Enako Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 guess what happened in WoW if you frost nova/thunderstorm/consecrate etc on a PvE server standing next to a flagged player of the opposite faction??? so then, because it has happened so in wow, it has to happen like that here too ? are you aware that, this is NOT wow ? and wow is not 'the' game that everyone should be subservient to ? again, this is NOT wow, and things do not need to happen how they happen in wow. If you weren't whining about this in WoW, you shouldn't be whining about it in TOR. It's fairly standard. why should i give a crap about how things were in wow ? and, take your 'whining' termage back to wow pvp forums. this is not wow. and such wordage is not well received here. you may get reported. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sotaudi Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Personally, I don't think you should be given the option. It sounds like Rift is the game for you! Sounds like a PvP server is for you. Of course, if you did that, you couldn't gank people who don't wish to PvP. Grow up a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VorpalK Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Bioware, it is long past time you give us some indication of your intent here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) Not the same thing and you know it. Methinks you're just being deliberately contrary for the giggles and laughs. Like I said, this issue doesn't impact your gameplay so there's no way you'll ever consider it an issue. You don't PvP, how would you know how frustrating CC is or what it does? Edited January 25, 2012 by EternalFinality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) Bioware, it is long past time you give us some indication of your intent here. I'm still wondering why anyone wants the ability to flag on a PvE server (unless they like to gank if the oppertunity arises). And how this could be possible in LOTRO as it only has 1 zone with monsterplay and you're auto-flagged in it? Edited January 25, 2012 by Goretzu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedistreen Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Just get stronger and learn how to fight and go kill him. Problem solved. that level 50 will have gear, ability, and talent point advantage. Problem NOT solved. You're also forgetting that the bolster mechanic won't work in the open world. So while his level 32 grenade hits for 300 damage, the lvl 50 will be critting for 4k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Really? Could you provide a developer statement that says that? Can you show a single developer post commenting on this topic at all, let alone saying it is working as intended? You can't. However, what you can find in this very thread a quote from Bioware stating that PvP on a PvE server must be mutually consented to. Inadvertently catching a flagged player in an AoE is not consent by any stretch of the imagination. It is a flaw in the code that allows a player to be dragged into unconsentual PvP in direct contradiction to Bioware's own statement that PvP is mutually consented on PvE servers. That means that this is a bug, not a "decision" on Bioware's part. Imagine that! A bug in a new game causing an unintended result. Call the press boys! News at 11! You're just speculating. You have no idea whether or not Bioware intends this mechanic and you can't prove otherwise. Other MMOs have PvE servers which follow this mechanic, some not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VarnieTsk Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 You don't PvP, how would you know how frustrating CC is or what it does? LOL ok, I'll give you that one. I notice you left out the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Sounds like a PvP server is for you. Of course, if you did that, you couldn't gank people who don't wish to PvP. Grow up a little. I liked the part when you assumed that I gank people who don't want to participate in PvP. Which I don't. It's always an "us vs them" to you, isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldartank Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I hope it is true, but on another forum that I visit that has a general gaming section, one of the posters their stated they got a 24 hour ban for exploiting. He said that he would wait for people to start doing their aoe's and he would enter them while stealthed to force the other player to PvP flag and he would kill him. He said Bioware told him it was an exploit, he didn't listen to the first warning, so he kept on doing it till he got the 24 hour ban. I know I will report anyone who uses this exploit. I did not join a PvE server to have to change my way of playing to account for PvP. I did not join a PvE server so that I have to keep watching my back from other players wanting to gank me. I play on Kath Hound, a RP/PVE server. The reason I'm on a PVE server is because I DON'T want to do PVP, and it's rediculous that some cowardly dirtbag who could never win a real PVP fight has to take his level 50 character into lower leve zones and use a sleazy exploit to gank lower level characters who DON'T WANT to do PVP. So far, I haven't gotten any of my characters out of Taris yet. But, having seen this and other similar threads, and having seen the above post, I will most definitely report anyone who pulls that cheap exploit on me to force me into PVP and gank me. This "get over it/don't use aoe" crap is just a cheap excuse to justify griefing other players. It is beyond moronic to suggest that I should have to adjust my playing style on a PVE server to accomodate inept dishonest gankers who are too cowardly to actually go on a PVP server. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I play on Kath Hound, a RP/PVE server. The reason I'm on a PVE server is because I DON'T want to do PVP, and it's rediculous that some cowardly dirtbag who could never win a real PVP fight has to take his level 50 character into lower leve zones and use a sleazy exploit to gank lower level characters who DON'T WANT to do PVP. So far, I haven't gotten any of my characters out of Taris yet. But, having seen this and other similar threads, and having seen the above post, I will most definitely report anyone who pulls that cheap exploit on me to force me into PVP and gank me. This "get over it/don't use aoe" crap is just a cheap excuse to justify griefing other players. It is beyond moronic to suggest that I should have to adjust my playing style on a PVE server to accomodate inept dishonest gankers who are too cowardly to actually go on a PVP server. It's ridiculous as well. Removing the PvP flag entirely from PvE servers solves this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chton Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Still no response... So what would you conclude from that? WAI apparently. Not saying I agree with it but the deafening silence seems pretty clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chton Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I play on Kath Hound, a RP/PVE server. The reason I'm on a PVE server is because I DON'T want to do PVP, and it's rediculous that some cowardly dirtbag who could never win a real PVP fight has to take his level 50 character into lower leve zones and use a sleazy exploit to gank lower level characters who DON'T WANT to do PVP. So far, I haven't gotten any of my characters out of Taris yet. But, having seen this and other similar threads, and having seen the above post, I will most definitely report anyone who pulls that cheap exploit on me to force me into PVP and gank me. This "get over it/don't use aoe" crap is just a cheap excuse to justify griefing other players. It is beyond moronic to suggest that I should have to adjust my playing style on a PVE server to accomodate inept dishonest gankers who are too cowardly to actually go on a PVP server. Hear hear from someone who's cowardly enough to play on a PVE server. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palenen Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 IF you like dueling IF you like player vs. player of anything Then all reasoning that these players can do to justify PvP on a PvE server can be thrown out the window. The whole point of rolling on a PvE server is to NOT PARTAKE in PvP. Unless of course it's their choice to do so. Just another flawed design to make people unsubscribe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cavegeta Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 This explains what happened to me the other day. Saw a same faction player get in trouble with an npc strong mob and decided to help out. Got flagged for my troubles. I don't believe it was intentional on his part as I just went on about my business and so did he (I only noticed the flag a few seconds later). As others have said, if it's intentional they need to change the pve description. If it's not they need to fix it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siorac Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 You're just speculating. You have no idea whether or not Bioware intends this mechanic and you can't prove otherwise. Other MMOs have PvE servers which follow this mechanic, some not. "The biggest distinction between PvE and PvP servers is that all player to player combat is consensual on a PvE server." That is how the GAME describes PvE servers. Hitting a stealthed, flagged enemy player with AoE isn't "consensual PvP combat". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racsofp Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Remember, if you're not a Carebear, then you must be a Psychopath. Hey now...I'm not a carebear or a psychopath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VarnieTsk Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 So what would you conclude from that? WAI apparently. Not saying I agree with it but the deafening silence seems pretty clear. I have to agree. Their silence is speaking volumes. Sad really. I like everything else about the game, but this is one particular issue that I absolutely refuse to deal with in any game. I don't buy games with forced-pvp and I don't appreciate being led to believe this game had none. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sotaudi Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) You don't PvP, how would you know how frustrating CC is or what it does? First, since CC is not limited to the PvP world, being CC'ed is a universal experience. Being kept out of a fight is frustrating whether you are trying to kill a Boss or another player. Second, the last I checked, there are no PvCC or non-PvCC servers. There are no statements from Bioware stating that, in a PvP fight, CC is completely voluntary. CC is a game mechanic that is working as intended and, in fact, is scaled down for PvP. Since virtually every class, if not every class, has some sort of CC, you have no right not to expect to be CC'ed in PvP, no matter how frustrating it is. By contrast, if someone rolls on a PvE server whose rules set specifically states that PvP must be consented to, that person has an absolute right to assume he will not be dragged into PvP unless he consents to it. When you chose a PvE server over a PvP one, it is specifically to avoid being dragged into PvP. It is utterly absurd to compare the level of frustration about a valid mechanic that is working as intended and is even weakened by the PvP mechanics to a broken mechanic that violates the intent of the rules set. Edited January 25, 2012 by Sotaudi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lasarith Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 While not the Same Thing, and this was Several weeks ago now, On Tatooine my jedi was hovering past a sith (exploring at the time) i get an invite to duel him, i click okay, i Preceed to kick his ***, in about 10 seconds, i win the duel - And here the thing i was level 34 he was level 32 (2 level diffrence) Only 2 levels in real world -not warzones -so id hate to see a level 50 v a level 32 duel or Griffer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 I have to agree. Their silence is speaking volumes. Sad really. I like everything else about the game, but this is one particular issue that I absolutely refuse to deal with in any game. I don't buy games with forced-pvp and I don't appreciate being led to believe this game had none. Still not sure how you got around that in LOTRO in the monsterplay zone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VarnieTsk Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Still not sure how you got around that in LOTRO in the monsterplay zone? Simple. I don't play monsterplay. So, as I said, ZERO issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Simple. I don't play monsterplay. So, as I said, ZERO issues. Yeah but that's the only zone in LOTRO where you can have any sort of PvP at all (PvM there). Much like my suggestion would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sotaudi Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) You're just speculating. You have no idea whether or not Bioware intends this mechanic and you can't prove otherwise. Other MMOs have PvE servers which follow this mechanic, some not. I am not speculating. Let me state it again. Bioware specifically states that PvP on PvE servers must be consensual. You can find this description on any PvE server on the server selection screen. Unless you can explain how someone inadvertently or intentionally getting hit by an AoE you fired at a PvE mob, especially if said person was stealthed and unable to be seen, constitutes "consent," I would be glad to hear it. It is not speculation. They have stated that PvP on a PvE server is consensual. Being dragged into PvP by a flawed targeting mechanic is not consensual by any definition. Even if that were not the case, someone earlier reported that someone got a 24 hour ban for exploiting this mechanic. That is pretty clearly a statement of intent on Bioware's part. Edited January 25, 2012 by Sotaudi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VarnieTsk Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Yeah but that's the only zone in LOTRO where you can have any sort of PvP at all (PvM there). Much like my suggestion would be. Exactly. That zone is for PvP. I don't want to PvP. So I never play that zone. And in the reamainder of the game, ZERO issues of a PvP nature. And in SWTOR I rolled on a PvE server because they said it would be PvP by consent of both parties only. Yet Bioware has not only given people the ability to PvP on a PvE server, they've given them the ability to drag anyone else into it whenever they choose, regardless of the wishes of the person they're dragging into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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