it. And about people unsubscribing the game. Let's be serious for a second. Do you really think that? With all of this new content there will be more people that will sub than unsub. I don't try to be mean or rude to you i think you have your part well explained but bioware will not gonna lose, the ones who will lose are those old-time players that are playing swtor for conquest mostly. Conquest isn't a thing anymore in any of other servers rather than the main one, Star Forge.

If swtor wouldn't fix the titles problem soon the conquest communities will die. The guilds find less and less people commited to playing in a guild especially as they cannot get active people anymore.

Another point is the titles that cannot be granted unless you take a planet. Now you would say that this is because the first guild in the yield shall take it as they take the planetary name. The real problem is those guilds who are winning the yields are always winning without losing. This prestige cannot be win ever by other guilds that are also work hard for them. In this manner, they either generate the titles to more than a guild in the yield or we will witness the death of the conquest.

As a final note i would like to apologize if my message is hardly readble i am originally from Slovakia.

[LeMage]

I think you may overestimating the conquest. Actually not so many people are into it. And about people unsubscribing the game. Let's be serious for a second. Do you really think that? With all of this new content there will be more people that will sub than unsub. I don't try to be mean or rude to you i think you have your part well explained but bioware will not gonna lose, the ones who will lose are those old-time players that are playing swtor for conquest mostly. Conquest isn't a thing anymore in any of other servers rather than the main one, Star Forge...

 

As a final note i would like to apologize if my message is hardly readble i am originally from Slovakia.

A large % of the folks in the 2 guilds I am with participate in conquest faithfully.

I really think that, there seems to be more bad than good in 7.0 and I'm ready to unsub if it doesn't pan out by 2022

Where is all this new content you speak of?

[Schlumpfine]

A large % of the folks in the 2 guilds I am with participate in conquest faithfully.

I really think that, there seems to be more bad than good in 7.0 and I'm ready to unsub if it doesn't pan out by 2022

Where is all this new content you speak of?

 

As far as we know by now the new content in 7.0 will be one new Operation, one new Flashpoint and a tiny bit of new Story.

Maybe there is more but i am skeptical.

[TrixxieTriss]

As far as we know by now the new content in 7.0 will be one new Operation, one new Flashpoint and a tiny bit of new Story.

Maybe there is more but i am skeptical.

 

No, that’s about right. This will be the lightest amount of playable content we’ve ever received from an expansion. I’m not even sure you can call it expansion at this point.

[Eli_Porter]

As far as we know by now the new content in 7.0 will be one new Operation, one new Flashpoint and a tiny bit of new Story.

Maybe there is more but i am skeptical.

 

Actually 7.0 will not contain the new operation, that comes in an update one month or so later. But there is the new Manaan weekly area, new Flashpoint, new Story, two combat styles, loadouts, and weapons in costumes.

[DeannaVoyager]

I think you may overestimating the conquest. Actually not so many people are into it.

 

Conquest leaderboards on all servers say otherwise.

 

And about people unsubscribing the game. Let's be serious for a second. Do you really think that? With all of this new content there will be more people that will sub than unsub.

 

Maybe we are not playing the same game. What new content? Not sure 2 minutes of story, which is the same for all classes, and a flashpoint every other year can be called "all of this new content".

 

I have seen more old time players (friends of mine) unsubbing within a few months than ever before because of a series of bad decisions made by the devs. They were thinking of returning for 7.0 but they more they read about it, the less they want to return.