Could Qui-Gon Jinn have trained Anakin any better than Obi-wan?

[TJBartlemus]

What do you think would have happened if Qui-gon lived and taught Anakin instead of Obi-wan? And if he did would Anakin have ever turned into Darth Vader?

[Torxussos]

Oh yes. I think Qui Gon wouldve have kept him away from Palptine more and Anakin would have listened to Qui Gon

[Kaskava]

I think Anakin was lost before he was ever borne.

[AngelousWang]

Oh yes. I think Qui Gon wouldve have kept him away from Palptine more and Anakin would have listened to Qui Gon

 

This.

 

Anakin would have listened to Qui Gon over Sidious.

 

Both Qui Gon and Palptine are father figures to Anakin, if Qui Gon had been around Anakin would never have formed the bond he did with Sidious in the first place.

 

Kenobi is a brother figure to Anakin, and people tend to ignore, show up, compete and purposely go against what their brother wants, even if it is good advice.

 

Father Figures > Brother Bonds. At least when it comes to listening and doing what you are told.

Edited February 26, 2012 by AngelousWang

[DarthRamette]

Oh yea, I think that Qui-Gon would have done a better job and kept him away from Palpatine. Obi-Wan was still pretty young and forced into training Anakin out of guilt.

[BrandonSM]

IMHO, I see Qui-Gon using Anakin to redo the entire Jedi Order.

[Stdinu]

What do you think would have happened if Qui-gon lived and taught Anakin instead of Obi-wan? And if he did would Anakin have ever turned into Darth Vader?

 

Qui-Gon Was the most Knowledgeable Jedi in the Order with maybe the exception of Yoda. That man Found and Forced the training of the "Chosen One", and Was the first Jedi to figure out how to come back to the world as a Force Ghost.

 

So yes I do believe that he would have been wise enough to realize that Palpatine was a bad model. If anything I would not have doubted he would have figured out who Palpatine really was and stopped him.

 

I believe this is why Qui-Gon had to die. Episodes 4, 5, and 6 would not be possible had he Lived.

Edited February 27, 2012 by Stdinu

[BrandonSM]

Qui-Gon Was the most Knowledgeable Jedi in the Order with maybe the exception of Yoda. That man started the creation of a Clone Army, Found and Forced the training of the "Chosen One", and Was the first Jedi to figure out how to come back to the world as a Force Ghost.

 

So yes I do believe that he would have been wise enough to realize that Palpatine was a bad model. If anything I would not have doubted he would have figured out who Palpatine really was and stopped him.

 

I believe this is why Qui-Gon had to die. Episodes 4, 5, and 6 would not be possible had he Lived.

 

When did Qui-Gon make the clone army? Sifo-Dayas did.

[Stdinu]

When did Qui-Gon make the clone army? Sifo-Dayas did.

 

You are correct sir my bad =p

[BrandonSM]

You are correct sir my bad =p

 

I meant to say Sifo ordered it. But actually, if I'm correct Palps and Plageuis played a part in the creation as well.

 

 

 

Ironically, pretty much everything that happened played a role in the Grand Plan.

[Kaskava]

Qui-Gon Was the most Knowledgeable Jedi in the Order with maybe the exception of Yoda. That man Found and Forced the training of the "Chosen One", and Was the first Jedi to figure out how to come back to the world as a Force Ghost.

 

So yes I do believe that he would have been wise enough to realize that Palpatine was a bad model. If anything I would not have doubted he would have figured out who Palpatine really was and stopped him.

 

I believe this is why Qui-Gon had to die. Episodes 4, 5, and 6 would not be possible had he Lived.

 

I'd like to point that, ~3.5 thousand years before the Rise of the Empire, Meetra Surik (the Jedi Exile) appeared as a Force Ghost.

 

A thousand years before them, Marka Ragnos appeared as a ghost on Korriban, then again on where ever Exar Kun and Uli Qel-Droma had their duel. He wasn't a Jedi, but still.

[wrong_turn]

I never really thought about this but its interesting. I'm inclined to think that yes, Qui-gon would have done a better job the Obi-wan. As much as I live Obi-wan, he seems a little too permissive and friendly with Anakin. Like he is more interested in being palsies rather than his Master. I don't think Qui-gon would have tolerated that. I think that kind of mentoring would have helped Anakin who needed someone to guide him rather than be his bestest buddy. Not only that, Qui-gon seemed to be the only person who really understood Anakin's potential. I think he would have kept a close eye on him and never allowed Palpatine to get as close as he did.

[radbass]

In Darth Plagueis it is revealed that the birth of Anakin was actually a manifestation of the Force's will, the force acting to balance itself after Plagueis and Sidious forced it into darkness. Plagueis determined that Qui gon was the key to anakin's training, that without him, the boy may be prevented from fulfilling his purpose. and in a way, he was right. but again, the force acted to balance itself, giving padme twins, and making them both strong in the force.

[Pesh]

I meant to say Sifo ordered it. But actually, if I'm correct Palps and Plageuis played a part in the creation as well.

 

 

 

Ironically, pretty much everything that happened played a role in the Grand Plan.

 

This is close to correct, but Sifo was actually dead before the clones where ordered into creation.

 

It was Sidious who was posing as Sifo, thus linking the clones back to the Jedi but having them originally being formed in the eyes of Darth Plageuis. Thus how the order 66 was imprinted in all the clones heads.

[Pesh]

This is close to correct, but Sifo was actually dead before the clones where ordered into creation.

 

It was Sidious who was posing as Sifo, thus linking the clones back to the Jedi but having them originally being formed in the eyes of Darth Plageuis. Thus how the order 66 was imprinted in all the clones heads.

 

Actually I am wrong, it was Dooku who posed as Sifo under the orders of Plageius, not Sidious.

[TJBartlemus]

I do agree with all of you that Qui-gon would have been better, but you do have to agree that Obi-Wan did his best even though he wasn't a master at the time.

[Darth_Pernisc]

Actually I am wrong, it was Dooku who posed as Sifo under the orders of Plageius, not Sidious.

 

Plagueis was dead before Dooku even officially left the Jedi Order never mind worked with the Sith.

[DrJawaPhD]

George Lucas already determined that Anakin had fallen to the dark side when the first movies came out, before Qui-Gon had even been conceived of as a character. So no, it doesn't matter who trains him, it was already pre-determined

[ounkeo]

If Qui Gon had been around, Anakin would not have fallen. You can see that much if not most of Anakin's fall was due to his adolescent angst and need to rebel.

 

Qui Gon was a much more flexible person than Obi Wan. Under a longer tutelage under Qui Gon, I think Anakin would have been allowed more leeway in certain things. I think his angst would have been more properly tempered.

 

Obi Wan was more traditional and I think it kept Anakin feeling like he was being held back (he said so himself). There just didn't seem to be much flexibility in his training under Obi Wan. It just seemed like a bad fit with Anakin's personality and character.

 

Someone that is more a father figure, who regularly bends/breaks the rules, yes he would have been someone Anakin would have flourished under. He wouldn't have felt the need to find expression and freedom in Palpatine because Qui Gon would have allowed a certain level of freedom; enough to not be overbearing but still within reason.

 

Anyway, Anakin was a whiney brat. I'm glad Obi Wan kicked his ash and learned him a lesson.

[DjDangle]

Considering Anakin went on to:

 

A) Destroy the Republic

 

B) Destroy the Jedi

 

C) Bring Darkness to the whole galaxy

 

I would say yes, Qui-Gon couldn't have done much worse :D

[SNEAKYSIX]

I agree with a lot of your points and how Obi Wan did fail Anakin.....

 

But... The questions remains, Qui-Gon would probably have held Anakin back even more thus frustrating Anakins already poor constitution. Being told youre the chosen one from an early age must create conflict and being mentored has to be seen to nuturing that potential. Maybe though Anakins issues of loss and abandonment were always greater then his potential,, a failed jedi lead by emotions.

[SammyRath]

I don't think having Qui-Gon train Anakin instead of Obi-Wan would have been ideal, nor do i think It would have stopped Anakin from falling to the Dark side at some point.

I believe It's implied in Episode 1 that Qui-Gon is very rebellious by nature, having defied the council at least once in the past. I do not believe having such a character mentor him would have saved Anakin from the Dark Side.

Qui-Gon believed almost from the moment he met Anakin that he might be The Chosen One. I think he would have catered way too much to his rebellious nature, and nurturing his advanced abilities and arrogance. He probably wouldn't have been "holding him back" as Anakin thought Obi-Wan did.

 

But I think that Obi wasn't as much "holding him back", as keeping Anakin grounded. If Anakin embraced his rebellious nature, powers, and arrogance he would just have fallen to the Dark side sooner, and more easily. Obi-Wan did his best to keep Anakin humble as every Jedi should be. In Episode 3 Anakin says that he wants more power, but admits he knows It's wrong. While Obi-Wan might have held Anakin back, either because he feared his powers, or someting along those lines, he tried all he could to turn Anakin into a Jedi, and for the most part he succeded.

I think Qui-Gon would gone to great lengths to ensure Anakin grew to be the most powerful Force user ever. Even If that meant defying the Council.

 

Part of me believes that no matter what path Anakin chose he would have fallen. Like It was part of his destiny.

[GarfieldJL]

Anakin probably wouldn't have fallen if Qui Gon Jinn had trained him. I mean seriously, Qui Gon would probably have been perfectly happy with Anakin getting married (heck he would probably be at the wedding).

 

 

The point people are missing here is that Anakin was entered into the Jedi Order when he was much older than younglings would enter the order, and went straight into being a Padawan.

 

The council made a horrible mistake handing Obi-Wan the training of Anakin, cause traditional training wouldn't have been a good fit.

 

Qui-Gon Jinn wasn't a traditional teacher, which would mean he could handle the fact that a lot of improvising would be needed to teach Anakin.

 

I would also argue that Anakin's mom might not have ended up dead if Qui Gon had survived, probably cause Anakin would have been aware she was missing a lot sooner. Qui-Gon would probably have made sure that Anakin still was in contact with his mom.

 

Yoda would have made a better teacher too, because he would have had to handle students that were older than normal when starting training in the past.

 

The fact Obi-Wan had no experience, and was reeling from Qui-Gon's death, was probably the worst possible teacher for Anakin.

[Tuscad]

It wouldn't have mattered if Yoda himself had trained Anakin. When one is destined to fall, they fall, there is no way to get around that. Obi-wan was not to blame for Anakin's fall it was the will of the force as Luke was also not to be praised for Anakin's Redemption as again it was the will of the force. Anakin was destined to be redeemed eventually as it was the only way to bring balance to the force. (EU withstanding) If you stop and think even if Luke had died Vader and Sidious would have been the only to force users left and both were on the darkside this would not have brought balance to the force, the force would only had been balanced by Sidious and Vader or Anakin killing each other.

[Ravshar]

It wouldn't have mattered if Yoda himself had trained Anakin. When one is destined to fall, they fall, there is no way to get around that. Obi-wan was not to blame for Anakin's fall it was the will of the force as Luke was also not to be praised for Anakin's Redemption as again it was the will of the force. Anakin was destined to be redeemed eventually as it was the only way to bring balance to the force. (EU withstanding) If you stop and think even if Luke had died Vader and Sidious would have been the only to force users left and both were on the darkside this would not have brought balance to the force, the force would only had been balanced by Sidious and Vader or Anakin killing each other.

 

You seem kinda wrong on alot of points.

 

Not sure I go for the whole "will of the force" type of stuff as an excuse. Even if i did that sounds like rubbish, cause the force is supose to be all good and stuff. The dark side is described as an aberation, a cancer on the universe NOT a true aspect of the force itself. Why would the force (being good) want Anakin to fall only to be redeemed? Especialy since all the bad stuff never would have happened if he hadn't fell in the first place.

 

Obi-wan wasn't anymore at fault though, than the council though. He obviously did his best. The council knew the risks involved with training him in the beggining, but seem to have forgotten towards the end. Ignoring his desire for power (to be on the council) and instead placing him in even more precarious position to spy on Palpatine.

 

Also, there were plenty of force users around besides Luke, Vader, and Sidious. The emporer had some working for him. Plenty elsewhere in the galaxy. Most were never trained as Jedi in the first place though. Remember that (while I dislike it, it seems to be what the writers meant) the idea of balance refered to in the prophecy is NO dark side users, not an equal number. Its supose to only be balanced if the dark side is virtually non-existant. This goes back to idea that the dark side is an aberation that isn't supose to exist.