Theron Shan (5.9) Request

[Cowoline]

There is no good exit strategy for this story. None whatsoever.

 

Personally, I was hoping that this story would lead to the end of the Outlander story line. Maybe Lana and Theron were in on it and that leads to the outlander walking out -- but I also dislike what the FEET story and it's aftermath had become. This, however, leads to a probable loss of Lana and Theron and a return to Pub vs Imp and two storylines (along with the problems of still missing companions) and the increased costs related to that should BW ever decide to do something resembling a story again.

 

Other problems are just as bad. Eliminate Theron and you eliminate the only currently guaranteed m-m LI. And Lana is the only F-F LI in the game.

 

Don't allow a way to get rid of Theron? You alienate a large percentage of the remaining players. Kill Theron off or eliminate him from the story? Same result with another large portion of remaining players.

 

Really, part of the goal in FEET was, imo, to have only one storyline and only two scripted companions (Lana and Theron). Lowering costs and accounts for how most used companions pre FEET (1 or 2 and the others are ship "decorations"), but that ignored the realities of what the players felt.

 

In the end, no matter the outcome of the storyline, the player base did not create this problem -- BW did. I've already voted my lack of faith in the producers and what's becoming second year of maintenance mode. My subscription expires in June. There's little BW can do at this point to change my mind. Another 9 month subscriber reward program or yet another token won't cut it. But successfully satisfying everyone (or nearly so) in this storyline might show they still have that edge.

 

This is only the case if they completely eliminate the Alliance though. Alternatively the Alliance could simply be "absorbed" by either the Empire and Republic - or simply remain their allies. Just because they go back to a story more focused on the Empire vs Republic it doesn't mean that everything build so far would be torn down. It's not and all or nothing scenario necessarily.

 

And I doubt they will make the mistake of taking companions from us again.

Edited March 24, 2018 by Cowoline

[IoNonSoEVero]

This is only the case if they completely eliminate the Alliance though. Alternatively the Alliance could simply be "absorbed" by either the Empire and Republic - or simply remain their allies. Just because they go back to a story more focused on the Empire vs Republic it doesn't mean that everything build so far would be torn down. It's not and all or nothing scenario necessarily.

 

And I doubt they will make the mistake of taking companions from us again.

 

But they already have. By May 1, when the next flashpoint is due to come out, Theron will have been gone for eight months. Sure, you can get him back from the terminal if you want (just like all the other missing companions) but that's eight months where he's not been officially available and in the story.

 

I feel like if the Alliance gets absorbed - and that seems like a more plausible path - you will still lose companions. Lana's devoted but I can't see her settling in permanently with the Republic and the Jedi. I can't see Theron doing that with the Imperials. There are companions on both sides who are pretty adamantly opposed to the other faction and would likely walk. Like I can't see Pierce or Talos cheerfully getting absorbed into the Republic, or Rusk, Jorgan or Elara going with the Empire.

 

If we just remain an ally, like Iokath, IMHO it's the only way everyone would likely stick around.

 

I wish I could trust Bioware to do the right thing by us all...but I don't.

[Cowoline]

But they already have. By May 1, when the next flashpoint is due to come out, Theron will have been gone for eight months.

 

Edit: this was invalid. Completely missread it.

 

New answer:

Theron has had almost as much representation as Lana in the story. The only story he hasn't been involved in were the unique companion returns. He is literally essential to the plot. But if this is view as "been taken away and not part of the story", then no wonder BioWare is having trouble satisfying peoples demands.

 

If Lana would have left, she would have done it, when the Alliance commander sided with the Republic on Iokath. Makes no sense for her to leave later on. She already left the empire long before defrosting the outlander.

 

Or they can do a plot twist: The Alliance joins the Hutt Cartel!

Edited March 24, 2018 by Cowoline

[IoNonSoEVero]

Edit: this was invalid. Completely missread it.

 

New answer:

Theron has had almost as much representation as Lana in the story. The only story he hasn't been involved in were the unique companion returns. He is literally essential to the plot. But if this is view as "been taken away and not part of the story", then no wonder BioWare is having trouble satisfying peoples demands.

 

If Lana would have left, she would have done it, when the Alliance commander sided with the Republic on Iokath. Makes no sense for her to leave later on. She already left the empire long before defrosting the outlander.

 

Or they can do a plot twist: The Alliance joins the Hutt Cartel!

 

Theron has been seen in the story, yes, but has the player been able to talk to him, get any letters from him, etc. since August of last year? Not so much. He's seen in the cut scenes and there's no direct interaction with him.

 

I have to disagree regarding Lana. On Iokath, you're still the Alliance. You're a separate entity that is allied with the Republic. You're not a part of it.

 

Being *absorbed* into the Republic would mean that you're no longer a separate faction, you're now part of the Republic. Lana still identifies as a Sith and pushes for the Outlander to ally with the Empire, and is upset if you don't save the Imperial prisoners in the GEMINI deception. In fact she refers to that as "OUR people," if your Outlander is a Sith.

 

She still prefers the Imperials and is still a Sith, and being in a faction where the Sith are hated --the Jedi consider them anathema -- likely would not work for her.

[Elessara]

 

.... successfully satisfying everyone (or nearly so) in this storyline might show they still have that edge.

 

That is impossible. There is no satisfying everyone who plays the game. No company can satisfy everyone who plays their games. Saying "nearly" everyone is subjective because what does that mean? 75% of the players .. 80%? More? Less?

 

I don't think they've done a good job with the story recently but that's an impossible standard there.

[Cowoline]

Theron has been seen in the story, yes, but has the player been able to talk to him, get any letters from him, etc. since August of last year? Not so much. He's seen in the cut scenes and there's no direct interaction with him.

 

I have to disagree regarding Lana. On Iokath, you're still the Alliance. You're a separate entity that is allied with the Republic. You're not a part of it.

 

Being *absorbed* into the Republic would mean that you're no longer a separate faction, you're now part of the Republic. Lana still identifies as a Sith and pushes for the Outlander to ally with the Empire, and is upset if you don't save the Imperial prisoners in the GEMINI deception. In fact she refers to that as "OUR people," if your Outlander is a Sith.

 

She still prefers the Imperials and is still a Sith, and being in a faction where the Sith are hated --the Jedi consider them anathema -- likely would not work for her.

 

You have been able to have three more conversations with Lana and gotten one more letter from her than Theron the past 8 months. He has been more represented than most of any of the other LI and companions. I love Theron, but what you are complaining about, is really minor compared to how little story there has been.

 

And they are not going to go completely away from the alliance. There are too many features, characters and content merged into the Alliance. Repeatable chapters and the new FP being a perfect example of this. The Alliance might support a certain faction (which has already happened), but beyond that it's going nowhere. It just wouldnøt make sense - especially not with this new Herald's of Zildrog plot.

[Cowoline]

That is impossible. There is no satisfying everyone who plays the game. No company can satisfy everyone who plays their games. Saying "nearly" everyone is subjective because what does that mean? 75% of the players .. 80%? More? Less?

 

I don't think they've done a good job with the story recently but that's an impossible standard there.

 

Completely agree with this. Some of the reason why the game has gotten the "it's dead" reputation, is because peoples demands are completely out of proportion with reality. It hasn't been great with amazing content, but people forget that Ben left and Kieth took over. It seems like there is a very little understanding of how long it takes to restructure something as massive as this and implement new changes. And if you have noticed it seems like they are trying to hurry finishing companion returns so that they can move on to something else. They obviously had great plans for something that got ditched halfway through the process. You can't expect it to not leave some sort of mark. Until we have seen what 6.0 truly is, then there is no reason to cry wolf.

[Paulsutherland]

Maybe they'll keep the player in the Alliance, but now and then he or she goes out to help the Empire or Republic with X?

[IoNonSoEVero]

You have been able to have three more conversations with Lana and gotten one more letter from her than Theron the past 8 months. He has been more represented than most of any of the other LI and companions. I love Theron, but what you are complaining about, is really minor compared to how little story there has been.

 

And they are not going to go completely away from the alliance. There are too many features, characters and content merged into the Alliance. Repeatable chapters and the new FP being a perfect example of this. The Alliance might support a certain faction (which has already happened), but beyond that it's going nowhere. It just wouldnøt make sense - especially not with this new Herald's of Zildrog plot.

 

We can agree that in terms of story, we're getting next to nothing. I'm actually not complaining. I personally really intensely detest Theron and nobody in my game romances him. I'm just pointing out that after ,Theron was removed from your companion list and the Odessen base (unless it was bugged, LOL) and that you had to get him back via the terminal - so I do NOT trust that Bioware won't rip more companions away in the future. I don't trust them to do the right thing anymore, or come up with fair or plausible story.

[Cowoline]

We can agree that in terms of story, we're getting next to nothing. I'm actually not complaining. I personally really intensely detest Theron and nobody in my game romances him. I'm just pointing out that after ,Theron was removed from your companion list and the Odessen base (unless it was bugged, LOL) and that you had to get him back via the terminal - so I do NOT trust that Bioware won't rip more companions away in the future. I don't trust them to do the right thing anymore, or come up with fair or plausible story.

 

Ripping people out of the story and then using them as plot devices is not the same though. I think the comparison in this case is a little unfair.

[Keta]

This is only the case if they completely eliminate the Alliance though. Alternatively the Alliance could simply be "absorbed" by either the Empire and Republic - or simply remain their allies. Just because they go back to a story more focused on the Empire vs Republic it doesn't mean that everything build so far would be torn down. It's not and all or nothing scenario necessarily.

 

And I doubt they will make the mistake of taking companions from us again.

 

Regarding eliminating the alliance, you're exactly correct. There's no simple way out for this. It might be interesting reading to see what the original FEET trilogy had in mind for the end result. Was all this due to truncated version we got or ....

 

I personally see no satisfying way out.

[Cowoline]

Regarding eliminating the alliance, you're exactly correct. There's no simple way out for this. It might be interesting reading to see what the original FEET trilogy had in mind for the end result. Was all this due to truncated version we got or ....

 

I personally see no satisfying way out.

 

I think you might be right. But there might be an "okay" way for the story to continue. I'm always looking forward to story updates, and I try to just enjoy it as is rather than concentrating too much on what I think it should be.

[devilkat]

But they already have. By May 1, when the next flashpoint is due to come out, Theron will have been gone for eight months. Sure, you can get him back from the terminal if you want (just like all the other missing companions) but that's eight months where he's not been officially available and in the story.

 

I feel like if the Alliance gets absorbed - and that seems like a more plausible path - you will still lose companions. Lana's devoted but I can't see her settling in permanently with the Republic and the Jedi. I can't see Theron doing that with the Imperials. There are companions on both sides who are pretty adamantly opposed to the other faction and would likely walk. Like I can't see Pierce or Talos cheerfully getting absorbed into the Republic, or Rusk, Jorgan or Elara going with the Empire.

 

If we just remain an ally, like Iokath, IMHO it's the only way everyone would likely stick around.

 

I wish I could trust Bioware to do the right thing by us all...but I don't.

 

There are also a lot Outlanders who don't want to go back. Some have turned on their old factions. Some may not have, but are romancing someone from the opposite faction. I, for one, am bored with the Imp vs Pub story as it was. It might be interesting to have this new Order wreak a little havoc and see what shakes out. Maybe decimate all 3 factions had force a new story that way.

[DuchessKristania]

Personally, I hope they keep all three factions but write in a way that players can absorb back into Pub/Imp, or remain a separate entity by continuing with the Alliance. Some of my characters simply would not go back to their original factions. I don't know how many of mine would, actually.

 

I think the Alliance is too integrated into the game as a whole to be completely eliminated at this point. I do hope that they provide the choice to return to original factions for those who want to. I mean, it may end up being something as simple as a dialogue wheel with three options a). Return to Republic, b). Return to Empire, c). Remain with Alliance. Then all future story would have something similar to Iokath in that you'd choose to side with Republic or Empire if you had already chosen to remain with the Alliance.

Edited March 24, 2018 by DuchessKristania

[Cowoline]

Personally, I hope they keep all three factions but write in a way that players can absorb back into Pub/Imp, or remain a separate entity by continuing with the Alliance. Some of my characters simply would not go back to their original factions. I don't know how many of mine would, actually.

 

I think the Alliance is too integrated into the game as a whole to be completely eliminated at this point. I do hope that they provide the choice to return to original factions for those who want to. I mean, it may end up being something as simple as a dialogue wheel with three options a). Return to Republic, b). Return to Empire, c). Remain with Alliance. Then all future story would have something similar to Iokath in that you'd choose to side with Republic or Empire if you had already chosen to remain with the Alliance.

 

Completely agree with this.

[MikeCobalt]

I don't think they shoulda started any of this "Comp. Killing" mess. IF...there are any more stories (This is a Story Based" game afterall) the Dev's will have a complicated *Puzzle of Companions (Who's alive, Who's Available, Who's the most alive percentage and more) to pick through just to start. Its a big mess they didn't have to start or need if the story was more *Thoroughly thought-out. Never shoulda started and now its a "Big Mess". Ultimately there is no "For me", Killing any character in even a handful of players stories effectively "Deadens" that character for Everybody (Except Arcann the Precious).

[Eshvara]

I don't think they shoulda started any of this "Comp. Killing" mess. IF...there are any more stories (This is a Story Based" game afterall) the Dev's will have a complicated *Puzzle of Companions (Who's alive, Who's Available, Who's the most alive percentage and more) to pick through just to start. Its a big mess they didn't have to start or need if the story was more *Thoroughly thought-out. Never shoulda started and now its a "Big Mess". Ultimately there is no "For me", Killing any character in even a handful of players stories effectively "Deadens" that character for Everybody (Except Arcann the Precious).

 

I think, that the problem lies with how there are just too many companions at this time and a story that's virtually never ends. It kind of reminds me of ME:2 While it was fun, there were just too many!!! I was kind of relieved to see the fat trimmed on that one in ME:3.🎅

[IoNonSoEVero]

There are also a lot Outlanders who don't want to go back. Some have turned on their old factions. Some may not have, but are romancing someone from the opposite faction. I, for one, am bored with the Imp vs Pub story as it was. It might be interesting to have this new Order wreak a little havoc and see what shakes out. Maybe decimate all 3 factions had force a new story that way.

 

That's a really good point. My Outlanders actually all would feel this way. They'll side with the Empire but they don't to go back to answering to anyone else and they'd rather stay independent, doing their own thing without all that baggage. I find the Imps vs. Reps trope really tired and boring, myself, and I like being able to work with open minded people from all over.

 

I think my Outlanders would rather say 'peace out' and vanish into the Rishi Maze before they'd go back to being the Wrath or a Dark Councillor, and they'd throw themselves into a sarlacc before joining the Republic.

 

It will be verrrry interesting to see what the Zlidrog order can accomplish.

Edited March 24, 2018 by IoNonSoEVero

[MikeCobalt]

I think, that the problem lies with how there are just too many companions at this time and a story that's virtually never ends. It kind of reminds me of ME:2 While it was fun, there were just too many!!! I was kind of relieved to see the fat trimmed on that one in ME:3.🎅

 

I'm sure your right I thought this during the Zakuul Chapters, they were "Whittling" down the vast number of companions (Too many V.A.'s- Paychecks). BioWare created a Gem with this game long ago, A game that went Far Beyond the simplistic "Run>Click>Shoot" trope of the general game format. Through Mismanagement They were unable to maintain that Gem and only able to sustain a far weaker version.

[AbilityDrain]

I'd have no problem with kill options IF:

 

1) It makes sense for the story arc to go down that route.

 

AND

 

2) IF those potentially killable companions still played a part in the story going forward (which so far hasn't been the case).

 

Look at the Torian/Vette situation, regardless of who you save neither of them play a part in the story once the choice is made, had they handled it the way Mass Effect did with the Ashley/Kaidan choice on Virmire (with the saved character still featuring heavily in the plot) then it would be fine. I think the biggest problem is that the expansions gave us far too many companions and as a result, left the killable ones on the sidelines because they have 10000000+ others to potentially showcase instead.

 

Personally, I feel they should've gone for a smaller crew made up of our class companions, Senya (to represent Zakuul and the whole Arcann/Vaylin situation), Lana and Theron (since they formed the Alliance) and Koth as our pilot (but not as a fully fledge companion, think along the same lines as Joker from Mass Effect). Any other character that shows up (and isn't one of our original class companions) could've just been a guest appearance for that particular scene/mission that we part ways with after the objective is complete. It would've upped the replayability factor too because we'd have an incentive to play through the expansions with each class.

Edited March 24, 2018 by AbilityDrain

[MrJunay]

By the way, given that the story returns to the theme "Imp vs Resp", most likely we will have to choose a faction and the opposing faction's companions will leave us ... Thus, the players will get rid of this huge herd of companions.

[Suzsi]

We only have one LI who gets a decent amount of attention, lets not kill him and have him put on the shelf with the others

 

The fact that Theron still gets romance content when no of the others do is about the only reason I still have a sub. Zero decent romance content, zero sub.

Edited March 24, 2018 by Suzsi

[Eshvara]

I'm sure your right I thought this during the Zakuul Chapters, they were "Whittling" down the vast number of companions (Too many V.A.'s- Paychecks). BioWare created a Gem with this game long ago, A game that went Far Beyond the simplistic "Run>Click>Shoot" trope of the general game format. Through Mismanagement They were unable to maintain that Gem and only able to sustain a far weaker version.

 

Yeah agreed. Doesn't sound unreasonable though when you think of it, there really are a lot of companions.

I'm quite surprised they did as much as they did!

Edited March 24, 2018 by Eshvara

[DuchessKristania]

To be honest, I like having comps from different classes. There are always a couple in each class that I really enjoy running with, and then some I can't stand. That being said, I think the best way to appease the player base is to simply make all the companions available through the terminal. People who don't want them don't have to have them and those who do, like myself, can pick and choose the comps they want. I doubt they're going to utilize the vanilla comps in future story anyway, so what does it matter if we assemble a crew of our choosing?

 

Even if, and I think it's a pretty big if, they used vanilla comps, the writing conflict would be a simple one to prevent. All original comps would return by default, leaving the comps from other classes retrievable via the terminal. The retrieved companions could just stand in the background of cutscenes, while the original class comps had all the lines. There's a middle ground that the dev team can walk with this, and no reason to jump into a permanent companion purge.

 

From a story perspective, in a post-Alliance world there would be character cross over. It's not unrealistic to imagine some of the companions would cross over to the opposing factions.

Edited March 24, 2018 by DuchessKristania

[ThomasStarWars]

By the way, given that the story returns to the theme "Imp vs Resp", most likely we will have to choose a faction and the opposing faction's companions will leave us ... Thus, the players will get rid of this huge herd of companions.

 

I can't wait for this.