Stejo Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Gee, WoW was/is so amazing! (sarcasm) To all the WoW player base, it was boring. It was a never ending "carrot-on-a-stick" play style. Not to mention the constant grinding feel of the game. And yes, Blizzard just reinvented the wheel only with a different hubcap. At least with SWTOR, I don't have the grind feeling bc of the story quests. One other thing if you powerleveled to 50 and are bored? Ha, that's own fault. Every single quest in the game asks you to kill 10+ mobs as main objective or bonus and it's not grindy because they tell you a pretty story before sending you to do so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fixiooo Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Gee, WoW was/is so amazing! (sarcasm) To all the WoW player base, it was boring. It was a never ending "carrot-on-a-stick" play style. Not to mention the constant grinding feel of the game. And yes, Blizzard just reinvented the wheel only with a different hubcap. At least with SWTOR, I don't have the grind feeling bc of the story quests. One other thing if you powerleveled to 50 and are bored? Ha, that's own fault. Instead of reading a quest in text you now hear the npc speak to you what must be done. What you will be doing is still the same in the end regardless. The quests in SWTOR aren't any less a grind than in WoW. Also, the powerlevel excuse is getting quite sad now. We're a month after release and I'd dare say the majority of the playerbase is already level 50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyACT Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Instead of reading a quest in text you now hear the npc speak to you what must be done. What you will be doing is still the same in the end regardless. The quests in SWTOR aren't any less a grind than in WoW. Also, the powerlevel excuse is getting quite sad now. We're a month after release and I'd dare say the majority of the playerbase is already level 50. Don't think so on the 50 thing. I am in a dual faction guild with over 200 members and we have about 10% at 50 - hardly majority. Won't be long though and you will be correct. Gives Bioware about 3-4 weeks in my view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pairadox Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 BW you had several MMO's to use as a reference to find out what worked and what did not. WoW obviously set the bar on many levels. But you had so many references and this is the end result? This is the best you could come up with when you had WoW, EQ, GW, DAOC, and Eve-Online to use as examples of great MMO's. That is why so many people are upset. You had all this hype for this game. You even had references to find out what worked and what didn't. 300m budget and what we get as an end result is this? That is why there are so many rage posts BW. What we have here is a great game lvl 1-49 and then a serious lack of end-game content. Thoughts? Thought: Creation of content 1 to max level takes quite a bit of work, time and effort. It is generally expected that people will take time to crunch through that content. (And has for a majority of players, with the exception of people who are putting in 8 hour plus days, or simply skipping cutscenes and dialouge.) And that endgame content is always light during the FIRST TWO MONTHS OF LAUNCH..... I mean really.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyfeld Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Gee, WoW was/is so amazing! (sarcasm) To all the WoW player base, it was boring. It was a never ending "carrot-on-a-stick" play style. Not to mention the constant grinding feel of the game. And yes, Blizzard just reinvented the wheel only with a different hubcap. At least with SWTOR, I don't have the grind feeling bc of the story quests. One other thing if you powerleveled to 50 and are bored? Ha, that's own fault. I have no level 50s. My highest character is my level 43 Vanguard. I have 8 characters in total, ranging from level 15 to level 43, each a different AC, split evenly between each faction. I'm freaking bored with questing, and I'm not looking forward to level 50. Class quests are cool and all, but when you have to sit through all the same side quests over and over again (and let's be honest, most of them do boil down to the same tired "go here, kill X number of creature Y, and bring back item Z" formula that WoW beat to death). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barathos Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Gee, WoW was/is so amazing! (sarcasm) To all the WoW player base, it was boring. It was a never ending "carrot-on-a-stick" play style. Not to mention the constant grinding feel of the game. And yes, Blizzard just reinvented the wheel only with a different hubcap. At least with SWTOR, I don't have the grind feeling bc of the story quests. One other thing if you powerleveled to 50 and are bored? Ha, that's own fault. That's your own fault* Sorry... it was bugging me... And i'm sorry, but you must be new to MMOs. The "carrot-on-a-stick" playstyle is in almost every. single. mmo. Except this one, where the raids are really (which is odd) simplistic. I'm NO hardcore raider by any means, but as soon as I get in a pug and I get the first tier of raiding gear easily, which basicly makes hardmodes invalid, I have a problem. So they got rid of the "carrot-on-a-stick" and instead I get "Nothing-in-front-of-you"... I want my carrot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 KOTOR with a worse storyline and worse set of companions, set in a persistent world that is static to a fault. I think you're wearing rose-colored glasses when remembering KOTOR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larlar Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 First of all, I laugh my *** off every time I see some holier than thou banana tell me how this game is so different from WOW, and they wouldn't be seen dead playing WOW and its a lame MMO etc etc. This game is an attempt at recreating WOW, with a Star Wars skin, and the addition of an incredibly expensively put together quest system. Oh yeah I forgot about Space battles... that makes all the difference :S anyway... In all the really crucial areas, I'm really sorry to say it, but this game is inferior to the game it is trying desperately to emulate. Firstly and most importantly by a mile, its not as smooth as WOW. Play a warzone, then go and play a WOW battleground. Its almost night and day. The gameplay is dramatically less precise, fluid and responsive than WOW's. The PVE is also nowhere near as interesting and complex other than that its Star Wars. Now we all know WOW has many years of a headstart on SWTOR so comparing PVE is unfair but ultimately, where it counts, gameplay, they actually haven't even managed to equal how good WOW was when it released. That's the really disappointing thing for me. WOW's combat was crisp and precise from day one, and once you experience that precision and responsiveness its incredibly difficult to adapt to an inferior package - which is what SWTOR offers. That's why so many people are contributing to the Ability Delay thread and why so many people are getting all hot under the collar. Now, I paid for a second month, and am really enjoying the quest levelling thing, and for me, it has had replay value - maybe I'm easily amused. Anyway, there is potential here, but they have an awful lot of ground to make up before the next new MMO arrives. I'm optimistic but realistic and don't expect this game to last me more than a month or two more having seen what is on offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyfeld Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 I think you're wearing rose-colored glasses when remembering KOTOR. I only played through the KOTOR games in 2010, I don't have any sort of long-standing nostalgia. But you're welcome to keep making baseless assumptions if it'll make you feel better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nurvus Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 (edited) We don't want a WoW-clone, or any other MMO clone, becuase that old standard is dead and beating. I like that BW is actually doing something different to break away from the mold. I kinda chuckled. Skill trees; boring +1% healing talents; skill ranks; item prefixes; rarity colors. At least 50% of SWTOR is pretty much cloned from WoW. It's like BioWare made the SWTOR project in TBC/LK and didn't realize even Blizzard got rid of that crap. Here's what SWTOR has of great: - A franchise with a huge fanbase (Star Wars) - A fun, but also frustrating crafting system that produces stuff you replace in a heartbeat - Huttball & good incentive to use your head due to positioning & knockbacks/pulls/stuns. - Enhanced Single player Experience After that, what do you have? I must say World of Warcraft, in its Vanilla release 7 years ago, even though it didn't have end game content, it had: - 3 starting areas per faction, and you could shuffle it -> start a human and quest in night elf land, then westfall, etc. In SWTOR you start on 2 different zones per faction, and then get forced into the same planet with everyone. - Enough content before lv60 to keep you busy for months. SWTOR is already showering you with dailies to to repeat content over and over again... - casual world pvp while questing SWTOR breaks this with the insane amount of quest instancing + sharding. You had random elite/rare enemies that were both tough to beat, near impossible to solo at the proper level, and dropped actually good gear. Rare (Prototype) gear was actually hard to get, and Epic (Artifact) was actually very rewarding. --- I hope players will stick around long enough for BioWare to take in the feedback and seriously improve this game. Edited January 28, 2012 by Nurvus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 I only played through the KOTOR games in 2010, I don't have any sort of long-standing nostalgia. But you're welcome to keep making baseless assumptions if it'll make you feel better. If you'd just played them, I agree, but you didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galanaer Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Your exactly right! I want to hear the dialog of what's going on. Rather that than reading 4 paragraphs in small font for the same thing. Pretty you say? Fine by me. Everyone knew this game was going to be similar to KOTOR. I remember reading articles from PC Gamer about it, almost a year before the release. And yet, players are screaming bloody murder of how they don't like the gameplay. Really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chromiie Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 The fact i actually have a character i care about. That i can choose to finish a quest or choose to take money from someone instead. This is much better than getting boar tusks for soup and having no choice. That to me is different than other MMO's, let's not pretend having a quest with the only choice being 'accept' is in the same ballpark. OMG I cared for my characters in every MMO I've played. In WoW my hunter was my favorite. The first I reached level 10 and went out and tamed my pet. It meant more to me than getting married to Ashara (which does nothing). I would always go out and fish to get some food for my pet, keep it happy for damage bonus, name and level it up. Seriously when I got my petrified leaf and did the epic bow quest a bunch of hunters from my server spent a lot of time trying to figure it out and when we did we all helped each other to get the best bow ever imo. The fact that you care for your character is not innovative at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nurvus Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 (edited) Your exactly right! I want to hear the dialog of what's going on. Rather that than reading 4 paragraphs in small font for the same thing. Pretty you say? Fine by me. Everyone knew this game was going to be similar to KOTOR. I remember reading articles from PC Gamer about it, almost a year before the release. And yet, players are screaming bloody murder of how they don't like the gameplay. Really? The gameplay isn't similar to KOTOR. KOTOR used a d20 dungeons & dragons system, with skills (awareness, etc), feats (Lightsaber Focus, Lightsaber Specialization, etc). You had 6 MEANINGFUL attributes. You had several types of damage (energy, sonic, thermal, electric, etc) You had several types of defenses (armor, willpower, fortitude, reflex) Why would BioWare throw all of that away, to replace it with: - 4 primary stats of wich you only ever use 1 (why do the other 3 even show up in your character sheet?) - Old WoW Talent trees with different names - Old WoW Skill ranks - Old WoW secondary stat style (armor, block, dodge, etc) with different names? KOTOR allowed great customization of your character. You could go Dexterity or Strength with Lightsaber, specialize in Power Attack or Flurry... and so on. You had Grenades, personal shields, etc. Now, you create a character with specific gear, with stats decided for you, where all you gotta do is follow the path laid in front of you and all will be well. What customization is there in this game? Honestly? Edited January 28, 2012 by Nurvus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyfeld Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 If you'd just played them, I agree, but you didn't. *Shrugs* whatever floats your boat man. Fact is, companions in both KOTOR games were more fleshed out and had actual dialogue trees that encouraged you to spend time talking with them and getting to know their story. They were interesting, they had opinions on things, and you could influence them toward the light or dark side. Almost none of that is true in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barathos Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Your exactly right! I want to hear the dialog of what's going on. Rather that than reading 4 paragraphs in small font for the same thing. Pretty you say? Fine by me. Everyone knew this game was going to be similar to KOTOR. I remember reading articles from PC Gamer about it, almost a year before the release. And yet, players are screaming bloody murder of how they don't like the gameplay. Really? We wanted KOTOR, not DA2 where you can't change your class quest at all. There's not pivotal moment in your story when you have to make a MAJOR choice that will be felt forever. =/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galanaer Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Actually, my first MMO was Sierra's Realms. You know, that little game company that dominated the pc market back in the 80s and part of the 90s? And, I've played just about every MMO out there since. Sorry junior I'm not new to MMOs or PC games for that matter. Now when. I made the comment about, "carrot on a stick", obviously you couldnt inference my statement. True every MMO has had that style of thinking. But, with this game I don't feel like I have to get the next best thing to feel accomplished or rush back to base to get my next rank in skill. As opposed to WoW, you couldn't wait to grind out that level to get your next spell or item bc developers created an atmosphere where if you didn't have it, you needed it too bc Johnny over there had it. And if this is a WoW clone as many are saying, then WoW is no better than EQ, UO, Meridian 59, etc. Bc they just took elements from other established MMOs to create theirs. Did WoW do anything new? Not really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chromiie Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 And if this is a WoW clone as many are saying, then WoW is no better than EQ, UO, Meridian 59, etc. Bc they just took elements from other established MMOs to create theirs. Did WoW do anything new? Not really. Why does everyone always mention that? Yes WoW copies what WORKED in MMOs prior and changed stuff like death penalty and ****. But WoW is also the biggest MMO so more people will obviously have played it. Everquest was great but WoW has become the new template that themepark mmos unfortunately try top copy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jezzikah Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Did you ever think that maybe the people at BW don't play MMO's.. Tim Burton doesn't read comic books and he got to direct Batman:eek: and we all know how his version measures up to The Dark Night..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stejo Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Did you ever think that maybe the people at BW don't play MMO's.. Yes, it has crossed my mind... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galanaer Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Blizzard is very crafty in their marketing department. How much spin was used when vanilla WoW was launched? Oh wait, probably 1/2 the community was still in diapers when it was launched. There were floods of nay-sayers when WoW launched. I took blizzard quite sometime to get it all worked out. And as developers, that was their first time creating a game like that. Besides, just because you make a game that grandma can play while the grand kids are taking a nap doesn't mean the game is amazing. Just means its an easy game to play like solitaire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stejo Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Blizzard is very crafty in their marketing department. How much spin was used when vanilla WoW was launched? Oh wait, probably 1/2 the community was still in diapers when it was launched. There were floods of nay-sayers when WoW launched. I took blizzard quite sometime to get it all worked out. And as developers, that was their first time creating a game like that. Besides, just because you make a game that grandma can play while the grand kids are taking a nap doesn't mean the game is amazing. Just means its an easy game to play like solitaire. Bioware managed to sell like 2 million copies of friggin DA2. If Blizzard's marketing department is crafty, bioware's would be the masters of deception. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackmanya Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Bioware managed to sell like 2 million copies of friggin DA2. If Blizzard's marketing department is crafty, bioware's would be the masters of deception. Quoted for brilliance. Ot. While I am enjoying the game so far, the end game is a bit worrying. That is where the game lives or dies. But this is really early in it's life cycle so I will give it time and hope for the best. That's pretty much all you can do. Well that or unsub Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurugeorge Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 (edited) What we have here is a great game lvl 1-49 and then a serious lack of end-game content. Thoughts? Endgame content comes with time. They'd better hurry up though. If there isn't a decent endgame upgrading by the 3 month mark, and about every 4 or 5 months thereafter, with a few expansions down the years, there will be tears before bedtime. Edited January 28, 2012 by gurugeorge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genesizs Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 (edited) I like that BW is actually doing something different to break away from the mold. they did ? .. lol the only mmorpg thats trying to break from the mold atm is Guildwars 2 , however if its going to work out and they gonna keep all their promises they claim that game is gonna have .. that is a whole other story .. but lol always nice to see someone who think they playing something realy different then , ... previous mmo titles Edited January 28, 2012 by Genesizs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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