Howbadisbad Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) Discuss. http://www.twitch.tv/strikinginsanity/b/311379895 Summary of tourney: 3v3 tourney, team with 1 commando healer and double assault vanguards roflstomped every team except for one with double maras and a pyro PT, which they won with significantly lower life, but still no deaths. EDIT: There was a team with conc Operative +double mara who killed one of the vanguards in an all out early burst. The Operative was slain shortly after and the Vanguard+Commando lost to double mara. This same team was defeated later because the Winning team spread out more for the opener and CCed as soon as the opener went off, preventing an early death. Summary of class performance: [Observations/Opinions] Sorc- Unable to kite double melee, as soon as DPS got full resolve the Sorc got wtfpwned. Operative- Injection was interrupted and then it was GG, vanish got countered hard by stealth scan, saw some interesting fights using the AOE stealth ability. I think I saw a few conc Operatives, after their initial burst ended, they were slain incredibly fast. Maraurder- Great damage, took a very long time to kill. Their defensive cooldowns were so strong, one team just took double mara and a powertech, they won most of their fights. Powertech- Pyro domination. Hard to kill, great damage, grapple prevented any prolonged kiting. MVP dps. Mercenary- When healing, MVP healer. When Arsenal, got LOSed and failed to do anything significant. Sniper- Don't think I saw any snipers actually. Will double check. Assassin- Honestly didn't see much Sin ownage, I think this is mostly because the team comps the Sins were in didn't have enough DPS. Seemed like a Mara who switched some of his damage for guard. Similar survivability from what I saw. Juggernaught- Didn't see any of these, or they just didn't stand out. How do you predict this sort of team comp will preform when ranked warzones come out? - In Alderaan and Voidstar since they both are attack/defend style. - In Huttball, where controlling middle is highest priority. - In 2v2, 3v3, and 5v5 (Or other combinations) Arenas assuming they are ever added. Obviously the video is only for reference when comparing how classes perform in small group fights in a medium sized arena. EDIT: Why no strikeout Video is a great referance to performance in warzones, controling mid in huttball, defending and attacking turrets/doors in Alderaan and Voidstar. 8v8 does not happen in warzones, there are almost always small scale fights like 4v4, ramping up to 6v6 during zergs on a single target. Edited March 14, 2012 by Howbadisbad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycao Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 sleeper? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howbadisbad Posted March 14, 2012 Author Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) sleeper? Term used in League of Legends for secretly basically. As in the masses don't QQ because said sleeper OP class is underplayed, or people don't realize it's true potential due to high skillcap or a certain strategy. Sometimes it is even based on the fact that a character may be ugly, and hence underplayed. Generally sleeper OP classes are revealed in high level tournaments, and then they become FOTM and meet the QQ train, ending in slight nerfs with which all the FOTM players forsake the class, and go tot he next one. The FOTM nerfs are usually very small, and have minimal impact on how the champion performs. Edited March 14, 2012 by Howbadisbad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wwkingms Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 hue dueling tourney on my server (32 players) bout 2 weeks ago showed the following sorcerers are absolutely terrible 1v1 marauders and tank assasin hybrids dominate pvp.. and pt pyro does insane dmg this is all 1v1 tho about merc healers... i find them the hardest to kill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smoontan Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) rage juggernaut in guard spec, guard on merc healer, aoe taunt/taunts and intercede for healer, and a pyrotech would ****. but honestly i wouldnt call them sleepers because good players have already recognized merc healers are the only ones who can go toe to toe with any and multiple dps. that anti interupt bubble is win Edited March 14, 2012 by smoontan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnesium Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 The Pyro build does way more damage and I'm pretty sure that class is getting "fixed" in 1.2, any tournaments after that should hopefully be more realistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainInsano Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) Merc healers are the best pure healers because of aura mastery preventing all interrupts. When you pair it with guard, no amount of DPS is going to be able to take down the Merc. Edit: Huttball utility is obviously a different story. Edited March 14, 2012 by CaptainInsano Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iite Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 None of this has any bearing on what happens in warzones. Mainly due to the lack of avenues for escape and objects for LOS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balmuck Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Discuss. http://www.twitch.tv/strikinginsanity/b/311379895 Summary of tourney: 3v3 tourney, team with 1 commando healer and double assault vanguards roflstomped every team except for one with double maras and a pyro PT, which they won with significantly lower life, but still no deaths. EDIT: There was a team with conc Operative +double mara who killed one of the vanguards in an all out early burst. The Operative was slain shortly after and the Vanguard+Commando lost to double mara. This same team was defeated later because the Winning team spread out more for the opener and CCed as soon as the opener went off, preventing an early death. Summary of class performance: [Observations/Opinions] Sorc- Unable to kite double melee, as soon as DPS got full resolve the Sorc got wtfpwned. Operative- Injection was interrupted and then it was GG, vanish got countered hard by stealth scan, saw some interesting fights using the AOE stealth ability. I think I saw a few conc Operatives, after their initial burst ended, they were slain incredibly fast. Maraurder- Great damage, took a very long time to kill. Their defensive cooldowns were so strong, one team just took double mara and a powertech, they won most of their fights. Powertech- Pyro domination. Hard to kill, great damage, grapple prevented any prolonged kiting. MVP dps. Mercenary- When healing, MVP healer. When Arsenal, got LOSed and failed to do anything significant. Sniper- Don't think I saw any snipers actually. Will double check. Assassin- Honestly didn't see much Sin ownage, I think this is mostly because the team comps the Sins were in didn't have enough DPS. Seemed like a Mara who switched some of his damage for guard. Similar survivability from what I saw. Juggernaught- Didn't see any of these, or they just didn't stand out. How do you predict this sort of team comp will preform when ranked warzones come out? - In Alderaan and Voidstar since they both are attack/defend style. - In Huttball, where controlling middle is highest priority. - In 2v2, 3v3, and 5v5 (Or other combinations) Arenas assuming they are ever added. Obviously the video is only for reference when comparing how classes perform in small group fights in a medium sized arena. Shouldn't have posted that. These nerdlingers are gonna rip you apart as soon as you wrote that Sorcs are completely useless 1v1.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maltra Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 There's nothing to discuss really, the 3 op acs are marauder/assassin/sorc. Wasting time "discussing" anything else is pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balmuck Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 None of this has any bearing on what happens in warzones. Mainly due to the lack of avenues for escape and objects for LOS. This HAS everything to do with WZs. I come here and read the forums and I HONESTLY think that 99% of people who play this game, either play a different game or are completely missing any brain cells. I mean, I do play with a great bunch of people.. Most of our mains are all 80+ but... outside of me, NOBODY plays a Sage in my guild. 4 other guys re-rolled Sentinels and Vanguards and it's just beyond stupid how amazing the classes are. The vanguards, assault spec, posses burst damage that's basically un-matched by any other class and on top of that, as far as objective and team play goes, they have a pull and their two taunts.. The Sentinels on the other hands... they have the best, sustained single target damage in this game.. especially Watchmen. They hit CRAZY hard.. and it never ends. Not only that, but the amount of defensive abilities is just ridiculous. I've said this many times before, a good Sentinel/Mara will last longer with 1% HP then most other classes going from 100% to dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xNonphixionx Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 people act like organized tournaments are the true test of class skill and capabilities. This is clearly not the case. PVP is best judged from unpredicatable encounters. For instance, in a 4v4 pre-organized match eveyone know's the exact kill order. Everyone knows who to do what to because they have time to plan it out before actually engaging. This is why sorcs are so ****** in organized pvp....Everyone focuses them first and they die so fast. It's WAY different in open world PVP and Warzones where PVP actually matters. Usually in a 4v4 you'd only have 1 healer. In warzones you're best off having multiple healers that can then heal each other when they are focused. This is where Sorc shines. While Sorc may be garbage in 1v1 and small organized skirmishes, they are still overpowered in large group battles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balmuck Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 There's nothing to discuss really, the 3 op acs are marauder/assassin/sorc. Wasting time "discussing" anything else is pointless. You didn't read the part where he said that Sorcs were the worst? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Ricky Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 its long been relized that complaning about sorc means your bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iite Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 This HAS everything to do with WZs. I come here and read the forums and I HONESTLY think that 99% of people who play this game, either play a different game or are completely missing any brain cells. I mean, I do play with a great bunch of people.. Most of our mains are all 80+ but... outside of me, NOBODY plays a Sage in my guild. 4 other guys re-rolled Sentinels and Vanguards and it's just beyond stupid how amazing the classes are. The vanguards, assault spec, posses burst damage that's basically un-matched by any other class and on top of that, as far as objective and team play goes, they have a pull and their two taunts.. The Sentinels on the other hands... they have the best, sustained single target damage in this game.. especially Watchmen. They hit CRAZY hard.. and it never ends. Not only that, but the amount of defensive abilities is just ridiculous. I've said this many times before, a good Sentinel/Mara will last longer with 1% HP then most other classes going from 100% to dead. Of course when you pit 3 high burst MDPS classes into a broom closet of an environment with squishy range classes with no avenue of escape we all knew what the result would be. I just don't see how you can take this as anything more than a grain of salt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BiggDirty Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Of course when you pit 3 high burst MDPS classes into a broom closet of an environment with squishy range classes with no avenue of escape we all knew what the result would be. I just don't see how you can take this as anything more than a grain of salt. There is NEVER going to be an avenue of escape for a sorc/sage. What part of "it's impossible to kite multiple melee" don't people like you understand? Only the worst players think sorcs are even VIABLE, let alone overpowered. I have already dropped my full BM sage because I know it will be useless in rated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iite Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Only the worst players think sorcs are viable ? Are you kidding me. I frequently kite 2-3 mdps around huttball with the use of hazards, knockbacks, terrain, airjets and slows. Marauders are one of the easiest classes to kite by far. Maybe i'm just that good, who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lidasel Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 There is NEVER going to be an avenue of escape for a sorc/sage. What part of "it's impossible to kite multiple melee" don't people like you understand? Only the worst players think sorcs are even VIABLE, let alone overpowered. I have already dropped my full BM sage because I know it will be useless in rated. Sorcs will dominate Huttball due to their massive amounts of utility. In 2v2 or 3v3 Arena situations they obviously lose some of their utility because there are no edges to pull/KB someone yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warultima Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Sorcs will dominate Huttball due to their massive amounts of utility. In 2v2 or 3v3 Arena situations they obviously lose some of their utility because there are no edges to pull/KB someone yet. Yea and when I play my scoundrel I can kill any sorc I choose even 1 v 2 as long as they dont crossheal "extensively". One of the easiest class to kill for me as a lolstunlockscrondel maybe I am just so godly killing such an OP class 1v2 and the 1st sorc cant even fight back. But yea nerf sorc they are too OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twor Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) Well, good that PvP isn't TDM. I mean, I do play with a great bunch of people.. Most of our mains are all 80+ but... outside of me, NOBODY plays a Sage in my guild. 4 other guys re-rolled Sentinels and Vanguards and it's just beyond stupid how amazing the classes are. I fear that if the people reroll sentinel and vanguard for sage, they will soon realize that they are the problem, not the class. Edited March 14, 2012 by Twor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orangerascal Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 (edited) I've re-rolled a scoundrel from a full BM sage because I foresaw this type of problem with sages and sorcs. Pugs complain about sorcs because ... how do I explain it best .... they are pugs. My 8 men premade are going down the melee pain train route and our sage(s) will become token healers. Edited March 14, 2012 by Orangerascal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iite Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Yea and when I play my scoundrel I can kill any sorc I choose even 1 v 2 as long as they dont crossheal "extensively". One of the easiest class to kill for me as a lolstunlockscrondel maybe I am just so godly killing such an OP class 1v2 and the 1st sorc cant even fight back. But yea nerf sorc they are too OP. If you're killing sorcs during the initial stun then you must be killing fresh 50s.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fdzzaigl Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 The results of that tounament are predictable, combine 2 of the biggest single target burst class with a near unkillable healer = you win. TOR should be balanced for 8vs8, which is the most played format now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redmarx Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Good players have been saying for a while that sorcs (and tracer mercs) are a weak class in PVP. You can pretty much tell if you're a good player or not by seeing if you agree or disagree with that. The strong classes are marauder, powertech and merc healer, possibly assassins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orangerascal Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 The results of that tounament are predictable, combine 2 of the biggest single target burst class with a near unkillable healer = you win. TOR should be balanced for 8vs8, which is the most played format now. you do realize a lot of fights break of into 1v1, 2v2, 3v3's right? 1 left, 4 mid, 3 right aldeeran strategy for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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