When they nerf marauders, and I (a marauder) still destroy all the terrible players in this game...that will be the best marauder joke ever. They could reduce my damage 25-30% across the board, and I'd still beat 90% of the current PvP population on my server.

2 second stun will have minimal impact on the resolve bar, I am sure. I mean...I guess if 3 juggs leap to the same person it might matter. There are so many people spamming sleeps, stuns and knockbacks now...I don't think this will change a whole lot.

Huh? You get a 2 second stun for free...no spec required, and that's a nerf? What am I missing?

I don't want you guys nerfed to where you are lolfaceroll. You should be able to do just as much damage as I can, if spec'd properly for it. What I do want, is that you have to do more than stand in one spot @ 30m, hit 3 buttons and do 300k+ damage. Please don't try to tell me it takes more than a few buttons either to put out DPS. I attack you guys constantly and see what abilities are being used. You should have to actually do some work for it. You know...move around, combine abilities, monitor cool downs, monitor resource usage, etc. Right now, you absolutely do not have to do any of this to put out decent DPS. Signed, Marauder. P.S. Marauder did not really get "buffed" in 1.2, just more viable specs than Annihilation. 90-95% of marauders who kill you are Annihilation. P.P.S Also not talking about 1 on 1...marauders pretty much own that as a class. It's about group/warzones.

Let's see.. - Casters had to know how to use thier stuns, snares, roots, insta-casts, etc to stand a chance against a melee. If they did know how to do this, they could easily blow melee up. - Melee play was much more interactive. It was all about reactional attacks, positionals and chains/combos. This is how you got the most damage and if you couldn't pull them off, you were useless. Some of this has existed in other games, but none as much as DAoC. I'm sure this whole idea is "too hard" for the modern gamer. - If you were good, you could do some awesome stuff. On my sorcerer, I could take on 4-5 guys my level and win if I did everything exactly right. Timed my CC, used my stuns at the right time as compared to my mezzes, used my roots, maintained my distance, etc. - My sorcerer sounds OP, you say? Sure, against certain classes...but a stealther could drop me in 2 shots. - Stealthers destroyed casters and bad players in general...but my mercenary ate them up. (see rock/paper/scissors developing here)? - If your 8-man was a well oiled machine, you could take out 20-30 zerglings. Were there issues during the life of the game, of course? Were there OPed classes along the way? You bet (oh hai frost axe). Most of it got worked out...and the game was just fun.

You have no idea what you're talking about when you make this statement. It is significantly more "even". The gap between a fresh 50 vs a champ or BM geared 50, is vastly more disparate than the gap between even a level 10 and a level 49 in the 10-49 bracket.

You're right...they shouldn't have what you have. You should have fancy titles, cooler looking gear, and slightly higher stats because of your gear. Not a massive advantage such as the one that exists now.

Sorry I didn't clarify...it's too big because I faceroll people without gear and that's lame. It's pretty close to the same as fighting green level mobs...yawn. It's not just about expertise either. There's a pretty massive gap in all the "normal" stats between crafted/purples and the champ gear. My jugg has plenty of gear to compete in the 50s bracket. If I lose a 1 on 1 fight, it's because I was outplayed, the short comings of my class, or a combination thereof. I actually have barely played her for the last few weeks. Sitting at rank 58 for a while now...I basically abandon her to play the marauder I mentioned.

People who want to have a huge advantage because of gear are not PvPers. People who want completely even gear/stats, think they are PvPers, but really aren't. Gear should play a role, but a smaller one than what it does now. I want the guy who rank whatever and has some gear to have a little advantage...because when I beat him, he knows I outplayed him. My favorite thing right now is when I solo kill people who are 45+ in 10-49 bracket. I'm 35now, but have been doing that since probably 25. That 45+ has a clear advantage in skills and skillpoints, but he knows he just got beat by someone better than him. In the 50 bracket, this gap is too big...I know this because I have a 50 jugg that is 500+ expertise. It needs to be more like it is in the 10-49 bracket.

Umm..note where I said "some of the most powerful abilities" and not "all abilities". Maybe that is 2 out of 10 abilities. Clearly though, by your response you saw me list "tracer missle" and freaked out because you are a tracer missle spammer. The whole class shouldn't be based around 1 ability.

No...use your stun and knockback to gain distance so you can use your abilities, instead of just being able to stand in melee range and be just as effective as you are at ranged.

There's a reason why the 10-49 brackets are filled completely with ranged classes on most servers. There's basically zero disadvantage to playing a range class right now.

Add 5m minimum range to some of the most powerful abilities. Abilities like Force Lightning, Telekenitic Throw, Tracer Missle, Grav round, etc. Not on everything of course...no need to completely gut them, but force ranged to actually "work" at doing damage when they encounter melee. This would completely change PvP dynamics. Ranged classes would need to actually think about when to use that knockback, stun, root, snare, or sleep instead of just the ridiculous spam as soon as it's off cooldown crap that happens now. This should stir up a festive conversation, for sure.

I'm only level 33 now and anni spec, but let's see... - Because at level 25ish, I started leading warzones in damage, kills, killing blows and solo kills. - Because at level 25ish, I started breaking 200k+ damage...didn't happen until 45+ with rage spec on my juggernaut. - Because I finish warzones with 30-50% more damage than other marauders/sentinels, regardless of what level they are. (in my bracket) - Because I've beaten every marauder/sentinel I've faced 1 on 1, regardless of level. (beaten many 40+, even in my late 20s). I hardly notice any of them using their cooldowns in the process...saber ward is about the most consistent. - Because I can count the number of times on 1 hand I've lost a straight up 1 on 1 fight with any class at any level. (in my bracket) - Because the bad players who rolled Sorcs/Sages/Troopers/BHs, who literally don't know what to do when I interrupt their force lightning/telekenetic throw/grav round/tracer missile, used to play marauders I am sure. I hate to be a "L2P" person, but I think that is a huge part of the issues. I will 100% agree that this is not an easy class to play...the ranged classes really are easy mode comparatively speaking, but that does not make the marauder totally incapable...you just have to work harder. My "cooldowns" are always on cooldown, because I constantly use them. Obviously I don't use them in downtime...but if I am fighting, they are getting used most likely. (unless it's an obvious face roll against someone). I have shelved my rank 58 juggernaut basically to play my marauder. It just feels better...and I kill so much better. While I am more squishy, with just force camo right now I feel like I can survive better than my DPS jugg. There are some tweaks and fixes that could take place. The ability misfire HAS TO GET FIXED BIOWARE. It's ridiculous and unacceptable. A few things I think could be done... - 6 seconds on force camo - make obsfucate work against sorcs/sages better - saber ward to 2 minutes on the cooldown - force push with leap reset like jugg would be freakin awesome - introduce minimum range on some of the ranged class's abilities.

Everyone did reroll on my server. Huttball match last night had 4 operatives on my side and 3 on the opposing team. Laughable.

Sorry, folks have the right to voice concerns at all levels. For some people, level 50 could be months of "real time". If the class has issues sub-50, then it should be looked at and corrected. Fixing the playability at lower levels doesn't have to directly impact level 50 play and make juggs OP.

Great minds think alike, I guess? I "made up" this exact build on the fly about 3-4 days ago. Seems to be pretty effective, but not sure if I prefer it to a heavier vengeance build. I am going to swap back in a couple of days and see how I feel then.

Not true. I have almost all champ gear...just not the stinking saber. But...it's pretty easy to tell I am in champ gear anyways.

So, what gear are you using that allows you to be tank spec and hit for over 4k as frequently or moreso than a DPS focused jugg?

Second funniest thread I have read while waiting in queue. The thread in the Operative forum where people those guys claim they need to be buffed takes the cake though.

Umm...you make it sound difficult? I do this all day long..over and over, it's really not hard and I do hit for more than 3k. Trying stacking some surge. I will agree that we are not on the same level as some of the other classes, but rage build is pretty effective. I win many 1 on 1 fights and have won numerous 2 on 1 fights. Haven't won a 3 on 1 yet...closest was a 2 on 1 that I won and as soon as I killed the last guy another guy ran in and attacked and I took him out. I really only struggle with taking down geared heavy specced tanks.

I worked towards this hybrid spec pretty much all the way. http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/sith_warrior/juggernaut/#::e2fe3f2efefe5f2ef4e2f4e2f3efef22: I didn't personally experience great difficulty with leveling like some have said. I used Vette, then Jaesa up to probably level 45ish and then switched to Quinn. It did get challenging towards the end though. The points in immortal helped with with being able to go into "tank mode" for harder fights.

Please post a screenshot of you one-shotting someone. That would be like a minimum of an 11k hit. As to the topic of discussion. I personally went with DPS gear, but I run in soresu form for extra surivivability. I do however use the shield over the DPS focus.

I rolled for just DPS and I was pretty disappointed until I discovered rage spec. I am quite effective in PvP but I am an above average player. I know from experience with playing as other classes though that we are not in the same ballpark as others, especially ranged DPS. I can't speak for end game PvE, but I am sure we really struggle there. Rage would be no good for that and I suspect vengeance is ok but nowhere near what the ranged classes can pull. Immortal juggs are practically that...immortal. We should not be holed into that though because that is not what was advertised. Even when I ran a hybrid spec I was pretty ridiculously hard to kill. But, "everyone" says jugg tanking is a challenge for end game because of aggro management and the ranged tanks have a big advantage. No experience there, so can't make a statement first hand. What seems to be clear to me though, is there is a massive ranged advantage in this game from all aspects. Probably moreso than any other MMO I have played. That gap needs to be closed a bit.

Umm...there's an entire tanking PvP set with defensive stats and they all come with lots of accuracy and endurance. It's definitely functional to use as you work on the PvE gear.