DarthDymond Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 You can look through the logs of thousands of players to determine this, yet you can't even slow the credit spammers who recite the exact same phrase daily...?! They aren't using the same phrase though. At least on POT5 they've started putting brackets around ever letter of the website they're hocking, and I would assume that change happened precisely because BW put in a filter or auto-flag to stop the old spam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vakyoom Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 It's good to know that you guys are paying closer attention than the olden days. It proves just how far this game has come... I do agree with most people that there should be some slight reward to those who didn't use the exploit, a 'real' thank you for not hindering the devs.... i don't apply for that reward since i didn't know it existed before today but plenty of people did and plenty deserve a little something for being good samaritans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sotty Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Hey folks, .... Stage 2 – With the exploit removed, we can work towards finalizing our data review and assigning appropriate actions. We have a lot of information! We know who used it, who they invited, how many times they exploited, when they participated, credits gained, and whether they gained a crafting pattern from reverse-engineering. We are still reviewing the data and determining the appropriate action for those who took undue advantage of the exploit. We won’t be taking action today, but we’ll wrap it up in the next week or so. ..... -eric Please show no mercy. I'm a little bit worried you will only punish the worst offenders. There should be appropriate actions against everyone who used it. People who only did it 1-2 times should at least get a small slap on their hands or people will keep exploiting in the future because they have nothing to fear unless they do it excessive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagy Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 I appreciate the action, but I have to say I find it somewhat disheartening that you evidently didn't go to nearly as thorough depths for abuse of the ranked seasons system. Blatant win trading, people /stucking and throwing games and all kinds of that stuff went completely ignored. Heck, you could look at the ranked leaderboard right now and see who blatantly win traded just by who has the minimum required rating for the highest tier, and yet they had no action taken against them whatsoever.you mean punish players that actually affect other players....nooooooooooo waaaaaaaaaaay lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuriDogshin Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 This renews my confidence in the game and the developers Are you really so naive that a vague "press release" can "renew your confidence," when you do not even know what they are actually going to do ? Don't give them credit for walking the walk when all they've done so far is talk the talk, you're just setting yourself up for disappointment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sindariel Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) So, you're going to make an example of those ravager exploiters, but all the other exploiters, bug users, dupers, win traders, scammers, etc. stay unpunished? That's very... hypocritical. Edited January 13, 2015 by Sindariel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infernixx Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 I don't remember Bioware giving a pass to people so they could take advantage of the exploit, weeks on end. This includes people who transferred from one server to another, to further profit from the exploit. Stop making up excuses, please. Isn't that what they did when they let it go live, knowing it was broken? Isn't that what they did when they let the nefra thing happen for months with no consequences for anyone involved? Inaction is action in and of itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 They aren't using the same phrase though. At least on POT5 they've started putting brackets around ever letter of the website they're hocking, and I would assume that change happened precisely because BW put in a filter or auto-flag to stop the old spam. Since when?! I'm on POT5...the only one I ever see is spelled out exactly as it is...no brackets. As of last Friday, they didn't mask it at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 So, you're going to make an example of those ravager exploiters, but all the other exploiters, bug users, dupers, win traders, scammers, etc. stay unpunished? They'll do nothing...this post is just supposed to make you feel like they will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDymond Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Isn't that what they did when they let it go live, knowing it was broken? Isn't that what they did when they let the nefra thing happen for months with no consequences for anyone involved? Inaction is action in and of itself. If someone goes on vacation and doesn't lock their house then it's fine for someone to say "damn that was a really dumb move, I don't feel sorry for you at all that you got robbed" heck it may even be fine for the insurance company to try denying the claim, but the one thing it absolutely doesn't mean is that the robbers shouldn't be punished if caught. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuriDogshin Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 They'll do nothing...this post is just supposed to make you feel like they will. Plus, waiting for the potential "Dear John" email for another week is a punishment in and of itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PavSalco Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) They'll do nothing...this post is just supposed to make you feel like they will. Let's bet! I think those who were spreading the exploit in the general chat and those who were selling lockouts will be punished severely. However I don't know what they will do with people that were only optimizing their chars. Edited January 13, 2015 by PavSalco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroDSMtuner Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 BURN THEM!!! So I may eat their flesh off their cheating *** bones like beef ribs!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
znihilist Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Let's bet! I think those who were spreading the exploit in the general chat and those who were selling lockouts will be punished severely. However I don't know what they will do with people that were only optimizing their chars. People who were selling the exploit, people who were keeping the lockout even after reset (yes that was another exploit), people who used all of their alts every week to farm the mats are going to get banned. Most likely everyone else will lose the mats they gained and/or any schematic they learned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 If someone goes on vacation and doesn't lock their house then it's fine for someone to say "damn that was a really dumb move, I don't feel sorry for you at all that you got robbed" heck it may even be fine for the insurance company to try denying the claim, but the one thing it absolutely doesn't mean is that the robbers shouldn't be punished if caught. Geezus...slow down Darth...you're talking about a crime, theft from real people...this was a game bug that players found and, of course, used. It wasn't until less than a week ago that it got called an "exploit". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildstarsrea Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 With all due respect. The ones to be punished should be private. If you ban players (accounts) or characters, then slowly you are slitting your own throats bioware. Subscribers pay the bills. Why haven't they addresses issues of harassment by gold sellers mass e-mailing? Those of you who take the position of punishing the offenders, never ran a business. At best you remove the gains. What about refunding all the subscribers who had early access and paid for training. About 1.2 million credits per character. No one we reimburst for this. You kill it and go on. It's a shame that many used this but swtor cannot afford to be as draconian as you want. The worst problem which is reverse engineering and making money off everyone else. An easy fix is to remove the ill-gotten schematics. Those that have gear, why worry because it has only saved them three weeks of raiding. There are so many exploits. Dread Fortress, SNV, ect. If everyone whoever used these were banned then the game would close due to loss of subscribers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GadgetDon Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) I'm still bothered by ex post facto punishment and the sometimes gray line between an exploit and strategically using game mechanics. I get the "if we label something an exploit it'll have a slew of people hearing about it and using it" but I think that ignores the efficiency of inter-player communication about really good strategies. And when several patches go by where the capacity to do this thing is untouched, that makes it harder to say "this is an exploit as opposed to a strategic opportunity". OK, maybe this was clearly being described as an exploit - but I think most people running old ops for ultimates knew that it was something that was going away and so ran it now. What if Bioware was to ban people who ran too many of those ops, and removed the commendations (or gear bought with the commendations) earned with them? Apparently Bioware didn't declare that an "exploit" and so everyone who ran the ops gets to keep their shiny 198 gear bought from these ill-gotten ultimate commendations. But they could have. And yes, removing gear isn't "making things whole", because they presumably sold the gear they had before they got the new gear. Fix the exploits. If it's really bad, declare it's not allowed and punish those who partake after the rule statement. But unless the rule is "don't think strategically, just do brute force through the game", ex post facto punishment is wrong. And no, I'm not at any risk of being punished by this. But I have been running the ops that lost their ultimate commendations. I have lured the Beast in Atthis off his platform. I've done other things that may or may not be an exploit and I can't even post about "is this an exploit" because I can get banned from the forums for asking. And with all the problems the game has - is this REALLY where your people should be spending their time, finding people who used a mechanism that you created and got results you didn't expect? Edited January 13, 2015 by GadgetDon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagy Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) now im starting to question all the times i was told "sorry we cant determine that" when i was screwed out of getting loot during boss fights. they were lying then or now. or maybe their incompetence is just with tracking loot. i imagine tracking instance IDs etc is doable but not the loot gained/modded. Edited January 13, 2015 by Pagy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThirdDementor Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 I just want to say we love you, Musco. That's all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Wicked Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 I just want to say we love you, Musco. That's all. ^^ BEST LINE IN THE ENTIRE GAME. The one in your signature, mate. His Wickedness approves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcTrooperElite Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) You forgot Stage 3 That's where everyone who paid $20 of their hard earned money for a broke expansion and then did what everyone else in their guild did, and hundreds if not thousands of others did get punished for getting some free loot unsub and quit the game. Stage 3 culminates with a drastic reduction in Cartel Market sales and subscriptions as well as a negative word of mouth backlash reducing the number of new players entering the game. Ultimately Stage 3 ends with what for all intents and purposes is the death of SWTOR. It won't happen next week or next month but I know a lot of people with their hand on the unsub button about this. We'll see how those crying for bans and punishment feel when that happens. On a personal note every single person crying out for punishment for something that does not affect their ability to play the game in the slightest are far worse than any exploiter could ever be. This was my first MMO and experiencing this community first hand has insured that when the time comes it will be my last. You are truly terrible people who are celebrating the possibility that bad things will happen to others. Edited January 13, 2015 by ArcTrooperElite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sindariel Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 now im starting to question all the times i was told "sorry we cant determine that" when i was screwed out of getting loot during boss fights. they were lying then or now. or maybe their incompetence is just with tracking loot. i imagine tracking instance IDs etc is doable but not the loot gained/modded. Well, Eric also said in his post they could track down schematics that people learned from that ill-gotten gear. So... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sotty Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Geezus...slow down Darth...you're talking about a crime, theft from real people...this was a game bug that players found and, of course, used. It wasn't until less than a week ago that it got called an "exploit". Everyone who did it could cleary identify it as an exploit and even if someone did not : Ignorantia legis non excusat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emeraldon Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 You forgot Stage 3 That's where everyone who paid $20 of their hard earned money for a broke expansion and then did what everyone else in their guild did, and hundreds if not thousands of others did get punished for getting some free loot unsub and quit the game. Stage 3 culminates with a drastic reduction in Cartel Market sales due and subscriptions as well as a negative word of mouth backlash reducing the number of new players entering the game. Ultimately Stage 3 ends with what for all intents and purposes is the death of SWTOR. It won't happen next week or next month but I know a lot of people with their hand on the unsub button about this. We'll see how those crying for bans and punishment feel when that happens. On a personal note every single person crying out for punishment for something that does not affect their ability to play the game in the slightest are far worse than any exploiter could ever be. This was my first MMO and experiencing this community first hand has insured that when the time comes it will be my last. You are truly terrible people who are celebrating the possibility that bad things will happen to others. No one forced you to do the exploit. You did it because for some reason you might've felt entitled to it because the game has issues. That's a stupid *********** attempt at justification. An exploit like this is something that really needs to be addressed and punishments dealt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDymond Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) Geezus...slow down Darth...you're talking about a crime, theft from real people...this was a game bug that players found and, of course, used. It wasn't until less than a week ago that it got called an "exploit". It's an analogy, I'm saying there's equivalent culpability not equivalent severity between the two situations. We're not talking about BW locking up the exploiters or suing them either. I'm certainly not calling for a lifetime ban on anyone and everyone who used this exploit, my point is that whatever negligence there was on BW's part by taking so long to fix the exploit doesn't magically absolve the exploiters, anymore than an unlocked house would absolve a robber. Edited January 13, 2015 by DarthDymond Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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