How about that inflation eh?

[TrixxieTriss]

Thought that was the consensus already?

 

They have only one chance to prove that they do. They have said they have other measures planned, but they haven’t said what. If they launch 7.0 with no other measures, then we flat out know that was a lie.

[OddballEasyEight]

Hypercrate is about 1.8-2B now on SF, woot!

Bioware really need to remove or seriously nerf the Trade function otherwise the inflation would only get worst.

 

Make credit Trade limit to 1M and put a time limit on it.

For example, you can only Trade once with a single Legacy in 3 hour.

 

It will force people back to buy/sell through the GTN. The price ceiling would be 1B, and there's that 8% tax.

 

Even if people come up with alternative currencies like "WTS Tulak Hord's Lightsaber, 1M+8xB/B dye", all the alternative currencies have to circle through the GTN where the price cap and credit sink still apply, thus there will still be a total upper limit of an item price, unlike in the real world where even the sky is not the limit.

 

That won't work.

 

Like I said, people would only start demanding 1BN value items instead.

 

Basically a barter system would evolve where people "sell" their Tulak Hord sables and stuff for other items worth 1 billion.

And yes, like you say, those items will then go through the GTN where there's a credit sink, but why make the hoops to jump through in the first place?

 

Just increase the limit and the credit sinks will work faster.

 

Especially combined with an incremental tax rate and the other suggestions.

[Pricia]

That won't work.

 

Like I said, people would only start demanding 1BN value items instead.

 

Basically a barter system would evolve where people "sell" their Tulak Hord sables and stuff for other items worth 1 billion.

And yes, like you say, those items will then go through the GTN where there's a credit sink, but why make the hoops to jump through in the first place?

 

Just increase the limit and the credit sinks will work faster.

 

Especially combined with an incremental tax rate and the other suggestions.

 

Agreed. The GTN is the main source of credit sink at this point. Having a 1b cap completely defeats the purpose.

[eabevella]

Agreed. They need to close the loop hole trading outside of the GTN. But they also need to put some actual downward pressures on inflation. So far, all we know they are doing is reducing credit rewards from conquest, which won’t reduce inflation on its own.

 

Not only that, but BioWare are removing two really large credit sinks in 7.0. Ie, Amplifiers removed and the majority of gearing and min-maxing costs will reduce by 99%. Which will actually put upwards pressure on inflation.

 

I guess we will find out if Bioware actually cares or is taking this issue seriously when 7.0 releases. If they have no other measures in place besides nerfing conquest credits, then we know they don’t care.

 

Making character modification for an insane amount of credits as an extra option (like how we can buy SH with credits or cc) could be another good addition for credit sink since people who spend a lot on expensive armor sets/weapons are more likely to spend a lot of credits to change their toons' hair style/make up for aesthetic reasons.

 

I don't know, if they make it possible to roll the stats on the gears we get in 7.0 with credits, that would be a huge credit sinks, but at the same time, people will be saying it's P2P even if it will only provide a chance to get the BiS faster instead of higher stats.

 

*shrug* Guess we'll just wait and see. Meanwhile I'm hoarding resources...

[eabevella]

That won't work.

 

Like I said, people would only start demanding 1BN value items instead.

 

Basically a barter system would evolve where people "sell" their Tulak Hord sables and stuff for other items worth 1 billion.

And yes, like you say, those items will then go through the GTN where there's a credit sink, but why make the hoops to jump through in the first place?

 

Just increase the limit and the credit sinks will work faster.

 

Especially combined with an incremental tax rate and the other suggestions.

 

Because if you simply raise the GTN limit to 2B now, people will still be selling Hypercrate in Trade for 2.5B. And if you raise the GTN limit to 5B next month, people will simply be selling Tulak Hord's Lightsaber in Trade for 7B.

 

But if you kill the Trade like I suggested, for example: 1M, 2 Items, with a 3 hour CD time per Legacy to Legacy exchange, people will be forced back to GTN no matter what loop holes they come up with. The most they can do is to sell an item as 1M + 2x1B Items and it's a hard cap. And when people need to buy those 1B items, they'll be force to buy it with CC (good) or GTN (good). Even if some people want to Trade a 1B item for 1M + 2x500M items, and those 500M items will still have to be obtained from either CC or GTN. Any item with a less value than that would be too inefficient to be sold in Trade.

 

The point is not to eliminate all possible loopholes (well, we can, if we simply shut down Trade once and for all), the point is to force all trading through GTN and it's credit sink one way or another. If you don't kill Trade, what ever high cap you put in the GTN will be pointless in a month.

[illgot]

Because if you simply raise the GTN limit to 2B now, people will still be selling Hypercrate in Trade for 2.5B. And if you raise the GTN limit to 5B next month, people will simply be selling Tulak Hord's Lightsaber in Trade for 7B.

 

But if you kill the Trade like I suggested, for example: 1M, 2 Items, with a 3 hour CD time per Legacy to Legacy exchange, people will be forced back to GTN no matter what loop holes they come up with. The most they can do is to sell an item as 1M + 2x1B Items and it's a hard cap. And when people need to buy those 1B items, they'll be force to buy it with CC (good) or GTN (good). Even if some people want to Trade a 1B item for 1M + 2x500M items, and those 500M items will still have to be obtained from either CC or GTN. Any item with a less value than that would be too inefficient to be sold in Trade.

 

The point is not to eliminate all possible loopholes (well, we can, if we simply shut down Trade once and for all), the point is to force all trading through GTN and it's credit sink one way or another. If you don't kill Trade, what ever high cap you put in the GTN will be pointless in a month.

 

The rules you made up do nothing to fix inflation. The rules you made up do nothing to lower the price of items worth more than suggested trade caps (I think someone in this thread suggested a limit of 200 million credits max per sale). The rules you made up do one thing; stop players from buying items worth more than the suggested credit cap from the Cartel Market and selling those items to players. With inflation constantly increasing you won't be able to find a single item worth more than 1000 CC in six months.

 

Bioware needs to increase the GTN limit to at least 50 billion credits and raise the player credit cap to the current legacy bank credit cap. This should give Bioware enough time to create meaningful credit sinks before inflation catches up to the 50 billion cap. This also allows the GTN to function as a credit sink for items worth more than 1 billion credits again.

 

Bioware needs to change the system so credits above the player cap gets deposited in the players legacy bank instead of deleted. Did you know that if you accept more than 4,294,967,295 credits on a character the excess gets permanently deleted? I guess that is one type of credit sink.

 

Bioware needs to create meaningful credit sinks people will use constantly. Give players Amplifiers back, these are amazing credit sinks. Add all Ops cosmetic drops like armor shells, pets, and mounts to the collections tab. Allow players to then unlock the cosmetics account wide with credits once they win those items. Allowing players to track Ops cosmetics in a collection tab will give completionists and outfit designers a reason to do Ops.

 

Do the same thing with old PvP sets, Alliance Crate sets, Command Crate sets, 6.0 armor sets etc going forward.

 

Restricting trade or how much Cartel Market items can be sold for does nothing to fix inflation or lower cost. These arbitrary rules will only harm high cost Cartel Market sales as no one will buy a 4500 CC lightsaber to sell on the GTN or to players if they can only get 1 billion credits.

 

Instead players will buy 7 dyes that cost 600 CC and sell those for 200-300 million credits each. Easier to sell, you don't have to jump through hoops to trade to players, and you can make more profit. Do you really want to see nothing but cheap items being told on the GTN?

Edited January 18, 2022 by illgot

[mike_carton]

The rules you made up do nothing to fix inflation...

 

Great post. Good ideas presented and bad ideas debunked. Agree 100%.

[Sir-steve]

The more I think on it, I realize....people are the problem.

 

We have a player-based economy as part of the game which means people will play it to win i.e. he who gets the most money by the time the servers shut off, wins. So, there's no point having a discussion on the value of items when the focus is profit.

 

We can all play armchair-economists here and theorize on cause/effect, but the way I see it the only way to truly change the dynamic of the market is to change its model from player-based (which is focused on maximum accumulation of Wealth as gameplay) to non-player based (providing every player the same thing for the same investment as a game enabler). In other words, eliminate the people problem by taking them out of the equation.

 

When you look at how many other currencies this game has for obtaining items, what purpose do credits really serve? They're just a way of measuring 'who wins' in economic-PVP.

[mike_carton]

When you look at how many other currencies this game has for obtaining items, what purpose do credits really serve?

 

They are medium of exchange.

 

A character crafts an Augment. Another character wants that Augment. Credits allow them to trade that Augment.

[OddballEasyEight]

Making character modification for an insane amount of credits as an extra option (like how we can buy SH with credits or cc) could be another good addition for credit sink since people who spend a lot on expensive armor sets/weapons are more likely to spend a lot of credits to change their toons' hair style/make up for aesthetic reasons.

 

Oooh! I like this idea for a credit sink!

 

Cosmetics is the #1 spending point for most players in the game. Making the appearance options available for credits as well (as opposed to only CC, like it is now) would introduce a pretty good credit sink.

 

As long as the prices were semi-realistic.

[OddballEasyEight]

Because if you simply raise the GTN limit to 2B now, people will still be selling Hypercrate in Trade for 2.5B. And if you raise the GTN limit to 5B next month, people will simply be selling Tulak Hord's Lightsaber in Trade for 7B.

 

But if you kill the Trade like I suggested, for example: 1M, 2 Items, with a 3 hour CD time per Legacy to Legacy exchange, people will be forced back to GTN no matter what loop holes they come up with. The most they can do is to sell an item as 1M + 2x1B Items and it's a hard cap. And when people need to buy those 1B items, they'll be force to buy it with CC (good) or GTN (good). Even if some people want to Trade a 1B item for 1M + 2x500M items, and those 500M items will still have to be obtained from either CC or GTN. Any item with a less value than that would be too inefficient to be sold in Trade.

 

The point is not to eliminate all possible loopholes (well, we can, if we simply shut down Trade once and for all), the point is to force all trading through GTN and it's credit sink one way or another. If you don't kill Trade, what ever high cap you put in the GTN will be pointless in a month.

 

*sigh* no.

 

Again, trying to force prices down artificially is not in any way dealing with inflation.

 

It's simply treating the symptoms, not the disease.

 

If you have a cold, using pills to lower your fever isn't actually helping you fight the cold.

In fact, it prolongs the cold.

It just makes you feel better and lets you go back to work (and infect all your colleagues).

 

Same thing here.

Artificially forcing lower prices on the GTN actually prolongs inflation.

 

All that will happen is that people who are willing to do it will look for loopholes, while the prices in general on the GTN will go up until suddenly most things will be 1 billion in listings.

Inflation won't go away because of it.

 

High prices =/= Inflation.

It's just a symptom of inflation.

 

Inflation is the lowering of value of the individual credit.

The cure is to remove credits as fast as possible.

 

Increasing the cap on the GTN will ensure that those credits will go away faster because more people will be inclined to put items on the GTN instead of trying to sell them privately, meaning that almost every sale will have a tax on them.

Thus removing larger chunks of credits faster.

Edited January 19, 2022 by OddballEasyEight

[OddballEasyEight]

The more I think on it, I realize....people are the problem.

 

We have a player-based economy as part of the game which means people will play it to win i.e. he who gets the most money by the time the servers shut off, wins. So, there's no point having a discussion on the value of items when the focus is profit.

 

We can all play armchair-economists here and theorize on cause/effect, but the way I see it the only way to truly change the dynamic of the market is to change its model from player-based (which is focused on maximum accumulation of Wealth as gameplay) to non-player based (providing every player the same thing for the same investment as a game enabler). In other words, eliminate the people problem by taking them out of the equation.

 

When you look at how many other currencies this game has for obtaining items, what purpose do credits really serve? They're just a way of measuring 'who wins' in economic-PVP.

 

That's... not how inflation works.

 

If you changed the economy today and switched out the currency and removed all player-to-player sales, inflation would still happen.

 

You just wouldn't see increased prices as a symptom any more.

 

But the fact that everyone would own a Tulak Hord lightsaber or 12 would be the indication instead.

 

And it would be just as bad for the playerbase.

[BRKMSN]

The more I think on it, I realize....people are the problem.

 

You may be right. Some people don't want to put in effort to accumulate credits and are mad because others have. So they complain in the forums and ask for the devs to do something so their own minimal effort can produce equal returns to other players that have worked hard. Of course, the devs then capitulate to this group and nerf player rewards, which just makes things harder for the lazy.

[TrixxieTriss]

You may be right. Some people don't want to put in effort to accumulate credits and are mad because others have. So they complain in the forums and ask for the devs to do something so their own minimal effort can produce equal returns to other players that have worked hard. Of course, the devs then capitulate to this group and nerf player rewards, which just makes things harder for the lazy.

 

You also have players who have more credits than sense. And ones that don’t know how to sort cheapest to dearest first.

I’ve sold way too many things for the maximum listed price while much cheaper ones are listed because people either don’t sort or don’t care.

And I’ve literally sold crafted red black dyes for 1 billion credits in this way. All the while there were 10 pages of the same dye for 120k-500k. I’ve easily got 20 billion credits doing this with crafted dyes.

I’m sure if Bioware increased the GTN cap to 10 billion, I’d still be able to sell them at the maximum list price.

It’s one reason why I think increasing the cap is a bad idea because it would only accelerate inflation more and put new players at a massive disadvantage.

[Blakinik]

 

Inflation is the lowering of value of the individual credit.

The cure is to remove credits as fast as possible.

 

Increasing the cap on the GTN will ensure that those credits will go away faster because more people will be inclined to put items on the GTN instead of trying to sell them privately, meaning that almost every sale will have a tax on them.

Thus removing larger chunks of credits faster.

 

Inflation will happen on SWTOR until they have credit sinks. Period.

 

Originally to level you had to literally pay a fee to level. People complained and it went away and gold farmers all cried. Then they removed other credit sinks. The problem is they made "1 shot credit sinks" over sustained credit sinks. As such there is literally a handful of items they can do now, none of which is immune too problems.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Impose a "Intergalactic Banking Clan" Tax seizure.
  

 

Everyone over "X" credits per legacy will find their credits gone overnight. You would get some token reward for it like a title or similar. Problem here is a given - people would riot and rage quit and if you thought the NGE was bad for SWG - honey you ain't seen nothing yet.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Impose heavy GTN fees. This should really be a % of the list price that is "non-refundable" like 10%. in other words, if you post an item for 1 Billion credits, you would need too immediately pony up a 100 million credit posting fee whether or not your item sells.
  

 

This is likely one of the least intrusive methods of credit sinks - simply raise the GTN fees. Problem here is the trade channel (or general chat if they removed the trade channel) would be a non-stop spam fest. Additionally, I could with all intention offer up an item at a legitimately reasonable amount, only to get 1 credit undercut 1,000 times over and over resulting in my items getting buried.

 

So maybe 10% might be a bit steep, but it should not be 1 credit to post something on the GTN for 1 billion credits either. I do like the fixed % idea as it would punish those jacking up prices for the hell of it.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Change the GTN to be a high-low posting spread.
  

 

This would eliminate GTN posting at 1 credit undercutting. Basically I would post "wiling to buy up too X" and a seller would be "wiling to sell as low as Y". This works better for commodities, than items, but allows for a the game to manage auctions in a dutch auction process - i.e. willing too pay more means you are more likely to fill your order.

 

Fees would pull out cash.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Reduce credits in the game for drops.
  

 

THIS IS THE SOLE PROBLEM WITH INFLATION - there is literally an abundance of credits in circulation. Issue is that without sinks, the credits are simply "there". As a result if you look at overall total credits today vs. total overall credits 5 yrs ago, I do wonder if the prices for items would be relatively static in terms of % of the overall credit pool.

 

Major downside is I would hate to be a new player or poor when it is implemented because your ability to get credits would really suck.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Offer a limited time credit sink in exchange for cartel coins or "tokens" of some sort. Even having rare highly sought items up for bid could pull out credits.
  

 

I will start off with this would be accused as "favoring the whales" as they could monopolize this as well as reward exploiters. Additionally, it would destroy a revenue stream for EA so likely would never be implemented.

 

Putting those complaints aside, lets look at this. It would permanently remove credits in a one shot period. Additionally, with the excess credits gone, it would likely have deflationary pressure on items sold - especially if combined with the posting taxes. This entire process for items simply revolves around crashing prices for high end items. Of course, it would need to be random and dynamic where not even people at EA would know what is going to post next to eliminate any chance of corruption or "early notice" to some that items will post. Think like a "Czerka Crate-o-matic" getting posted or something similar.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Lastly simply have more credit sinks as options.
  

 

This is pretty straight forward -nickel and dime the hell out of EVERYTHING. Require fees to teleport. Require a fees to land on planets. Require fees to do anything. Problem is this could just be annoying.

 

Rather I would say have credit sink options to move along. Tired of waiting for a respawn of a boss? Literally dump credits into a token that you could use to spawn in a boss, locked too you. You don't NEED to get the token, but it would make it move faster. Additionally it would make the game more enjoyable since you wouldn't have to wait if you didn't want too. Problem would be figuring out a reasonable price to sell the expediting. Think of it like the fast lane at Disneyland without the whole "skipping in the line".

 

I'm sure there are other items I didn't think about at this hour, but if credits could get bled from the game - inflationary pressure would decline.

[illgot]

Inflation will happen on SWTOR until they have credit sinks. Period.

 

Originally to level you had to literally pay a fee to level. People complained and it went away and gold farmers all cried. Then they removed other credit sinks. The problem is they made "1 shot credit sinks" over sustained credit sinks. As such there is literally a handful of items they can do now, none of which is immune too problems.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Impose a "Intergalactic Banking Clan" Tax seizure.
  

 

Everyone over "X" credits per legacy will find their credits gone overnight. You would get some token reward for it like a title or similar. Problem here is a given - people would riot and rage quit and if you thought the NGE was bad for SWG - honey you ain't seen nothing yet.

 

Developers can not take away a players credits unless those credits were obtained through illegitimate means like credit duping or buying them from a third part website.

 

People who spend a few hundred dollars a week buying Hypercrates or other CM items to sell on the GTN for credits will be legitimately angry that they just lost their real money investment because Bioware was too lazy to create attractive and effective in game credit sinks. This will lead to people canceling their subscriptions, processing charge backs, and giving up on SWTOR completely. The last thing Bioware wants are it's whales who spend hundreds a week on this game to walk away forever.

 

No one is ever going to play the GTN, sell crafted materials, or save up credits if there is a constant threat of developers randomly deleting 50% of your credits over night.

Edited January 19, 2022 by illgot

[BRKMSN]

Inflation will happen on SWTOR until they have credit sinks. Period.

 

Inflation will happen regardless. Credit sinks are the solution, but only to curb inflation, not end it.

 

IMO, if you take a lot of the guild perks and offer the same things as character perks, you create credit sinks that are used more than one time per legacy. There are two ways this can be done that players would likely embrace:

 

1. Character perk (one character) --- permanent. (price should be much higher than the guild perk cost)

2. Legacy perk (all characters) for a limited duration (like Guild perks) - price should be around the guild perk cost.

 

 

Another thing that can be done is since amplifiers are being removed, get some of those benefits moved to character perks as well.

 

I'm not sure how much revenue character modification generates, but I do believe that more people would use it if there was a credit option. Same with GSF paint options (which are all one character at a time).

[OddballEasyEight]

Inflation will happen on SWTOR until they have credit sinks. Period.

 

Originally to level you had to literally pay a fee to level. People complained and it went away and gold farmers all cried. Then they removed other credit sinks. The problem is they made "1 shot credit sinks" over sustained credit sinks. As such there is literally a handful of items they can do now, none of which is immune too problems.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Impose a "Intergalactic Banking Clan" Tax seizure.
  

 

Everyone over "X" credits per legacy will find their credits gone overnight. You would get some token reward for it like a title or similar. Problem here is a given - people would riot and rage quit and if you thought the NGE was bad for SWG - honey you ain't seen nothing yet.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Impose heavy GTN fees. This should really be a % of the list price that is "non-refundable" like 10%. in other words, if you post an item for 1 Billion credits, you would need too immediately pony up a 100 million credit posting fee whether or not your item sells.
  

 

This is likely one of the least intrusive methods of credit sinks - simply raise the GTN fees. Problem here is the trade channel (or general chat if they removed the trade channel) would be a non-stop spam fest. Additionally, I could with all intention offer up an item at a legitimately reasonable amount, only to get 1 credit undercut 1,000 times over and over resulting in my items getting buried.

 

So maybe 10% might be a bit steep, but it should not be 1 credit to post something on the GTN for 1 billion credits either. I do like the fixed % idea as it would punish those jacking up prices for the hell of it.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Change the GTN to be a high-low posting spread.
  

 

This would eliminate GTN posting at 1 credit undercutting. Basically I would post "wiling to buy up too X" and a seller would be "wiling to sell as low as Y". This works better for commodities, than items, but allows for a the game to manage auctions in a dutch auction process - i.e. willing too pay more means you are more likely to fill your order.

 

Fees would pull out cash.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Reduce credits in the game for drops.
  

 

THIS IS THE SOLE PROBLEM WITH INFLATION - there is literally an abundance of credits in circulation. Issue is that without sinks, the credits are simply "there". As a result if you look at overall total credits today vs. total overall credits 5 yrs ago, I do wonder if the prices for items would be relatively static in terms of % of the overall credit pool.

 

Major downside is I would hate to be a new player or poor when it is implemented because your ability to get credits would really suck.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Offer a limited time credit sink in exchange for cartel coins or "tokens" of some sort. Even having rare highly sought items up for bid could pull out credits.
  

 

I will start off with this would be accused as "favoring the whales" as they could monopolize this as well as reward exploiters. Additionally, it would destroy a revenue stream for EA so likely would never be implemented.

 

Putting those complaints aside, lets look at this. It would permanently remove credits in a one shot period. Additionally, with the excess credits gone, it would likely have deflationary pressure on items sold - especially if combined with the posting taxes. This entire process for items simply revolves around crashing prices for high end items. Of course, it would need to be random and dynamic where not even people at EA would know what is going to post next to eliminate any chance of corruption or "early notice" to some that items will post. Think like a "Czerka Crate-o-matic" getting posted or something similar.

 

 

• 
   
  
• Lastly simply have more credit sinks as options.
  

 

This is pretty straight forward -nickel and dime the hell out of EVERYTHING. Require fees to teleport. Require a fees to land on planets. Require fees to do anything. Problem is this could just be annoying.

 

Rather I would say have credit sink options to move along. Tired of waiting for a respawn of a boss? Literally dump credits into a token that you could use to spawn in a boss, locked too you. You don't NEED to get the token, but it would make it move faster. Additionally it would make the game more enjoyable since you wouldn't have to wait if you didn't want too. Problem would be figuring out a reasonable price to sell the expediting. Think of it like the fast lane at Disneyland without the whole "skipping in the line".

 

I'm sure there are other items I didn't think about at this hour, but if credits could get bled from the game - inflationary pressure would decline.

 

Ah, hello and welcome to the discussion.

 

It's nice of you to bring up pretty much everything that's been discussed in this entire thread.

 

Also, I don't think you've read many of my responses, since you seem to think I don't know what credit sinks are.

 

But hey, thanks for the effort.

 

 

You also have players who have more credits than sense. And ones that don’t know how to sort cheapest to dearest first.

I’ve sold way too many things for the maximum listed price while much cheaper ones are listed because people either don’t sort or don’t care.

And I’ve literally sold crafted red black dyes for 1 billion credits in this way. All the while there were 10 pages of the same dye for 120k-500k. I’ve easily got 20 billion credits doing this with crafted dyes.

I’m sure if Bioware increased the GTN cap to 10 billion, I’d still be able to sell them at the maximum list price.

It’s one reason why I think increasing the cap is a bad idea because it would only accelerate inflation more and put new players at a massive disadvantage.

 

And if you managed to sell that Red Black dye for 10 billion instead of 1 billion (ignoring the fact that the individual credit cap is 4-ish billion), you'd be removing 800.000.000 credits from the game in one sale instead of just 80.000.000 credits from your 1 billion sale of the same thing.

 

Do you see why I don't think raising the limit is a bad idea?

 

In that one sale you'd be effectively removing the same amount of credits from the game as 10 sales of the same item at the previous cap would, thus fighting inflation much faster.

 

The GTN tax is currently one of the best and most stable credit sinks in the game (and I'd hope for it to be improved with higher taxes on higher prices etc.), and letting bigger sales happen will make it work faster.

[TrixxieTriss]

Inflation will happen regardless. Credit sinks are the solution, but only to curb inflation, not end it.

 

IMO, if you take a lot of the guild perks and offer the same things as character perks, you create credit sinks that are used more than one time per legacy. There are two ways this can be done that players would likely embrace:

 

1. Character perk (one character) --- permanent. (price should be much higher than the guild perk cost)

2. Legacy perk (all characters) for a limited duration (like Guild perks) - price should be around the guild perk cost.

 

 

Another thing that can be done is since amplifiers are being removed, get some of those benefits moved to character perks as well.

 

I'm not sure how much revenue character modification generates, but I do believe that more people would use it if there was a credit option. Same with GSF paint options (which are all one character at a time).

 

Those are some Good ideas.

 

I’d like to expand on the amplifier issue too. Many of us crafters use the amplifiers to increase the speed and crits to craft. If we didn’t, it would take way too long to craft some things these days. So with BioWare removing those amplifiers, many crafted items won’t crit and will take way too long to craft. Which will (in theory, ie less crits, higher costs) make crafters increase their prices on the GTN. Which will probably increase inflation more from less supply and higher sell prices.

 

This would be a great opportunity to add some other credit sinks for crafting. BioWare could add increased crafting speed and crit buffs, just like we have XP or gift giving perks in the legacy panes. Of course, these should be per character and not per legacy. They could have 5 levels that increase exponentially in credit cost as you go up a level (just like the other perks like XP and gift giving).

 

Then BioWare could add some consumable buffs too, that only last an hour or 4 hours (like stims and XP buffs). A version of these could be crafted and sold on the GTN so it’s not pay to win. And another version could be sold on the CM and given as rewards from GS login events.

[TrixxieTriss]

 

 

 

And if you managed to sell that Red Black dye for 10 billion instead of 1 billion (ignoring the fact that the individual credit cap is 4-ish billion), you'd be removing 800.000.000 credits from the game in one sale instead of just 80.000.000 credits from your 1 billion sale of the same thing.

 

Do you see why I don't think raising the limit is a bad idea?

 

In that one sale you'd be effectively removing the same amount of credits from the game as 10 sales of the same item at the previous cap would, thus fighting inflation much faster.

 

The GTN tax is currently one of the best and most stable credit sinks in the game (and I'd hope for it to be improved with higher taxes on higher prices etc.), and letting bigger sales happen will make it work faster.

 

My point is I shouldn’t have been able to sell those crafted dyes for 1 billion in the first place. And if BioWare raised it to 10 billion without fixing the GTN systems and implementing restrictions outside of it, I’d still sell crafted dyes from 10 billion because some people are stupid.

 

Honestly, I think the part of the reason they even sell is because credit sellers are using the GTN to launder their sales. They say to prospective credit buyers to list “x” items at 1 billion and they’ll buy them. That way BioWare can’t easily track the people selling credits and the credit buyer has zero risks of being banned. So increasing the GTN limit to 10 billion would just make credit selling easier and put more upward pressure on inflation.

Edited January 20, 2022 by TrixxieTriss

[illgot]

My point is I shouldn’t have been able to sell those crafted dyes for 1 billion in the first place. And if BioWare raised it to 10 billion without fixing the GTN systems and implementing restrictions outside of it, I’d still sell crafted dyes from 10 billion because some people are stupid.

 

Honestly, I think the part of the reason they even sell is because credit sellers are using the GTN to launder their sales. They say to prospective credit buyers to list “x” items at 1 billion and they’ll buy them. That way BioWare can’t easily track the people selling credits and the credit buyer has zero risks of being banned. So increasing the GTN limit to 10 billion would just make credit selling easier and put more upward pressure on inflation.

 

The fact is players do stupid things because they are drunk, too tired, high, or their little brother logs on without understand what they are doing. Yes, crazy sales happen, people sometimes buy the highest item by mistake and some people buy a single crafted dye for 1 billion, but that doesn't mean the person has so many credits they don't care, more than likely they made a mistake they will notice when they sober up.

 

Demonizing people who buy crafted dyes for 1 billion credits... you are listing items you know do not sell for 1 billion credits to intentionally profit on people making mistakes. I wouldn't run around bragging about that as a reason to keep GTN credit caps at 1 billion.

 

"You can't increase the GTN max limit because people like me who prey on others making mistakes will just exploit people!"

 

That makes you look bad, not the system.

 

Credit selling websites do not "launder" credits through the GTN. There is no reason for them to fake sales and lose 8% to the GTN tax, they simply mail the credits directly to players who buy them.

 

Even if a website did use the GTN, that is beneficial to the economy because of the 8% GTN tax. Better tax 8% than nothing.

 

The GTN limit needs to be raised because right now there are a lot of items not being sold on the GTN because they are worth well above 1 billion credits and every transaction that happens outside the GTN is bypassing the best credit sink we have in the game.

Edited January 20, 2022 by illgot

[TrixxieTriss]

The fact is players do stupid things because they are drunk, too tired, high, or their little brother logs on without understand what they are doing. Yes, crazy sales happen, people sometimes buy the highest item by mistake and some people buy a single crafted dye for 1 billion, but that doesn't mean the person has so many credits they don't care, more than likely they made a mistake they will notice when they sober up.

 

Demonizing people who buy crafted dyes for 1 billion credits... you are listing items you know do not sell for 1 billion credits to intentionally profit on people making mistakes. I wouldn't run around bragging about that as a reason to keep GTN credit caps at 1 billion.

 

"You can't increase the GTN max limit because people like me who prey on others making mistakes will just exploit people!"

 

That makes you look bad, not the system.

 

Credit selling websites do not "launder" credits through the GTN. There is no reason for them to fake sales and lose 8% to the GTN tax, they simply mail the credits directly to players who buy them.

 

Even if a website did use the GTN, that is beneficial to the economy because of the 8% GTN tax. Better tax 8% than nothing.

 

The GTN limit needs to be raised because right now there are a lot of items not being sold on the GTN because they are worth well above 1 billion credits and every transaction that happens outside the GTN is bypassing the best credit sink we have in the game.

 

I listed at those prices for an experiment I did last year and I stopped doing it at the beginning of December.

I’ve been doing similar short term experiments for the last 3 years. You can read about some of my previous posts in other older threads to do with crafting and GTN prices.

 

As for credit sellers. I’ve actually had them approach me to ask for the credits back and admitted to doing what I’ve posted about. I copied their correspondence and sent it to BioWare. So yes, they are using the GTN as a way to transfer credits to their customers. 8% isn’t that large amount and they would obviously factor that into their prices (the same as most GTN sellers do).

 

Raising the credit limit on the GTN only helps the credit sellers and the super rich in the game get richer. It doesn’t need to be increased if the aim is to reduce inflation or remove credits.

 

If the goal is to remove credits, BioWare can remove more credits by increasing the GTN tax for super expensive items through a scaled tax system. And then prevent people from circumventing the tax by limiting player to player trades. BioWare could also add a small percentage fee when listing that isn’t refunded if the item doesn’t sell.

 

BioWare doesn’t need to increase the GTN price. The only people asking for that are sellers wanting an easier time trading above 1 billion. It doesn’t help buyers or inflation. Just admit that you only want it so you can sell things at over inflated prices.

[Gibonski]

I think everyone here just skipped the thing that drives the prices so high. Not one mentioned rpm/ oem prices needed to do the augments. If they were to drop from flashpoint bosses and weekly, instead of ranked pvp, it would not be an issue. People have billions of credits, running staged pvp with 8 people. One side wins, and then looses on a rotation. Everyday these groups run for 3 hours straight for 7 days a week, gaining ludacris amounts of money. Then these people have so much money, so they don't give a flying flamingo if they buy something for 500 mil, because they can make it back in 1 hour. And with little effort.

 

But the devs ignored this issue for almost 2 years and here we are. It's not because people are great at playing the market. It's because certain group of people allowed market prices to go higher and higher over this timeframe.

[Xhuuyaa]

I think everyone here just skipped the thing that drives the prices so high. Not one mentioned rpm/ oem prices needed to do the augments... People have billions of credits, running staged pvp with 8 people.

 

There was inflation before. But it really spiraled out of control since you can trade rpm/oem for 10k tech-fragments. This was the moment prices for rpm/oem went down and for everything else went way faster up than before.

 

Friend of mine had before 400 Millions. Today he has ~3.5 Billions. And he's playing not that much and only sells the mats he's traded for 10k tech-fragments.

[illgot]

I listed at those prices for an experiment I did last year and I stopped doing it at the beginning of December.

I’ve been doing similar short term experiments for the last 3 years. You can read about some of my previous posts in other older threads to do with crafting and GTN prices.

 

As for credit sellers. I’ve actually had them approach me to ask for the credits back and admitted to doing what I’ve posted about. I copied their correspondence and sent it to BioWare. So yes, they are using the GTN as a way to transfer credits to their customers. 8% isn’t that large amount and they would obviously factor that into their prices (the same as most GTN sellers do).

 

Raising the credit limit on the GTN only helps the credit sellers and the super rich in the game get richer. It doesn’t need to be increased if the aim is to reduce inflation or remove credits.

 

If the goal is to remove credits, BioWare can remove more credits by increasing the GTN tax for super expensive items through a scaled tax system. And then prevent people from circumventing the tax by limiting player to player trades. BioWare could also add a small percentage fee when listing that isn’t refunded if the item doesn’t sell.

 

BioWare doesn’t need to increase the GTN price. The only people asking for that are sellers wanting an easier time trading above 1 billion. It doesn’t help buyers or inflation. Just admit that you only want it so you can sell things at over inflated prices.

 

I'm not going to get into how now improbable the it was just a social experiment excuse is when you stated you have and would post dyes again at the max credit limit if the GTN limit was raised.

 

And how gold sellers who can barely create a proper advertisement in English asked for their credits back because they accidentally bought my 1 billion credit dye. Lets ignore these two fantastical deflections.

 

Lets jump down to the fact you do not want a higher GTN limit because "Raising the credit limit on the GTN only helps the credit sellers and the super rich in the game get richer. It doesn’t need to be increased if the aim is to reduce inflation or remove credits."

 

You do not want to increase the GTN limit because you believe credit sellers launder their credits on the GTN? This does not happen and even if it did the 8% tax is at least doing it's job of being a credit sink. And how would would increasing the GTN limit help credit sellers if they did use the GTN to "launder" credits? The only benefit that credit sellers would gain is less transactions per sale, they would still get taxed 8%. Raising the limit doesn't help credit credit sellers even if they did "launder" their credits through the GTN. What are they gaining? Buying less dyes?

 

And you do not want players to have an easier time selling items worth more than 1 billion credits because... you don't want the "super rich in the game to get richer". This makes no sense either. Players have been bypassing the 1 billion credit limit for years doing direct trades. You aren't stopping multi-billion credit trades by limiting the GTN to 1 billion credits. Instead, players are bypassing the best credit sink in the game because they have no other choice.

 

Your stance against increasing the GTN limit is not about helping the economy or reducing inflation, it's about being punitive to people you consider "super rich".

 

If you understood what inflation was, the difference between inflation and high prices, what it takes to fix inflation, how long it would take Bioware to implement proper credit sinks and how long it would take for those credit sinks to take effect, you would understand that keeping the GTN at 1 billion credits is causing inflation to increase at a rate faster than it would if the GTN could tax multi-billion credit sales.

 

Raise the GTN limit and let people sell their multi-billion credit items on the GTN and tax them 8%. Remove a few hundred million credits per transaction as a credit sink instead of forcing everyone to trade directly bypassing the best credit sink we have in the game. Do this while Bioware creates and implements effective credit sinks which will naturally increase the value of credits and lower the cost of traded goods.

Edited January 20, 2022 by illgot