TUXs Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 It was, honestly, like every other trip to Ilum on a Tuesday for me. I know several of my guildmates experienced the same thing. Helm of Graush server at about 9PM ET last night...Ilum 3 Hmmm...I'm also on HoG and I was in Ilum 2 from 7pm C until about 8:30. Between 7:30-8:00 Ilum 2 crashed and reloaded EVERYONE into Ilum 4 (upon reconnecting). That was when I had my 2nd 1v1 fight and received no credit...so your theory on kills capping for 'tags' doesn't seem to be the issue, but I do find it odd that you were in instance 3 having no issues, while tons of people in Ilum 2 were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 WHERE THE HELL DO YOU SEE THE FAST ANSWER HERE? CAUSE I DON'T SEE IT ANYWHERE. Very bad BioWare, very bad, but you will learn from your errors as soon as GW2 is out. First...GW2 makes lotro look manly. Second...have you ever had anything other than fast food? 24-48 hours for a fix is actually pretty quick in software. If you wanna leave because that wasn't fast enough for you, go for it...but this is perfectly acceptable imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khadroth Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 Hi everyone, I wanted to let you know that we will be deploying a patch tomorrow (details coming very soon) with the following resolutions: Killing players on Ilum will now consistently grant Valor and mission credit as intended. Once again, thank you for your patience. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daMarek Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 hi everyone, i wanted to let you know that we will be deploying a patch tomorrow (details coming very soon) with the following resolutions: killing players on ilum will now consistently grant valor and mission credit as intended. once again, thank you for your patience. what another downtime omg! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildcat Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 So, bets on what will break when they implement this? The bonus valor from kills? The objectives switching properly? Bags not being rewarded from the daily quest turn in? Who knows? Something in PVP breaks everytime they patch it. Warzone wins counted consistently until patch 1.1 when they split 50's off into their own bracket. Ilum kills counted consistently until they changed champion bags. Anyone want to speculate as to what they break in trying to fix kills counting towards dailies/weeklies? Or if this fix will even work? They've claimed 3-4 times to have fixed the warzone problem too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 First...GW2 makes lotro look manly. Second...have you ever had anything other than fast food? 24-48 hours for a fix is actually pretty quick in software. If you wanna leave because that wasn't fast enough for you, go for it...but this is perfectly acceptable imo. When you mess up on a live production system, 24-48 hours is not fast. At all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donaldus Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 Fast? Let me laugh... 1 or 2 hors after receiving the error report could be fast. 4 hours can be acceptable. After 8 hours you start wondering *** they are doing. 24 hours later is something like... "We want to lose subscribers faster than a lightsaber switches on". BUT 30 hours after receiving the problem, when there were more than 100 threads in the forums talking about the same issue, is TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE. (Don't forget you are paying to play and they are earning more than 15 million dollars every month just with the subscriptions) WHERE THE HELL DO YOU SEE THE FAST ANSWER HERE? CAUSE I DON'T SEE IT ANYWHERE. Very bad BioWare, very bad, but you will learn from your errors as soon as GW2 is out. Some people don't seem to understand what a massive undertaking it is to fix a bug as widespread as a whole world in SWTOR. There isn't a magic button in coding that says " hey, you screwed up here. please come fix me now." The reason why such bugs occur is that they did pass some kind of testing under certain circumstances. Having to go back through all of the code released for a patch and how it meshs with the actual game takes time. Realistically, you can't expect a quick response in a couple hours. Thats just being abusive to the deuggers at bioware Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaodon Posted February 8, 2012 Author Share Posted February 8, 2012 Fast? Let me laugh... 1 or 2 hors after receiving the error report could be fast. 4 hours can be acceptable. After 8 hours you start wondering *** they are doing. 24 hours later is something like... "We want to lose subscribers faster than a lightsaber switches on". BUT 30 hours after receiving the problem, when there were more than 100 threads in the forums talking about the same issue, is TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE. (Don't forget you are paying to play and they are earning more than 15 million dollars every month just with the subscriptions) WHERE THE HELL DO YOU SEE THE FAST ANSWER HERE? CAUSE I DON'T SEE IT ANYWHERE. Very bad BioWare, very bad, but you will learn from your errors as soon as GW2 is out. I started the thread at 2:52 PM. Dev responded at 5:35 PM. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=2607618#edit2607618 5:35 - 2:52 = 2 hrs 43 minutes to respond. Next day, 7:45, they announce an incoming fix. Elapsed time: 1 day, 4 hours 53 minutes Since you seem to have no knowledge of software development, and I have 26 years of experience, let me tell you that this was .... what's the word I'm looking for here .... fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esaru Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 Hi everyone, I wanted to let you know that we will be deploying a patch tomorrow (details coming very soon) with the following resolutions: Killing players on Ilum will now consistently grant Valor and mission credit as intended. Once again, thank you for your patience. Hotfix the main quest on Voss that's preventing me from progressing on my alt as well. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 (edited) I started the thread at 2:52 PM. Dev responded at 5:35 PM. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=2607618#edit2607618 5:35 - 2:52 = 2 hrs 43 minutes to respond. Next day, 7:45, they announce an incoming fix. Elapsed time: 1 day, 4 hours 53 minutes Since you seem to have no knowledge of software development, and I have 26 years of experience, let me tell you that this was .... what's the word I'm looking for here .... fast. One time, after a deployment, something broke on production. I got on-called by Ops, came online, and after an hour or so of investigation, figured out a workaround. After some quick testing and review (by quick I mean 30 minutes), it was pushed to production and then monitored for a few hours to confirm it fixed the problem. A bug was filed for a long term fix. Total turnaround time until fix: 3 hours. That's fast. This isn't fast. Edited February 8, 2012 by EternalFinality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okedo Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 Please remove the system notification that alerts that enemy in the PVP zone for daily / weekly comms. As it is the Imps camp central in large numbers and solos or small groups can't get anything done there. Open up the crates to be avail at each of the locations instead of just the central zone and don't tell the enemy that anyone is "spotted in the area". Because the gank squads sit out there all day swarming unsuspecting pvp'ers and there's nothing that we can do about it. UNBALANCED = NOT FUN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildcat Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 I've worked for a company that has a real Q/A testing department. IBM's. At a company like IBM, extreme flaws like this are never seen by the customer. They are found and fixed before an update goes out. I know, I was one of their testers. NO MMO publisher really does QA testing on patches. They compile it and test it to see if the client loads and runs. If it doesn't blue screen they pass it. That's a FAR cry from testing all functionality and doing regression testing on previous functions added. Like I said, all they would have had to do to catch this bug is take a couple groups to Ilum on a test server and try to do the daily mission and they would have seen it. It's not just Bioware who has this kind of shoddy operation, EVERY publisher, including Blizzard does things this way. Why? Because people don't punish them financially for doing it. They don't see having a proper Q/A testing department as making them any money. So they push the junk live and let the paying customers find the bugs. Like I said, most of our lead Devs came from SOE, which also followed this practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Organikal Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 I started the thread at 2:52 PM. Dev responded at 5:35 PM. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=2607618#edit2607618 5:35 - 2:52 = 2 hrs 43 minutes to respond. Next day, 7:45, they announce an incoming fix. Elapsed time: 1 day, 4 hours 53 minutes Since you seem to have no knowledge of software development, and I have 26 years of experience, let me tell you that this was .... what's the word I'm looking for here .... fast. ^ This... People don't realize the complexity of a game like this (in before you say how many kajillion dollars they are making and it should be fixed by Harry Potters wand) and how fixing this might require a scheduled maintenance rather than a hotfix. Most players are spoiled by WoW and how much of a masterpiece it is... but remember: it still has problems and is in no way perfect nor will it ever be. Relax, 1 part of the game is not working as intended but that doesn't mean you cannot play the rest of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NomadX Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 (edited) When you mess up on a live production system, 24-48 hours is not fast. At all. Agreed I work in a datacenter and trust me when our servers are down its worth millions of dollars in loss. The last thing you wanna do is **** up your prod. Why not backtracking to the last working version when the first posts appeared?? Edited February 8, 2012 by NomadX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildcat Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 (edited) Please remove the system notification that alerts that enemy in the PVP zone for daily / weekly comms. As it is the Imps camp central in large numbers and solos or small groups can't get anything done there. Open up the crates to be avail at each of the locations instead of just the central zone and don't tell the enemy that anyone is "spotted in the area". Because the gank squads sit out there all day swarming unsuspecting pvp'ers and there's nothing that we can do about it. UNBALANCED = NOT FUN Take the notifications out PERIOD. If we aren't going to see enemy players on the radar we shouldn't get red flashy notices. And it really gives the advantage to the side with superior numbers making hit and run raids basically pointless. This is one reason why Ilum is more a game of AFK "Red Rover Red Rover" instead of a real fight. The fact that the other side gets notification that you are heading north long before you've even got there means they will just have a gank squad there waiting for you. Which is why there is very little gang fighting and why everyone collects at one point rather than fighting at each node. It also probably adds to the FREQUENT lag spikes. Edited February 8, 2012 by Wildcat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nytak Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 (edited) deleted Edited February 8, 2012 by Nytak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaodon Posted February 8, 2012 Author Share Posted February 8, 2012 (edited) One time, after a deployment, something broke on production. I got on-called by Ops, came online, and after an hour or so of investigation, figured out a workaround. After some quick testing and review (by quick I mean 30 minutes), it was pushed to production and then monitored for a few hours to confirm it fixed the problem. A bug was filed for a long term fix. Total turnaround time until fix: 3 hours. That's fast. This isn't fast. Let me tell you about the software I manage, One time, after a deployment, something broke on production. I got a text message, came online, and after an hour or so of investigation, determined it was a Severity level 3 bug with no workaround (severity level 1 is system down, 2 is major bug). The next day, after some debugging and testing, it was pushed to QA for full testing. Day after that, it was deployed to production. Total turnaround time until fix: 2 days. That's fast for a fairly minor issue. This Ilum bug is a non-production-affecting issue. (low severity) - Quests weren't broken. - The servers didn't crash. - There was no exploit giving players millions of credits per second. It was a minor, inconsistent, not-always-reproducible bug, only on Ilum, only affecting PvP daily/weekly, and only bugging out randomly. Players found a workaround in some cases (logout/in or dying or swapping Ilum instances) within minutes. Patch was announced in 1 day 4 hours. For an MMORPG. That's fast. Edited February 8, 2012 by Zaodon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrtomie Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 There was no exploit giving players millions of credits per second. If only that came true :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marinesusmc Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 Sorry but I am not even having this issue at all I have gotten credit for all my kills so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenokane Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 Some people don't seem to understand what a massive undertaking it is to fix a bug as widespread as a whole world in SWTOR. There isn't a magic button in coding that says " hey, you screwed up here. please come fix me now." The reason why such bugs occur is that they did pass some kind of testing under certain circumstances. Having to go back through all of the code released for a patch and how it meshs with the actual game takes time. Realistically, you can't expect a quick response in a couple hours. Thats just being abusive to the deuggers at bioware It can't be that damn hard considering there about 1000+ quests int he game that count monster kills so i don't wanna hear BW's lame excuses because fact is this could of been fixed within 1-2hours, and *** are you guys even testing your patches THIS IS SOE all over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dranzen Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 Hi everyone, I wanted to let you know that we will be deploying a patch tomorrow (details coming very soon) with the following resolutions: Killing players on Ilum will now consistently grant Valor and mission credit as intended. Once again, thank you for your patience. So your doing a PVP fix for Ilum but ignoring the new PVE bug with Soa on every difficulty level - Pylons sometimes don't break Soa's shield and Soa has random agro in phase 3. Why not fix that bug also with one patch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 (edited) Most players are spoiled by WoW and how much of a masterpiece it is... but remember: it still has problems and is in no way perfect nor will it ever be. Yeah, we were spoiled because Blizzard actually took down the servers, hotfixed them, and ROLLED THEM BACK when bugs and exploits of this nature happened. Bioware just lets people keep whatever crap they can churn up during the bugged periods. It lets people get headaches and nausea from their terrible new UI flashy flash flash and doesn't think this deserves a full stop rollback either. This Ilum bug is a non-production-affecting issue. (low severity) - Quests weren't broken. - The servers didn't crash. - There was no exploit giving players millions of credits per second. All you've established is that you are incapable of determining the proper priority/severity of a bug. Quests were broken. The daily/weekly Ilum PvP quest WAS BROKEN. And as opposed to an exploit giving people too much rewards, people were getting too few (or no) rewards. This will cause far more outcry than one that gives too much. This was a production issue and should have been treated as such. But hell, Bioware didn't even think the spawn camping the day after Ilum 1.1 was a production issue, so you're obviously just as clueless about it as Bioware is. Edited February 8, 2012 by EternalFinality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaodon Posted February 8, 2012 Author Share Posted February 8, 2012 All you've established is that you are incapable of determining the proper priority/severity of a bug. Severity 1: System down/inaccessible (in this case, system means the entire SWTOR Server) Severity 2: One feature of system not functioning (Example, quests (all of them!) not working, vendors (all of them) not working, crafting (all crafting) not working. Severity 3: One aspect of a feature of system not functioning properly, or failing intermittently. (Example, kills in Ilum intermittently not counting for PvP daily/weekly quest) Severity 4: One extremely minor issue, such as quest text mispelling, wrong skin on an avatar (naked Companions), etc.) You CLEARLY do not know the difference between a Severity 1, a Severity 2 and a Severity 3. The Ilum bug was Severity 3, or possibly 2 if it was not as intermittent as people proclaimed. It definitely, positively, absolutely was NO WHERE NEAR a Severity 1. Yet, it was communicated in 1day 4 hours that a patch to fix it was imminent. THAT IS FAST. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattus Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 So your doing a PVP fix for Ilum but ignoring the new PVE bug with Soa on every difficulty level - Pylons sometimes don't break Soa's shield and Soa has random agro in phase 3. Why not fix that bug also with one patch? The Ilum bug affects everyone who PVPs. At least with SOA you can do Karagga's instead, or EV up to SOA. By the way, before you say at least we can WZ, there are serious bugs there too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wangchi Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 I say roll everyone back to level 10, so everyone has a equal start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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