For those saying Juggernaut DPS suck in pvp, I present exhibit A:

[MurseSteve]

http://imgur.com/yK2SP

 

This is my game, solo queue in a pug, with no pocket healer as vengeance spec.

 

I am particularly good at pvp in mmo's and my opponents may not have been the best. But at level 24 I dominated the competition.

 

Juggernaut's take skill to play well in pvp as it is not mindless face-rolling on the keyboard to get kills. However, played well, you can see they clearly are wrecking balls.

 

Tyrius

[Berronaxftw]

wow you stomped a bunch of lvl10-25's gz.

[Evin]

wow you stomped a bunch of lvl10-25's gz.

 

yeh.. except that he's 24 and you can't tell what level the others have.

 

So still good.

[Soonerjohn]

lol, I like how you are the only warrior in the game. That says something.

 

I don't disagree that Juggs can do dps, but you were getting heals. You were the only melee on your team, a team that put well over 400k of healing out.

[Dreadspectre]

1. Pocket heals.

 

2. I don't think anyone here thinks that our DPS is "suck" it's just that all the ranged classes do as much damage or more than we do, at range and with barely less survivability than us.

 

And don't try and tell me you didn't have constant heals, melee always get *****tomped on because were easiest to target, and being the only SW on your team in that match I can almost certainly say you were going to be targeted.

 

Edit: In response to the post above me there are games when I'm the only SW, then there are huttballs where there is literally 8-10 SW's in the match heh.

Edited January 2, 2012 by Dreadspectre

[steinsgate]

Anecdotal evidence. Therefore, absolute truth.

 

The end.

[derfnose]

I seem to be one of 2 or 3 in Hutt ball...and never get a chance to even attempt to dps due to running the ball.

 

As the others have said, your team seemed to bust out a lot of heals, so dont play all *********** ****** with "no pocket healer".

 

On average, i get 50k-80k damage a game while playing the *********** objective. thats nothing seeing as how everyone else can watch a movie while knocking out 180k+...so yes, our dps is *********** **** compared to everyone else.

[VandredTOR]

1. Pocket heals.

 

2. I don't think anyone here thinks that our DPS is "suck" it's just that all the ranged classes do as much damage or more than we do, at range and with barely less survivability than us.

 

 

Ding ding ding! We have a winner. This is it, but more to it.

 

If you are DPS spec, you can do DPS. But, you have LESS survivability than most of the ranged classes. They have all kinds of absorbs, stuns, knockbacks, etc.

[blackcerberus]

http://imgur.com/yK2SP

 

This is my game, solo queue in a pug, with no pocket healer as vengeance spec.

 

I am particularly good at pvp in mmo's and my opponents may not have been the best. But at level 24 I dominated the competition.

 

Juggernaut's take skill to play well in pvp as it is not mindless face-rolling on the keyboard to get kills. However, played well, you can see they clearly are wrecking balls.

 

Tyrius

 

BHs Agents and Inqs easily break the 450k barrier, in worse teams, against better players, without pocket healers, and die less

 

if you are a wrecking ball, what are they then? death stars?

 

 

it all boils down to what you compare yourself to. compared to trash NPCs, SWs are gods. compared to the other 3 classes, SWs suck.

Edited January 2, 2012 by blackcerberus

[Maintain]

1. Pocket heals.

 

2. I don't think anyone here thinks that our DPS is "suck" it's just that all the ranged classes do as much damage or more than we do, at range and with barely less survivability than us.

 

And don't try and tell me you didn't have constant heals, melee always get *****tomped on because were easiest to target, and being the only SW on your team in that match I can almost certainly say you were going to be targeted.

 

Edit: In response to the post above me there are games when I'm the only SW, then there are huttballs where there is literally 8-10 SW's in the match heh.

 

I don't ever have heals and still manage to pull around 200k+ each match. Just need to constantly be on your best.

 

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l591/criticision/Screenshot_2011-12-29_21_56_48_967997.jpg

[Dreadspectre]

I don't ever have heals and still manage to pull around 200k+ each match. Just need to constantly be on your best.

 

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l591/criticision/Screenshot_2011-12-29_21_56_48_967997.jpg

 

You have a guy with 200k healing on your team, I'm sure you didn't get any of those. You also lost, and having 200k damage in a Huttball probably means you didn't do crap for trying to actually win this match via objectives. I know my damage suffers because I'm too busy gettin h osed because I pick up the ball and get hosed constantly while I yell at people to get ahead of me for passes. It's not hard to put up big numbers when you play deathmatch mode.

[Kolbenito]

I top KBs and damage done as well as lowest deaths in this other mmo against bads in bgs, doesnt mean people are knocking down my door to be on their arena team or dps their raids.

 

If you are having fun though that is all that matters. Juggs and Guardians will be better off after some tweaks when it comes around.

[DropDeadFred]

Look at how much healing you had on that team. LoL. A trooper can pull 300k all day, he's ranged and never dies. (I have 44 commando). If this is your best game it only proves the point.

[dargor-]

ITT op max'd out his gear and got lucky in a random instance

 

Tell the masses of people who disagree that they MUST be wrong, OP has proven beyond doubt, that the class is just fine. It obviously had nothing to do with the rest of his team vs the rest fo their team. It was all him.

 

 

/sarcasm

Edited January 4, 2012 by dargor-

[Xorak]

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/818/juggdpsproof.jpg/

 

No pocket healer and no use of sweeping strikes and only used a couple smashes.

[Durio]

Why are some people so eager to try stopping BW from buffing juggernauts?

[PestisX]

Pulling 200k in the longest warzone with constant clustered fighting and excellent healing isn't impressive at all. If anything, your victory is an indication of what you can do with good healing and teamwork in spite of weak DPS.

[Xorak]

Pulling 200k in the longest warzone with constant clustered fighting and excellent healing isn't impressive at all. If anything, your victory is an indication of what you can do with good healing and teamwork in spite of weak DPS.

 

The most healing done on my team was 13k id say that's pretty crap healing. Clustered fighting would be better for damage if I abused smash but I can count the number of smashes I use per war zone on one hand.

[Noth]

The most healing done on my team was 13k id say that's pretty crap healing. Clustered fighting would be better for damage if I abused smash but I can count the number of smashes I use per war zone on one hand.

 

Let me use another analogy for what I've been saying this entire time.

 

You can polish poop.

 

What do I mean by this? A good player can make a bad class seem god-like. It does not mean the class is fine, simply that the player is good.

[Xorak]

Let me use another analogy for what I've been saying this entire time.

 

You can polish poop.

 

What do I mean by this? A good player can make a bad class seem god-like. It does not mean the class is fine, simply that the player is good.

 

LMAO thanks for the compliment

[Lord_Rezo]

Are you guys seriously?

 

You consider 200k good dps? Lets make a simple math...

 

If a good played Juggernaut does 200k (my best was 215k following objectives at Huttaball, a great victory).

 

A good Bounty Hunter does...: -> CLICK HERE <-

[Lord_Itharius]

1. Pocket heals.

 

Congratulations, you identified the reason why Juggernauts can facestomp in PvP.

 

Juggs are good in PvP exactly because they're very survivable while dishing out tons of burst damage. A concealment operative or sorcerer will NOT do as well as a rage or vengeance jugg in PvP with pocket heals because they can be easily focused due to their limited survivability. Juggs can't be easily focused, even as vengeance spec, due to high armor mitigation and cooldowns.

 

I solo pvp-geared lvl 50 sorcs in my sleep. Haven't any of you guys played Arms Warriors in the latest WoW build? Juggernauts are virtually the same thing in regards to survivability, mobility, and burst, except they can also reduce other players' damage by taunting and have more utility.

 

- lvl 50 jugg in full champion and columni.

 

Btw, if you need additional e-peen evidence, I've gone Immortal with 28-0 in a game of alderaan, and this is with 20 fps and massive input lag, and without pocket heals (yay biochem).

Edited January 4, 2012 by Lord_Itharius

[Lord_Itharius]

BHs Agents and Inqs easily break the 450k barrier, in worse teams, against better players, without pocket healers, and die less

 

No, they can't. Stop lying, I've only seen anyone break the 450k dmg mark on one occasion, and it was a concealment operative in full PvP epics in a game in which the other team was entirely low level players, in a super long game of voidstar.

 

I swear, these forums are 100x worse than the WoW forums.

Edited January 4, 2012 by Lord_Itharius

[Dreadspectre]

Congratulations, you identified the reason why Juggernauts can facestomp in PvP.

 

Juggs are good in PvP exactly because they're very survivable while dishing out tons of burst damage. A concealment operative or sorcerer will NOT do as well as a rage or vengeance jugg in PvP with pocket heals because they can be easily focused due to their limited survivability. Juggs can't be easily focused, even as vengeance spec, due to high armor mitigation and cooldowns.

 

I solo pvp-geared lvl 50 sorcs in my sleep. Haven't any of you guys played Arms Warriors in the latest WoW build? Juggernauts are virtually the same thing in regards to survivability, mobility, and burst, except they can also reduce other players' damage by taunting and have more utility.

 

- lvl 50 jugg in full champion and columni.

 

Btw, if you need additional e-peen evidence, I've gone Immortal with 28-0 in a game of alderaan, and this is with 20 fps and massive input lag, and without pocket heals (yay biochem).

 

Gear makes up for a lot of issues, wait until the rest of the players on your server catch up to your overly geared self and check again.

 

Also I already know you're not that great because everyone in the world agreed that, while not terrible, Arms warriors were junk as recent as last season which JUST ended. There was hardly any Warrior's in 2's or 3's in the top spots. After they linked intercept/charge they were laughably easy to kite if you had half a brain. I say this having playing as one and playing against them. My Enhance Shaman and FIRE Mage laughed at Warriors all day and neither of those were considered good PvP/Arena specs(enhance is especially frowned on.)

 

 

As far as soloing "pvp geared sorcs in your sleep" those must be the absolute worst sorcs in the world. I'm not saying a Jugg can't ever beat a sorc, but the amount of tools they have for control vs. our control/gap closer we are at a disadvantage. And we do not have high mitigation, we get about 30-33% which isn't that great. And what awesome CD's do we have? Saber Ward? Endure Pain? Pfft, I've jumped into Soresu form, popped both and STILL get burned down in 8-10 seconds depending on who was looking at me(granted not 50 yet so maybe it changes dramatically.)

 

I digress, everyone has those "god mode" matches, it doesn't mean the class is fine.

Edited January 4, 2012 by Dreadspectre

[Afaramas]

I'm completely tank specced, so I don't really concern myself with the DPS we deal, outside the fact I can't use my main DPS skills like Savage Kick. I didn't roll a Jugg to DPS, that would be absurd, I rolled it to tank.

My main problem in PVP though is that I don't have way more survivability than other DPS classes. My spec should give me that but it doesn't, I'm usually near the top of the deaths table in all WFs and I die pretty easily even to lower levels who of course because of boost have the smae hp as me, making me stacking end a bit pointless for PVP pre 50 anyway.