The Scam/Not a Scam debate storyline

[LordArtemis]

This thread has (mostly) moved on, and is primarily dedicated to talking about potential quality of life changes that would be beneficial to all with the added effect of reducing the number of occurrences of this kind of thing.

 

Brewski sums it up rather nicely Nova. I'm just making it possible to focus on the suggestions provided. I am not forcing folks to be more positive, though I may be trying to steer them that way.

[mokkh]

If this doesn't qualify as an in-game scam, what exactly does? A scam is simply using deceit or confusion to take advantage of others. In this case some players are manipulating their listing price per item in order to confuse others. In my opinion, that absolutely meets the scam definition.

 

Do you think that it's good that some players are trying to take advange of the less attentive players? Should stupid people not have any protections? Where do you draw the line? Regardless of how stupid some may be, they are still PAYING CUSTOMERS, (F2P and Preferred players have credit caps that prevent them from losing large amounts of credits) and as such, Bioware should consider their welfare in addressing this issue.

 

Personally speaking, I find it offensive that so many people defend the "they're stupid, and thus shouldn't be protected" argument. It's very probable that people who get scammed will leave and not come back. People that don't come back are a permanent loss of revenue that would otherwise go towards keeping the servers operating. People that get scammed will tell all their friends about how SWTOR caters to scammers, and they will cause more revenue loss. Do you find those repercussions acceptable? Sorry, but I don't.

 

Beyond that, I'm annoyed when I look for things on the GTN, and have to weed out the idiots who price Plasteel at 330,333 credits ea, phobium at 350,333 credits ea, and bondite at 800,333 ea. Do they really think that a single bondite is worth 800k credits? Of course not. Their only motivation is, of course, to trick others into paying their hyper inflated prices. If I were able to pick the people that I want to spend time with in-game, I'll take the friendly moron over the scammer EVERY TIME.

 

I am a "victim" of this "scam."

I didn't pay attention to what I was doing and I lost virtual currency.

I deserved to be a victim of my own inattentiveness and am not going to blame my actions on others.

I am okay with what happened to me because I learned from my mistake and now pay attention to what I do before I buy something.

 

Stupid people have protections, but nothing can protect them from themselves. This is why things like the "Darwin awards" exist.

 

I hope you are personally offended that I am okay with accepting responsibility for my actions.

I'm ok with that and have nothing further to say to you, but since you didn't mention the post I made that refutes every one of your points with actual in game screens from last night. I will repost and turn my back on you to continue getting in a huff over something you perceive as an intentional will to confuse.

 

OK people I just went and did some actual GTN searching and... this "debate" is really, really, ridiculous.

 

A screen of prices without decimal places, this is for items that are both stacked and not stacked. No decimal places, like people have suggested in this thread. Just so happens that the stacks are common multiples of each other.

 

A screen for items that are both not stacked and stacked. Huge difference between 10,000 and 101.01. Just gonna throw that out there. Moreover, this person is clearly not a "scammer", they just want 10k per stack of silica.

 

And a screen for the "scammers", note how ridiculous the amount is to the quantity, they are stacks of ONE. 18 aluminum for 55,555.56? Even if you were ignorant of the number system that would be dramatically more expensive than 1,000,000. Both figures have 7 digits after all.

 

The whole decimal place argument is lost because there are two clearly demarcated columns that separate price per unit and total price. QoL talk or not, anyone that is attempting to legitimize the argument that there aren't proper safeguards in place to protect people from their own inattentiveness is intentionally delusional.

 

Can there be auto sorting QoL improvements made? Sure.

Is there any way to safeguard against every type of error ever ever? No.

This topic needs to be flushed. Period.

 

1 turadium for a billion credits, scam? I'm sure that one is going to get a lot of people, it's sneaky.

18 Aluminum for a million credits, scam? Mhmm, I almost bought it myself. No seriously, I got confused and thought that it must be special aluminum so I hit "buy now" but luckily the confirmation box popped up and I accidentally hit cancel.

 

There is no deceit, there is no intent to confuse. Just horribly overpriced trash items and people who aren't paying attention to what they do. Who are you to pretend to know the motivations of others by a few numbers in a gtn gui?

I'll tell you what their motivation is.... to make money.

 

"A fool and his money are easily parted."

[anonnn]

You seem to have missed the point entirely. This is no longer a discussion about buyer protections or buyer/seller behavior and responsibilities.

 

This discussion is now about the merit of suggestions as QoL improvements for the GTN.

...

 

If you want to discuss GTN QoL improvements, spin it off into a new thread that has "GTN QoL" in the title. You pretending to be the shepherd of this thread is becoming a nuisance.

 

I would think you would at least respect the fact that a COMMUNITY MANAGER has posted to this thread and keep on-topic with the thread. When the Community Manager merged his own thread into this thread, it BECAME that thread, not whatever this thread was before that. SO... this thread can ONLY be about this:

 

"Hey folks,

 

There has been a lot of chatter this weekend in General Discussion around how players are posting on the GTN, specifically around use of decimals/commas, and whether we feel it is an exploit or not. For starters, we definitely don't want to see any players scammed out of their hard earned credits and we will work to stop those situations wherever possible. Unfortunately, this is not one of those scenarios.

 

What someone is doing in this scenario is posting something at a higher value than the market would typically have that item listed for. For us, it would be impossible to tell if a user was posting an item at a higher value to try to "scam" another user, or simply because that is what they want to sell it for.

 

When purchasing items on the GTN, aside from the initial sorting and purchase we also have a secondary window pop-up as confirmation of sale. If you feel you are at risk of buying something off of the GTN at an intended value, take your time! Make sure to read over exactly what they are selling it for and then double check that number when you receive the pop-up. Also, we highly recommend using the sorting functions for both total and unit prices to make sure you are paying what you want.

 

With that in mind, I am going to pass these issues back to the dev team and see if there is anything we can work towards in the future for the GTN to help alleviate these issues. Thanks everyone!

 

-eric

[LordArtemis]

If you want to discuss GTN QoL improvements, spin it off into a new thread that has "GTN QoL" in the title. You pretending to be the shepherd of this thread is becoming a nuisance.

 

I would think you would at least respect the fact that a COMMUNITY MANAGER has posted to this thread and keep on-topic with the thread. When the Community Manager merged his own thread into this thread, it BECAME that thread, not whatever this thread was before that. SO... this thread can ONLY be about this:

 

The current discussion is not off topic.

 

If you really feel that my posts are off topic you are welcome to report my posts. As a result of the merge this is now a potluck thread. Unless you can point to some specific rule that states otherwise, I am going to assume that ALL original topics are fair game from the merged threads.

 

Otherwise I intend to continue.

Edited November 13, 2014 by LordArtemis

[Gomla]

I would think you would at least respect the fact that a COMMUNITY MANAGER has posted to this thread and keep on-topic with the thread. When the Community Manager merged his own thread into this thread, it BECAME that thread, not whatever this thread was before that. SO... this thread can ONLY be about this:

 

Ahhh back seat moderators, gotta love them.

 

All topics this thread has discussed are fair game. Thread is still a thread it didn't "become" anything.

[robertthebard]

@XiamaraSim IMO There are 2 reasons to explain why it appears the way you describe in your post to you and many others that have posted here just going by what i have read.

 

1 . people are like this its becase they are in denial and they refuse to believe this is a 100% buyers caresses not paying attention to what they are doing issue and think that the seller are partially to blame because they "tricked" them into making a mispurchase when all you have do is pay attention and uses the existing tools properly and you can see any nefarious pricing from a mile away.

 

So becase they weren't paying attention and as a result made a mispurchase becase they were careless they need more "buyer protection"

 

2 Some simply want to turn a simple system into something more complicated with ratings and flags and what not and a bunch of other imo again unneeded features.

 

Really there is only 2 things i need to know on gtn ... as i said earlier some feel differently and want to make the system more bloated and complicated however they are entitled to their opinion

 

1 Does it have the product i'm looking for

 

2 who's selling for the lowest price .

 

Ii don't even need to know the names it really doesn't matter to me . The current system without any QOL improvements do that for me just fine and i have never fallen for any of the "scams" people on her complain about.

 

@ScarletBlaze i concur with that assessment

 

So did you download your swtor bot program yet? I know, in one of your last posts, you were looking for one. Some of these suggestions would have absolutely 0 impact on you, such as, for example, removing decimal points, since the game cannot and does not use fractions of currency. Unless, of course, as I have postulated before, this is how you make your money, and that's why you're grandstanding your soapbox to leave it alone? I realize that an admission may be viewed as something that BW may indeed take action against, so I understand your reluctance, but really, what other reason would there be for you to become so obviously hostile, unless some kind of QoL improvement costs you money?

Edited November 13, 2014 by robertthebard

[eartharioch]

11) Optional pop up box with buyout price threshold to warn players if they exceed set amount in the purchase.

12) Optional pop up box with per item price threshold to warn players if they exceed set amount in the purchase.[/color]

 

 

I support 2, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9 and 10. I really like 2, 6 and 9. 6 seems to be the most popular one so far. I don't see the harm in 11 and 12, so they are included for folks to discuss, though I would not rate it as one of my favorite in the list.

 

Items (11) and (12) would not (in my proposal) be new pop-Up boxes, just modifications to the trigger for the existing Pop-up box.

 

Currently, there is a check box, and if the option is selected, a confirmation Pop-Up always appears; if the option is unselected, the Pop-Up never appears. Thus, many users either disable the option or get so used to clicking 'OK' that they might as well disable it.

 

My proposal (11) is to replace the checkbox with a threshold for the total price, and changing the logic of the existing Pop-Up to trigger if (and only if) the total price exceeds the threshold. A value of '0' would mean "always", and a value of [max price] would mean never, so users who want the existing checkbox behavior could easily retain that. The advantage is that users who are want to see the confirmation pop-up only for "big purchases" can set what "big" means for them, and (since they set the threshold) thus would be less likely to click through.

 

My proposal (12) would modify the trigger for the existing pop-up *for stackable items only*. If the item isn't stackable, there would be no change. For stackable items, the pop-up would trigger if the total price was higher than the total price threshold (as in (11) *or* if the price per unit was above the separate threshold.

 

So, no new pop-ups, just making the one that's there more user-friendly (and thus more likely to be respected).

[LordArtemis]

Items (11) and (12) would not (in my proposal) be new pop-Up boxes, just modifications to the trigger for the existing Pop-up box.

 

Currently, there is a check box, and if the option is selected, a confirmation Pop-Up always appears; if the option is unselected, the Pop-Up never appears. Thus, many users either disable the option or get so used to clicking 'OK' that they might as well disable it.

 

My proposal (11) is to replace the checkbox with a threshold for the total price, and changing the logic of the existing Pop-Up to trigger if (and only if) the total price exceeds the threshold. A value of '0' would mean "always", and a value of [max price] would mean never, so users who want the existing checkbox behavior could easily retain that. The advantage is that users who are want to see the confirmation pop-up only for "big purchases" can set what "big" means for them, and (since they set the threshold) thus would be less likely to click through.

 

My proposal (12) would modify the trigger for the existing pop-up *for stackable items only*. If the item isn't stackable, there would be no change. For stackable items, the pop-up would trigger if the total price was higher than the total price threshold (as in (11) *or* if the price per unit was above the separate threshold.

 

So, no new pop-ups, just making the one that's there more user-friendly (and thus more likely to be respected).

 

Ah, I will correct the options to better represent your suggestion the next time I post it. If I understand you correctly, you want to be able to set a dollar amount to the current toggle, using a slider or entry field as an option.

[Max_Killjoy]

If this doesn't qualify as an in-game scam, what exactly does? A scam is simply using deceit or confusion to take advantage of others. In this case some players are manipulating their listing price per item in order to confuse others. In my opinion, that absolutely meets the scam definition.

 

Do you think that it's good that some players are trying to take advange of the less attentive players? Should stupid people not have any protections? Where do you draw the line? Regardless of how stupid some may be, they are still PAYING CUSTOMERS, (F2P and Preferred players have credit caps that prevent them from losing large amounts of credits) and as such, Bioware should consider their welfare in addressing this issue.

 

Personally speaking, I find it offensive that so many people defend the "they're stupid, and thus shouldn't be protected" argument. It's very probable that people who get scammed will leave and not come back. People that don't come back are a permanent loss of revenue that would otherwise go towards keeping the servers operating. People that get scammed will tell all their friends about how SWTOR caters to scammers, and they will cause more revenue loss. Do you find those repercussions acceptable? Sorry, but I don't.

 

Beyond that, I'm annoyed when I look for things on the GTN, and have to weed out the idiots who price Plasteel at 330,333 credits ea, phobium at 350,333 credits ea, and bondite at 800,333 ea. Do they really think that a single bondite is worth 800k credits? Of course not. Their only motivation is, of course, to trick others into paying their hyper inflated prices. If I were able to pick the people that I want to spend time with in-game, I'll take the friendly moron over the scammer EVERY TIME.

 

Nailed it.

[ArielaKnight]

If you want to discuss GTN QoL improvements, spin it off into a new thread that has "GTN QoL" in the title. You pretending to be the shepherd of this thread is becoming a nuisance.

 

I would think you would at least respect the fact that a COMMUNITY MANAGER has posted to this thread and keep on-topic with the thread. When the Community Manager merged his own thread into this thread, it BECAME that thread, not whatever this thread was before that. SO... this thread can ONLY be about this:

 

If that is the case then maybe you should stop posting since there is already a purchase confirmation pop up in game, which I believe countless people have stated over and over but you seem to ignore that fact.

 

Funny about pretending you have done the same thing thinking the pop up box was confirmation of your idea, when the pop up box has existed since the game started so therefore it could not be your idea.

 

But go ahead and inflate your ego some more and then wonder why people ignore your ideas.

 

For everyone else, some of the ideas sound good.

 

Have a good evening and a great weekend.

[LyraineAlei]

If you want to discuss GTN QoL improvements, spin it off into a new thread that has "GTN QoL" in the title. You pretending to be the shepherd of this thread is becoming a nuisance.

 

I would think you would at least respect the fact that a COMMUNITY MANAGER has posted to this thread and keep on-topic with the thread. When the Community Manager merged his own thread into this thread, it BECAME that thread, not whatever this thread was before that. SO... this thread can ONLY be about this:

 

Excuse me? This thread was not about whether or not there was a scam in place.

 

My thread is the one who's title has remained, even as EM himself has posted and had everything merged into. Ergo, the whole thread is technically off topic. You do not get to decide for MY thread that the others were merged into, what is or is not off topic.

 

Ahem.

 

That being said, my thread was an archive of everything. EM was ending the "is there a scam or not debate" and listing the tools we have available. As far as I can tell, it was no support for anyone's suggestion or another.

 

And now, as the original poster of the thread all the others were merged into, I say let us move of to GTN QoL improvements.

[MillionsKNives]

I'm ok with that and have nothing further to say to you, but since you didn't mention the post I made that refutes every one of your points with actual in game screens from last night. I will repost and turn my back on you to continue getting in a huff over something you perceive as an intentional will to confuse.

 

 

 

1 turadium for a billion credits, scam? I'm sure that one is going to get a lot of people, it's sneaky.

18 Aluminum for a million credits, scam? Mhmm, I almost bought it myself. No seriously, I got confused and thought that it must be special aluminum so I hit "buy now" but luckily the confirmation box popped up and I accidentally hit cancel.

 

There is no deceit, there is no intent to confuse. Just horribly overpriced trash items and people who aren't paying attention to what they do. Who are you to pretend to know the motivations of others by a few numbers in a gtn gui?

I'll tell you what their motivation is.... to make money.

 

"A fool and his money are easily parted."

 

Well it certainly was an interesting strawman if nothing else.

[Max_Killjoy]

...what other reason would there be for you to become so obviously hostile...

 

Have you not yet noticed that any expression of dissatisfaction or suggestion for improvements will immediately draw a swarm of posters are either just looking for people to attack, or who can't stand that 1 byte of forum space or 1 second of developer time might go to an issue that isn't on THEIR list? Haven't you noticed the number people who evidently only read these forums in order to find opportunities to tell someone else to shut up?

[_NovaBlast_]

So did you download your swtor bot program yet? I know, in one of your last posts, you were looking for one. Some of these suggestions would have absolutely 0 impact on you, such as, for example, removing decimal points, since the game cannot and does not use fractions of currency. Unless, of course, as I have postulated before, this is how you make your money, and that's why you're grandstanding your soapbox to leave it alone? I realize that an admission may be viewed as something that BW may indeed take action against, so I understand your reluctance, but really, what other reason would there be for you to become so obviously hostile, unless some kind of QoL improvement costs you money?

 

First of all If i don't respond to you any more its not becase you made some grand point its becase I personally feel you never have anything useful to say and i am ignoring you.

 

 

If you can find a post of me looking for a bot please post it here and i will address it ..there won't be one becase i never said i was i have however said that when i do sell on gtn i undercut the lowest price by a large amount.

 

 

It has never been about them affecting me or supporting scammers becase if you pay attention you will nver miss buy a product you think is a "scam" .

 

its about buyers not accepting responsibility for their mistakes and blaming everything from gtn formating , sellers abusing stuff , being tired , hurriedly clicking becase they are doing other thing and have to get back to the game and other examples of careless behavior and expect the world to change becase they refuse to be more careful as the below post states .

 

 

basically this post .....

 

I think the problem a lot of the people giving all the "make more pop ups and hoops to jump through" posts dont seem to understand is those of us who have yet to become click happy ADD shoppers don't want to have to do the Hokey Pokey to make purchases because some people just derp their way through the GTN ignoring the tools already available to them...

Edited November 13, 2014 by _NovaBlast_

[Heal-To-Full]

or who can't stand that 1 byte of forum space or 1 second of developer time might go to an issue that isn't on THEIR list? Haven't you noticed the number people who evidently only read these forums in order to find opportunities to tell someone else to shut up?

It's PvP man.

[mokkh]

Well it certainly was an interesting strawman if nothing else.

How cute, you feel the need to interject.

 

I gave actual real in game "evidence" of this so-called "scam."

 

Haven't seen any actual examples by anyone else, just off the cuff anecdotal stories laced with an air of false omniscience founded in ... well nothing.

 

i.e. You can't prove "intent to confuse" so stop trying. If you are, in fact, confused, well that's what I was just pointing out to the person who (for whatever reason) people seem to think are "nailing" this argument. unless of course you'd like to back up your statement with something a little more... developed.

 

You're right though, the "scam" debate has been in interesting circularly fake argument. i.e. the only "straw man" was the premise of a "scam" in the first place.

[LyraineAlei]

How cute, you feel the need to interject.

 

I gave actual real in game "evidence" of this so-called "scam."

 

Haven't seen any actual examples by anyone else, just off the cuff anecdotal stories laced with an air of false omniscience founded in ... well nothing.

 

i.e. You can't prove "intent to confuse" so stop trying. If you are, in fact, confused, well that's what I was just pointing out to the person who (for whatever reason) people seem to think are "nailing" this argument. unless of course you'd like to back up your statement with something a little more... developed.

 

You're right though, the "scam" debate has been in interesting circularly fake argument. i.e. the only "straw man" was the premise of a "scam" in the first place.

 

And the "is there a scam or not" debate has gone into a standstill. So we aren't continuing it anymore.

 

Was a good cathartic release over the weekend however.

[ThorgrimLutgen]

It clearly is a scam, by the very definition of the word. People are intentionally setting out to trick others into buying their goods at inflated prices, by using two things. The buyers innocence, lack of patience, personal greed, stupidity etc etc and of course BWs appalling GTN UI.

 

I have never personally fallen foul, but I am a long time GTN player.

 

These people are preying on impulse buyers, who see what they think is a bargain, ie, their own greed, and snap it up immediately without paying proper attention to what is actually before their eyes on the screen, ie, lack of patience. Their innocence/stupidity is their undoing.

 

Could BW introduce some GTN QOL improvements? Absolutely.

 

At the very least lining decimal points up, or right justifying all numeric text, would go a long way to helping the innocent.

 

Personally, if anyone is against GTN QOL, then they are clearly a scammer themselves. Otherwise, there is no reason whatsoever to be against such things.

 

Additionally, people happy to exploit people in a game, are far more likely to degenerate down this slippery slope in their real lives as they grow up.

Edited November 13, 2014 by ThorgrimLutgen

[LadyVix]

It has never been about them affecting me or supporting scammers becase if you pay attention you will nver miss buy a product you think is a "scam" .

 

its about buyers not accepting responsibility for their mistakes and blaming everything from gtn formating , sellers abusing stuff , being tired , hurriedly clicking becase they are doing other thing and have to get back to the game and other examples of careless behavior and expect the world to change becase they refuse to be more careful as the below post states .

 

If the GUI can be improved to clarify pricing and prevent these things from happening, why would you not support it?

 

Modifications shouldn't have any negative impact on user functionality. The only reason anyone would oppose this is because they feel that all stupid/careless players should be severely punished by paying much higher prices on the GTN. Weigh the pros versus the cons of implementation.

 

Pros:

- Clearer prices/less confusion;

- Fewer people feeling cheated/fewer people rage quitting the game/more subscribers/more revenue to keep SWTOR servers operating.

- The people posting the ridiculously priced make less money, i.e. less price gouging;

 

Cons:

- dev time needed to make these changes

 

Many assume that because the prices are clear cut to us, it's clear cut to all. I don't believe this to be true. There are a lot of kids that play this game. Imagine you were a 12 year old, a big Star Wars fan, and playing SWTOR, your first MMO. Regardless of whether you were careless or not, if you lost all your hard earned credits due to questionable GTN prices, how enthusiastic would you be? SWTOR would lose a potential subscriber, the Star Wars franchise would potentially lose an enthusiast, and people like you would simply call them a noob for not paying attention.

 

Beyond that, considering the number of players in this game, do you tink that some may not be totally literate? Is there a possibility that some may be dyslexic? GTN pricing may not be as clear cut to them as it is to us, and if changes can be made to help make pricing clearer, there's no reason to not implement them.

 

I get that you think everyone with an opposing opinion deserves to be punished like a child and lose large numbers of credits on the GTN. Damn noobs need to be taught a lesson, right? The problem is, you're not going to teach anyone to not be stupid. Some people just are. We're all much better off if GUI improvements are implemented.

[mokkh]

And the "is there a scam or not" debate has gone into a standstill. So we aren't continuing it anymore.

 

Was a good cathartic release over the weekend however.

 

I guess so, I was more or less on the fence until I actually logged in last night to do some sample searches based on the gripes that others had posted in this thread. I fully realize that there are people who have made up their mind, at least my mind was open to being convinced but now it's going to be hard to sway me since I took time out to seriously analyze the issues and weigh them on their individual merits.

 

Honestly, I cannot get my head around how someone convinces themselves on the motivations of others due to the display of a decimal point in a user interface.

 

Spurred by the recent increase in need for crafting materials (let's face it that's the reall crux behind this argument) I lost 400-500k or so on me not paying attention. Altering the UI wouldn't have made a difference since I was clearly already ignoring it. And I did get mad, at myself. I then altered the way I use the GTN. Et voila! That doesn't happen anymore.

 

The QoL portions of thread have been more productive, however the thread itself still has the words "scam" and "debate" so don't fool yourself into thinking that it's over. I can almost guarantee that I'll get a couple of roasty responses from the last two people I talked to. Good thing I don't subscribe to threads. I won't be back.

 

Have a goodnight.

[LyraineAlei]

I guess so, I was more or less on the fence until I actually logged in last night to do some sample searches based on the gripes that others had posted in this thread. I fully realize that there are people who have made up their mind, at least my mind was open to being convinced but now it's going to be hard to sway me since I took time out to seriously analyze the issues and weigh them on their individual merits.

 

Honestly, I cannot get my head around how someone convinces themselves on the motivations of others due to the display of a decimal point in a user interface.

 

Spurred by the recent increase in need for crafting materials (let's face it that's the reall crux behind this argument) I lost 400-500k or so on me not paying attention. Altering the UI wouldn't have made a difference since I was clearly already ignoring it. And I did get mad, at myself. I then altered the way I use the GTN. Et voila! That doesn't happen anymore.

 

The QoL portions of thread have been more productive, however the thread itself still has the words "scam" and "debate" so don't fool yourself into thinking that it's over. I can almost guarantee that I'll get a couple of roasty responses from the last two people I talked to. Good thing I don't subscribe to threads. I won't be back.

 

Have a goodnight.

Yeah, as the creator of the original thread, I was intending this thread for archival purposes (the Storyline part of the title).

 

I'm not fooling myself really, just trying to help change the direction from the toxic debate.

[eartharioch]

Ah, I will correct the options to better represent your suggestion the next time I post it. If I understand you correctly, you want to be able to set a dollar amount to the current toggle, using a slider or entry field as an option.

 

Yes. Should be easy to program, and (assuming people use it correctly), should reduce the number of times the confirmation dialog appears, making it more likely people would take it seriously. No "five second pause" needed.

[Reno_Tarshil]

If the GUI can be improved to clarify pricing and prevent these things from happening, why would you not support it?

 

Modifications shouldn't have any negative impact on user functionality. The only reason anyone would oppose this is because they feel that all stupid/careless players should be severely punished by paying much higher prices on the GTN. Weigh the pros versus the cons of implementation.

 

Pros:

- Clearer prices/less confusion;

- Fewer people feeling cheated/fewer people rage quitting the game/more subscribers/more revenue to keep SWTOR servers operating.

- The people posting the ridiculously priced make less money, i.e. less price gouging;

 

Cons:

- dev time needed to make these changes

 

Many assume that because the prices are clear cut to us, it's clear cut to all. I don't believe this to be true. There are a lot of kids that play this game. Imagine you were a 12 year old, a big Star Wars fan, and playing SWTOR, your first MMO. Regardless of whether you were careless or not, if you lost all your hard earned credits due to questionable GTN prices, how enthusiastic would you be? SWTOR would lose a potential subscriber, the Star Wars franchise would potentially lose an enthusiast, and people like you would simply call them a noob for not paying attention.

 

Beyond that, considering the number of players in this game, do you tink that some may not be totally literate? Is there a possibility that some may be dyslexic? GTN pricing may not be as clear cut to them as it is to us, and if changes can be made to help make pricing clearer, there's no reason to not implement them.

 

I get that you think everyone with an opposing opinion deserves to be punished like a child and lose large numbers of credits on the GTN. Damn noobs need to be taught a lesson, right? The problem is, you're not going to teach anyone to not be stupid. Some people just are. We're all much better off if GUI improvements are implemented.

 

Your con is why I don't support the need for all these "QoL" changes Arty and everyone is proposing. There are more bugged and other breaking issues flooding the Bug report forum that could better use the resources that these suggestions would take up all because Little Timmy doesn't pay attention on the GTN when he has all the tools and information available to him in-game.

[_NovaBlast_]

If the GUI can be improved to clarify pricing and prevent these things from happening, why would you not support it?

 

Modifications shouldn't have any negative impact on user functionality. The only reason anyone would oppose this is because they feel that all stupid/careless players should be severely punished by paying much higher prices on the GTN. Weigh the pros versus the cons of implementation.

 

Pros:

- Clearer prices/less confusion;

- Fewer people feeling cheated/fewer people rage quitting the game/more subscribers/more revenue to keep SWTOR servers operating.

- The people posting the ridiculously priced make less money, i.e. less price gouging;

 

Cons:

- dev time needed to make these changes

 

Many assume that because the prices are clear cut to us, it's clear cut to all. I don't believe this to be true. There are a lot of kids that play this game. Imagine you were a 12 year old, a big Star Wars fan, and playing SWTOR, your first MMO. Regardless of whether you were careless or not, if you lost all your hard earned credits due to questionable GTN prices, how enthusiastic would you be? SWTOR would lose a potential subscriber, the Star Wars franchise would potentially lose an enthusiast, and people like you would simply call them a noob for not paying attention.

 

Beyond that, considering the number of players in this game, do you tink that some may not be totally literate? Is there a possibility that some may be dyslexic? GTN pricing may not be as clear cut to them as it is to us, and if changes can be made to help make pricing clearer, there's no reason to not implement them.

 

I get that you think everyone with an opposing opinion deserves to be punished like a child and lose large numbers of credits on the GTN. Damn noobs need to be taught a lesson, right? The problem is, you're not going to teach anyone to not be stupid. Some people just are. We're all much better off if GUI improvements are implemented.

 

well i do have to commend you for a really well written response I am impressed.

 

For the first time in this thread you brought up a point that i had not considered fully but also doesn't really fall into the theme of this thread. That would fall more into making it more kid friendly .

 

See all the reasons you mentioned that I highlighted are valid reasons for a gui enhancement and i would have no problem with that . It may surprise you but i am not against the minor gui enhancements themselves. I Don't think they're necessary and see no actual merit in them when compared to gtn as it stands now as i personally have never had an issue with anything to do with the gtn.

 

(but i am against extra steps unless you can opt out of them)

 

I am against the reasons why some want them .

 

I mentioned this before if someone had started a thread

 

hey i lost a lot of credits last night becase of one of the reason you mentioned / i misread /wasnt paying attention/ etc etc and noticed some things that could be changed

 

.. i probably would have had a similar view as to the necessity of the changes but had more respect for the actual topic.

 

Im also not about "punishing stupid" either but i'm not going to sit back while someone announces that there are scams going on that are unavoidable and they were "cheated" and thats the reason that changes need to be made .

 

I maintain for the average teen /adult gamer there are no undesirable postings on the gtn that are unavoidable to a careful person.

Edited November 13, 2014 by _NovaBlast_

[Han_Salo]

I think the problem is existing (and well known by players) for about 2 month now, so I think almost everybody should be aware of it.

 

But Players are still buying and klicking too fast & are still not paying attention to what they do by buying and the prices for items. So I think nobody other is respnsible but 'you' by 'yourself'.

 

For every single Transaction I'm sorting the Items by price again ... and again ... and again ... before buying, but it works & I'm saving millions of credits.

 

... SLOW DOWN - Double check what you are doing before you do it, and this won't ever happen again. Take the FIVE SECONDS to make sure you are buying what you want to buy and paying what you are willing to pay.

You can't ban sellers and their listing from appearing, but you CAN actually pay attention to what you buying and the price for that item.

 

And that's (for the moment) is the only way to go. Maybe BW will implent a kind of 'auction-Seller-igno/ban-list', maybe they won't. But for the moment, 'Slow down' ist the only way to go ...

Edited November 13, 2014 by Han_Salo