All the systems for 6.0 seem unappealing. Bioware you need to pay attention.

[Jdast]

But they won't begin fixing it until at least two weeks after release.

 

Personally, I'm not leaving. My sub expires about two weeks before 6.0 drops, so I'll probably sign up for another month to get the expansion, because I want the levels.

 

I completely agree, which is why I have long advocated for releasing it as soon as possible, obviously assuming there are no game breaking bugs which prevent completion of the story.

 

Some (erroneously in my view) characterize me as a White Knight. Au contraire. We are now 49 days to the release. There actually has been very, very good feedback in my opinion on the PTS, which is very easy to read and requires people to click one button to access.

 

I share the concerns about RNG layered on RNG and too many non-moddable pieces of gear, which is directly related to what I think the biggest problem is -- the current gearing system encourages people to wear sub-optimal gear because Ilvl is too important in determining outcomes. It seems people have good points too about the cost of items.

 

But BW has this feedback. Frankly, I don't think there is too much they can do in 49 days, but I could be wrong. Changing prices / drop rates I would presume is easier than overhauling non-moddable gear to moddable, but again, I could be wrong.

 

But enough of us will enjoy the story and leveling characters because I highly doubt gear will be a factor in enjoying that portion of the game. End game will be sorted out after there is an uproar on the forums, which I fully anticipate and fully expect to participate in as warranted.

 

TL-DR: Unleash the Onslaught! The PTS at best is going to get them to tweak a few numbers here and there.

 

Dasty

Edited September 3, 2019 by Jdast

[kodrac]

I hope that feedback is taken seriously on PTS for 6.0, and if it's really as bad as most have indicated, BW considers the feedback and makes the proper changes to improve it. I feel bad for the game, it really does deserve better than what it has been given by whoever has made the decisions over the years navigating SWTOR down the path it has been taken.

 

I can understand them wanting to push a new vision or change directions, but when you've got such a small playerbase, can you really afford to? I mean this is really just a niche game now because there's so few still playing. Overturning the apple cart doesn't make much sense to me. I think Keith has his playstyle (or his guild to cater to) and that's what determines the decision making. Maybe he's betting the apple cart on the changes attracting 100s of thousands of new players but I doubt it.

[ZionHalcyon]

I’ve unsubbed, so I can’t. I’m only still on the forums till my cookie access runs out. But if I could, I think it would depress me too.

 

Bioware continue to shoot off their proverbial foot and then shoot off their arms and legs to see if that helps.

https://imgur.com/gallery/83UDR

http://championsandheroes.smackjeeves.com/comics/2551829/swtor-health-and-safety-violation/

 

So then basically, you're just here to try to get everyone to quit with you so you can tell BioWare you told them so about them going out of business because you left the game...

 

Ugh, if you unsubbed then just go away.

 

Let those of us left behind worry about PTS. Yes there are some problems but it's nothing that can't be fixed. And already from Phase 1 to phase 2 BioWare listened to a lot of the player feedback on tacticals.

 

Not saying they will get this right.

 

But you being here trying to convince others to quit with you is extremely tacky.

Edited September 3, 2019 by ZionHalcyon

[KendraP]

It took them a year to fix the disaster that was 5.0 gearing which was a year they couldn't do anything else, except class nerfs, which in turn made the playerbase anxious, to say the least, about content droughts. Another year later and here we are, after just one whole month of promised increased communication by the way, and we are finally getting an expansion and they're going to do it all over again? It'll take them a year, or more given how slow they are lately, to fix 6.0. Oh boy! Where do I sign up?

 

This is my sentiment exactly... could they stop trying to reinvent the wheel until they find some degree of competence?

[ZionHalcyon]

I completely agree, which is why I have long advocated for releasing it as soon as possible, obviously assuming there are no game breaking bugs which prevent completion of the story.

 

Some (erroneously in my view) characterize me as a White Knight. Au contraire. We are now 49 days to the release. There actually has been very, very good feedback in my opinion on the PTS, which is very easy to read and requires people to click one button to access.

 

I share the concerns about RNG layered on RNG and too many non-moddable pieces of gear, which is directly related to what I think the biggest problem is -- the current gearing system encourages people to wear sub-optimal gear because Ilvl is too important in determining outcomes. It seems people have good points too about the cost of items.

 

But BW has this feedback. Frankly, I don't think there is too much they can do in 49 days, but I could be wrong. Changing prices / drop rates I would presume is easier than overhauling non-moddable gear to moddable, but again, I could be wrong.

 

But enough of us will enjoy the story and leveling characters because I highly doubt gear will be a factor in enjoying that portion of the game. End game will be sorted out after there is an uproar on the forums, which I fully anticipate and fully expect to participate in as warranted.

 

TL-DR: Unleash the Onslaught! The PTS at best going to get them to tweak a few numbers here and there.

 

Dasty

 

I actually contend that the systems they put in the place are very good. It's just the values are so out of whack it's not even funny.

 

If they can adjust the cost of, well basically everything, to reasonable levels, it will take care of 90% of the issues. And that is something that can be done in the time we have left.

 

Now the unmoddable gear is a little bit trickier but I think something can be done with that by using the deconstruction process. If we can get barrels, hilts, modifications, enhancements, and armorings with the same item rating as the piece we deconstructed, granted it's one extra step but at least it then it's a way to solve the issue fairly quick.

Edited September 3, 2019 by ZionHalcyon

[xordevoreaux]

So then basically, you're just here to try to get everyone to quit with you so you can tell BioWare you told them so about them going out of business because you left the game...

 

Ugh, if you unsubbed then just go away.

 

Let those of us left behind worry about PTS. Yes there are some problems but it's nothing that can't be fixed. And already from Phase 1 to phase 2 BioWare listened to a lot of the player feedback on tacticals.

 

Not saying they will get this right.

 

But you being here trying to convince others to quit with you is extremely tacky.

 

I don't understand it either. Lobbing grenades on the way out the door and for what? Poisoning the forums for new players who come along is all. People who want to play will keep right on playing.

[Lhancelot]

But you being here trying to convince others to quit with you is extremely tacky.

 

Trixxie isn't leaving, she loves the pain too much to leave.

[ZionHalcyon]

I don't understand it either. Lobbing grenades on the way out the door and for what? Poisoning the forums for new players who come along is all. People who want to play will keep right on playing.

 

Yeah, its a bad look.

[Raansu]

Okay then, but it kinda feels like 5.0 to me. It's a disaster that no one asked for, and BW will slowly make changes afterwards when they notice sub numbers dropping, and not a second before. In other words, it's not a new phenomenon. So it's a bit odd to me. The one time BW listened to feedback beforehand was for the Rishi SH. The one exception to the rule. And idk, I guess people saw that, or they saw BW's latest attempt at communication efforts, and they thought "oh boy, they're listening to us this time!"

 

There have been occasions where they have gone back and changed things after getting bad feedback from pts testing.....it was just rare.

[TrixxieTriss]

There have been occasions where they have gone back and changed things after getting bad feedback from pts testing.....it was just rare.

 

Yeah, like when they were going to remove AOE from interrupting capers in Void Star and we told them it would break it. We got them to do a session with us on the PTS and we all spam capped the doors to prove our point.

It’s a shame they didn’t listen to us on that PTS about the lightning Sorc rotation and AOE spam. Maybe if they had, they wouldn’t have nerfed the wrongs things a few months later when everyone was complaining they were OP.

[TrixxieTriss]

And this is what is scaring a lot of us. I came back for onslaught because what they originally talked about sounded interesting and I wanted to see the new story as well. If this current situation goes live though? I'm permanently done with this game. I will not come back.

 

It scares me too and normally I would just be resigned to them doing what theyve done in the past and not listen.

But this time they seem to be more engaged. I can’t every remember them spending so much time on the PTS forum and asking for specific feed back on everything while they are still developing. And I can’t ever remembering them pushing a launch back a month to change stuff already in development (I could be wrong on this, I honestly can’t remember).

 

It’s for those reasons that I’m a little hopeful that getting the community involved more will help steer them in the right direction. Of course, Bioware is a big ship and won’t turn fast, so the sooner we get them to start turning, the faster they can get to where we want them to head towards.

 

Lastly, I dont expect Bioware will release a perfect 6.0. I’m not that naive to think that our feed back will all be listened to or that I’ll like all the changes or that they won’t make some bad decision that many people hate.

My hope though is they are listening to the players this time and won’t make all the same mistakes again that end up making the game less fun and ultimately drive more players from the game.

 

I guess it is a wait and see prospect. But as I’ve said early, if we stay silent and just wait to complain after it’s released, then we are also partly to blame for the situation because we didn’t do it now when they might have been able to change some things.

[TrixxieTriss]

So then basically, you're just here to try to get everyone to quit with you so you can tell BioWare you told them so about them going out of business because you left the game...

 

Ugh, if you unsubbed then just go away.

 

Let those of us left behind worry about PTS. Yes there are some problems but it's nothing that can't be fixed. And already from Phase 1 to phase 2 BioWare listened to a lot of the player feedback on tacticals.

 

Not saying they will get this right.

 

But you being here trying to convince others to quit with you is extremely tacky.

 

Not once have I encouraged anyone to quit.

 

Reading and understanding a meaning are hard sometimes

[TrixxieTriss]

Trixxie isn't leaving, she loves the pain too much to leave.

 

LoL, I might be back, but I have definitely left for the mean time.

My hope is 6.0 won’t be a quagmire of bad Bioware decisions and things will change enough from the PTS to allow people to enjoy playing for fun and not a second job.

I’ve had enough pain for the mean time and it’s taken 3 years of waiting for some other game to come along to give me a break from swtor or I would have left after 5.0 fiasco.

I am having fun in classic at the moment and the player culture is 100% friendlier in the game (of course there are still a few tools in the shed).

 

I’m sure the story part of 6.0 will be good. I’m definitely on the fence that the systems will be anything but terrible. But I’m ready to resub in an instant if they aren’t.

[Jdast]

LoL, I might be back, but I have definitely left for the mean time.

My hope is 6.0 won’t be a quagmire of bad Bioware decisions and things will change enough from the PTS to allow people to enjoy playing for fun and not a second job.

I’ve had enough pain for the mean time and it’s taken 3 years of waiting for some other game to come along to give me a break from swtor or I would have left after 5.0 fiasco.

I am having fun in classic at the moment and the player culture is 100% friendlier in the game (of course there are still a few tools in the shed).

 

I’m sure the story part of 6.0 will be good. I’m definitely on the fence that the systems will be anything but terrible. But I’m ready to resub in an instant if they aren’t.

 

You have an interesting way of leaving.

 

TL-DR: One of my pet peeves is when people ascribe numbers or fuzzy categorizations to their posts; i.e., when people say, "most players" or "the majority."

 

Here I will make an exception...

 

Absolutely NO ONE believes you are quitting, though there is the possibility of you switching to a forum alt.

 

Oh wait, my TL-DR is longer than my post. I deserve a spanking. I've been a bad, bad Hutt.

 

Hugs,

 

Dasty

Edited September 4, 2019 by Jdast

[Darklighter]

So then basically, you're just here to try to get everyone to quit with you so you can tell BioWare you told them so about them going out of business because you left the game...

 

Ugh, if you unsubbed then just go away.

 

Let those of us left behind worry about PTS. Yes there are some problems but it's nothing that can't be fixed. And already from Phase 1 to phase 2 BioWare listened to a lot of the player feedback on tacticals.

 

Not saying they will get this right.

 

But you being here trying to convince others to quit with you is extremely tacky.

 

...still at it, eh Zion? Funny you're giving them a hard time for leaving.....didn't you loudly head out the door way back when.....only to come back later as the biggest Bioware White Knight? Sounds to me like they doesn't WANT to leave, as is trying to get them to see reason so they doesn't end up leaving.

 

Man, that was quite a few years ago...and you're STILL licking their boots...

Edited September 4, 2019 by Darklighter

[kodrac]

You have an interesting way of leaving.

 

We've all tried at one point or another to get BW to listen and ended up taking a break afterwards when they didn't. Haven't we?

[kodrac]

...still at it, eh Zion? Funny you're giving them a hard time for leaving.....didn't you loudly head out the door way back when.....only to come back later as the biggest Bioware White Knight? Sounds to me like they doesn't WANT to leave, as is trying to get them to see reason so they doesn't end up leaving.

 

Man, that was quite a few years ago...and you're STILL licking their boots...

 

Yep, his one man revolt, trying to get Musco fired on his way out. Funny isn't it?

[ZionHalcyon]

...still at it, eh Zion? Funny you're giving them a hard time for leaving.....didn't you loudly head out the door way back when.....only to come back later as the biggest Bioware White Knight? Sounds to me like they doesn't WANT to leave, as is trying to get them to see reason so they doesn't end up leaving.

 

Man, that was quite a few years ago...and you're STILL licking their boots...

 

I left for a year. I wasn't planning on coming back, but the change in direction under Keith BROUGHT me back. Until then, SWTOR was indeed dead to me, and I might not have even known about coming back except for incidentally getting wind of the change in direction while looking up some other things, and then reading Keith's initial producer's note.

 

Now, you want to defend the Ben Irving-led team? Be my guest. But me being back wasn't some emotional flight of fancy. It was earned back. It's called being a human being - you should try it some time.

[ZionHalcyon]

We've all tried at one point or another to get BW to listen and ended up taking a break afterwards when they didn't. Haven't we?

 

True that.

[ZionHalcyon]

Yep, his one man revolt, trying to get Musco fired on his way out. Funny isn't it?

 

I'll let you in on something.

 

I was not happy about what Musco was doing under Ben Irving. And he was an absolutely TERRIBLE community manager during that time.

 

BUT.

 

The man under Keith has been absolute fire. Total 180. A Community Manager now in every sense of the word and FAR more communicative than he has ever been, EVER. Actually collecting feedback from the community too instead of just being used as a pre-expansion-launch hype man.

 

Which honestly made me think what kind of environment the man had to be working in and what kind of stress must he have been under while Ben Irving was in charge?

 

It will NEVER sit right with me that he came on the forums after the dev-stalking incident and essentially blamed everyone in the community for it and threatened to never talk to us again. But he's human, and given his recent performance over Keith's tenure, I can certainly understand the stress of the time, admit the man was human and made a huge mistake in doing that, and let it go given he is seriously kicking *** now.

 

Things changed when Keith took over. If Keith never did and we just got another EA yes-man, I wouldn't be back.

[Ardrossan]

We've all tried at one point or another to get BW to listen and ended up taking a break afterwards when they didn't. Haven't we?

 

Not me. My breaks are at my whim and what BW does or doesn't do has no effect on them. I was thinking about this the other day, and, short of boredom, I think the only breaking point for me would be if I got locked out of my account for some reason, and would have to start a new account and legacy from scratch. In that case, I would just leave.

 

But yes, leaving because the devs don't do what you want is certainly the protocol for the forum drama queens.

[ZionHalcyon]

But yes, leaving because the devs don't do what you want is certainly the protocol for the forum drama queens.

 

As a reformed forum drama queen, I can agree with that.

 

But I will say the year off did me good.

[Lhancelot]

The man under Keith has been absolute fire. Total 180. A Community Manager now in every sense of the word and FAR more communicative than he has ever been, EVER.

 

I must admit this is probably the most shameful boot-licking I have ever witnessed on these here forums.

[Lhancelot]

But yes, leaving because the devs don't do what you want is certainly the protocol for the forum drama queens.

 

Actually not only drama queens leave under such circumstances.

 

I am pretty sure it's fairly common for players in general who are unhappy with the direction of a game to leave it. That directly is due to "devs not doing what they want," as you put it. Pretty normal, actually.

[Rolodome]

But yes, leaving because the devs don't do what you want is certainly the protocol for the forum drama queens.

Naw, that's just what most people do when a game like this goes in a direction they don't want. Unless you're talking about announcing it specifically, but I don't really see that as dramatic. If it's prolonged, I'd just think of it as slow-walking out the door. But whether it's slow or not, if it conveys a specific problem or problems, it could be invaluable feedback.

 

Most people who leave aren't taking breaks. They are leaving for specific reasons, with no intention of coming back, or with very specific ideas about what would need to change for them to consider returning. And then there's the ones who leave for reasons that have nothing to do with the game itself; just natural turnover.