My guild is helping to kill our server

[utuwer]

Cross server queue + valor/rank + team's size match up is what Rift does to its Warfronts. One more thing, they have free server transfer, so that hardcore pvp guilds can leave the server for more competitive one. Edited May 4, 2012 by utuwer

[Krashnburn]

Just the fact of being in a pre-made group that is coordinating on vent is going to make them dominate.

 

BW 's inability to add cross server ques and matching pre-mades vs pre-mades is driving the pugs to quit WZs or just not que at all. Which is killing the game.

 

So merge servers add cross server ques and ranked WZs fast before this game dies.

 

He isn't bragging, just stating facts. IMHO

Edited May 4, 2012 by Parali
rude

[fungihoujo]

Let's be honest, we're all just waiting for GW2 so we can pvp the right way.

 

GW2 is terrible. The balance is already awful- it's pretty much unanimous that the engineer is utterly useless- weapons mechanics in many cases are extremely clunky- one of the worst UIs ever made.

 

WvW is zerg vs zerg- stand back and aoe aoe aoe, damage damage damage. It's fps team deathmatch no matter what you do- perfect for CoD simpletons who'd prefer to only tunnel vision for kills.

 

The dodge mechanic is clunky and frankly, more poorly implemented than the dodge mechanic in DDO- which as an action game actually made sense to have one.

 

Irony is- with all the complaints about servers being broken here- guess what happens if you roll on a terrible server in GW2? One that ends up spending 100% of WvW in your base being farmed by the server that holds the entire map?

 

You get to pay real money for the priviledge of ROLLING on another server- that's right, no chance like in this game to just say 'screw this server, gonna go reroll on that one'- you are stuck on the server you pick day one... unless you're willing to pay Anet some money.

 

 

 

Pretty clear what Anet's financial plan is.

[Sheduur]

I will try to explain this without coming off as cocky, or happy about this.

 

We have a decent pvp background, mostly 2400+ arena/RBG WOW players with a few glads sprinkled in,

 

I even enjoyed raiding in this game and have done all the content but BOTH of the 16 man raiding guilds I have been in have already quit the game and moved on. I now solely pvp.

 

We play ALOT. We don't lose. When my guild is online and queueing up with 2 or more groups over the course of 4-6 hour sessions, we get into games and look at the final scoreboard and you can see anywhere from 16-20 imps came in and out of the game. People queue dodge us, or stop Q'ing completely. Since we are the smaller faction, all they see is our premades mixed with a couple other pub guild premades, and we all know how to work together and it is actually a good pvp community. We have a call and name for just about every passing location in huttball.

 

This is starting to make queue times horrible. Our server is dying just like everyone elses. We have multiple empire players saying it takes them roughly 4+ hours of queue dodging and playing just to get their daily done. We have anyone who is any decent at pvp asking to reroll and join us. We don't like this because who the hell are we supposed to play? Instead of having any rivalry or decent games, we just have people who would rather stand around and socialize in say chat while we 3 cap or 6 score huttball. And most people just seem to be quitting.

 

TLDR - Nothing is more important right now then server merging/transfers. We all want rateds, we all want cross-server warzones, we all want balance and to make sure no cheats or hacks happen in rateds. None of that matters if our servers are dead and we can't play the game in even its current basic state.

 

Instead of complaining about the situation why not share the wealth? By that I mean, split up and maybe join up with other ppl who are usually playing AGAINST you guys. If this is not simply meant as stroking the e-peen then I guess this might be a solution even if you would have to make a change instead of just hoping for someone else to fix it for you. In case youre really as good as you think you are then you will at least be able to fight another team thats as good as you, and you can have fun playing vs each other and be sure to have fun battles without griefing

[kweassa]

I will try to explain this without coming off as cocky, or happy about this.

 

We have a decent pvp background, mostly 2400+ arena/RBG WOW players with a few glads sprinkled in,

 

I even enjoyed raiding in this game and have done all the content but BOTH of the 16 man raiding guilds I have been in have already quit the game and moved on. I now solely pvp.

 

We play ALOT. We don't lose. When my guild is online and queueing up with 2 or more groups over the course of 4-6 hour sessions, we get into games and look at the final scoreboard and you can see anywhere from 16-20 imps came in and out of the game. People queue dodge us, or stop Q'ing completely. Since we are the smaller faction, all they see is our premades mixed with a couple other pub guild premades, and we all know how to work together and it is actually a good pvp community. We have a call and name for just about every passing location in huttball.

 

This is starting to make queue times horrible. Our server is dying just like everyone elses. We have multiple empire players saying it takes them roughly 4+ hours of queue dodging and playing just to get their daily done. We have anyone who is any decent at pvp asking to reroll and join us. We don't like this because who the hell are we supposed to play? Instead of having any rivalry or decent games, we just have people who would rather stand around and socialize in say chat while we 3 cap or 6 score huttball. And most people just seem to be quitting.

 

TLDR - Nothing is more important right now then server merging/transfers. We all want rateds, we all want cross-server warzones, we all want balance and to make sure no cheats or hacks happen in rateds. None of that matters if our servers are dead and we can't play the game in even its current basic state.

 

Exactly as I've warned in other premade-related posts.

Premades that overshadow other players, when left unchecked in PvP arenas, kills the competition itself.

 

Thanks for proving my point.

 

 

Yes, cross-server queuing is direly needed.

Yes, we need to stop team queuing in normal WZs, and only allow it in rated WZs.

[kweassa]

Instead of complaining about the situation why not share the wealth? By that I mean, split up and maybe join up with other ppl who are usually playing AGAINST you guys. If this is not simply meant as stroking the e-peen then I guess this might be a solution even if you would have to make a change instead of just hoping for someone else to fix it for you. In case youre really as good as you think you are then you will at least be able to fight another team thats as good as you, and you can have fun playing vs each other and be sure to have fun battles without griefing

 

 

But wealth is like the one-ring. People don't give it away.

 

That's why we need the system to do things for the common good.

Edited May 4, 2012 by Parali
inappropriate content - politics

[Sheduur]

Exactly as I've warned in other premade-related posts.

Premades that overshadow other players, when left unchecked in PvP arenas, kills the competition itself.

 

Thanks for proving my point.

 

 

Yes, cross-server queuing is direly needed.

Yes, we need to stop team queuing in normal WZs, and only allow it in rated WZs.

 

Yeah something like that would most likely work out well. Probably allow a group of two ppl to queue so you can at least join up with a mate and still have someone around instead of just playing in a completely random warzone.

[Eddizel]

Instead of complaining about the situation why not share the wealth? By that I mean, split up and maybe join up with other ppl who are usually playing AGAINST you guys. If this is not simply meant as stroking the e-peen then I guess this might be a solution even if you would have to make a change instead of just hoping for someone else to fix it for you. In case youre really as good as you think you are then you will at least be able to fight another team thats as good as you, and you can have fun playing vs each other and be sure to have fun battles without griefing

 

On a very rare occasion we end up facing each other, you have to remember you can only Q up as 4, so this does happen sometimes.

 

Still, this isn't a very viable solution. It is Bioware's problem, not ours.

[Sheduur]

On a very rare occasion we end up facing each other, you have to remember you can only Q up as 4, so this does happen sometimes.

 

Still, this isn't a very viable solution. It is Bioware's problem, not ours.

 

It is the only option that you have right now in order to change anything for your own playing experience. I would even go as far as to create toons on both sides so you can just switch to the queues for republic/imperial side depending which queues seem to be giving the best results at the time.

 

If youre really playing for just the pvp, then I am afraid you picked the wrong game. I can feel the pain, as I hoped for better pvp in swtor aswell, but lets face it: They messed it up and now they dont seem to find the magic switch to get it to a state where people at least stop making the forums explode in nerd rage

 

PvP in this game has been doomed from the start. The Ilum disaster, the silly pvp loot distribution system, reluctance to make substantial changes to classes and rather just stick to nerfing some already meager ratings even more (crit/haste talent reductions etc). It seems they just dont know what to do as much as the next guy.

 

Changes have to happen, like hiring some guys who are actually having a clue about pvp and probably even going as far as to create some meaningful pvp system that does not just include warzones or arenas to actually create some longevity. Experience from other games tells us though, that they will probably _slowly_ integrate things from wow, like arena/rated wz and thats all you get. I doubt they will include anything innovative or at least slightly different and change will not come quickly, otherwise you would probably already heard about "groundbreaking changes - coming to you soon ".

 

The harsh truth is, Ilum was probably the gunpowder they had in their barrel, and thats been fired off now and turned out to be a dud. And that musket takes a long time to reload now! Especially since they have the shiny M16 pve rifle laying next to it and rather shoot a few rounds with that one before bothering with picking up that old faulty one again

[CodyLundeen]

Most of the woes of the pvp'rs is the spread out population. From about 9pm to 11pm est, I was single queuing and I literally ran into the same preforms, and I do mean preforms it was two 4 man groups, and once it looked 4 by 2 by 2 from their guild tags, every match for 2 hours. I even logged an imp alt and sure enough those appeared to be only guys queuing as no same faction matches were going. The last time I did make a group of 4 guys but 4 guys grouped against two 4 man groups together isn't going to cut it.

 

The OP may come off as sounding like a douche, some have raised this point lol, but he's right. When the imps are running multiple preforms (or pubs maybe on select servers), and even get those preforms grouped together due to lack of other guys queuing, there's just no way to fight back. We literally do not have 8 players good/geared enough on at one time to match them. I'm not really one to rage quit but I am getting sick of this stuff, so I know others are already at breaking point or beyond it. They absolutely don't have until late June, that's early summer technically, to fix this because I sure as heck haven't seen a huge influx of new players, just old ones quitting.

Edited May 4, 2012 by CodyLundeen

[saborw]

Cross-Server Warzones Please

 

Groups of 3 or 4 should be put in a queue to play other teams made up of groups with 3 or 4. 2 and Under should be unchanged

 

It's just another balance issue really. Level 50's with 0 expertise are not going to stand up to level 50's with expertise, so it's foolish to think that Pick up Groups who type three words over the course of a game is going to compete with a team who's on Ventrilo and PvP's with one another on a daily basis

Edited May 4, 2012 by saborw

[Maurdiib]

Server merges won't fix this. The true problem lies with Expertise. It's like a jest in poor taste.

[Carbonated]

my server used to have a heap of pvp. People rarely left, then when ilum became the bm farm grounds it turned into people leaving. Now that they farmed bm with the reps my server is basically imp side leaving constantly and rep premades. my fresh 50 sniper that i finally leveled does 80k damage gets 1-3 medals against this premade and thats usually top for imps in them because everyone leaves or just sits and whines about the opposing team.

 

Can't play a pug anymore due to the pugs just afking or leaving. every games just basically dead. Getting gear is terrible for fresh players because once they spend what they earned prior to 50 is gone they get 1 medals worth on average per game. Its just sad now. The 10-49 queues also seemed to have died. The event was busy but since then its quiet.

[Alataral]

I am on a server where a similar problem exists, one guild completely dominates pvp, it takes weeks to get a single win above level 50 if you are playing during the evenings only. Yeah, you can tell me, and some have, just suck it up, princess, and put the time in, and get the gear, but they are turning in dailies in three wins every night. I'm turning in dailies once a month if I'm lucky, even less than that at present, because I'm too discouraged to get my butt kicked more than about 10-12 times per evening per character. [also long queue times on our low population server because people just give up]

 

So while they get more and more rewards, and better and better gear, the gap grows, and soon even being able to get the daily done in a month's play time will likely be impossible.

 

When we do get a queue, and it's 4 pugs against a full 8man premade, gosh it's fun.

 

Just my two cents, kudos to the player who started this thread, I appreciate hearing from the other side that even you think there's something wrong here.

[Racter]

Exactly as I've warned in other premade-related posts.

Premades that overshadow other players, when left unchecked in PvP arenas, kills the competition itself.

 

Thanks for proving my point.

 

 

Yes, cross-server queuing is direly needed.

Yes, we need to stop team queuing in normal WZs, and only allow it in rated WZs.

 

If you stop team queuing in normal WZs I'd say a solid 1/3 of people will quit pvp entirely. For a lot of us, that means unsubbing because that's all we care about. I'm not trying to roll the other team, I'm trying for a sure bet half my team isn't a complete moron and that we have at least two healers.

 

100% agree on cross server queuing, but seeing as Fatman is my main server and our queues are never over 5Ms regardless of the time of day, that is less important to me personally than 8m queues.

[Erasimus]

Server merges won't fix this. The true problem lies with Expertise. It's like a jest in poor taste.

 

I disagree. Server mergers are the first step in fixing the problem. Expertise? Really? Gear is very easy to get if you PvP regularly and even the starter set isn't all that bad. Pre-mades playing PuGs is indeed one of the issues. PuG vs PuG tends to level out the gear differences much like pre 50 PvP. I think of Expertise kind of like the difference in abilities between level 14-49 characters. It does make a difference, but in PuGs tends to make much less of a difference.

 

In some of the under 50 matches I've run across pre-mades where virtually the entire opposing team were 48-49, usually a disaster.

 

I know, at least until most of my Republic guild stopped logging in, we occasionally did guild PvP. We'd make up 4 man groups, get on vent, time our queuing and would often get 8 mans. If we didn't we'd just drop and try it again until we did.

Edited May 4, 2012 by Erasimus

[Gjorind]

Server merges won't fix this. The true problem lies with Expertise. It's like a jest in poor taste.

 

No. And it's a very common misconception.

 

See, here's the thing. Most folks aren't as good as they think they are. They get placed against the dominant premade on their server and the first thought in their head is "if I had full War Hero we'd own these guys because it's all gear".

 

It's not all gear(which is what blaming expertise is, blaming gear), and frankly some of these premades would beat a PuG in their skivvy drawers.

 

Cross Server queues fixes it almost completely. Cross server+ranked solves even more of it. The premades don't go away, but suddenly you aren't getting paired against them over and over until they log out.

[JediDuckling]

Honestly, if I am in a premade I only want to play against premades. When I am in a pug, I will leave every game against premades I can, no matter the penalty. They make the penalty severe, I will play a diff character. If it's even more severe, I'll go back to rift where they figured out how to separate the Q's.

 

exactly premades should only come across premades as its totally unfair for that mixed pug of maybe undergeared and new 50's.

[criminalheretic]

either you are just trolling or you didn't read the OPs post or you lack reading comprehension.

 

Everyone that has PvPed in this game has seen what he is pointing out.

 

Just the fact of being in a pre-made group that is coordinating on vent is going to make them dominate.

 

BW 's inability to add cross server ques and matching pre-mades vs pre-mades is driving the pugs to quit WZs or just not que at all. Which is killing the game.

 

So merge servers add cross server ques and ranked WZs fast before this game dies.

 

He isn't bragging, just stating facts. IMHO

 

He probably could have accomplished that by saying "We roll premades, and we're pretty good."

[Girltank]

premades will continue to be a problem until they come out with cross server Qing. It would be foolish of them to split pres and pugs without cross server Qing as many servers already suffer from an inability to get Qs.

[criminalheretic]

No. And it's a very common misconception.

 

See, here's the thing. Most folks aren't as good as they think they are. They get placed against the dominant premade on their server and the first thought in their head is "if I had full War Hero we'd own these guys because it's all gear".

 

It's not all gear(which is what blaming expertise is, blaming gear), and frankly some of these premades would beat a PuG in their skivvy drawers.

 

Cross Server queues fixes it almost completely. Cross server+ranked solves even more of it. The premades don't go away, but suddenly you aren't getting paired against them over and over until they log out.

 

Amen. Gear will not close the gap between a premade and a PUG. Particularly if they are on voice. I know that and I have never even been part of a premade group.

 

Just watch them move, or specifically how they never stop moving, but they are always within 4m of each other. Watch how they all break for an objective at exactly the same time. Watch how they almost never settle into a 1v1 fight, they hit you once and keep running because they know they have a teammate running right behind them to hit you as well. In fact that is the easiest way to tell you're going against a premade before you have a chance to read guild names. When you have 5 people running in a circle, and they all hit you once and then immediately move on to another target, like a relay race where they each bash you with the baton? Yeah that's a premade. You're gonna lose 97% of the time, and gear isn't gonna help.

[Sendai_S]

I will try to explain this without coming off as cocky, or happy about this.

 

We have a decent pvp background, mostly 2400+ arena/RBG WOW players with a few glads sprinkled in,

 

I even enjoyed raiding in this game and have done all the content but BOTH of the 16 man raiding guilds I have been in have already quit the game and moved on. I now solely pvp.

 

We play ALOT. We don't lose. When my guild is online and queueing up with 2 or more groups over the course of 4-6 hour sessions, we get into games and look at the final scoreboard and you can see anywhere from 16-20 imps came in and out of the game. People queue dodge us, or stop Q'ing completely. Since we are the smaller faction, all they see is our premades mixed with a couple other pub guild premades, and we all know how to work together and it is actually a good pvp community. We have a call and name for just about every passing location in huttball.

 

This is starting to make queue times horrible. Our server is dying just like everyone elses. We have multiple empire players saying it takes them roughly 4+ hours of queue dodging and playing just to get their daily done. We have anyone who is any decent at pvp asking to reroll and join us. We don't like this because who the hell are we supposed to play? Instead of having any rivalry or decent games, we just have people who would rather stand around and socialize in say chat while we 3 cap or 6 score huttball. And most people just seem to be quitting.

 

TLDR - Nothing is more important right now then server merging/transfers. We all want rateds, we all want cross-server warzones, we all want balance and to make sure no cheats or hacks happen in rateds. None of that matters if our servers are dead and we can't play the game in even its current basic state.

 

I dodge playing against certain palyers as well. It is absolutely NO FUN to get stomped. Even worse is spednig all that time in a match and still getting no rewards for at least trying. (Which coincidentally just happened to me...)

 

I am valor 50ish and i was up against a team Conquerors and highers. I however am in that horrible place where I had a whole bunch of old system gear and then there's the new gear and there's no solution FOR THOSE IN BETWEEN. The recruit gear has more expertise and it's ridiculously confusing to try and gear for PVP and I have no idea if it's literally bettter to get all the recruit gear and ditch my champion set for then there's the fact that Battlemaster Gear and War hero gear is out there makgin them even more difficult to kill.

 

IMHO PVP gear is a BAD IDEA. You want peopel to enjoy PVP? Make the gear an equalizer and not a differntiator. No one wants to get stomped. And from my own POV I don't want to beat people by a ton either. I LIKE close fights - they're far more fun.

 

The good of making gear the same - is that no one can claim their gear makes them better. It's all skill and class at that point.

 

The bad - all the players will whine. And no one wants to look the same.

 

 

 

Anyway, back on point. I can't stand fighting groups like the OPs. I rarely get into them and when I run across groups like that - I sotp queueing - I have no choice. Playing against them makes me want to quit. It's NOT fun.

[mrekxxx]

I suggest only 8 men premade ops, if you don't have 8 men cannot queue.

 

And grp premade in 8 would queue automatically to ranked WZ.

 

The rest queue solo to non ranked, that's all.

 

Btw. i am not sure how could cross-server game work, i mean latency, technically issues, server positions etc...

 

I personally move to the most populated server i guess.

[Siliconrose]

Yeah, I know I'm not the best player, but I try to avoid being a drag on my team. I can take out bads on the other side 1v1 when I get jumped, I watch the objectives, and I try to pay attention and focus targets alongside my team (I'm always PUGing).

 

...but hell, when I'm facing the premades on the Republic, I walk up, dot up the targets and then start the FL... and I'm dead. Seriously, it is a struggle not to just drop out of the game and stop queueing when that happens. It's not even a learning experience, just an exercise in futility. I'm glad that they increased the comms from a loss, because at least I'm still making (slow) progress towards full BM.

[halorix]

...but hell, when I'm facing the premades on the Republic, I walk up, dot up the targets and then start the FL... and I'm dead. Seriously, it is a struggle not to just drop out of the game and stop queueing when that happens. It's not even a learning experience, just an exercise in futility. I'm glad that they increased the comms from a loss, because at least I'm still making (slow) progress towards full BM.

 

i see people quit vs premades and i just wonder how they can be such cowardly creatures.

 

IMHO PVP gear is a BAD IDEA. You want peopel to enjoy PVP? Make the gear an equalizer and not a differntiator. No one wants to get stomped. And from my own POV I don't want to beat people by a ton either. I LIKE close fights - they're far more fun.

 

The good of making gear the same - is that no one can claim their gear makes them better. It's all skill and class at that point.

 

sure it would all be skill and class, but you forget something, this is a gear based mmo, there would be little reason to get gear for pvp if we all instantly got some neutral stats put on us upon entering a warzone, this has been argued to death, but you know what you were getting into when you decided to pvp in a gear based mmo.

 

I hear gw2 does this, remember everyone likes something different, not everyone can be pleased by one mmo, that's why many mmo's exist, or else one would have everyone because it really was the best.

 

Hopefully when cross server comes out they limit premade's to only vs other premade's, that alone would help a lot of people while still getting geared, as then they should really only be in a queue against other people trying to get gear, or bored people...

Edited May 4, 2012 by Parali
rude