NO Addons please. There is another solution!

[Powercord]

I personally like the idea of parses, I play a tank in everygame and I like to know what my party is doing right/wrong. I don't do flashpoints with pugs or when I do I hardly care enough to look at the meters. I'm not saying MUST IMPLEMENT ADDONS NOWWWWW I would just like a combat log for someone to make a program to look at parses with. The idea of a "Scoreboard" at the end of a Flashpoint is a great idea but maybe add to it, why not allow a "Copy" of everything done in the flashpoint. Sure it may take a bit to download to your drive but I'd love to AFK for 5 min while it downloads and I can look at it after to see my group is doing well. Making fun of scrubs/baddies will always be around, the people I group with laugh at people doing bad and try to help in a constructive/sarcastic way, however; we will carry someone through an instance/raid if we have to as long as they learn something from it.

[Uzilara]

if you don't like addons, don't use them...now give me a recount like addon so i can see what i do wrong and where i can improve.

 

and above all: give me addons so i can customize my ui the way i like it and not like it is set in stone now.

 

I know BW is working on the UI interface but as there are so many people, they can never do good for everyone, so just open the game for addons.

[BeBenNova]

So from reading this thread one thing is clear

 

Scrubs are afraid of being kicked out of a group because they're a liability to the team because they don't do their job well enough because they ''want to enjoy the game'' and not read up on their class and learn how to better themselves as players.

 

Give me a combat log and a DPS meter already so i can be the best that i can be

[halfhourofpower]

I read a lot about people missing addons. "I need healbots, dpsmeters, threatmeter..." You can do just fine without these, it's just a different game, we just have to adapt. Healbot, for instance, turns a very interesting game into something pulled out of a 90's Nintendo!

As for the meters, I have a suggestion: an <End Flashpoint/Operation Report>, just like in the end of Warzones. Voilá, you can consult who's doing their jobs right. DPS, Healing, Protection, MVP vote also (why not?)... It's all there.

Please NO addons. Don't turn this very enjoyable game into a big load of numbers popping out of my screen...

 

 

P.S. I do admit that some customization options on UI are needed.

 

I actually love this idea.

[Sunshinegasm]

My experience there is WoW and how it changed the community.

 

People are competitive so even in a group they want to compete. In some cases that's good, but there are simply too many people who are competative in such a way that for them it's more important than anything else in that group, that it turns the group into a "me versus the rest" ordeal where all they care about it being on top of the DPS meters.

 

You can't blame add-ons solely for the community changes in WoW. For as long as that game has been around, the fluctuation of community interaction has changed drastically from year to year.

 

Also, competitiveness is a part of any game. I feel you're making comparisons that aren't fair. You can't compare this community to that of WoW. You can't assume that just because there's a chance that add-ons will be implemented in this particular game that the outcome will be a rise of elitist jerkwads that will "ruin" the game play experience. And honestly, even if add-ons aren't implemented, its like I said before, if someone is going to be "I'm better than you" they won't need an add-on to say/do/show that.

[ShreddedRocks]

There's more to addons than the various stupid pve metrics addons. I don't want to be unable to customize the ui to the extent I want to for the sake of avoiding the existence of a few pve addons that are probably harmless anyway.

 

And no, they can't just add more customization options to the ui instead. There's a million different ways to go about setting up your ui and they can't possibly build all of them into the game.

This. For the last year when i played WoW, i found Spartanui, it was truly beautiful. I loved it compared to the default ui.

[Andrewie]

I wouldn't mind some ui customization. But I wouldn't want to see addons such as recount, healbot and omen. Those do more harm than good in my opinion.

 

Healbot (click casting on unitframes) turns healing into a boring minigame.

Recount makes people focus way way too much on output rather than tactics and their surroundings.

Omen.... well. Its cool to have a visual indicator that you are about to gain or loose aggro, but I would prefer to not know how close I am until very close.

[Utorian]

This. Why ruin other people's game play because of something you don't like. Until the day that a developer can make a UI that caters to the preferences of millions of different users, add-ons will have their place.

 

And if something like Healbot is really an issue, the developer can simply break the add-on through the API.

 

Right back at ya!

 

Why ruin other peoples game play because of something you like?

 

Simple thing is guys, this IS NOT WOW! It's a whole new game that is less than a month old. I am sure the devs have a few tricks up their sleaves and are just waiting for the right time to implement them. DPS meters and they likes should never be implemented in this game. If you want to see who is performing in a raid or instance, take a look at who is dead at the end, easy really. Allot of addons that were used over in WoW took all the skill out of the game, heck we ended up with addons that even told you where to stand for crying out load and even ones that made you spell icons sparkle "use this now"!

 

I have to admit though I do like a customisable UI. As a healer its nice to be able to move bars about and raid frames and this will be here soon as the devs have already said they working on it. I say we just wait and see what their effort is on this then go from there.

[nix_crash]

I read a lot about people missing addons. "I need healbots, dpsmeters, threatmeter..." You can do just fine without these, it's just a different game, we just have to adapt.

yeah, I Live on the first floor too and the guys at the 7nth are always whining about the elevator, they should just do like me, I never use it and I'm fine!

[frecklesmoker]

Personally the only addons I find myself wanting are data addons that are attributed to crafting. Like one that tells me what kinda stuff a certain toon can make while I am off farming or making it. Personally this game is screaming for data addons.

[Yeahberndt]

The only addon I need is one that shows proc buffs a bit better, it is hard picking up a 4 second proc with such a small ui.

 

Also on my Sage it would be nice to allow for easier tracking of dots. It is again hard to see the dots in the current ui format. Yes I can still play without addons but these changing would be nice!

 

Thanks.

[Breeti]

The thing is, people with them will start insulting other players - did you never play wow?

 

I kinda like the idea of a summary at the end, but addons that make it possible to flame others - no, never - we dont need a second wow.

 

I hate to give you the trip to reality, people will flame people even if there are no addons in the game.

[Humankeg]

I mostly didn't mind addons in WoW until GearScore. That freakin' thing being mentioned for almost every PuG raid or whatnot, when anyone who can play knows gear doesn't automatically make you a better player. I saw people in amazing gear who could barely compete with people in blues, yet all anyone wanted was a GS of over <insert current patches average GS here>.

 

I never installed it, which meant I could only really raid with friends... Not actually a bad thing.

 

Yes, better gear automatically makes you a better person.

 

If not, then why bother getting that piece of better gear in the first place?

[Spartanicusx]

This perfect world of magical ponies and rainbows and no 12 year olds flaming about how bad you are, isn't going to happen without addons. Incase you haven't been playing the game since release, queue for a couple battlegrounds when you get the chance.

 

It will just be very hard for Swtor to be even considered a competitive game without addons. If that's what Bioware wants, is just a simple game that isn't taken seriously in the competitive gaming world, then that's also their choice. Measuring your performance on demand is something 7 or 15 other people in the raid should have when they want it.

 

Gaming performance is also something that Sponsors are attracted to, which leads to promoting the game and contributing to live events (such as blizzcon). Just because you don't want some random troll from the internet telling you that your damage isn't good enough, isn't a very good reason not to have it available for the greater good of the game and its future growth.

 

Can tell you right now, if there was a way to track dps/healing, then Star Wars would see even more people from the WoW community pick up the game. Money is understandably the main push for every business, and unless Bioware isn't financially driven and only views this as a game, then you'll see no addons. Good luck with keeping addons out of the game, you'll need it.

 

To those who have been crying about being 'forced' to use certain addons in a game (IE:WoW) You can /hide recount, and be running straight default UI with the OPTION to view your performance as well as the players around you. My guess is you all just had a terrible experience with WoW, where you had no idea how to play your class, and some over zealous elitist informed you of how bad you are. Which presented a road of options to you. 1) Get better at the game, become knowledgeable of your class, learn and improve. 2) Attempt to remove the freedom of knowledge from that guy who hurt your feelings, as well as removing knowledge from everyone else who uses these programs.

 

Bioware putting these in-place is convenient and all, but no one will ever be happy with 1 uniform UI and is just a lost cause for them to keep putting their resources into it, when they could just open the option for authors to write addons and players can pick and choose their own happiness. Regardless this is pointless, its the same argument for results, just a different route getting to the end result. Those of you wishing to spend hours arguing over which is the better route to take are just idiots, or members of the United states congress.

[QiBao]

I would like mods. I just don't trust Bioware to get it right, to be honest. I know the game is just out, but not having target of target, or mouseover healing, or resizing/moving UI, etc... is just not acceptable in 2011.

 

Rift had a pretty good UI (had other problems). Could move/resize things. Could import different settings to alts (or all settings). Had target of target.

 

Allowing addons does not mean allowing any/all addons. Can be done smartly. But the vast community will come to better/more solutions than Bioware.

[Eloshan]

For the anti-addon crowd, I have two words for you - auction house.

 

Worst I've ever seen in a game. I literally cringe when I have to use it.

 

It's the same for WoW's unmodded AH (although, not as bad).

 

Sometimes, the community can come up with great ideas that really *DO* improve a game. I see very little downside to allowing them.

[Yoggs]

Right back at ya!

 

Why ruin other peoples game play because of something you like?

 

Simple thing is guys, this IS NOT WOW! It's a whole new game that is less than a month old. I am sure the devs have a few tricks up their sleaves and are just waiting for the right time to implement them. DPS meters and they likes should never be implemented in this game. If you want to see who is performing in a raid or instance, take a look at who is dead at the end, easy really. Allot of addons that were used over in WoW took all the skill out of the game, heck we ended up with addons that even told you where to stand for crying out load and even ones that made you spell icons sparkle "use this now"!

 

I have to admit though I do like a customisable UI. As a healer its nice to be able to move bars about and raid frames and this will be here soon as the devs have already said they working on it. I say we just wait and see what their effort is on this then go from there.

 

"DPS meters and they likes should never be implemented in this game. If you want to see who is performing in a raid or instance, take a look at who is dead at the end, easy really."

 

Except seeing who is dead at the end doesn't do fark all to help figure out who is performing when a raid or op wipes due to reaching enrage timers. If the game is going to have enrage timers (here's a hint, TOR does on endgame content) players need to have a way to figure out why enough dmg isn't being done to the boss before the enrage timer hits.

"heck we ended up with addons that even told you where to stand for crying out load"

You mean it told you when you were being targeted by an effect and to **** of the way. The one that actively told people where to stand got banned. The same with "even ones that made you spell icons sparkle "use this now"!"

 

Seriously, stop using old and busted excuses for not wanting things you quite obviously have no understanding or knowledge of.

 

Here's a few hints, healbot doesn't choose which spell to cast for you, and hasn't for years now. If the game is going to have threat as a mechanic, which it does, then the players will need to know in some way or form if they are going to pull aggro from a tank. Now that doesn't have to be a meter, it can be an audio/visual warning in game like many MMO's do, I don't care if it ends up being an addon or built into the game, but it needs to be done, or threat needs to be eliminated from the game. Same with DPS meters, if enrage timers are going to be used, players need a way to see the dmg done so they can improve their performance or gear to be able to beat the encounter, otherwise having an enrage timer is worthless and frustrates the player base because they don't know what the problem. You can't improve without first knowing what is wrong.

 

As far as the UI goes, I don't care how it's done, in game customization a'la Rift, or addons, but there needs to be a way to adjust it, especially raid/ops frames. As it stands it's piss poor for an MMO UI. There is a serious lack of information coming in to the player through it, and the info that it does feed the player is a confused clusterfark.

[Cluexyst]

I raided tonight. We hit the enrage timer twice. I wish we knew who was doing crap dps.

 

Sadly we cannot.

[bwally]

lol people trying to make the game more casual by denying addons.

[Jeweledleah]

lol people trying to make the game more casual by denying addons.

 

1. that's wrong.. why?

 

2. excessive reliance on addons means developers are forced to design subsequent encounters around them to provide at least some challenge to the hardcore which in turn makes addons into a required to have feature, which in turn makes the game barely playable for those who don't run addons..and so on and so forth.

 

not all addons are bad. but anything that significantly affects people's playstyles? no. and coders WILL design things that will automate/streamline a great deal for the players, all in a name of convenience and efficiency.

 

and honestly, I'd rather wait for bioware to implement some of the quality of life features like movable/scalable UI and at least rudimentary macros (which were already promised), then open it up to addons.

 

it's different from single player addons. becasue the addons you make/install don't just affect YOUR game - they affect EVERYONE's game

[Lord_Itharius]

Agreed, add-ons are bad mm'kay

 

I'm actually going to quit if they don't add combat logs and add-on support at some point. Right now, half of the game's difficulty at endgame comes from its cryptic game mechanics, making tank and spank fights a chore. We need the ability to see what we died from, how much damage and healing we're doing, and some way to gauge aggro, else I just feel like I'm playing a poorly polished WoW-in-space that disregards 7 years of MMO evolution. We should be challenged by mechanics that force raid movement and coordination, not by aggro pulls or enrage timer wipes because we can't gauge where people are at in dps and aggro.

 

Also, not having add-ons makes pugs INCREDIBLY frustrating.

Edited December 29, 2011 by Lord_Itharius

[Kresse]

All I want:

 

-Macros (so I can stop cluttering all 2 action bars with relic buttons and CDs that I intent to use simultaneously anyway)

 

-Damage/healing meter so I can see how changing my priorities affects my output and to improve based on the results. Let's get some training dummies, too

 

Buuuut I'll wait for BW to sort out the actual issues in the game before any of that.

[Draccman]

I personally hate those DPS/heal meter programs.

They ruined WoW for me. I played a ret pally from day one and I did pretty good except for solo, which was a PITA having no pulling ability.

But 5 mans, raids, did what I was supposed to do, what hybrids are meant to do. Fill in where ever there's a need. Very few wipes in any group I was in. I could be DPSing then stepping back and throwing some extra heals around, even off tanking when needed.

When ever some one had a look at the percentages I was in the middle for DPS, but same for heals. After BC it was "your a ret pally you should be putting out more DPS", etc. Playing became more of a formula with rotations, and burst damage, and less about paying attention and reacting as needed. H@ll a trained monkey could play a pally after awhile.

Those meters and PVP ruined playing a ret pally for me.

Isn't a game supposed to be about having fun? I've found most add-ons are for either the lazy (can't pay attention to who needs heals or buffs) or anal retentive (we all have to play this way) and they suck the fun out of playing a MMO.

 

Sounds like you did a pretty **** job at your class. I played a ret pally from day 1, I even did MC/BWL as ret, although later on for AQ40 I did succumb to pressure and go holy. A ret pally was worthless as a healer in a raid, throw around a few heals and you would be oom. Offtank? Yeah, maybe when the whole raid is dead and you bubble tank vael for 12 seconds at 1% and finish him off, but thats a hero move, not offtanking.

 

Bad players are afraid of meters and addons.

 

I personally dont give a crap if they put meters in, but I would love some PROPER dot timers so I dont have to play a damn guessing game with my class.

[Uzilara]

All i want are addons that permit me to setup my UI the way i want it and not the very limited options we currently have.

not just talking about the ability bars but also the option to move the character window or inventory window where I want it and in the size i want it....that I have the option to open any screen i want at any time i want without i switching to the other side or closing another screen.

 

another thing i would like is rightclick = selfcast instead of always having to select my character first and then using the ability (especially for healing)

 

MMO's have evolved in the last years and the options SWTOR currently has for UI are lacking.

 

Now I know they are working on this but they will never be able to make the perfect UI for everyone, so why not let the community sort it out themselves via addons...makes perfect sense to me.

[dlaselle]

Why exactly do you not want addons available? If you don't like them, don't use them.

 

Maybe, people don't want to be judged by a DPS meter when they play? Be told by some kids that, " Your DPS sucks dude, I'm going to kick you from the raid"