RandomName_Ru Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Think Arcann will scratch his butt when he gets an itch? or will he rub himself against one of the rock walls? Is it some kind of reference? If not - once learned secret can not be unlearned. Are you sure you want to know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakRoanin Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Also I think all players forget Valky's mind domination schtick! Our JK, Revan, the Masters, hello why does this never get any consideration? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomName_Ru Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 (edited) Also I think all players forget Valky's mind domination schtick! Our JK, Revan, the Masters, hello why does this never get any consideration? You think that Valky was playing mind tricks on his family? Edited February 13, 2018 by RandomName_Ru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebamcfan Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 (edited) Considering that we're talking about man who killed his own followers in a ritual in order to gain immortality, that created a Wound in the Force, and ignited few wars in Galaxy, I don't count out him on not manipulating his family in general/ or via mind tricks too to make them do his bidding. Edited February 13, 2018 by Rebamcfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakRoanin Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Of course he was! Maybe not all the time but a little imprinting here and there definitely. How is it possible for two infant boys to not bond with a loving mother. How is Vaylin so convinced that her mother hates her and would want Arcann dead for killing Thexan. How is Arcann the only one so devastated by his father's destain, while Thexan and Vaylin hardly care? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskIsNotAmused Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 (edited) You think that Valky was playing mind tricks on his family? Considering he was okay with manipulating the outlander into killing off Vaylin and Arcann (Whom he had twisted into his desired states- presumably to get them to the power/ condition he wanted) so that he could absorb them and use them as his weapons/tools...I'de say mind tricks are well within his acceptable range. Edited February 13, 2018 by DuskIsNotAmused Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milishor Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Think Arcann will scratch his butt when he gets an itch? or will he rub himself against one of the rock walls? what did i just read ? /facepalm can we make a Paulsutherland love thread ? :D i like this guy lol ahahaha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfdawg Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 what did i just read ? /facepalm can we make a Paulsutherland love thread ? :D i like this guy lol ahahaha Paul is pretty amazing. He and I have gone back and forth on Twitter about the Zakuulan royal family for a while now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomName_Ru Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Considering that we're talking about man who killed his own followers in a ritual in order to gain immortality, that created a Wound in the Force, and ignited few wars in Galaxy, I don't count out him on not manipulating his family in general/ or via mind tricks too to make them do his bidding. I am not sure that he could mind trick any of his children for a long time. Definitely not Vaylin - otherwise why the need for code words and brainwashing? I do hope that he have not done anything to Senya (thats some nightmare fuel here). Of course he was! Maybe not all the time but a little imprinting here and there definitely. How is it possible for two infant boys to not bond with a loving mother. How is Vaylin so convinced that her mother hates her and would want Arcann dead for killing Thexan. How is Arcann the only one so devastated by his father's destain, while Thexan and Vaylin hardly care? Would Valkorion even need this? He could manipulate them like a fiddle without waving his hands and issuing commands. I have seen children adore one parent and take another for granted - and we are talking about a "god" here. Vaylin - after what happened to her, I am surprised she do not hate her brothers for doing nothing to help her - oh, one was visiting. Thats nice. As for Thexan death - maybe she do not care enough, maybe Arcann is the only one who she have. Vaylin is crazy. Arcann have grown up with a feeling of being the "runt of the family". I have seen parents doing great damage to unfavored child just by ignoring them, no mind tricks needed . Thexan was a first born, was better at many things, was favored by Valkorion, found a way to deal with Valkorion indifference (maybe by protecting his loved ones), was universally adored and seen as natural successor of the Throne by Zakuul people. I suspect if not for the bond brothers shared Arcann would kill Thexan earlier and not by accident . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrJunay Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 Arcann have grown up with a feeling of being the "runt of the family". I have seen parents doing great damage to unfavored child just by ignoring them, no mind tricks needed . Thexan was a first born, was better at many things, was favored by Valkorion, found a way to deal with Valkorion indifference (maybe by protecting his loved ones), was universally adored and seen as natural successor of the Throne by Zakuul people. I suspect if not for the bond brothers shared Arcann would kill Thexan earlier and not by accident . I think so. Despite brotherly love, there was clearly a rivalry between them. Arcann apparently, from the birth hashas a fairly rather complicated character, and was jealous to his brother. If Texan remained alive until the arrival of our PC and the murder of Valkorion, Arcann would have clearly fought with him for the throne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskIsNotAmused Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 (edited) I am not sure that he could mind trick any of his children for a long time. Definitely not Vaylin - otherwise why the need for code words and brainwashing? I do hope that he have not done anything to Senya (thats some nightmare fuel here). Would Valkorion even need this? He could manipulate them like a fiddle without waving his hands and issuing commands. I have seen children adore one parent and take another for granted - and we are talking about a "god" here. Vaylin - after what happened to her, I am surprised she do not hate her brothers for doing nothing to help her - oh, one was visiting. Thats nice. As for Thexan death - maybe she do not care enough, maybe Arcann is the only one who she have. Vaylin is crazy. Arcann have grown up with a feeling of being the "runt of the family". I have seen parents doing great damage to unfavored child just by ignoring them, no mind tricks needed . Thexan was a first born, was better at many things, was favored by Valkorion, found a way to deal with Valkorion indifference (maybe by protecting his loved ones), was universally adored and seen as natural successor of the Throne by Zakuul people. I suspect if not for the bond brothers shared Arcann would kill Thexan earlier and not by accident . Your right of course, even in the real world manipulative (abusive) spouses/partners will often turn the children/friendship group against the target spouse/partner. Edit: I think so. Despite brotherly love, there was clearly a rivalry between them. Arcann apparently, from the birth hashas a fairly rather complicated character, and was jealous to his brother. If Texan remained alive until the arrival of our PC and the murder of Valkorion, Arcann would have clearly fought with him for the throne. I'm not sure. It was a very strong bond, despite Valky's influence. I think for them to have ended up at odds it would have had to be an in the moment thing (Rage/Perceived betrayal etc.). They truly loved each other. I don't see them fighting each other otherwise. Edited February 13, 2018 by DuskIsNotAmused Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebamcfan Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 (edited) I think so. Despite brotherly love, there was clearly a rivalry between them. Arcann apparently, from the birth hashas a fairly rather complicated character, and was jealous to his brother. If Texan remained alive until the arrival of our PC and the murder of Valkorion, Arcann would have clearly fought with him for the throne. Yeah, we see it in Sacrifice-trailer how there's small hint of envy in his eyes when Thexan excells at things (and that Thexan was given the charge of the invasion fleet, Arcann was supposed to stay behind but rebellied against their father's wishes). Edited February 13, 2018 by Rebamcfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eshvara Posted February 13, 2018 Author Share Posted February 13, 2018 (edited) I think so. Despite brotherly love, there was clearly a rivalry between them. Arcann apparently, from the birth hashas a fairly rather complicated character, and was jealous to his brother. If Texan remained alive until the arrival of our PC and the murder of Valkorion, Arcann would have clearly fought with him for the throne. I don't think Arcann would have fought Thexan, because Thexan would not fight. In the small story he said, "Your dreams are mine" If Arcann wanted to rule, he'd probably let him. And try to guide him, as doing g his duty, I do get the impression Thexan was a honourable person and much more level headed than his twin. Totally love the hot headed part though. Edited February 13, 2018 by Eshvara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskIsNotAmused Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I don't think Arcann would have fought Thexan, because Thexan would not fight. In the small story he said, "Your dreams are mine" If Arcann wanted to rule, he'd probably let him. Also this ^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eshvara Posted February 13, 2018 Author Share Posted February 13, 2018 Also this ^ Time slowed and yet the world spun around us as I felt my brother slip away from me. On Zakuul, Arcann and I had conversations without words. We moved in tandem, flowed like water with one mind and purpose. But he was different now. I could feel the rage building inside of him. A rage I did not share. I took his metallic hand. “How much are you willing to give?” “Everything,” Arcann said without hesitation. “Will you not do the same?” “I will fight for you, brother,” I pledged. “Your dreams are mine.” Thexan just doesn't seem like he'd stand in Arcann's way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakRoanin Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I just watched all the trailers again and Valkorian's omnipresent malevolence is chilling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskIsNotAmused Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 (edited) I like all the different interpretations. It's interesting to see how others perceive in game events. Adds to your head cannons you know? Edit: I just watched all the trailers again and Valkorian's omnipresent malevolence is chilling. He generally fills me with contempt and Impotent rage (Impotent because as much as I may want to get the -redacted- I have to make do with my outlanders dealing with him). Edited February 13, 2018 by DuskIsNotAmused Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eshvara Posted February 13, 2018 Author Share Posted February 13, 2018 I don't really have a head canon, I perceive a story a certain way, if I were to be proven wrong, by lets say a BW employee, I'd go with that instead. From what I think head canon means, is like Quinn having betrayed you, but just thinking that he didn't in your version of your story, no matter the actual canon? I don't seem to be able to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskIsNotAmused Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I don't really have a head canon, I perceive a story a certain way, if I were to be proven wrong, by lets say a BW employee, I'd go with that instead. From what I think head canon means, is like Quinn having betrayed you, but just thinking that he didn't in your version of your story, no matter the actual canon? I don't seem to be able to do that. Hmmm then perhaps I used the wrong term. I meant my interpretation of game events . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eshvara Posted February 13, 2018 Author Share Posted February 13, 2018 Hmmm then perhaps I used the wrong term. I meant my interpretation of game events . Oh I'm not saying I'm right, I'm just not certain what it really means? I just noticed the Quinn fans, (some of them) head canon around his betrayal. So I figured it was kind of similar to a fan fiction? I could be wrong! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskIsNotAmused Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 (edited) Oh I'm not saying I'm right, I'm just not certain what it really means? I just noticed the Quinn fans, (some of them) head canon around his betrayal. So I figured it was kind of similar to a fan fiction? I could be wrong! No it makes sense, head canon - ergo personal cannon, no point making the distinction if it follows official cannon . You are quite correct, though I think I have seen it used both ways. still I believe yours is the correct usage I'm not actually that famillier with forums and posting/ reading them, it's a relatively new development. Some of the forum/fandom terms meanings elude me Edited February 13, 2018 by DuskIsNotAmused Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eshvara Posted February 13, 2018 Author Share Posted February 13, 2018 No it makes sense, head canon - ergo personal cannon, no point making the distinction if it follows official cannon . Your are quite correct, though I think I have seen it used both ways. still I believe yours is the correct usage I'm not actually that famillier with forums and posting/ reading them, it's a relatively new development. Some of the forum/fandom terms meanings elude me I'm the same way! I only am so so with certain terms as well, I think I only "learned" about head canon a little over 6 months ago. I'd see it being used around the forums and I'd just be like, huh?:p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrJunay Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 I'm not sure. It was a very strong bond, despite Valky's influence. I think for them to have ended up at odds it would have had to be an in the moment thing (Rage/Perceived betrayal etc.). They truly loved each other. I don't see them fighting each other otherwise. But how would they share the throne? Let's say that Thexan was still alive when our PC killed Valkorion. The throne is free and the first contender for it is Thexan. What would Arcann do? Just would accept it and take a subordinate place (like Vaylin)? I think he would claim the throne, one way or another Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskIsNotAmused Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 (edited) I'm the same way! I only am so so with certain terms as well, I think I only "learned" about head canon a little over 6 months ago. I'd see it being used around the forums and I'd just be like, huh?:p `Huh?` is a fairly common sentiment for me But how would they share the throne? Let's say that Thexan was still alive when our PC killed Valkorion. The throne is free and the first contender for it is Thexan. What would Arcann do? Just would accept it and take a subordinate place (like Vaylin)? I think he would claim the throne, one way or another Like Eshvara said I don't think Thexan would have fought him for it, and besides that he manages with us/the Outlander taking the throne later (Admittedly he's in a very different place then, still). As you say lots of things at play, but I think any break between them would have had to be nurtured and given a suitable catalyst. Edit: Which perhaps is exactly what the campaign to take the core worlds was supposed to do had Arcann obeyed and stayed behind. Valky was tricky. Edited February 13, 2018 by DuskIsNotAmused Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estelindis Posted February 13, 2018 Share Posted February 13, 2018 (edited) I think that Arcann's jealousy of Thexan was a very small thing beside his love for Thexan. It looks like Thexan and Valkorion were the two people who Arcann had the strongest feelings about. Thexan was better than him at everything, and that hurt, but he'd rather have Thexan still with him (and still be better at everything) than have lost him. He loved his brother, and he knew his brother loved him. It didn't matter to Thexan if Arcann was "good enough" by some grand universal standard; he was still good enough from Thexan's point of view. By contrast, Arcann could never be good enough for Valkorion. No matter how much he tried, how far he pushed himself, he couldn't earn his father's approval. Resentment over that built up until it spilled out in rage. When Thexan intervened and they fought, Arcann was, I think, still essentially fighting Valkorion. I think that's the only thing that let him overcome Thexan (for probably the first time ever). When he won, he actually lost - and lost something far more important than what he'd been trying to gain. A deeply shameful failure caused an unspeakably painful loss. It wouldn't surprise me if he spoke about it to no one. There are many interesting parallels between that scene and subsequent ones. When Arcann helps Senya against Vaylin, he's mirroring Thexan's intervention. Vaylin's shocked, betrayed reaction is, in many ways, just like his own earlier one. They both expected their brother to take their side against the parent who "didn't love them enough," but in that moment the brother had a different point of view. And the brother, intervening on behalf of the parent, is somehow also trying to help the person he's intervening against. I'm not sure if Thexan actually loved Valkorion or felt loved by him. I feel as if he obeyed and respected his father, and intervened when Arcann attacked because he felt his brother was making a mistake - but Arcann was the one he cared about more. By contrast, until the scene where Senya found Arcann in the rubble, I don't think he'd ever really appreciated or valued her love - certainly not compared to the way he'd fought to win his father's esteem. But when he saw that she still cared about him after everything he'd done, he was moved by her love, and some spark lit up in him that made him want to protect her. I think he acted more to help Senya than to stop Vaylin from making a mistake. So even though an offer is made to Vaylin after that moment (an offer that's interrupted by the collapse of the ship, not a choice any of them make), I think she's faced with more solidarity between Senya and Arcann than Arcann was between Thexan and Valkorion. I think she must have felt more alone and betrayed than Arcann did. It's all the more tragic because the parent in front of her at that moment actually did love her, so there was a chance for something in that encounter that Arcann really never had with Valkorion. Could Vaylin, starting later, have managed the sort of journey Arcann did if she'd had more time? I have plenty of complaints about various big and little things in the Alliance storyline, but these particular moments with these characters stand out as truly stellar. Edited February 13, 2018 by Estelindis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts