Involuntarily flagged for PvP as a 32 by a 50 on a PvE server.

[DevonDs]

They understand it. The issue is that it is totally unacceptable to most pve players. Given the stealth abilities and intentional interference in clearly pve intent of unflagged players, the current rules will result in many players avoiding shared quest areas or simply quitting.

 

I could live with it being a once a year accident, but it sounds like a much more common event (bored pvp players?)

 

Swtor appeals to a much more single player or co-op game player. BW will need to be carefully to not force pvp on unintentional players. Every mmo has eventually given the player a way to fully disable pvp.

 

I've been a strong supporter of this game, however this is a horrible problem and one that could stop me from playing. I hate bullies, and these gankpredetors abusing the rules on pve servers are unconionable. If you enjoy ruining other peoples day...join a pvp server. If your idea of fun is defeating someone that has no chance of beating you.....join a pvp server......if your style of combat is running in circles and jumping,......join a pvp server.

 

The devs need to look at this and make a public statement....if this is within the intended rules then maybe I need to unsubscribe....if it is an exploit then warnings quickly follows by permabans or expulsions and banishment from ever being on a pve server.

[SJackson]

"You should also not flag for PVP if you buff someone from your same faction who is flagged."

(Sorry, I screwed up with the quote system)

 

I wholeheartedly agree. It's happened to me a few times. Running around some world with my Commando, I see someone with low health. I don't catch the difference in their name color showing that they're PVP in time and I heal them, being the nice guy that I am. Then I'm flagged.

 

Luckily, I haven't been anywhere where that is a problem yet and I've had no problems turning it off. But it is a little annoying.

Edited January 26, 2012 by SJackson
Screwed up the quote system

[terminova]

Incorrect. PvP servers are constant, always on PvP. PvE servers are toggled, either mainually, or by taking action that affects another flagged player.

 

You got zinged by someone who knows how to trick you into flagging yourself. It's not an exploit, because it's working as intended.

 

The thing to do here is avoid AoE if you think someone is going to try to involuntarily flag you, or go somewhere else until the other guy gets bored and moves on.

 

This is the same system nearly every other MMO has. It's fairly easy to avoid being tricked if you're paying attention to what's going on around you.

 

It is an exploit of the AoE mechanic to auto-flag someone who didn't intend to attack a flagged player in the first place and never targeted them.

 

Exploit: 2. To make use of selfishly or unethically

 

What these players are doing is selfish and unethical considering it's a PvE server and the players they are harassing are not intentionally flagging themselves.

[SJackson]

One of my favorite activities is jumping into the aoe of Empire players and then just standing there watching them after they get flagged.

 

They start to get paranoid, and sometimes even attack me. Then it's self defense.

 

ROFLMAO... I'm not sure I can quite agree with this attitude, but at least you leave it up to the opposing player. I can picture this happening and it is funny.

[Ateius]

At this point and time, with so many voices speaking out against this, Bioware's silence is either a sign of quiet duplicity (concerning the terms of PvE) or incompetence (with regard to customer relations). Please, Bioware, I don't like posting into threads either. I guess, you could say, we are both pretty shy. But, see, I did it, and it's not even my job. Did it for free. You can do it Bioware. Hands on the home keys like they taught you in school and type. Edited January 26, 2012 by Ateius

[terminova]

It still would be in zone specified for PvP, and no where else.

 

Why would you want a PvE flag anywhere else on a PvE server anyway?

 

Why ask pointless questions?

 

Players that want to open world PVP should be on a PVP server, no exception. PVE server is for Player v. Environment, not PVP. It is stupid to have a PVP flag on a PVP server.

 

No, players that want to constantly get ganked while leveling and/or gank others who are leveling/otherwise engaged with mobs should play on PvP servers.

 

I'm going to assume you don't proofread your posts before hitting submit, either of you.

[kevlarto]

It's griefing.

 

yep, they run to get flagged, it is no accident, the level 50 most likely lacks the skill to fight on his level so he looks for lowbies, to gank it's sad on PVE server, has not happened to me on my lowbie yet, but if it does I will go get my level 50 and see how the griefer likes the shoe on the other foot..insert evil laugh..

[Chessack]

The way I see it, the only people that would be inconvenienced by the removal of this feature are griefers. I haven't seen anyone post another reason why they require it.

 

This. ^^^

 

Who other than someone trying to deliberately drag unsuspecting PVE players into a PVP gank-fest would WANT there to exist any code whatsoever that would allow that to happen?

[xGrinchy]

Exactly the same thing happened to me. Twice. So I couldn't continue my quest and had to do other other stuff until the griefer went away.

I don't like this system. No sir.

[Amenian]

Most MMOs initially had their flag mechanics work like this. WoW did. Rift did in Beta. The uproar from the community eventually became so great that they were forced to change their flag mechanics to the more sensible ones they have now. I'm shocked Bioware fell into the trap of allowing this mechanic to go live with so much evidence against it in prior mmos.

[Derbefrier]

Was that fragment of a sentence meant to convey a complete thought?

 

 

it was a star wars reference......

[EternalFinality]

ROFLMAO... I'm not sure I can quite agree with this attitude, but at least you leave it up to the opposing player. I can picture this happening and it is funny.

 

Exactly. Changing this behavior would ruin my ability to do this and have fun, which is not griefing at all. So don't think I have no stake in it.

 

I could live with it being a once a year accident, but it sounds like a much more common event (bored pvp players?)

 

Of course it's a once in a year accident, they're vastly overstating the frequency of a stealth class getting in their aoe unnoticed. It happened to one person once and now it's a BIG DEAL to everyone!

[Renzetsu]

think about it this way.. he's a level 50 and your way way down. it just shows how insecure he is and needs some outlet to let out all those insecurities and it just so happens that he thought killing players way lower than him makes him cool and powerful.

 

so instead of nerd raging.. just pat the level 50 in the head and say "that's okay child we all have insecurities once in a while"

[VorpalK]

think about it this way.. he's a level 50 and your way way down. it just shows how insecure he is and needs some outlet to let out all those insecurities and it just so happens that he thought killing players way lower than him makes him cool and powerful.

 

so instead of nerd raging.. just pat the level 50 in the head and say "that's okay child we all have insecurities once in a while"

 

And I don't want someone like that interfering with my game.

[Khyler]

But you don't get to do whatever you want in the game just because you paid $15. Bioware decides what you can and cannot do to other players. And they have decided that AOE flags for PvP.

 

That's the problem here. Bioware SAID that PvE was "consent only", and it isn't. So they told him he was buying Product-A, but gave him Product-B. Now, If you paid for a Mercedes and I gave you a Pinto, you wouldn't be too happy with the product now, would you?

[EternalFinality]

That's the problem here. Bioware SAID that PvE was "consent only", and it isn't. So they told him he was buying Product-A, but gave him Product-B. Now, If you paid for a Mercedes and I gave you a Pinto, you wouldn't be too happy with the product now, would you?

 

I'll repeat:

 

By AOEing and hitting someone, you gave consent, same as if you targeted them with a direct attack. You are attacking a flagged player.

[Mephane]

I'll repeat:

 

By AOEing and hitting someone, you gave consent, same as if you targeted them with a direct attack. You are attacking a flagged player.

 

I'll repeat: The OP was Aoe'ing a group of mobs, and only then did the PvP-flagged 50 run into his AoE. Never did the OP intentionally or even knowingly attack the 50 with his AoE.

 

The point is, That Other Game had this same problem until they simply deactivated PvP-autoflagging from AoE. Ever since then, only targetting a flagged enemy player and using a targetted attack on them would flag you, as the same type of grieving that happened to the OP was a problem there, too.

[Ageizm]

I was working on the bonus series on Nar Shaddaa on my level 32 character at the time. The bonus quests that take you into the Shared area with Imperials. I think nothing of it, I'm not flagged.

 

Attack a group of mobs, and just as I'm about to do an AoE burst, a level 50 jump in tags one just before my AoE damage ticks flagging the mob to him, so when my damage hits, I'm flagged also.

 

I rolled on a PvE server to avoid stuff like this. I don't mind PvP, but I'm not interesting in Open World all the time. Most of my characters are on PvE servers, and that is what I expected, PvE unless I voluntarily decide to PvP. That did not occur here.

 

There is no PvP buff for it to balance it out some either.

 

 

 

Again I rolled on PvE server expecting not to have to deal with this. That is what the PvE and PvP server difference was for. But seems there are some ways to exploit that.

 

 

This is a a complete and total lie!!!!

[Greyfeld]

Most MMOs initially had their flag mechanics work like this. WoW did. Rift did in Beta. The uproar from the community eventually became so great that they were forced to change their flag mechanics to the more sensible ones they have now. I'm shocked Bioware fell into the trap of allowing this mechanic to go live with so much evidence against it in prior mmos.

 

lol I'm not. Have you seen the state of Ilum? If anything, Bioware has already begun crafting a track record of completely botching pvp content.

[Sapphireshadow]

Poping my head in to see if there has been a dev response yet. Moderators have obviously seen this since similar threads are being redirected to this one so its only a matter of time till a response happens.

 

Sooner is better than later by the way. Even a moderator just stating that this issue has been brought to the appropriate attention would make me feel at least a tiny bit better.

[justadude]

lol I'm not. Have you seen the state of Ilum? If anything, Bioware has already begun crafting a track record of completely botching pvp content.

 

Its really weird too. Bioware was in such a rush to copy WoW systems you would think they might have gotten some of it right, but it seems that they only got the WoW game mechanics right that actually could have used innovation and changing (ie crafting as a credit sink, lack of customization options, gear based economy...)

[VarnieTsk]

Exactly. Changing this behavior would ruin my ability to do this and have fun, which is not griefing at all. So don't think I have no stake in it.

 

Thanks for confirming it. I kinda figured you were one of the griefers with a stake in it. And yes it is griefing when you ruin someones day and ruin their entire experience thereafter because of having to watch out for the likes of you all the time, just for your petty entertainment at their expense. Pretty sad to think otherwise, really.

 

Of course it's a once in a year accident, they're vastly overstating the frequency of a stealth class getting in their aoe unnoticed. It happened to one person once and now it's a BIG DEAL to everyone!

 

Nice try. Sorry, read through all the posts on all 5 of the biggest threads on this and you'll see it's more than once a year. And I doubt very much that ALL of the incidents happening are being posted about here on the boards.

 

If it really was only once a year, then changing it sure wouldn't impact your game very much now would it?

 

This is a flawed mechanic that needs to be changed.

Edited January 26, 2012 by VarnieTsk

[VarnieTsk]

This is a a complete and total lie!!!!

 

Really? Were you there? Are you the griefer who did it and is now defending himself? And why the mad face? Did he hit a nerve? Care to elaborate?

 

Considering that this seems to be happening to a lot of people, I would tend to believe the OP over a one-liner saying "That's a lie."

[VarnieTsk]

think about it this way.. he's a level 50 and your way way down. it just shows how insecure he is and needs some outlet to let out all those insecurities and it just so happens that he thought killing players way lower than him makes him cool and powerful.

 

so instead of nerd raging.. just pat the level 50 in the head and say "that's okay child we all have insecurities once in a while"

 

Sigh. So you've either not read the posts or you're being deliberately obtuse, because you obviously have no clue just how this impacts people and/or just don't care.

 

It is not just the one incident that has an impact. It is the fact that people have to change their playstyle in order to avoid it. That is not the way it should be and we want it changed.

 

Just because we know the griefer is a lowlife loser doesn't mean we have to let him continue getting his jollies at our expense.

[Valkirus]

Sigh. So you've either not read the posts or you're being deliberately obtuse, because you obviously have no clue just how this impacts people and/or just don't care.

 

It is not just the one incident that has an impact. It is the fact that people have to change their playstyle in order to avoid it. That is not the way it should be and we want it changed.

 

Just because we know the griefer is a lowlife loser doesn't mean we have to let him continue getting his jollies at our expense.

 

Good points. To say I have to watch using one of my aoe skills on multiple mobs just because some jerk is close to me flagged, is crazy. This should not be a issue on a PVE server. Last night..when getting off a tram ride in Corellia, I accidently hit a yellow colored npc and then had to kill him. And what is puzzling is, I am not sure why I hit him. This should'nt be happening.