The reason Sorcerer/Sage CC is OP in PvP

[GrandMasterDarth]

There is another reason they are OP in damage, same as tracer/grav mercs/commandos, check my thread for details, basically the stats like FORCE POWER and TECH POWER do nothing for some classes while doing it all for others.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=2856506#post2856506

[Lormif]

I have 10+ years of MMO PVP experience.

 

 

 

Im a good player, I know this.

I can beat mediocre sages no worries,

A great sorc vs me, its close to impossible to beat if they know what they are doing,

 

 

So you are a good player, who expects to beat great players....

[me_unknown]

What game are you playing? From your post I would confirm that you do "know less" as you put it. Marauders / Sentinels don't have **** for CC. They have a 4 sec channel stun and an aoe stun that breaks on damage. I'm not sure where you are getting 10 out of that. You don't know anything it sounds like.

 

the last time i do this, only for you:

sage:

1 stunn on 60sec cd

1 maze which breaks by your dots on 60sec cd (45 if skilled and then it has a 2sec stunn when it brakes)

1 knockback which you can add a 2sec root with talents

1 slow

 

here i do not add the kinetik collaps/backslash ability that you can skill because it is STUPID to skill it. but for you i briefly explain you why you never ever should skill this in pvp: your bubble is breaking quite fast and the kinetik collaps afterwards is nearly fully filling our opponents resove bar. the effect also breaks on damage (you know you have dots on him ).

 

so you actually the result is that when you NEEED a stunn you CAN'T stunn because this stupid talent made your chaser immune.

 

and finally

1. root as the 31 points talent but then you won't have the knockback with a 2 sec root.

 

 

the setinel:

1 channeld stunn 1min cd (can be skilled to 50s with at the lowest level)

1 slow

1 jump at 15s cd or 12 if skilled which most have as watchman is the best pvp tree

1 another jump attack if you are focus which is the only real pvp alternative to watchman

1 aoe maze

 

i omit the abilities you have in combat builts as it is not a good idea to paly combat builds in pvp

 

so, basically the sage/sorc has at MOST ONE ability more while they have far higher cds and you can jump 4 to 5 times on them or even more if focus.

 

 

edit: and not to forget not only as watchman you are doing a LOT OF MORE single target damage! as watchman you do double damage compared to any other sage build!

 

edit: actually you proved what i always say: only players that have no skill and no idea about pvp, their classes and other classes are whining and crying overpowered!

 

thank you

Edited February 15, 2012 by me_unknown

[Digtahk]

Are there any sorcs not playing a hybrid spec?

 

If so I have some RBS shares you might like to purchase......

 

Hybrid specs should never be a requirement for optimal performance they should not even be allowed please remove.....thx

[me_unknown]

Are there any sorcs not playing a hybrid spec?

yes, but it is only fun against stupid enemies that let you alone doing your damage.

 

though i personally find this extremly boring. actually sorc/sage has only one single good and interesting pvp build: hybrid (though there are small variants to hybrid).

 

pure builds are more of aoe artillerists

[Waagabond]

So you are a good player, who expects to beat great players....

 

I was trying to be humble.

Im a great player and I beat great players.

Honestly, I have never lost to a sorc in 1vs1. But this game is about team effort.

And what the sorc brings to a team, in utility, damage and healing is absurd.

 

This game is not about 1vs1 but 8vs8.

And there, there is no reason to bring anything but sorcs, or possibly 4 sorcs and 4 powertechs so you have guard and great additional ranged/melee dps.

[SicNNasty]

1. And running away from sorc cause he has no chance IS fun? No its not fun to spend 80% of your time running after a target. I'm not saying that it isn't balanced, I'm just saying it's not fun. I ending up facing my guildies in a Huttball last night, and for kicks spent my time annoying our two sorcs, they admitted after that dispite me being a nusance, I didn't ever make them sweat. Again, I'm a pretty decent player, if you want to think other wise fair deal, I'm old enough to not want to bother proving myself to strangers

 

2. Pretty much. thats why all utility is there and sorc needs to use it all to even stand a chance.

 

3. I have smilar build and i am 63 valor without Ilum farming

 

4. Its not OP, 1 AoE is 3 targets free target 15s CD, another is 6s CD 5 targets with either POM proc or 3s cast time. Neither hits hard. Other skills are underpowered. Especially top tree skills. They need serious buff. Then its either/either.

 

No it's not OP, but admit that doing more dmg with an AoE than a single target spell doesn't make sense. And in all my ranks I not once casted Chain Lightning, would be a waste of time: 3s to cast, or deal damage for 3s with force lightning and instant cast it behind.

 

5. see 4. hybrid is not OP, it has very simple general counter and quite a few hard class counters. Its not my fault that tarribads let me free channel whole WZ. In a bit advanced gameplay playing sage is...very challenging or you eat dirt during whole WZ.

 

The fact remains as a sorc DPS, the hybrid is the only viable option, a pure build would a. nerf your DPS b. nerf your CCs c. nerf your energie regen. If you would rather say, no it isn't OP, it's just the other that are UP... same difference, the fact is, it needs looking at

 

What is underpowered are top tree skills and they need serious buff.

 

I'll just say it one last time, then I'm off this board:

 

Sorc DPS sucks! (don't go show me some AoE spam fest to prove I'm wrong, it won't work, AoE fluffing through Force Storm will kill no one, but will give you sick DPS scores.

 

Sorcs CC in hybrid max CC build, is Over Powered. So many defense mecanisms on a single class is just wrong, regardless of if it's wearing cloth of paper.

 

(And no I'm not saying I know it all, nor am I saying everything I say is the utmost entire tuth and you should believe only me. I'm sharing my opinions, if you don't know how to read or just want to put words in my mouth, fair deal. I SAID THAT THE SORCs DPS SUCKS, I REROLLED BECAUSE OF IT!! Jesus, get to specsavers guys ^^)

 

We have already shown they do not have more Cc, or DPS then any other normal builds.. untalented the marauders have 10 CC abilities and WAY more burst.

 

Yes I KNOW, read the sgnature guys, jesus christ, I put math to show that yes the Sorcs DPS sucks compared to Mrauders and peeps feel the need to tell me ^^

 

And don't confuse Def Cool Downs and Crowd Control (CC), marauders have 2 CCs at lvl50 one of which also roots him. 3 if you count predation as a speed. Def CD wise they 5 if you count the vanish.

 

I'm talking about a well played sorc that is only seeking to incapicate in order to ignore you and go about their business, and yes they can do this whilst as a melee class you will just have to endure it.

 

If it makes you feel better I'll say it like this: IMO, having played the hybrid sorc to valor 54, the full Crowd Control build is on the Over Powered side.

 

And I'm not stuborn enough continue this one way conversation, I say one thing, and you get excited and say the same thing with a twist.

 

So one last time in it's simplest form:

 

BUFF SORC DPS

NERF SORC CC

 

Enjoy your ranting on at people without listening to them

 

peace

[Lormif]

I was trying to be humble.

Im a great player and I beat great players.

Honestly, I have never lost to a sorc in 1vs1. But this game is about team effort.

And what the sorc brings to a team, in utility, damage and healing is absurd.

 

This game is not about 1vs1 but 8vs8.

And there, there is no reason to bring anything but sorcs, or possibly 4 sorcs and 4 powertechs so you have guard and great additional ranged/melee dps.

 

what damage, they have no burst, they will slowly damage you.. As for focusing down, 8 class can do it, and much better. Utility is all we have.

[me_unknown]

 

BUFF SORC DPS

NERF SORC CC

 

oh i hope no one hears this! all the fun will be gone. just smashing your damage abilities needs no skill and is only boring.

[me_unknown]

This game is not about 1vs1 but 8vs8.

And there, there is no reason to bring anything but sorcs, or possibly 4 sorcs and 4 powertechs so you have guard and great additional ranged/melee dps.

 

8 sentinels vs 8 sorcs will end in 5 sentinels alive.

 

the first 3 sentinels die at the beginning due to cc and focus fire.

the 8 sorcs die afterwards running from cc immune 5 sentinels.

[biowareftw]

Force Camouflage - stealth run speed

Intimidating Roar - Untalented 6 second AOE stun/mes

Force Choke 3 second stun

Predation 10 second run speed increase for a group

Deadly Throw reduces healing to the target

Disruption interrupt

Crippling Slash 50% slow for 12 seconds

Cloak of Pain shield/reflect damage all in one

Saber Ward - reduces melee and tech defenses by 50% and reduces all force damage by 25% for 12 seconds, MUCH better then our shield which will last about 3 seconds for a static amount.

Force Charge- built in jump to target with an 2 second imobilize and interupt, giveing you a 30m itnerupt.

Cloak of Pain - shield

 

Intimidating Roar - Untalented 6 second AOE stun/mes

Not a stun. Stuns don't break on dmg. Fail.

 

Force Choke 3 second stun

Again not a stun. A channeled CC that can be interupted. Fail 2.

 

Predation 10 second run speed increase for a group

And sage/sorc throws instant heals on people (shields that can't be dispelled), can cleanse CC off people, and is the only offhealer in the game with the endless freakin force/procs as hybrid spec to effectively be able to offheal. If you use predation you aren't using your dmg zen ability. Which means less dmg for you. Utility comes at a huge cost.

 

Deadly Throw reduces healing to the target

Yeah a 20 percent mortal strike when expertise increases healing done by 15 percent...Compare this to mortal strikes in other games. Add to this the dmg on it is garbage, it costs a resource and with expertise it is 5 percent less healing. OMG!

 

Disruption interrupt

Sage/sorc has an interupt. What is your point? Yours is ranged.

 

Crippling Slash 50% slow for 12 seconds

You have a slow that is ranged. Along with that the button you are pressing 80 percent of the time autokites.

 

Cloak of Pain shield/reflect damage all in one.

Lasts 6 seconds unless people are stupid enough to hit you. Try using a CC on a marauder/sent that has it up. When it ends? They are the softest target in the game.

 

Saber Ward - reduces melee and tech defenses by 50% and reduces all force damage by 25% for 12 seconds, MUCH better then our shield which will last about 3 seconds for a static amount.

Most fail comparison ever. 3 min cooldown vs shield which can be casted twice in any pvp encounter, can be given to other people. Fail 3.

 

Force Charge- built in jump to target with an 2 second imobilize and interupt, giveing you a 30m itnerupt.

Yeah we use our charge only for interupts...not to get back to the target or anything...Cus you know there aren't a ton of knockbacks, stuns, slows and roots in this game. Fail 4.

 

A hybrid sage/sorc brings more CC (stuns are the best CC in the game and yours is ranged), has more survival in a group settings, does equal dmg to a pure dps spec, can throw instant heals (shields which can't be dispelled) on other players, can dispel CC off players, and is a stupidly easy to play class who has to worry less about resources and managing them then any class in the game.

 

There are what? 200 "good" sages/sorcs on every realm? And 5 marauders/sents combined? LOL. I am sure it is cus all the good players rolled sorcs right? Oh wait...many of us beta tested sorc, reported the hybrid spec as OP, too simple to play and simply no fun. We also said the resolve system sucked, ranged stuns was a horrid idea and that people would just stack ranged stuns and sorcs up the wazoo.

 

Like I said feel free to roll a sent/marauder. Just because other people can lead dmg on them? Doesn't mean you will do half the dmg you do on a faceroll class that is the most stupidly OP ranged class ever seen in an MMO.

 

About the only class/spec that half the people in this thread could even approach the dmg they do on their sage/sorc is a commando/merc that has nowhere near the utility, sucks at off healing and has a cast time on their CC (not the stun). They are also completely screwed by interupts and line of site because they have no passive dmg.

 

But whatever. Please roll a marauder. I love clownstomping kids on my sentinel who can't break 100 k on a melee class. Funny thing? I bet some of them are as good or better then you at the game. They just didn't roll one of the two faceroll classes. Don't worry they got the memo. See the 10-49 brackets as proof. Out of the 10 games I played tonight. Half had ALL sages and commandos in them lol. Soon Republic will be as "skilled" as Empire.

 

If I am going to play a ranged class I will play WoW. At least I have to time things, my CC has cast times other then roots and those can be dispelled as soon as they are put on (no 6 second dispel timer).

 

Sorc/Sages are not fun, are not challenging and are simply too good when hybrid specced. The only class that comes close to them in this game as dps in a warzone is a extremely well played marauder/sent and I can do better on the sage/sorc then my sent/marauder which brings us to..

 

Why bother. As a sage/sorc I can sit back do more dmg, with an easier playstyle, throw out heals, dispel cc off teammates and not be kited/rooted/stunned/knockedback to the point it just isn't even fun. Yeah I can lead dmg on my sent/marauder and actually get to hit my target 3 out of every 10 seconds. Why am I leading dmg? Cus these kids can't even play an OP spec right, most are specced wrong, and most use about 1/3rd of their abilities but can be right under me in dmg lol.

 

They can balance the game, rework the resolve system or we will all go back to WoW when pandas hit. The game can be fixed and they need to start with the hybrid spec sorc/sage. It is the most glaring OP spec in this game with healing sorc right behind it.

Edited February 15, 2012 by biowareftw

[Lormif]

Intimidating Roar - Untalented 6 second AOE stun/mes

Not a stun. Stuns don't break on dmg. Fail.

Then we only have one stun, besides you missed the part where I said stun/MEZ

 

Force Choke 3 second stun

Again not a stun. A channeled CC that can be interupted. Fail 2.

A) not if speced into it

B) how can intsant spells be interupted, I would love to know.

 

Predation 10 second run speed increase for a group

And sage/sorc throws instant heals on people (shields that can't be dispelled), can cleanse CC off people, and is the only offhealer in the game with the endless freakin force/procs as hybrid spec to effectively be able to offheal. If you use predation you aren't using your dmg zen ability. Which means less dmg for you. Utility comes at a huge cost.

Not sure how this is even related.... But we need the less damage.. Remember I have no armor, I have no hps and you are one of the hardest hitting classes in the game.

 

Deadly Throw reduces healing to the target

Yeah a 20 percent mortal strike when expertise increases healing done by 15 percent...Compare this to mortal strikes in other games. Add to this the dmg on it is garbage, it costs a resource and with expertise it is 5 percent less healing. OMG!

Again, you are one of the hardest hitting classes in the game 5% less healing is still a lot vs you, especially when my heals are crap anyways....

 

Disruption interrupt

Sage/sorc has an interupt. What is your point? Yours is ranged.

Did you forget that your force charge interupts, and is ranged and also immobilizes and closes the distance?

 

Crippling Slash 50% slow for 12 seconds

You have a slow that is ranged. Along with that the button you are pressing 80 percent of the time autokites.

Do you know what kitting is? if I am standing still I am not kiting, and you still have TWO ways around it.

 

Cloak of Pain shield/reflect damage all in one.

Lasts 6 seconds unless people are stupid enough to hit you. Try using a CC on a marauder/sent that has it up. When it ends? They are the softest target in the game.

BS sorcs are always the softest.

 

Saber Ward - reduces melee and tech defenses by 50% and reduces all force damage by 25% for 12 seconds, MUCH better then our shield which will last about 3 seconds for a static amount.

Most fail comparison ever. 3 min cooldown vs shield which can be casted twice in any pvp encounter, can be given to other people. Fail 3.

 

Most failed logic ever on your part... It can only be cast 2time in combat if I prepare for said combat.. Instant combat, which is still combat, it cant be cast 2 times on because I die in 17 seconds 1v1... In addition if I prepare for it you have 7+ seconds ever combat where I am avoiding all combat.

 

Force Charge- built in jump to target with an 2 second imobilize and interupt, giveing you a 30m itnerupt.

Yeah we use our charge only for interupts...not to get back to the target or anything...Cus you know there aren't a ton of knockbacks, stuns, slows and roots in this game. Fail 4.

 

Just because you dont use something doesnt mean you cant, not to mention you have a secondary leap for this... And I am sorry if you are not using your leap to interupt there is a problem with you...

 

A hybrid sage/sorc brings more CC (stuns are the best CC in the game and yours is ranged), has more survival in a group settings, does equal dmg to a pure dps spec, can throw instant heals (shields which can't be dispelled) on other players, can dispel CC off players, and is a stupidly easy to play class who has to worry less about resources and managing them then any class in the game.

 

According to your logic, that stuns dont break on damage, we only have one stun, so it is not the most.

 

I would love to see how we burst the same as a pure dps spec

 

our "heal" which is really a protection not a heal, is once ever 17 seconds..

 

There are what? 200 "good" sages/sorcs on every realm? And 5 marauders/sents combined? LOL. I am sure it is cus all the good players rolled sorcs right? Oh wait...many of us beta tested sorc, reported the hybrid spec as OP, too simple to play and simply no fun. We also said the resolve system sucked, ranged stuns was a horrid idea and that people would just stack ranged stuns and sorcs up the wazoo.

citation please? anyone can make up stats

 

Like I said feel free to roll a sent/marauder. Just because other people can lead dmg on them? Doesn't mean you will do half the dmg you do on a faceroll class that is the most stupidly OP ranged class ever seen in an MMO.

 

I have a maurader, have stated this before.

 

About the only class/spec that half the people in this thread could even approach the dmg they do on their sage/sorc is a commando/merc that has nowhere near the utility, sucks as off healing and has a cast time on their CC (not the stun). They are also completely screwed by interupts and line of site because they have no passive dmg.

It has way more burst, and more surviability.

 

But whatever. Please roll a marauder. I love clownstomping kids on my sentinel who can't break 100 k on a melee class. Funny thing? I bet some of them are as good or better then you at the game. They just didn't roll one of the two faceroll classes.

 

Again, I already have one.

[biowareftw]

Then we only have one stun, besides you missed the part where I said stun/MEZ

 

 

A) not if speced into it

B) how can intsant spells be interupted, I would love to know.

 

 

Not sure how this is even related.... But we need the less damage.. Remember I have no armor, I have no hps and you are one of the hardest hitting classes in the game.

 

 

Again, you are one of the hardest hitting classes in the game 5% less healing is still a lot vs you, especially when my heals are crap anyways....

 

 

Did you forget that your force charge interupts, and is ranged and also immobilizes and closes the distance?

 

 

Do you know what kitting is? if I am standing still I am not kiting, and you still have TWO ways around it.

 

 

BS sorcs are always the softest.

 

 

 

Most failed logic ever on your part... It can only be cast 2time in combat if I prepare for said combat.. Instant combat, which is still combat, it cant be cast 2 times on because I die in 17 seconds 1v1... In addition if I prepare for it you have 7+ seconds ever combat where I am avoiding all combat.

 

 

 

Just because you dont use something doesnt mean you cant, not to mention you have a secondary leap for this... And I am sorry if you are not using your leap to interupt there is a problem with you...

 

 

 

According to your logic, that stuns dont break on damage, we only have one stun, so it is not the most.

 

I would love to see how we burst the same as a pure dps spec

 

our "heal" which is really a protection not a heal, is once ever 17 seconds..

 

 

citation please? anyone can make up stats

 

 

 

I have a maurader, have stated this before.

 

 

It has way more burst, and more surviability.

 

 

 

Again, I already have one.

 

Do me a favor and post a screenshot of your dmg as a marauder. Seeing that in the last thread you thought marauders and sents had force push (LOL) you know what? Don't bother.

 

Just keep posting more crap about how CC's that break on dmg are stuns, and try to explain to people that sage/sorc are somehow the only class in the game balanced around hybrid specs that no other classes are allowed to have, and the ones that did have them? Got nerfed, even though I never saw one thread complaining about the spec.

 

Spin it all you want. Your posts simply aren't worth responding to or reading anymore. I don't know how anyone can take you seriously at this point, or care about anything you post.

 

I will be back to this forum when the inevitable nerf comes and hopefully it isn't a "to the ground" nerf (I don't like to see classes become non viable like a scoundrel/op as dps in pve).

 

I will just say simply... I told you so and have fun leveling your merc/commando.

Edited February 15, 2012 by biowareftw

[Lormif]

Do me a favor and post a screenshot of your dmg as a marauder. Seeing that in the last thread you thought marauders and sents had force push (LOL) you know what? Don't bother.

 

Just keep posting more crap about how CC's that break on dmg are stuns, and try to explain to people that sage/sorc are somehow the only class in the game balanced around hybrid specs that no other classes are allowed to have, and the ones that did have them? Got nerfed, even though I never saw one thread complaining about the spec.

 

Spin it all you want. Your posts simply aren't worth responding to or reading anymore. I don't know how anyone can take you seriously at this point, or care about anything you post.

 

I will be back to this forum when the inevitable nerf comes and hopefully it isn't a "to the ground" nerf (I don't like to see classes become non viable like a scoundrel/op as dps in pve).

 

I will just say simply... I told you so and have fun leveling your merc/commando.

 

 

You again with this nonsense.. I have already stated SEVERAL TIMES I forgot to move that one out of my list I was seperating.

 

Again, all the ones that break I called stun/MEZ, and if you dont wanna count them then sorcs only have ONE stun.

[Waagabond]

8 sentinels vs 8 sorcs will end in 5 sentinels alive.

 

the first 3 sentinels die at the beginning due to cc and focus fire.

the 8 sorcs die afterwards running from cc immune 5 sentinels.

 

So what you are trying to tell us is that 8 sorcs would not be able to beat 5 sentinels?

 

And at what point in this story did you wake up?

 

Just acknowledge that fact that the class is broken instead of putting up redicilous statements such as this.

 

For the sake of the game it needs to be rebalanced.

[me_unknown]

So what you are trying to tell us is that 8 sorcs would not be able to beat 5 sentinels?

i wonder: are you so retarded or is it only a kind of intensional provocation?

 

8 sorc cannot beat 5 sentinels if.... and this i already wrote above is the case when they start 8 vs 8 and are not so skill-less like you seem to be....

 

the 5 sentinels are nearly all IMMUNE to cc, most of the sorcs/sages are already quite alot damaged.

 

it is not 8 sorcs against 5 sentinels, it is 8 vs 8 which results in 8 srocs vs 5 CC immune, already close sentinels that slow you and interrupt you stoping nearly all your damage!

 

edit: oh and just in case you need that explanation too:

if the srocs were so stupid to throw all their cc only on the first 3 sentinels then even though the other sentinels are not immune, the sorcs have 1min cd on their stunns while the sentienls have 12(skilled or 15 unskilled)s cd on their jump.

Edited February 15, 2012 by me_unknown

[da_krall]

I have 10+ years of MMO PVP experience.

 

I can beat mediocre sages no worries, but with the scoundrel Im the rock to the scissor.

 

I honestly dont see the Scoundrel as the rock to toh sorc scissors. Sure if you get a jump on them, crit alot and can stun lock them a little they are toast, if not the sorc gets some distance using force speed, slows you and goes to town as you have no gap closer. But this is a problem with the scoundrel not a problem with the sorc being OP.

Edited February 15, 2012 by da_krall

[me_unknown]

I honestly dont see the Scoundrel as the rock teh toe srco scissor. Sure if you get a jump on them and can stun lock the ma little they are toast, if not the sorc gets some distance using force speed, slows you and goes to town as you have no gap closer. But this is a problem with the scoundrel not a problem with the sorc being OP.

 

a tip (it is not a guaranteed win strategy): don't waste your stuns to early. instead interrupt a sorcs/sages spam spell. if you do this he has nothing dangerous to swith to and no procs allowing long time cast spells being instant on the run.

 

interrupt is one of the most dangerous counters to a sorc/sage. don't hold it back for a heal or any long time casting. us it for their spammed spell!!!

 

edit: but i admit i have only few experiences with scoundrells. so only treat this as an idea. not more.

Edited February 15, 2012 by me_unknown

[da_krall]

For PVE, you need a tank. For PVP, you just need a full team of sorcs.

 

Thats just not true in my opinion, i have seen quite a few mostly sorc teams get rolled. replace that 8 man sroc with with a 4 man sorc, a couple of tank classes and the rest maurders and they easily roll the sorc.

 

Honestly sorc are the easiest class to kill in the game if you have a root, a pull or an interupt, and if you cant kill them its only because they run off and left whatever fight was happening.

[Wingzeron]

Intimidating Roar - Untalented 6 second AOE stun/mes

Not a stun. Stuns don't break on dmg. Fail.

 

Force Choke 3 second stun

Again not a stun. A channeled CC that can be interupted. Fail 2.

 

Predation 10 second run speed increase for a group

And sage/sorc throws instant heals on people (shields that can't be dispelled), can cleanse CC off people, and is the only offhealer in the game with the endless freakin force/procs as hybrid spec to effectively be able to offheal. If you use predation you aren't using your dmg zen ability. Which means less dmg for you. Utility comes at a huge cost.

 

Deadly Throw reduces healing to the target

Yeah a 20 percent mortal strike when expertise increases healing done by 15 percent...Compare this to mortal strikes in other games. Add to this the dmg on it is garbage, it costs a resource and with expertise it is 5 percent less healing. OMG!

 

Disruption interrupt

Sage/sorc has an interupt. What is your point? Yours is ranged.

 

Crippling Slash 50% slow for 12 seconds

You have a slow that is ranged. Along with that the button you are pressing 80 percent of the time autokites.

 

Cloak of Pain shield/reflect damage all in one.

Lasts 6 seconds unless people are stupid enough to hit you. Try using a CC on a marauder/sent that has it up. When it ends? They are the softest target in the game.

 

Saber Ward - reduces melee and tech defenses by 50% and reduces all force damage by 25% for 12 seconds, MUCH better then our shield which will last about 3 seconds for a static amount.

Most fail comparison ever. 3 min cooldown vs shield which can be casted twice in any pvp encounter, can be given to other people. Fail 3.

 

Force Charge- built in jump to target with an 2 second imobilize and interupt, giveing you a 30m itnerupt.

Yeah we use our charge only for interupts...not to get back to the target or anything...Cus you know there aren't a ton of knockbacks, stuns, slows and roots in this game. Fail 4.

 

A hybrid sage/sorc brings more CC (stuns are the best CC in the game and yours is ranged), has more survival in a group settings, does equal dmg to a pure dps spec, can throw instant heals (shields which can't be dispelled) on other players, can dispel CC off players, and is a stupidly easy to play class who has to worry less about resources and managing them then any class in the game.

 

There are what? 200 "good" sages/sorcs on every realm? And 5 marauders/sents combined? LOL. I am sure it is cus all the good players rolled sorcs right? Oh wait...many of us beta tested sorc, reported the hybrid spec as OP, too simple to play and simply no fun. We also said the resolve system sucked, ranged stuns was a horrid idea and that people would just stack ranged stuns and sorcs up the wazoo.

 

Like I said feel free to roll a sent/marauder. Just because other people can lead dmg on them? Doesn't mean you will do half the dmg you do on a faceroll class that is the most stupidly OP ranged class ever seen in an MMO.

 

About the only class/spec that half the people in this thread could even approach the dmg they do on their sage/sorc is a commando/merc that has nowhere near the utility, sucks at off healing and has a cast time on their CC (not the stun). They are also completely screwed by interupts and line of site because they have no passive dmg.

 

But whatever. Please roll a marauder. I love clownstomping kids on my sentinel who can't break 100 k on a melee class. Funny thing? I bet some of them are as good or better then you at the game. They just didn't roll one of the two faceroll classes. Don't worry they got the memo. See the 10-49 brackets as proof. Out of the 10 games I played tonight. Half had ALL sages and commandos in them lol. Soon Republic will be as "skilled" as Empire.

 

If I am going to play a ranged class I will play WoW. At least I have to time things, my CC has cast times other then roots and those can be dispelled as soon as they are put on (no 6 second dispel timer).

 

Sorc/Sages are not fun, are not challenging and are simply too good when hybrid specced. The only class that comes close to them in this game as dps in a warzone is a extremely well played marauder/sent and I can do better on the sage/sorc then my sent/marauder which brings us to..

 

Why bother. As a sage/sorc I can sit back do more dmg, with an easier playstyle, throw out heals, dispel cc off teammates and not be kited/rooted/stunned/knockedback to the point it just isn't even fun. Yeah I can lead dmg on my sent/marauder and actually get to hit my target 3 out of every 10 seconds. Why am I leading dmg? Cus these kids can't even play an OP spec right, most are specced wrong, and most use about 1/3rd of their abilities but can be right under me in dmg lol.

 

They can balance the game, rework the resolve system or we will all go back to WoW when pandas hit. The game can be fixed and they need to start with the hybrid spec sorc/sage. It is the most glaring OP spec in this game with healing sorc right behind it.

 

You're soooo right about this. I'm also giving Bioware some time to fix it, or Iwill also go back to WoW when MoP comes out.

[JustinxDuff]

A good sentinel/mara will beat an equal geared sage/sorc all of the time. The only class I have real trouble with on my Sent are assassins.

 

I do have to say that Sorcs seems to be a tad over the top but I think this has more to do with how many people play them as opposed to them being OP as a class. 2-3 sorcs in a WZ gives that team a HUGE advantage over a team that has 1 or none.

Edited February 15, 2012 by JustinxDuff

[SicNNasty]

 

A) not if speced into it

B) how can intsant spells be interupted, I would love to know.

 

You again with this nonsense.. I have already stated SEVERAL TIMES I forgot to move that one out of my list I was seperating.

 

Forgot to take that one out as well, that's a juggernaught ^^

 

And the second leap thing is for Rage specced Marauders, and only a Big Number AoE loving noob would play a rage specced Mara in pvp. (especially since the rage spec is actually better for juggs)

 

Oh yeah, I said I was going to get off this board, bored at work?

[Waagabond]

I honestly dont see the Scoundrel as the rock to toh sorc scissors. Sure if you get a jump on them, crit alot and can stun lock them a little they are toast, if not the sorc gets some distance using force speed, slows you and goes to town as you have no gap closer. But this is a problem with the scoundrel not a problem with the sorc being OP.

 

Its actually supposed to be.

 

Especially with the arp nerf on flechette round a scoundrel have no business hitting on a heavy armored target anymore.

 

And with the nerf reduction it have not much business going for sorcs either.

 

Whats left is snipers really, and unguarded, unweary, solo roaming sorcs that forgot to bubble themself.

 

And yes, there is a problem with the scoundrel and operative as they was over nerfed and I agree its not the sorcs problem.

 

The sorc should not be overly nerfed. But they should not be able to spec hybrid as they currently do, to get the most bang for the buck, and its a big bang rather then a small puff.

 

The fact is that apart from scoundrels or operatives the sorc really have very little that threaten them in a team oriented environment. While other healers have nothing to compare with when it comes to survival.

Merc or commando healers do have good survival vs a few when they can focus heal themself while under a guard, but they have no cc to speak of or able to get out of a sticky situation as the sorc can.

 

I think the bubbles should just be removed, then again, that would be a huge blow for PVE.

Solution: Place the bubble as a high tier talent in the healing tree so you are forced to spec into it, tier 4 minimum, tier 5 preferably.

 

I think the general issue is with hard hitting sorcs that still can bubble themself AND be able to self heal, if not great, so good.

 

Or reduce the strenght of the bubble by say 75% but make it on a shorter cd.

 

I honestly dont know, but something needs to be done about this class to restore pvp balance in the game, but not at the cost of PVE balance.

[Waagabond]

a tip (it is not a guaranteed win strategy): don't waste your stuns to early. instead interrupt a sorcs/sages spam spell. if you do this he has nothing dangerous to swith to and no procs allowing long time cast spells being instant on the run.

 

interrupt is one of the most dangerous counters to a sorc/sage. don't hold it back for a heal or any long time casting. us it for their spammed spell!!!

 

edit: but i admit i have only few experiences with scoundrells. so only treat this as an idea. not more.

 

Thanks mate.

But honestly, as I earlier said. personally I dont have too much trouble with the sorc in a 1vs1.

I have never lost to one. But the game is team oriented, and its near impossible to kill a sorc healer compared to other healers.

Operative healers or merc healers, or rep equivalent is far easier to kill then a sorc.

 

And ofc interupt is the most important tool.

Personally I never burn the stun unless I need too.

 

But usually the scenario is this:

 

Shoot first, backblast

Sorc: Aoe knockback, root...then ccd..sorc escapes and start nuking at 30m range, where you have no gap closers, and unless vanish is off cd you are toast.

 

Personally though:

 

I let them knock me back and root me, at which point I tendom blast them for a root, they cc me and I trigger our of it, at which point all movement impairing effects also is off.

Flash bang with 10m range, and either another backblast or vanish, shoot first, backblast, interupt, suckerpunch...etc etc...the scenario ends in a beaten sorc most of the time.

 

We have many tools to deal with sorcs in a 1vs1.

But the sorc brings too much utility to the team. Thats the issue I have.

[Waagabond]

A good sentinel/mara will beat an equal geared sage/sorc all of the time. The only class I have real trouble with on my Sent are assassins.

 

I do have to say that Sorcs seems to be a tad over the top but I think this has more to do with how many people play them as opposed to them being OP as a class. 2-3 sorcs in a WZ gives that team a HUGE advantage over a team that has 1 or none.

 

And this is the problem me and others are saying as well.

 

Its their utility coupled with heals and damage.

 

There is no class that brings even half of what a sorc brings to a team.

 

Either they should be healers or dps, with some cc.

 

Bubble should be a talent high up in the healing tree, not a baseline spell.

And the cyklone cc should not have a 2 sec stun at its end but just act as a mez.

 

Tbh thats it to ensure this class is more balanced.

 

Healers will be hard to kill, but dps sorcs will be just like any other pure dps class, able to sustain and cc but their survival will be just as other healers since bubble is removed.

Their bubble is their movement speed ability, they dont need anything else.

To have bubble AND movement speed, AND a huge amount of CC makes this class near impossible to kill in a team vs team encounter.