In Praise of the 6.1.1 Conquest Overhaul

[Sarfux]

At the heart of the matter is this, more people are getting conquest, enjoying the game their way, etc. They can access CQ without having to resort to content that doesn't interest them. The trolls are complaining, probably because the value of the mats, which come from CQ are falling fast, they are so caught up in lost earnings they've lost all rational thoughts.

It seems there are probably four accounts, maybe a little more, complaining, and quite possibly, they are the same person, or they are playing human centipede and are so far in to 'it' that you can't tell them apart. Either way, the mods need to step in, and clear out the forums

 

that's too bad if the trolls are complaining and the vocal minority "yet again" is complaining on this, much like the OP in the other thread complaining about conquest. This is how conquest will be now and it's part of the game. not just an afterthought anymore. and it's fantastic. He can either like it and adapt? or be bitter and upset. It's his call.

Edited April 25, 2020 by Sarfux

[Sarfux]

I usually am not active on the forums anymore due to what is going on in several threads with the trolls and people who like to argue take over, but I needed to come onto the forums to show 100 percent support from people all over INSIDE the game, on just how active their guilds have been with this and just how much people LOVE THIS.

 

BioWare? do NOT listen to the vocal minority of complainers on this. You did a fantastic job

[ceciltaru]

I usually am not active on the forums anymore due to what is going on in several threads with the trolls and people who like to argue take over, but I needed to come onto the forums to show 100 percent support from people all over INSIDE the game, on just how active their guilds have been with this and just how much people LOVE THIS.

 

BioWare? do NOT listen to the vocal minority of complainers on this. You did a fantastic job

 

so much this!

 

the alt guild i'm in had so much talking and laughing on discord last night, i got emotional. we were down to 3 or 4 active players up until tuesday, most of us being only concerned with getting our imp and pub mains their CQ and then usually logging off. I figured we might get a little active because of double XP, but holy crap! we've even picked up some 'strays" and new players who are showing excitement for the game. we were making plans last night about which area of our flagship to open up in a month or 2 once we started getting the encryptions, and had a plan by the end of the night for the rest of the year on unlocking the flagship. i know the naysayers will be like, "see! you shouldn't be unlocking a flagship in a year, it took us 20!" yeah well, your exaggerations aside, i'm freaking ecstatic, and its all thanks to these changes. again, some balancing should be done, but if you want to go back to running the same 2 or 3 ops and flashpoints over and over and over and over and over... you can actually still do that right now. i just saw a shout for an EV farm pt you can join.... i'm going back to leveling my alts!

[Darkbloom]

I am sort of a weird player in that I mainly like to play through the story missions from 1-50 and don't really do any endgame content. I also like to do the pve space missions, which I guess is also weird. Before this week, I achieved my personal conquest a grand total of one (1) time, and that was two weeks ago during the rakghoul event. In general, trying to achieve it would have required abandoning all the things I actually like to do in the game in favor of the ones that Bioware arbitrarily decided were more important. So, I'm really happy that story missions and space missions now reward conquest points, and that there are rampages for multiple planets. I now have the ability to do conquest while playing how I like to play. Whether or not they choose to tweak the amount of points for some objectives later on, I hope they keep the same variety of activities available.

 

OK this is way off topic, but I just wanted to tell you--I think you might really like the new Ossus/Onslaught content. And once you hit level 69 or so you can just skip Makeb/Shadow of Revan/KotFE/KotET and go straight to the new stuff.

 

I've done that with a couple of characters and no regrets.

 

Now back on topic.

 

Someone above mentioned that they don't "have to do" pvp any more in order to reach their conquest goals. Thank God. And that's one of the great things about the new system. As someone who passionately loves pvp, the fewer people who are queuing because they think they "have to", the better!

[Ylliarus]

I usually am not active on the forums anymore due to what is going on in several threads with the trolls and people who like to argue take over, but I needed to come onto the forums to show 100 percent support from people all over INSIDE the game, on just how active their guilds have been with this and just how much people LOVE THIS.

 

BioWare? do NOT listen to the vocal minority of complainers on this. You did a fantastic job

 

100% agreed. The surge in activity can be seen everywhere, planets that usually had only 1 instance and it was a miracle to encounter anyone now have started getting multiple instances again and you see people around everywhere it's really great to see people engage with various parts of the game again.

[Stradlin]

Someone above mentioned that they don't "have to do" pvp any more in order to reach their conquest goals. Thank God. And that's one of the great things about the new system. As someone who passionately loves pvp, the fewer people who are queuing because they think they "have to", the better!

 

Did you notice they've gone and nerfed the amount of conq you get from pvp? By the looks of it, people make 300%-400% more conq than they used to. Yet, conquest you get from PvP and GSF has gotten nerfed. That's so crazy.

Win a match is a daily repeatable now, vs infinite as it used to be,. Doing matches after the first one is some of the worst /slowest conquest you can now have.Win or lose, you get 1500/match. That's 1/4th of what you get for selling garbage, clicking your gear, doing a planetary mission etc. None of these low effort goals they launched to completely change conquest is for content that requires other people to happen. Multiplayer content gets to keep old goals, from days when reaching target on 1 char/day was a major effort, rather than a 10 min thing.

Edited April 26, 2020 by Stradlin

[DarkestMicheal]

100% agreed. The surge in activity can be seen everywhere, planets that usually had only 1 instance and it was a miracle to encounter anyone now have started getting multiple instances again and you see people around everywhere it's really great to see people engage with various parts of the game again.

 

It's great to see the game active again, except when waiting on a node and there's 25 people around, and someone tries to ninja it...lol. But even still I'll put up with that to keep the game active I do have one small gripe with the CQ rewards though, the exp boost the give out is a class mission one, they should have made it a general one, like in the missions, doesn't have to be a major one, a minor one would do, i just think it'd be more useful.

Edited April 26, 2020 by DarkestMicheal

[Zaldalia]

Conquest is to Easy now and is making it so you don't even have a chance to beat the big guild's ever atleast before you had a chance plus they have some really dumb conquest missions like "add a utility point " I hate the new system

[Toraak]

Conquest is to Easy now and is making it so you don't even have a chance to beat the big guild's ever atleast before you had a chance plus they have some really dumb conquest missions like "add a utility point " I hate the new system

 

Small/medium guilds have not had a chance to beat a large guild in a very long time now. Not since they did the conquest overhaul in patch 5.8 I think it was. It may have been before that now that I think about it.

[casirabit]

I am finding more and more people on the server I play that is enjoying this new system and they are actually having fun doing things they like. Good job BW

[CoiledNine]

Every single day, you can pretty much reach your target by doing this low effort busywork. Takes 10 mins. Restrict it to 10-50 and lvl 10-50 characters become far more efficient conq farmers than max level characters are. In terms of sanity, that'd def be in line with rest of this mess. Turning this junk into weekly dings..or removing a digit from rewards would be the reasonable thing I think. Doing stuff with other people in this multiplayer game is currently less valued than selling vendor trash. lol

 

Thhiiiisssss ^^ It's an MMO. But there are currently very little group-oriented contest objectives anymore. Since we're breaking it down so much, maybe there should also be additional conquest objectives based on guild size or even invasion target.

[Damask_Rose]

Thhiiiisssss ^^ It's an MMO. But there are currently very little group-oriented contest objectives anymore. Since we're breaking it down so much, maybe there should also be additional conquest objectives based on guild size or even invasion target.

 

Conquest has always had different objectives different weeks. This is week 1. We don't know what other weeks look like yet. This does not look like "very little" to me. Don't forget many other objectives will be met in the process of completing these objectives.

 

1 infinite Veteran flashpoint objective.

8 Daily Master Mode flahspoiint objectives.

1 infinite Group Finder objective.

1 daily Group Finder objective that has multiple tiers.

3 daily operation objectives.

2 daily Starfiighter objectives.

1 infinite Starfighter objective.

2 daily PvP objectives.

1 infinite PvP objective.

[HuaRya]

Well, I see Mr. Grouchypants has crashed the party...

 

Anyway, I love the new system. I'm a one-person guild these days with lots of alts. With the old system and my current playtime, I could get 1 or 2 characters to the conquest cap. There's one week where I can get up to 7 or even 8 and that's the week where you can do lots of crafting to get points.

 

Yesterday, I got 4 characters to conquest cap. It was exhilarating. I'm going to shoot for all my characters to hit the cap this week (30 characters), a goal I never thought possible.

 

This seems to be where the game is definitely headed and these new conquest low achievement awards "This is the Way". Nothing wrong with that....

 

However, long ago the whole idea of guilds/ships/conquest was to bring people together for activities. Years ago when conquest was new we would actually go in groups of 20 or more to protect/kill battlemasters on places like Tatooine. Or, we would scout out world bosses in different phases. As our guild shrank we would run flashpoints to kill certain bosses at different choke points...MMO's were the last places to do these kinds of things....but alas "That is no longer the way".

[Ylliarus]

Small/medium guilds have not had a chance to beat a large guild in a very long time now. Not since they did the conquest overhaul in patch 5.8 I think it was. It may have been before that now that I think about it.

 

Agreed, small guilds haven't been able to beat large guilds since a long time now and to blame the current Conquest rework for it is folly, because the latest rework didn't cause that issue.

Edited April 26, 2020 by Ylliarus

[Stradlin]

This does not look like "very little" to me.

 

1 infinite Veteran flashpoint objective.

8 Daily Master Mode flahspoiint objectives.

1 infinite Group Finder objective.

1 daily Group Finder objective that has multiple tiers.

3 daily operation objectives.

2 daily Starfiighter objectives.

1 infinite Starfighter objective.

2 daily PvP objectives.

1 infinite PvP objective.

 

 

If one looks at time required vs. points given and compares it to rest of the stuff going on in this new conq, it certainly is very little. Almost all of the things you've listed are leftovers from the conq system as it used to be. Back when reaching conq target in a day meant a busy day and some effort. Some of the things you've listed have actually gotten nerfed.(Pvp and GSF) NONE of the stuff that brings you to conq target in 10 mins are additions to grp content. All of the good stuff is all about either menial tasks or soloing missions. It is obscene.

 

FP content pales in comparsion to selling garbage or doing few fast missions alone. PvP/GSF been utterly shafted in terms of conq rewards. To great degree, all grp content has time vs conq made sound like an echo from the past system. None of them have ridiculously generous, fast and easy objectives of this new system.

Edited April 26, 2020 by Stradlin

[DarthAlastor]

If one looks at time required vs. points given and compares it to rest of the stuff going on in this new conq, it certainly is very little. Almost all of the things you've listed are leftovers from the conq system as it used to be. Back when reaching conq target in a day meant a busy day and some effort. Some of the things you've listed have actually gotten nerfed.(Pvp and GSF) NONE of the stuff that brings you to conq target in 10 mins are additions to grp content. All of the good stuff is all about either menial tasks or soloing missions. It is obscene.

 

FP content pales in comparsion to selling garbage or doing few fast missions alone. PvP/GSF been utterly shafted in terms of conq rewards. To great degree, all grp content has time vs conq made sound like an echo from the past system. None of them have ridiculously generous, fast and easy objectives of this new system.

 

Just because you don't see it doesn't mean people aren't grouping for FP's OP's and other groups for killing world bosses. In the last month or so I've been doing more group content then I have in almost the entire time I've played the game. PVP and GSF are not the only ways to play the game

[Stradlin]

Just because you don't see it doesn't mean people aren't grouping for FP's OP's and other groups for killing world bosses. In the last month or so I've been doing more group content then I have in almost the entire time I've played the game. PVP and GSF are not the only ways to play the game

 

I'm not sure whbere you are getting this and what it has to do with anything. I'm underlining how content requiring other people to happen is now extremely unrewarding (conq earned from objectives+time required to complete) when compared to menial tasks or straightforward solo stuff. This is exceptionally true with PvP and GSF. Applies, to a lesser degree with pve grp content too. People doing challenging solo stuff also affected.

Edited April 26, 2020 by Stradlin

[DarthAlastor]

I'm not sure whbere you are getting this and what it has to do with anything. I'm underlining how content requiring other people to happen is now extremely unrewarding (conq earned from objectives+time required to complete) when compared to menial tasks or straightforward solo stuff. This is exceptionally true with PvP and GSF. Applies, to a lesser degree with pve grp content too. People doing challenging solo stuff also affected.

 

To me the conquest points you earn from doing either group content or solo content is a bonus to whatever you're doing in the game

[Soljin]

All conquest should have rewards based on time investment. If A solo Flashpoint takes 30 mins on average and an Operation takes an hour then the Operation should give twice the conquest reward. If a Master mode Operation averages 1.5hrs to complete then 1.5 times the conquest reward should be give.

 

Just set a baseline conquest number for .25 minutes of conquest and scale the rewards based on time moving up...that is fair and I agree it should scale per time investment.

 

As soon as the discussion turns to "group content deserves more rewards" or "harder content deserves greater rewards" I 100% don't agree and will actively advocate against either concept whenever I see it.

 

This game is both a Single player RPG and an MMO.

Edited April 26, 2020 by Soljin

[Stradlin]

All conquest should have rewards based of time investment. If A solo Flashpoint takes 30 mins on average and an Operation takes an hour then the Operation should give twice the conquest reward. If a Master mode Operation averages 1.5hrs to complete then 1.5 times the conquest reward should be give.

 

Just set a baseline conquest number for .25 minutes of conquest and scale the rewards based on time moving up...that is fair and I agree it should scale per time investment.

 

As soon as the discussion turns to group content deserves more rewards or "harder" content reserves higher rewards I 100% don't agree and will actively advocate against either concept whenever I see it.

 

This game is both a Single player RPG and an MMO.

 

 

Precisely. There should be some time/effort formula going for all the core objectives at the very least. (=stuff that is there every week.) One doesn't have to dwell in "easy" vs "hard" even - old conq system certainly didn't either. But one can estimate "effort" by counting mouse clicks if you rly wanna get down to basics. In practice, this type of "effort" is almost always completely married with time required, so it is perhaps a bit irrelevant.

[DarthAlastor]

All conquest should have rewards based on time investment. If A solo Flashpoint takes 30 mins on average and an Operation takes an hour then the Operation should give twice the conquest reward. If a Master mode Operation averages 1.5hrs to complete then 1.5 times the conquest reward should be give.

 

Just set a baseline conquest number for .25 minutes of conquest and scale the rewards based on time moving up...that is fair and I agree it should scale per time investment.

 

As soon as the discussion turns to "group content deserves more rewards" or "harder content deserves greater rewards" I 100% don't agree and will actively advocate against either concept whenever I see it.

 

This game is both a Single player RPG and an MMO.

 

As others have said I'm sure the numbers will be tweaked as with everything else in the game. It hasn't even been a full week of the new conquest system I say let people enjoy it for now and let BW collect some data on what people seem to prefer doing in the game

[Soljin]

Precisely. There should be some time/effort formula going for all the core objectives at the very least. (=stuff that is there every week.) One doesn't have to dwell in "easy" vs "hard" even - old conq system certainly didn't either. But one can estimate "effort" by counting mouse clicks if you rly wanna get down to basics. In practice, this type of "effort" is almost always completely married with time required, so it is perhaps a bit irrelevant.

 

Effort required is basically difficulty...effort required/difficulty decreases with numbers (and is now likely "farmable" because of grouping creating a treadmill) so that means rewarding group content and harder content at a higher level than "easy" content which is often associated with content an individual can complete.

 

I agree that conquest rewards should scale off an average completion time (averaged across a large sample of players). When effort, difficulty, grouping start being considered for grounds to increase rewards I'm out! Don't agree.

Edited April 26, 2020 by Soljin

[Soljin]

As others have said I'm sure the numbers will be tweaked as with everything else in the game. It hasn't even been a full week of the new conquest system I say let people enjoy it for now and let BW collect some data on what people seem to prefer doing in the game

 

I agree with this.

[DarkTergon]

All conquest should have rewards based on time investment. If A solo Flashpoint takes 30 mins on average and an Operation takes an hour then the Operation should give twice the conquest reward. If a Master mode Operation averages 1.5hrs to complete then 1.5 times the conquest reward should be give.

 

Just set a baseline conquest number for .25 minutes of conquest and scale the rewards based on time moving up...that is fair and I agree it should scale per time investment.

 

As soon as the discussion turns to "group content deserves more rewards" or "harder content deserves greater rewards" I 100% don't agree and will actively advocate against either concept whenever I see it.

 

This game is both a Single player RPG and an MMO.

 

The big problem with that is group content takes the longest, so will get the most rewards, CQ wise, so basically anyone who doesn't want to (or can't) do group content is getting the middle finger. Not to mention, ops, etc are for higher level players, so new players, would be missing out on getting CQ points for them. The systm may not be balanced, and it may take tweaking, but as far as CQ goes, at the moment it's probably the most inclusive it's ever been.

[Damask_Rose]

If one looks at time required vs. points given and compares it to rest of the stuff going on in this new conq, it certainly is very little. Almost all of the things you've listed are leftovers from the conq system as it used to be. Back when reaching conq target in a day meant a busy day and some effort. Some of the things you've listed have actually gotten nerfed.(Pvp and GSF) NONE of the stuff that brings you to conq target in 10 mins are additions to grp content. All of the good stuff is all about either menial tasks or soloing missions. It is obscene.

 

FP content pales in comparsion to selling garbage or doing few fast missions alone. PvP/GSF been utterly shafted in terms of conq rewards. To great degree, all grp content has time vs conq made sound like an echo from the past system. None of them have ridiculously generous, fast and easy objectives of this new system.

 

1. This is the first week of the new system. We don't know what next week's will look like. In past systems there were big swings on what content got the most objectives. At this time there is no reason to think that has changed. Other weeks will likely have a preponderance of group content related objectives.

 

2. I have the 150% stronghold buff and can't get to 50k in 10 minutes doing the objectives you are complaining about. If I do all of them I end up with 30k and have to do something else to hit my target. A new player would get only 20k from those objectives. So hitting the 50k target either takes 2-3 days or participating in other content.

 

3. When you do flashpoints and ops you are also hitting quest completions and rampages, not to mention a flood of points for killing mobs. While doing flashpoints and ops you can send your companions out on crew missions during the inevitable down times and *gasp* you can send your companion out to sell the trash.

 

4. This game has never, ever rewarded based on time spent.