Clickers.

[LadyVix]

Also, while clicking you are spending time looking at your spells more than you are looking at whats going on around you. You lose some awareness while clicking.

 

Are you saying, then, that you don't look at your quickbars to keep track of your cooldowns? Everyone looks at their quickbars, and doing so has NO impact on awareness. Gotta love peripheral vision.

[Darth-Rammstein]

Keep clicking, makes it easier for me.

[Aluc]

None of what you said is obvious or of the "can't argue" kind. Have you missed many people finding the opposite things true, in this very thread? It takes about .1-.2 seconds to glance at the bars, with the screen still quite there in your peripheral vision. It does not limit awareness.

 

I've clicked once upon a time, so believe me when I tell you that keybinds are better. But okay, you say clicking doesn't decrease awareness. Fine let's go with that. Reaction time is still increased, and movement is definitely more fluid with the mouse. Because chances are if you click then you keyboard turn, and we all know they are the bane of our existence.

[AshlaBoga]

I've clicked once upon a time, so believe me when I tell you that keybinds are better. But okay, you say clicking doesn't decrease awareness. Fine let's go with that. Reaction time is still increased, and movement is definitely more fluid with the mouse. Because chances are if you click then you keyboard turn, and we all know they are the bane of our existence.

 

I find that keybinding is a must for progression PvE, but that there's no mechanic in any of the Ops that punishes the player for keyboard turning. Even in NiM EC you can keyboard turn without any issue.

[PoliteAssasin]

Keep clicking, makes it easier for me.

 

Not all clickers are bad. Don't even kid yourself on that one. I personally use keybinds, but there are top players on my server who are clickers, and you would never had known unless they told you. Some people can make it work, some can't.

[Keadil]

I can think of nothing more foolish than to believe that your way and only your way is the most optimal playstyle for anyone and everyone.

[Marmerus]

Not all clickers are bad. Don't even kid yourself on that one. I personally use keybinds, but there are top players on my server who are clickers, and you would never had known unless they told you. Some people can make it work, some can't.

Nobody said clickers is bad. They are just not at their full potential. Being a clicker compared to a keybinder is like playing basketball with one hand tied behind your back. You can still be a good player and do pretty good but when you face an equal player playing with both hands then you are giving the facing player an advantage.

In PVP this advantage is massive since you have much less downtime moving your mouse cursor across the screen to interupts and CC breakers but not so much in PVE because you know what to press in rotations.

[Jeweledleah]

I can think of nothing more foolish than to believe that your way and only your way is the most optimal playstyle for anyone and everyone.

 

^^this

[Transcendent]

Personally, I just can't wrap my head around mouse movement. Holding down two mouse buttons feels sloppy and hard to control. :/ I've tried to do it but it's just pretty blah IMO.

 

This, I don't do it in any other game and i'm not about to start now as it'll slow me down. There is little to no difference in my playstyle by not using hotkeys, aside from one, i move more freely by NOT using hotkeys in SWTOR.

 

If there were no global cooldowns i'm absolutely certain i would be using hotkeys, but this isn't an RTS game and there are global cooldowns.

 

Use whichever suits best.

[Marmerus]

This, I don't do it in any other game and i'm not about to start now as it'll slow me down. There is little to no difference in my playstyle by not using hotkeys, aside from one, i move more freely by NOT using hotkeys in SWTOR.

 

If there were no global cooldowns i'm absolutely certain i would be using hotkeys, but this isn't an RTS game and there are global cooldowns.

 

Use whichever suits best.

You use one button on mouse. You still use WASD for moving forward and strafing while using mouse to quickly turn around.

 

When you mention GCD. Does your abilities gets affected when an enemy player or mob stuns you? If not you just lost LOTS of time moving your mouse cursor across the screen to press on the CC breaker.

And there is abilities that does not get affected by global cooldown. If using mouse to click on those you lose SECONDS moving your mouse between abilities.

[AsheraII]

Not all clickers are bad. Don't even kid yourself on that one. I personally use keybinds, but there are top players on my server who are clickers, and you would never had known unless they told you. Some people can make it work, some can't.

This. Basically, the people claiming keybinding is always better are simply those who fail at clicking themselves. They simply can't comprehend that their failure to use some gamemechanic doesn't apply to everybody else.

[Marmerus]

This. Basically, the people claiming keybinding is always better are simply those who fail at clicking themselves. They simply can't comprehend that their failure to use some gamemechanic doesn't apply to everybody else.

That is the dumbest thing I have read today.

 

You do realize that pretty much every single key binder started out as a clicker but moved on to key binding to increase their awareness, maximize their efficiency and get MUCH faster reaction time.

 

There is a very simple way of testing out the difference in speed.

Just bring out your on screen keyboard and use your mouse and click on the keys to type messages. Then try doing the same with your normal keyboard and notice the difference.

 

And before you go on about GCD just think about ALL the abilities YOU and YOUR enemy can use that does not trigger GCD and it is that time you are losing out on.

[MariaD]

Nobody said clickers is bad. They are just not at their full potential. Being a clicker compared to a keybinder is like playing basketball with one hand tied behind your back.

If you want analogies, clicking is like playing soccer and keybinding is like playing basketball and hybrid is like being allowed to both kick and throw the ball (rugby? not sure).

 

What you are saying is that switching to clicking would handicap YOU. Well, switching to full keybinding OR full clicking would handicap ME. And from what people in this thread wrote, people have a nice DIVERSITY in how they use their peripherals. Heck, my husband rigged an optic interface similar to Wii to play by whole-body movements. It's not optimal for him, but I bet it is for somebody somewhere. Some people like 18 buttons for their thumb, others like full keyboards, others click, some have foot pedals and so on. We had a quadriplegic in our guild, who played with a special stick since he can only move a few fingers a bit. He pulled awesome DPS.

 

People's bodies, reflexes, visual and motor memory, past skills and so on are DIFFERENT from person to person. SWTOR user interface supports different playstyles well. This makes it a better game.

[PoliteAssasin]

This. Basically, the people claiming keybinding is always better are simply those who fail at clicking themselves. They simply can't comprehend that their failure to use some gamemechanic doesn't apply to everybody else.

 

I'd have to agree. To me keybinds are easy mode, clicking is hard. But for others its the exact opposite. Just like people who are right handed or left handed, you can't claim that your method is the best.

 

 

Nobody said clickers is bad. They are just not at their full potential. Being a clicker compared to a keybinder is like playing basketball with one hand tied behind your back. You can still be a good player and do pretty good but when you face an equal player playing with both hands then you are giving the facing player an advantage.

In PVP this advantage is massive since you have much less downtime moving your mouse cursor across the screen to interupts and CC breakers but not so much in PVE because you know what to press in rotations.

 

Sorry but this simply isn't true. I know of two specific players on my server who are literally the best players of their classes, and they both click. They have no problem dealing with someone who keybinds. As the above poster said, just because you can't do it doesn't mean others can't. I've seen footage of these players clicking and the speed and precision they use along with the flawless movement is really a sight to see. I'm a keybinder and I couldn't click with the skill and speed of those players if I tried. As I said before, there are good players who you wouldn't know are clickers unless they told you. I exclusively PvP so this isn't regarding PVE.

Edited January 26, 2013 by PoliteAssasin

[Marmerus]

If you want analogies, clicking is like playing soccer and keybinding is like playing basketball and hybrid is like being allowed to both kick and throw the ball (rugby? not sure).

 

What you are saying is that switching to clicking would handicap YOU. Well, switching to full keybinding OR full clicking would handicap ME. And from what people in this thread wrote, people have a nice DIVERSITY in how they use their peripherals. Heck, my husband rigged an optic interface similar to Wii to play by whole-body movements. It's not optimal for him, but I bet it is for somebody somewhere. Some people like 18 buttons for their thumb, others like full keyboards, others click, some have foot pedals and so on. We had a quadriplegic in our guild, who played with a special stick since he can only move a few fingers a bit. He pulled awesome DPS.

 

People's bodies, reflexes, visual and motor memory, past skills and so on are DIFFERENT from person to person. SWTOR user interface supports different playstyles well. This makes it a better game.

That analogy is bad because you are comparing different sports doing different things. In this game it is about doing the same thing and one way being better than the other.

 

There will always be people who has different handicaps that can't perform optimal. That does not make them worse players but at the same time they will never be as good as other players even if they do a great job.

You won't see the best handicapped basketball player playing in the NBA even if he is the best at what he is doing.

 

And my analogy fits perfectly because like the basketball player with one hand tied behind your pack moves all his attention to his other hand, just like the clicker moves the majority of his abilities to a single hand.

Sorry but this simply isn't true. I know of two specific players on my server who are literally the best players of their classes, and they both click. They have no problem dealing with someone who keybinds. As the above poster said, just because you can't do it doesn't mean others can't. I've seen footage of these players clicking and the speed and precision they use along with the flawless movement is really a sight to see. I'm a keybinder and I couldn't click with the skill and speed of those players if I tried. As I said before, there are good players who you wouldn't know are clickers unless they told you. I exclusively PvP so this isn't regarding PVE.

Well knowing some random people on a random server with some random person who thinks they are the best players in the world does not mean that much. But if you would have followed the WoW arena tournaments you would have noticed there has never been a single clicker playing because at that high level you need lightning reflexes.

 

Like I said earlier clicking does not make you a bad player. It just limits your potential of being even better.

[TwitchingFiber]

This. Basically, the people claiming keybinding is always better are simply those who fail at clicking themselves. They simply can't comprehend that their failure to use some gamemechanic doesn't apply to everybody else.

 

Well just so you know, about 8 years ago when I started mmo's I played on a schitty laptop. I keyturned and clicked. It took me about 4 weeks to realize what I was missing out on. So your theory of people who keybind have never tried clicking is wrong. Most keybinders started out as clickers and just simply moved on.

[AsheraII]

Well just so you know, about 8 years ago when I started mmo's I played on a schitty laptop. I keyturned and clicked. It took me about 4 weeks to realize what I was missing out on. So your theory of people who keybind have never tried clicking is wrong. Most keybinders started out as clickers and just simply moved on.

I didn't say you didn't try clicking. I simply said you were probably bad at clicking but are obviously better at keybinding. I could go on about comprehensive reading, but that would be off topic.

[PoliteAssasin]

That analogy is bad because you are comparing different sports doing different things. In this game it is about doing the same thing and one way being better than the other.

 

There will always be people who has different handicaps that can't perform optimal. That does not make them worse players but at the same time they will never be as good as other players even if they do a great job.

You won't see the best handicapped basketball player playing in the NBA even if he is the best at what he is doing.

 

And my analogy fits perfectly because like the basketball player with one hand tied behind your pack moves all his attention to his other hand, just like the clicker moves the majority of his abilities to a single hand.

 

Well knowing some random people on a random server with some random person who thinks they are the best players in the world does not mean that much. But if you would have followed the WoW arena tournaments you would have noticed there has never been a single clicker playing because at that high level you need lightning reflexes.

 

Like I said earlier clicking does not make you a bad player. It just limits your potential of being even better.

 

But some random person who comes from some random wow server and likes to spread his opinion as fact is? I forgot only good players come from wow or pvp servers. Where was my head? You sir just lost all credibility. I know many clickers who can take on a keybinder of equal skill and win. It's not difficult for some people to click. It's personal preference. Who are you to tell someone how they can or cannot play a game? As I said earlier its like a right handed person telling a left handed one they're doing it wrong. There is no right or wrong. Some people keybind, some people click. One is not superior to another. Some people find keybinding easier while others find clicking easier. It's preference. Tell yourself what you want, but your inability to accept that truth doesn't change reality.

Edited January 26, 2013 by PoliteAssasin

[Marmerus]

But some random person who comes from some random wow server and likes to spread his opinion as fact is? I forgot only good players come from wow or pvp servers. Where was my head? You sir just lost all credibility. I know many clickers who can take on a keybinder of equal skill and win. It's not difficult for some people to click. It's personal preference. Who are you to tell someone how they can or cannot play a game? As I said earlier its like a right handed person telling a left handed one they're doing it wrong. There is no right or wrong. Some people keybind, some people click. One is not superior to another. Some people find keybinding easier while others find clicking easier. It's preference. Tell yourself what you want, but your inability to accept that truth doesn't change reality.

I know WoW hating and bashing is really cool especially on this forum. But if you would put aside the fanboy hate you would realize that when the top players of one of the most successful games ever plays in a PVP tournament against each other with thousands of watching they are most likely the best players in the world. And when not a single player has ever been a clicker it kinda put things into perspective.

 

And it was never about a left handed person telling a right handed person he is doing it wrong. It is a person using both hands telling a person using one hand he could be better if he used both hands.

 

Just ask yourself what is faster. Moving mouse cursor across screen and pressing a button OR just pressing a button.

 

This video is a good example

The player is good and as you can see in the video he is using keybinds and using the mouse to click on friendly targets and to move camera around. In almost every fight he has to use instant abilities at the right moment. If he would have moved his mouse across the screen it would have taken to much time, his friends would have taken more damage or spent more time doing nothing.

[Keadil]

That analogy is bad because you are comparing different sports doing different things. In this game it is about doing the same thing and one way being better than the other.

 

There will always be people who has different handicaps that can't perform optimal. That does not make them worse players but at the same time they will never be as good as other players even if they do a great job.

You won't see the best handicapped basketball player playing in the NBA even if he is the best at what he is doing.

 

And my analogy fits perfectly because like the basketball player with one hand tied behind your pack moves all his attention to his other hand, just like the clicker moves the majority of his abilities to a single hand.

 

Well knowing some random people on a random server with some random person who thinks they are the best players in the world does not mean that much. But if you would have followed the WoW arena tournaments you would have noticed there has never been a single clicker playing because at that high level you need lightning reflexes.

 

Like I said earlier clicking does not make you a bad player. It just limits your potential of being even better.

 

No, knowing random people on random servers that prove that your theory doesn't hold water disappoints you. Face facts please! You cannot decide what will work best for everyone, because you honestly do not know. Use what works best for you and let others use their way.

[MariaD]

And it was never about a left handed person telling a right handed person he is doing it wrong. It is a person using both hands telling a person using one hand he could be better if he used both hands.

 

You simply keep repeating your analogy and saying - without ANY arguments - that it's better than other people's analogies. Do you see the problem with that?

 

I am interested in the data you cite about tournaments. Where do you get your data that nobody in tournaments clicks? I would like to check on it, please.

[SnoggyMack]

t when the top players of one of the most successful games ever plays in a PVP tournament against each other with thousands of watching they are most likely the best players in the world. And when not a single player has ever been a clicker it kinda put things into perspective.

 

To put things into perspective ... here's a movie about some of the top players of one of the most successful games ever:

 

King of Kong. It's about Donkey Kong. Perspective achieved.

[madtycoon]

Clicking is slower than keybinding unless you're like korean. I don't understand why people don't keybind. There aren't many abilities in this game. Its pretty easy to bind everything.

 

Get better and keybind.

[LostInReverie]

Clicking only becomes a hindrance in PVP. You can click away to your heart's content in PVE and be completely fine thanks to a little thing called the GCD.

[MoobooMagoo]

I'm too lazy to read the whole thread, but here are my two cents anyway.

 

I used to be a clicker until I got a Razer Naga. That thing is awesome. Using 1 through +, shift 1 through shift +, and alt 1 through alt + I have every one of my skills bound, except for things I never need in a fight like quick travel or my mount.

 

It is great being able to access whatever skill I need with only my thumb and pinky finger.