Nitblade Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 Damned if they do, damned if they don't. Personally, I'm starting to see why they spent months not talking to this community. This community became more polarized and rabid as time went exactly because they spent months ignoring us and not talking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine-Elf Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 This community became more polarized and rabid as time went exactly because they spent months ignoring us and not talking. Yes, but that's changed now, so lets try to be more positive about it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuixupu Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 The focus in this game so far on raiding and end content in general has been really minimal. Honestly, they're still catching up on what should have been in the game at launch, and granted that stuff is getting better. That said, using NM modes as a point here is not strong. The raiding content in TOR so far has been extremely weak in comparison to games like WoW and Rift. WoWs current tier of raiding is 13 bosses strong, their last tier which lasted less than 6 months was a whopping 16 bosses; 29 nicely tuned raid bosses (plus several world bosses) in 6 months in that game. I agree with that, but that wasn't the point I was making. My point is a small percentage of the population does the most difficult content, but that doesn't deter them from working on it. I'm all for them focusing more on raid content, but I fail to see a good reason for them to abandon class stories indefinitely. Making 3 levels of operations is time consuming and expensive too. Incidentally, I keep running into people in WoW who think they're patching *too* fast and complaining that there's too much raiding content for them to keep up with. No, TOR really needs pick it up in all areas of end game content (or people start dropping out at level cap), and hopefully a class story driven expansion is still in the works for the future. Exactly. This community became more polarized and rabid as time went exactly because they spent months ignoring us and not talking. No. That's just how online communities are, and always will be, no matter what. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitblade Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 No. That's just how online communities are, and always will be, no matter what. I played for 5 years in another MMO and 2 on yet another one and the communities were in no way close to what level this group here degenerated to from the neglect. The one thing i can say from either game's forum community was Communication was key. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuixupu Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 I played for 5 years in another MMO and 2 on yet another one and the communities were in no way close to what level this group here degenerated to from the neglect. The one thing i can say from either game's forum community was Communication was key. 7 years of WoW hasn't really done much for my faith in humanity...I think maybe too many of those people came over here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowermanx Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 7 years of WoW hasn't really done much for my faith in humanity...I think maybe too many of those people came over here. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Karsk Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 Well as long as they are taking feedback now i'm happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vraesh Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 Considering how this community reacts to any and every crumb of info that gets out into the open, I don't blame them for being tight-lipped. Even WoW players aren't this rabid about their MMO. It'd be different if there was some sort of consistency, but it doesn't matter what they do, it's going to result in a group of players, somewhere, getting pissed off and ranting for weeks/months about it. What's that? You're giving the game away for FREE? Subscribers: *** MAN, I HAD TO BUY THIS GAME, THIS SUCKS, I QUIT. They could give everything away to anyone who wanted it, for free, and there'd be a core of angry players, staging protests and ranting endlessly about how easy the game is now, and how they had to work for everything and BW/EA sucks cause they're EA/BW. Damned if they do, damned if they don't. Personally, I'm starting to see why they spent months not talking to this community. ... and it will result in a group of players (you perhaps), blindly berating anyone pointing out the flaws that the game has, has made, or will make. Either for just the sake of arguing, trolling, or being closed minded. Touche'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stryklone Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 ESO did the same thing... Most do. I know tone is hard to judge. The statements were meant only as explanation, not complaint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kubernetic Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/03/29/gdc-2013-james-ohlen-on-how-f2p-saved-swtor/ Very interesting , so the money didn't go on VO's and we might even get another SW MMORPG and/or another IP's. I'm just glad the game is a lot healthier now and pleased about the positive attitude from the dev's and mostly us. Anyways looking forward to the next expansion and intrigued to what these items that they are going to add to the game are ( never appeared in an mmo before ? ). Any thoughts ? Cheers, BadOrb. I don't see anything that suggests there's another Star Wars MMORPG on the way, but it does look like they'll be getting into other IPs, at least that's how I read that phrase. All in all, after a rocky start, it's good that they're on a firm footing. Hopefully if they can get the space combat correct, they're in for another burst of expanded players and subscribers. Now if they could just fix the PVP Quitter problem... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sydexlic Posted April 1, 2013 Share Posted April 1, 2013 This game was their baby, and it must have hurt to see it start to fail. If this game was their baby, then Bioware/EA were the meth addicted mothers that left it to play with a rusty fork in the corner of the filthy, roach infested abode it's being neglected in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stockmks Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 While there's everything good celebrating some new successes (the defense drones in this thread deserve a break).. my only concern is that people both in and out of bioware will use this success to affirm that its okay to release a game with.. issues... and quite blatantly not fix them, and somehow still claim success. When you start to feel positive about something, especially in a corporate environment, that generally means 'good job, keep doing more of the same'. Drones and haters alike should think about that... hopefully someone at bioware still gets it. I don't have that many issues with the game to be honest, my main ones are: - Subscription is about restoring negatives than providing positives. I feel like im getting raped for the lack of a better metaphor. Game items exclusive to the cartel market is in conflict with the idea of subscribers as well. Im not saying remove the gambling boxes, im saying make things available to subscribers in game (without requiring someone somewhere to initially gamble). How could this not be reasonable? - Alot of the legacy convenience unlocks i've paid for seem more about working around bad game design rather than simply convenience. The fact that my QOL increased 10 fold by being able to instantly travel from FLEET to my SHIP, and i paid over 10$ for the privilege as a sub seems also very much like im getting exploited. Its feels like im paying to avoid a mistake that bioware, the people who are charging me, made in the first place. These type of QOL enhancements that around game mechanics bioware know have issues in the past should be free to paying customers. I can imagine it would be definitely a positive for the current developers to see some life return to TOR, i think it would be ungreatful though if all the existing issues (continue to?) be forgotten and everything is considered suddenly great. Because there are issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshlaBoga Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 7 years of WoW hasn't really done much for my faith in humanity...I think maybe too many of those people came over here. If you have faith in humanity after WoW then you're some sort of SUPER-idealist. WoW's community took my faith in humanity and exsanguinated it, threw it in a dumpster, took it to the dump and dropped a couple of tons of dirty needles and barbed wire on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kynesis Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 Consumer Feedback and BETA Testing are completely different. A tester is there to test what is in the build. It sounds like you fall in the category of the masses in BETA who were just in for a free early trial. He may certainly have been in that category, but if a person who is interested in your product takes the time to try it and provide feedback that they feel is very important, failing to listen is still failing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerTaran Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 - Alot of the legacy convenience unlocks i've paid for seem more about working around bad game design rather than simply convenience. The fact that my QOL increased 10 fold by being able to instantly travel from FLEET to my SHIP, and i paid over 10$ for the privilege as a sub seems also very much like im getting exploited. Its feels like im paying to avoid a mistake that bioware, the people who are charging me, made in the first place. These type of QOL enhancements that around game mechanics bioware know have issues in the past should be free to paying customers. Sorry, but all of the Legacy Perks are available for credits, so for subscribers they are for free (at least free of real money). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBBP Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 While there's everything good celebrating some new successes (the defense drones in this thread deserve a break).. my only concern is that people both in and out of bioware will use this success to affirm that its okay to release a game with.. issues... and quite blatantly not fix them, and somehow still claim success. When you start to feel positive about something, especially in a corporate environment, that generally means 'good job, keep doing more of the same'. Drones and haters alike should think about that... hopefully someone at bioware still gets it. I don't have that many issues with the game to be honest, my main ones are: - Subscription is about restoring negatives than providing positives. I feel like im getting raped for the lack of a better metaphor. Game items exclusive to the cartel market is in conflict with the idea of subscribers as well. Im not saying remove the gambling boxes, im saying make things available to subscribers in game (without requiring someone somewhere to initially gamble). How could this not be reasonable? - Alot of the legacy convenience unlocks i've paid for seem more about working around bad game design rather than simply convenience. The fact that my QOL increased 10 fold by being able to instantly travel from FLEET to my SHIP, and i paid over 10$ for the privilege as a sub seems also very much like im getting exploited. Its feels like im paying to avoid a mistake that bioware, the people who are charging me, made in the first place. These type of QOL enhancements that around game mechanics bioware know have issues in the past should be free to paying customers. I can imagine it would be definitely a positive for the current developers to see some life return to TOR, i think it would be ungreatful though if all the existing issues (continue to?) be forgotten and everything is considered suddenly great. Because there are issues. You are lazy enough to use the travel to ship ability from the fleet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine-Elf Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 You are lazy enough to use the travel to ship ability from the fleet? The real question is why the developers would spend all of our valuable times developing such a feature. 10 minutes would be too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshlaBoga Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 You are lazy enough to use the travel to ship ability from the fleet? ...Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stockmks Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 You are lazy enough to use the travel to ship ability from the fleet? That is the main travel case i spent 1050 + 240 per alt cartel coins on. ... Well as a newish player i don't have tonnes of alts with spare comms for moddable gear.. therefore i enjoy doing flashpoints, trust me after your second flashpoint getting back from fleet starts adding up. Also i timed it on my machine with an ssd, the worst case scenario for getting back to a planet (with the extra orbiting station step) took ~3 mins to reach the surface of the planet from fleet doing it by hand. What's worse is you cant just jump on a fp and be there in 3 mins time as with other games, you actually have to move for a few seconds 1/2 a dozen times between loading screens and transitions. No im not going to force my brain to find enjoyment in this, as its completely miserable. As much as i strongly resent paying bioware real money to get around their bad game design, 30 min quick travel + emergency fleet passes from security vendor + priority starship travel (including the legacy unlocks for gtn+droid+mailbox) actually plays alright if you're frequently changing between flashpoints+questing. ./sigh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LovarBoy Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 Too soon to tell in comparison to WoW (since SWTOR is on the upbound now and continuing)... .. No, it's not to soon. It's naive to think it will be otherwise in a few months. It's likely "insane" to dare a comparison in success between WoW and SW:TOR - you can't compare them, WoW is another dimension of success that SW:TOR will never have - for sure. And to continue: we don't know SW:TOR sub numbers due to the fact that EA doesn't dare telling them. Maybe we got 100.000 subs and it's "increasing". Nevertheless the sub number would be astonishing low. Uh.... game is still young. MMOs add lots of things over time to entertain players.... much of which does not come until years 3,4,5,10. SW:TOR isn't young. It's 1.5 years old. MMO's need to develop very fast in their first months, not years after. Only stable and "secure" MMO's can do that, SW:TOR and many others can't. _____________ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeonBraun Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 (edited) 7 years of WoW hasn't really done much for my faith in humanity...I think maybe too many of those people came over here. Zarhym, Bashiok, Ghostcrawler and other CMs and Devs frequently speak with the WoW community, and are very open and candid about design decisions and the directions of the game, even when sometimes those decisions don't please everyone. Before a new patch comes out, the PTR forums have amazing two way communication between the players and the Devs. Until, Eric took over here the interaction with the TOR community was abysmal, and the player base had every justification to react negatively to it. Edited April 2, 2013 by LeonBraun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CelCawdro Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 Zarhym, Bashiok, Ghostcrawler and other CMs and Devs frequently speak with the WoW community, and are very open and candid about design decisions and the directions of the game, even when sometimes those decisions don't please everyone. Before a new patch comes out, the PTR forums have amazing two way communication between the players and the Devs. Until, Eric took over here the interaction with the TOR community was abysmal, and the player base had every justification to react negatively to it. That being said, the whole "Bus Shock!" thing was really something else. Getting to that level of involvement with the community can have cons as well as pros, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeonBraun Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 If this game was their baby, then Bioware/EA were the meth addicted mothers that left it to play with a rusty fork in the corner of the filthy, roach infested abode it's being neglected in. Sad, but true. There was so much mismanagement and so many bad decisions made at and after launch. Seems there are some indications of turnaround though which should hopefully start pushing this game in a more healthy direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thylbanus Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 ...and we might even get another SW MMORPG and/or another IP's. I hate to burst your bubble on this point. I didn't read anywhere in the article that implied that and Disney specifically stated that no other Star Wars games would be produced outside of LucasArts. Now to the point of other IPs, that could imply Mass Effect. Many have called for it and there is a diverse enough universe to make it possible. Of course, setting would be problematic, but I'm sure that they will pull something out of their... bag. o.O Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeonBraun Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 Sorry, but all of the Legacy Perks are available for credits, so for subscribers they are for free (at least free of real money). Also true. I have not paid for one single unlock as a sub since early access. The only thing I've bought so far as a sub is an armour set that I wanted for a companion, and virtually all the cartel items can be bought in the GTN. Subs complaining about CM cosmetic issues or items if frankly stunning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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