Now give us all Cross Faction maps

[TrixxieTriss]

And it seems like one of the solutions we have the most hope (but still rather little, imo) of actually bullying bioware into implementing. It's what, year 6 of swtor? We've gotta be pragmatic in our asks

 

I think it’s pragmatic. Its obvious they can get the queue to do it, so it’s not a technical hurdle. The only hurdle I’ve heard of is the voice overs at the beginning. Even that can be surpassed because there is already an announcement if you are playing the same faction. But even if that was a problem for some WZs, it wouldn’t be for Hutt Ball because the factions aren’t even mentioned.

[TrixxieTriss]

On Star Forge it's fairly balanced in the latter, so I don't really see across the board cross-faction queues as necessary for either side to get wins. On that server if you solo pug equally on both factions (and I do) the wins and losses are more or less the same regardless of what faction you queue on. Of course sometimes one faction can go on a run but in the end it seems to balance out. I think Reps win slightly more often, usually because they have more heals or skanks, but not to the extent that the devs need to step in and fix things. If Reps have an edge it is very slight.

 

One faction completely dominating the other is mainly a Satele Shan thing, where Imps usually ROFLstomp Pubs, and that could be solved by some good PVPers starting to queue on Rep side toons. Instead everyone stacks Imp and worsens the problem.

 

I'm in favor of across the board cross faction queues but only to reduce queue times when necessary.

 

SF is in no way balanced. A lot of the Imps are really terrible, much worse than the reps. The problem is there are more Imps than reps, so the reps get less pvp pops than Imps.

Cross faction doesn’t just balance skill across the population, it also balances numbers so reps can get some more pvp games.

[TrixxieTriss]

It isn't a problem on every server. Sorry, but that's just not the case on Star Forge.

 

As someone who only concentrates on pvp and plays on both SS and SF, I can say from my experience, that Imps are worse on SF than Reps. Some are so bad that when Yavin pops, even when I’m on an Imp class, I pray there will be more reps than Imps.

[helpmewin]

Don't think thats a good idea. I'd rather to see back sith vs jedi confrontation, objective based owPvP. Some cross faction maps - yes, yolo ranked cross-faction is what actually peoples asking about for a years, its a Baron Deathmark deathmatch - not breaking any lore - as a Huttball maps btw - they should be cross-faction too. Edited January 14, 2018 by helpmewin

[TrixxieTriss]

I am all for every map to be cross faction. Pvpers want to PvP not sit in que waiting. Fortunately the server merges helped a lot with waiting. But why stop there when you can make ques pop even more.

 

Queue pops have slowed right down to what they were just after the mergers and they continue to slow and will get worse as the weather in the US warms up and you move into your summer.

I’m already experiencing 2 hour wait times outside of US prime times because Bioware have driven other APAC players from the game. This was a problem before the mergers and it’s quickly getting bad again.

Cross faction helps in multiple ways.

1. Fixes Faction skill imbalance

2. Fixes faction population imbalance

3. Increases pop times

[Rafiknoll]

Whilst I can see the merits of this, this is Star Wars. Republic vs the Empire. Bioware killed of OWPVP because people were whining that they had to pvp on a pvp server.....

 

The joined "alliance" story was bad enough, now people want cross faction everything. When they get that, next it will be, just make the game have one class, to prevent class imbalance, it gives all players an equal chance etc etc.

There is no room for RP in PVP, and as I said before: since 1.0 when they match light bounty hunters who killed a sith at the chancellor's request and a dark sith warrior who is the emperor's wrath in the same side of a PVP match, in order to fight the Jedi who faced the emepror and saved the galaxy teamed up with the crimelord who couldn't care less about the republic, the consideration of lore and RP in PVP was just non-existent.

It has nothing to do with them simplifying the game, cross-faction and the removal of surge rating have nothing to do with one another. Don't mix subjects...

 

Notice I am just listing the reason's you lot gave for cross faction PVP?

 

Then it will be just make the only class in the game have one single ability, due to some abilities being far more powerful than others.

 

We may as well just sit in a dark room with our eyes shut, sitting on our hands and not breathing.

 

If you want no factions, go play a MOBA like League of Legends etc.

No, there is no connection at all. Unless all classes are same they will never be truly 100% equal, but there is absolutely no reason that a mirror class will have better chances just because of the faction that the player has chosen. There is absolutely no reason that I would rather play my sin tank and not a shadow tank using the very same legacy gear just because it is more likely (at some hours on some servers) that my team will actually work with me toward the same goal and not each trying to be a hero and failing... And again don't mix the simplification of the game and the removal of stats with cross-faction, it just has nothing in common.

 

It's bad enough they removed almost all stats from the game because people were too incompetent to realise that Sniper's did not need strength, and that a merc healer in a dps cell wasn't going very far. Also apparently it was too hard for people to work out how much surge they needed also?

And even though it isn't connected let's answer the 3 complaints:

Mastery was introduced to ease the transfer of gear between characters, basically allowing you to gear each role right side once and use it for any of your characters, suffering only from the penalty of a weaker left side, lack of set bonus, and sometimes untuned min-maxing, until the alt can get its own gear. I play my concealment, who is still on tier one, using my 248 DPS gear of my deception sin. No set bonus, but still better performance than what my concealment would have with the gear it gets from crates. You among all people should appreciate this change, given your hate for the need of "pagan rituals" to get gear these days. The fact that noobs now don't get to gear the wrong primary stat is just a blesses side effect.

Stances were removed because it enabled players to abuse the ability to switch them under certain circumstances. It mostly happened with juggs and guardians who could switch stances with no resource cost, no CD and no activation time. So tanks would sometimes switch to shi-cho to get rage faster, or DPS would switch to soresu for the armor bonus (even if they didn't hold a shield), to get more tanky and hold people off longer than they should be able to. Therefore, stances were removed from all classes with stances (didn't make sense to remove it only for some and leave it for others, again causing the blessed side effect of noobs being forced out of the wrong stances (though NOT solving the noob problem, because the offhand still ruins everything when talking about 3/5 of the classes with stances, which are tanking classes, and the noobs still use wrong offhands both ways)

Surge was removed because accuracy became more necessary (because it became important for total F/T-based classes such as the sorcs who didn't need it at all before), therefore consumed more of the little tertiary stats we have to spare (remember that at the same time they restricted all stats except for defense and power to tertiary, meaning that there were no longer mods with them, only enhancements). If surge and critical would be left untouched, it would be stupid for almost all specs except for lightning (and maybe some healers) to pick any surge at all, because after the needed alacrity and accuracy are gained, you have so little left to spare that it better all go to crit. So they merged crit and surge, to keep the stat in usage. And if you call that simplification then you probably don't know that 90% of the players don't have any idea what happens when crit chance goes other 100%, and therefore make many wrong decisions.

 

The dumbing down of almost everything in this is game is becoming painful. Lets not start messing with the fundamentals of Star Wars as well now please.

 

They messed with fundamentals when they added a 3rd party, united the sworn enemies, killed Vitiate completely when fighting the Outlander, even if he is a nameless agent, a republic privateer, or a major whose primary story achievement is undoing what a companion of the sith warrior does in a "brb-black screen-done" ship conversation. Then let the same outlander become the commander of the eternal alliance and the eternal fleet, which means in other words that he is the emperor of the galaxy and can destroy either the old republic or the old empire on a whim. Making cross-faction maps based on that already written ("fundamental breaking") story, will not do any more damage on that aspect, and (3rd time) has nothing to do with BioWare dumbing down the game (which is a thing, but all the examples you gave for it are wrong. You can see the dumbing down in the nerfing of PVE content such as Manaan for example, which lets the worse coordinated group eventually kill the 1st boss even though it required coordination or death in eternal combat when it was released)

[omaan]

Factional racism? You DO realize that many players play both factions? I am quite sure that if I make a shadow tank I will be as skilled with it as I am with my sin. And have you never met useless imps?

Are you also claiming to have never lost to reps? Even if you would say something such as "if I lost they were premade" or "if reps win its only because they have more healers", both answers still support cross-faction because it is a solution. Even if one group gets 5 healers versus 0 healers as a result of the mismatchmaking, now everyone regardless of something meaningless such as faction has 50% chance to be on either side. Even if you say "tbh no, imps ALWAYS win versus reps" it is a reason to do cross-faction to even the odds of both groups.

 

I upvote the OP. Good idea, and do it in solo ranked and GSF too (too bad it is impossible in TR... Oh well, one place for the faction-elitists to retreat to )

 

First rep to post a picture of himself carrying the quoted number-wise or even better objective-wise (solo capped a node to turn the tide, for example) will do us a great service for proving the point. Any skill gap faction-wise is incidental.

 

Server merges were done so wrzs popping with same ratio for both factions, so there is NO REASON to provide cross-faction anymore. Healers?'both factions have many healers so i dont see any reasons for cross-faction because it wont fix crap matchmaking. Iam more than sure that those who cry for cross- faction just want to be carried by other faction because crier's faction is BAD.

[omaan]

Whilst I can see the merits of this, this is Star Wars. Republic vs the Empire. Bioware killed of OWPVP because people were whining that they had to pvp on a pvp server.....

 

The joined "alliance" story was bad enough, now people want cross faction everything. When they get that, next it will be, just make the game have one class, to prevent class imbalance, it gives all players an equal chance etc etc.

 

Notice I am just listing the reason's you lot gave for cross faction PVP?

 

Then it will be just make the only class in the game have one single ability, due to some abilities being far more powerful than others.

 

We may as well just sit in a dark room with our eyes shut, sitting on our hands and not breathing.

 

If you want no factions, go play a MOBA like League of Legends etc.

 

It's bad enough they removed almost all stats from the game because people were too incompetent to realise that Sniper's did not need strength, and that a merc healer in a dps cell wasn't going very far. Also apparently it was too hard for people to work out how much surge they needed also?

 

The dumbing down of almost everything in this is game is becoming painful. Lets not start messing with the fundamentals of Star Wars as well now please.

 

I fully agree with you here. Servers merged, no sense for making cross-factions. MMO like wow,swtor etc always have different factions fighting with each other. Everyone chooses the faction he likes most. Combining them is stupid, and i see no reason for it. Iam sure we just have a bunch of whiners here who looses in regs/solo ranked because their faction is bad. But it is their fault not ours.

 

First they will cry for cross-faction pvp, then cross-faction fleet, then cross-faction guilds, and in the end this game will turn into trash without any real lore where there will be one faction vs npc. There wont be any real war going on, no one to fight really.

[Rafiknoll]

Server merges were done so wrzs popping with same ratio for both factions, so there is NO REASON to provide cross-faction anymore. Healers?'both factions have many healers so i dont see any reasons for cross-faction because it wont fix crap matchmaking. Iam more than sure that those who cry for cross- faction just want to be carried by other faction because crier's faction is BAD.

Red is false info, knocking down your whole post. It is fact that in some servers in some hours rep queue will pop nothing but cross-faction maps. People already complain about it.

Yellow is a pure unprovable insult. Some of the people in this thread are skilled PVPers, who have proven to make sense in various "nerf XYZ" threads. As for myself, for example, I am from DM. There is no dominant faction there, or at least I never felt constantly dominating/dominated. You still avoid the fact that your factional racism is truly based on nothing.

 

You quoted me and referred to my response one rhetoric possible answer that you could have answered my questions. Watch the words, I said "Even if you would say something such as ... "if reps win it's only because they have more healers"". So ok, you don't say that, so you should disregard the answer I presented in case you do.

What you SHOULD do is instead is to actually answer my questions because apparently, the answers I tried to predict are not your answers. So please do answer these questions, and I will not assume possible answers, I will just wait and respond to them. Questions copied from my previous post for convenience:

"Factional racism? You DO realize that many players play both factions? I am quite sure that if I make a shadow tank I will be as skilled with it as I am with my sin. And have you never met useless imps?

Are you also claiming to have never lost to reps?"

[Rafiknoll]

First they will cry for cross-faction pvp, then cross-faction fleet, then cross-faction guilds, and in the end this game will turn into trash without any real lore where there will be one faction vs npc. There wont be any real war going on, no one to fight really.

 

Listen to yourself, if people want PVP to be cross-faction because their faction is bad, why would they need cross-fleets? And why not have cross guilds really? You are acting as if you never met people who play both factions.

Really, the RP, it burns!! [Don't have anything against RPers, but don't hide behind different motives]

 

Also, "no one to fight"? Do pops not happen in "training matches" imp vs imp already? Being pushed into PVP match is enough reason to fight, we don't need 3000 years of ancient nations fighting in hatred as reason...

[TrixxieTriss]

Server merges were done so wrzs popping with same ratio for both factions, so there is NO REASON to provide cross-faction anymore. Healers?'both factions have many healers so i dont see any reasons for cross-faction because it wont fix crap matchmaking. Iam more than sure that those who cry for cross- faction just want to be carried by other faction because crier's faction is BAD.

 

That may have been so, but the reality is thats not what is actually happening now. The smaller faction is now popping a lot less since they put Yavins pop back to normal. That alone should indicate that without cross faction, pop times for that faction are affected when it’s not there. That is enough of a reason to have it for every map.

 

No one wants to be carried and I can tell you from experience that there are just as many good vs bad players in both factions.

 

There is no match making at all in regs. There isn’t even an algorithm to try. So complaining that the match making is bad is pointless because there isn’t any. If you want matchmaking, I suggest you start a thread to ask for it.

 

We need cross faction to improve the health of pvp and the pop times. There is nothing negative about cross faction, it is all in your head or you are trying to make excuses for Role Players. The probelem with that is there should be zero RP while matches are going on. All you see is red flagged enemies, so most of the time your brain doesn’t even register that they are reps or Imps, just that they need to die.

Edited January 14, 2018 by TrixxieTriss

[TrixxieTriss]

Red is false info, knocking down your whole post. It is fact that in some servers in some hours rep queue will pop nothing but cross-faction maps. People already complain about it.

Yellow is a pure unprovable insult. Some of the people in this thread are skilled PVPers, who have proven to make sense in various "nerf XYZ" threads. As for myself, for example, I am from DM. There is no dominant faction there, or at least I never felt constantly dominating/dominated. You still avoid the fact that your factional racism is truly based on nothing.

 

You quoted me and referred to my response one rhetoric possible answer that you could have answered my questions. Watch the words, I said "Even if you would say something such as ... "if reps win it's only because they have more healers"". So ok, you don't say that, so you should disregard the answer I presented in case you do.

What you SHOULD do is instead is to actually answer my questions because apparently, the answers I tried to predict are not your answers. So please do answer these questions, and I will not assume possible answers, I will just wait and respond to them. Questions copied from my previous post for convenience:

"Factional racism? You DO realize that many players play both factions? I am quite sure that if I make a shadow tank I will be as skilled with it as I am with my sin. And have you never met useless imps?

Are you also claiming to have never lost to reps?"

 

What’s interesting is on SF, is it’s mainly the Imps running double healer skank premades.

[DzastinBiberi]

Umm....no.

[sayNih]

'the health of PvP'?

The reason we switched to Imp was because it became a gear grind, and winning was essential.

Now Group Ranked is a degenerate mat-grind.

There is nothing healthy about SWTOR pvp. Even if you do C/F all of Unranked, good players will form pre-mades.

[omaan]

Red is false info, knocking down your whole post. It is fact that in some servers in some hours rep queue will pop nothing but cross-faction maps. People already complain about it.

Yellow is a pure unprovable insult. Some of the people in this thread are skilled PVPers, who have proven to make sense in various "nerf XYZ" threads. As for myself, for example, I am from DM. There is no dominant faction there, or at least I never felt constantly dominating/dominated. You still avoid the fact that your factional racism is truly based on nothing.

 

You quoted me and referred to my response one rhetoric possible answer that you could have answered my questions. Watch the words, I said "Even if you would say something such as ... "if reps win it's only because they have more healers"". So ok, you don't say that, so you should disregard the answer I presented in case you do.

What you SHOULD do is instead is to actually answer my questions because apparently, the answers I tried to predict are not your answers. So please do answer these questions, and I will not assume possible answers, I will just wait and respond to them. Questions copied from my previous post for convenience:

"Factional racism? You DO realize that many players play both factions? I am quite sure that if I make a shadow tank I will be as skilled with it as I am with my sin. And have you never met useless imps?

Are you also claiming to have never lost to reps?"

 

If reps are getting yavin or odessen pops during what you said "in some servers in some hours rep queue will pop nothing but cross-faction maps." Means we dont need any cross-faction. If someones servers is SOO BAD that they dont get any pops while playing on their faction it means that their servers is nearly dead, and even server merges didnt help them. In addition to this, it also might mean that their playersCHOOSED their faction and their path, and that pvp players are not interested in republic or empire.

 

I played on DM, SF and tulak hord. All these servers HAVE constant queue pops on both factions during different periods, and i see NO REASON to make all wrzs cross faction. Rp is RP, imps are imps, reps are reps. Thats why i always leave yavin and odessen. I dont like reps, i have all rights to do so because they are my enemies. I like to kill them though. And i KNOW IAM NOT ALONE here.

[Rafiknoll]

If reps are getting yavin or odessen pops during what you said "in some servers in some hours rep queue will pop nothing but cross-faction maps." Means we dont need any cross-faction. If someones servers is SOO BAD that they dont get any pops while playing on their faction it means that their servers is nearly dead, and even server merges didnt help them. In addition to this, it also might mean that their playersCHOOSED their faction and their path, and that pvp players are not interested in republic or empire.

Green is wrong, it means they get a pop only because there are imps to fill their group. It is truly not rare to get to the point where 15 reps queue while 25 imps queue. That means that there can only be one full rep group at a time. Resulting in always one imp vs rep and 1 imp vs imp going on while 7 reps and 1 imp get no pop, while cross-faction would give them an arena.

The rest I just don't understand. I understand your words but not how they support your ideal...

 

 

Rp is RP, imps are imps, reps are reps. Thats why i always leave yavin and odessen. I dont like reps, i have all rights to do so because they are my enemies. I like to kill them though. And i KNOW IAM NOT ALONE here.

At least you backed off from the nonesense about "carrying bad reps"...

But really: " i have all rights to do so because they are my enemies"?? You do realize it is a game, that most of its players don't RP and play both factions? The people currently playing reps aren't your enemies, not more than the opposing team in a soccer game. Many of them relog in the empire and fight beside you sometimes, calling them enemies is just taking RP too far into places it shouldn't matter. I repeat again: RP does NOT matter AT ALL in PVP.

RP is RP, PVP is PVP, RP is not PVP, PVP is not RP. There used to be seperate servers for that. If there would still be seperate RP servers it would make sense for these to exclude cross-faction content, while at it, exclude huttballs too, because there is no way lords of the dark council would play for a hutt's pleasure. Maybe also separate force and non-force sensitives in PVP because it makes no sense that a scoundrel can kill a lord of the dark council after being disarmed by an apprentice, or for an agent to beat the Jedi who defeated the emperor in single combat, not to mention what I said multiple times about having dark and light players being non-sensically teamed up. The light hunter would rather team up with Jedi, and the dark smuggler should be the sworn enemy of the light smuggler.

 

So for all RP players: leave RP considerations out of conversations about the general good of PVP. Remain objective when making assumptions about the enemy's skills and choices, because they are just normal people, and if they aren't role players, factions could be totally irrelevant to them, or a matter of conveniences such as "which effects look cooler" or "where the conquesting guild is".

[TrixxieTriss]

If reps are getting yavin or odessen pops during what you said "in some servers in some hours rep queue will pop nothing but cross-faction maps." Means we dont need any cross-faction. If someones servers is SOO BAD that they dont get any pops while playing on their faction it means that their servers is nearly dead, and even server merges didnt help them. In addition to this, it also might mean that their playersCHOOSED their faction and their path, and that pvp players are not interested in republic or empire.

 

I played on DM, SF and tulak hord. All these servers HAVE constant queue pops on both factions during different periods, and i see NO REASON to make all wrzs cross faction. Rp is RP, imps are imps, reps are reps. Thats why i always leave yavin and odessen. I dont like reps, i have all rights to do so because they are my enemies. I like to kill them though. And i KNOW IAM NOT ALONE here.

 

Let me correct a couple of things

 

1. The queue doesn’t work like that.

If the algorithm wants to give you a Hutt Ball next, it won’t matter if you have enough for a cross faction map, but not enough for a 2 faction Hutt Ball match. Because the queue will wait till you have enough for Hutt Ball.

It’s the same as if you have enough for a 4v4, but it wants to give you Hutt Ball, it will make you wait in the queue till you have enough even if it’s a 2 hour wait.

 

2. You may get constant pops when you play, but not all of us do. Let me refer to a couple of posts made in another thread so I don’t have to write it out again.

 

Sorry I have a long post, read at your own peril 😉

 

It also comes down to timezones and the time you can login. For me, getting pvp pops is getting much harder than it was before Xmas. I waited 2 hours the other night and that was before they even put Yavin back into a normal rotation. And don’t even bother trying to do lowbies or mids anymore at those times, they just don’t pop. But two weeks ago I could get pops just as fast in those 2 brackets as I could in lvl 70 pvp.

There has been a massive reduction in how many people are now playing at those times. This is what happened on Harbinger about 18 months ago. Back then when I complained about it, I was told I had to play in US prime time and to stop QQing because there was no problem in prime time (great attitude for a global game). Anyway I tried to change my play times and would get up super early to play before work or do all nighters on the weekend.

Even then I saw the prime times shrinking. Over the course of 12 months the prime time bracket shrunk by about 30%. But the people who only played in that time bracket still didn’t see that their own prime time was shrinking and I was still being told I was imagining it and I should stop QQing. Then when it shrunk more, the excuse was it was US summer time and people were outside (we all know true nerds are allergic to the sun 😉.) But then summer ended and people started to grumble they need mergers because the population was slowing down pops outside of a 2-3 hour prime time. But still, there were people who only played for 2 hours and they were saying we didn’t need mergers because pops were fast in prime time 🙄. So even more people left the game.

My concern is history is repeating itself. We are already seeing a big decline outside of the prime time and the prime time is shrinking yet again and it’s still winter in the US, so what happens when we get to summer? I guess we’ll all find out when pops outside of a 3 hour window go from 5 mins to 2 hours or not pop at all.

This is why I questioned the wisdom of even having 2 US servers after they moved them to the same location. I could already see that this problem would happen again and they would need to merge once more, although I did think it would take longer for this situation to develope (I’m shocked at how fast this has happened). The fact that it’s only been a month since the mergers says a lot about the actual health of the game. It made sense to have two servers “if” there was one located in each region. It makes zero sense to split the population when they are located in the same Data Centre. I really hope when it gets to the stage that we need another merger, that Bioware don’t drag their feet again for 12 months or we’ll be having a swtor funeral.

Unfortunately, people who do not play odd hours or on the fringes of when prime time is expected, will not experience this problem for many months, maybe not till the end of the year, so I expect to be told over and over again that the game “is” healthy and isn’t dying because people can see 3-4 instances when they are on. The worst of these will be the white knights who will say the game’s healthy till they switch off the servers.

As someone who has to adjust their life around this game if I want to play it, I can already see it slipping back to where it was 12 months ago and it’s doing it much faster than it was before.

IMO, the worst thing they did for this game internationally was to cull the apac players from the game. We may not have been as big a population as the US players, but it allowed people to play at odd (US) times and still get pops. This not only affects the remaining few APAC players like myself, but also any US players who do shift work or can’t play in prime time, all that does is drive more people away than just APAC players and hastens the shrinkage of prime time, which leads to more people leaving. The whole thing is a massive snow ball affect and detrimental to the game’s over all health. EA seem to never look at cause and affect, all they look at is how they can make a quick dollar in that financial quarter, then they wonder why game’s fail or they lose player base. EA isn’t a gaming company for gamers, it’s an investment company for people playing the stock market who want their profits by any means necessary. They don’t need EA to keep a game going in the long term because they can just sell stocks and move on. They have no personal attachment to the game’s or the IPs. EA know this, that is why they are the worst gaming company in the world for gamers, but the best gaming company in the world for the stock market. The stupid thing is because of their short sightedness and lack of vision, they are making much less money than they could be. If they actually catered to the gamers and invested in the games, customers and industry talent, instead of slash and burn tactics, they would actually be making much more money that would have a steady profit stream and investors would get more money.

 

In those 3 hours (or what I call fringe time) at the beginning part and end part of that bracket, it drops off a lot, but that’s because of the time zones. What I’m seeing at the moment is those fringe hours slipping back to 2 hours and then it will be 1 hour and then it will infringe on the current actual prime time hours. Then it’s a slippery slope. I expect by March, the bracket hours will be more like this -

3-4pm eastern time and 8pm eastern time (which is where it was on Harbinger in March last year)

By June I expect it will be more like this -

6pm eastern time and 8pm western time (with lull in the middle of about 2-3 hours)

Basically, prime time will not be one US prime time, but two seperate prime times again that will be about 3 hours each. Also remember that at the edges of the prime time it starts to drop off. This is why prime time shrinks because people who initially played at that time see slower pops and decide their time is better spent in another game or doing something else instead of sitting around. That is how I measure the health of a game, by how fast those fringe times shrink because once you get to a critical point, they accelerate and it’s near impossible to stop them.

[omaan]

Green is wrong, it means they get a pop only because there are imps to fill their group. It is truly not rare to get to the point where 15 reps queue while 25 imps queue. That means that there can only be one full rep group at a time. Resulting in always one imp vs rep and 1 imp vs imp going on while 7 reps and 1 imp get no pop, while cross-faction would give them an arena.

The rest I just don't understand. I understand your words but not how they support your ideal...

 

.

 

Onces again i have no idea about what server u talking. I played on TH, DM and SF. These 3 servers dont have any problems with pops in different times. Wether i queued early or late the difference in waiting varied around +- 2-3 mins which is not that catastrophic to implement cross-faction. In addition to this, once again i repeat - if rep side is DEADit is only rep's side problem. If people dont want to play with them why we must force them? If all went imp side it means that they dont Like something in rep side, and have no wish to play with them in one team. Only This explains why there are 30 imps in queue while only 7 on rep side. Devs cant interfer in such faction choices, it is nonsense. If one faction is nearly dead - deal with it, because players decided so, and stop forcing devs to help this low populated faction, they wont respond on it. Besides me, there are many people who likes to play only one side (either imp or rep), and even those people who have classes in both factions recognise who/what they are playing. When a guy plays sith - he wants to play with imps, when a guy plays rep - he wants to be With reps. You cant just float everything in one bucket ignoring classic stories

[Stellarcrusade]

No. I wont carrie useless reps in regs. 2/10, nothing to discuss here

 

You are fooling yourself. HALF of your imp teammates are pubs already, because nearly all PvPers gave up on pubs quick and have been playing their imp chars pretty much since 5.0. No matter what, your teammates are the same, so get over it.

 

We DEFINATELY need all cross faction wartypes. That way people can play their pub chars again.

[Rafiknoll]

Besides me, there are many people who likes to play only one side (either imp or rep), and even those people who have classes in both factions recognise who/what they are playing. When a guy plays sith - he wants to play with imps, when a guy plays rep - he wants to be With reps. You cant just float everything in one bucket ignoring classic stories

There are some people like you, true. But you are wrong about the rest. I CAN exactly "float everything in one bucket ignoring classic stories". You can see many people (if you learn to recognize people's alts) switching to the currently winning faction after losing more than twice in a row.

I personally couldn't care less if a scoundrel is walking beside me to help me stealth-cap from a jugg, or if it is an operative with me and we go versus jedi. Truly. Don't. Care. There are many people like me, more than there are like you, I suspect, and we include more factors when we ask for cross-faction than RP.

If rep queue dies, it will only be because all reps are now playing imp beside you, and are mingled in your team when you get imp vs imp and all "real imps" might be on the opposing side. There is absolutely no reason that if I want to get the achievement for rank 300 consular it would be harder and slower doing it through PVP, than it would be doing it with my inquisitor.

 

The STORY of this game broke RP. If story is allowed to do it, PVP constraints such as bad distribution in number of players will not be limited by it. And I assure you, half the people who left rep queue simply because they got less pops will return there soon as faction will have no factor in the rate of pops (aka when cross-faction is implemented).

 

As for the servers you don't know which I am talking about, refer to Trixxie above, and be more observant in the PVP forums in general. I don't personally play in the problematic times, and neither do you, apperantly, but at least I am aware of the problem.

[DynamiCtagez]

I 100% agree. This should be implemented for all Warzones and Solo Ranked as soon as possible.

[TrixxieTriss]

Onces again i have no idea about what server u talking. I played on TH, DM and SF. These 3 servers dont have any problems with pops in different times. Wether i queued early or late the difference in waiting varied around +- 2-3 mins which is not that catastrophic to implement cross-faction. In addition to this, once again i repeat - if rep side is DEADit is only rep's side problem. If people dont want to play with them why we must force them? If all went imp side it means that they dont Like something in rep side, and have no wish to play with them in one team. Only This explains why there are 30 imps in queue while only 7 on rep side. Devs cant interfer in such faction choices, it is nonsense. If one faction is nearly dead - deal with it, because players decided so, and stop forcing devs to help this low populated faction, they wont respond on it. Besides me, there are many people who likes to play only one side (either imp or rep), and even those people who have classes in both factions recognise who/what they are playing. When a guy plays sith - he wants to play with imps, when a guy plays rep - he wants to be With reps. You cant just float everything in one bucket ignoring classic stories

 

Do you play 24 hours a day? Please tell us what times you play so you can back up that statement.

[TrixxieTriss]

There are some people like you, true. But you are wrong about the rest. I CAN exactly "float everything in one bucket ignoring classic stories". You can see many people (if you learn to recognize people's alts) switching to the currently winning faction after losing more than twice in a row.

I personally couldn't care less if a scoundrel is walking beside me to help me stealth-cap from a jugg, or if it is an operative with me and we go versus jedi. Truly. Don't. Care. There are many people like me, more than there are like you, I suspect, and we include more factors when we ask for cross-faction than RP.

If rep queue dies, it will only be because all reps are now playing imp beside you, and are mingled in your team when you get imp vs imp and all "real imps" might be on the opposing side. There is absolutely no reason that if I want to get the achievement for rank 300 consular it would be harder and slower doing it through PVP, than it would be doing it with my inquisitor.

 

The STORY of this game broke RP. If story is allowed to do it, PVP constraints such as bad distribution in number of players will not be limited by it. And I assure you, half the people who left rep queue simply because they got less pops will return there soon as faction will have no factor in the rate of pops (aka when cross-faction is implemented).

 

As for the servers you don't know which I am talking about, refer to Trixxie above, and be more observant in the PVP forums in general. I don't personally play in the problematic times, and neither do you, apperantly, but at least I am aware of the problem.

 

Well said.

 

Let me add something though about RPing and PVP. I had a situation the other day with my whole team stopping to RP in Hypergates. This has happened a few times, so I knew it wasn’t a one off. It pissed me off so much that I made a thread about it to ask what the deal was and had others encountered it. (People can read the thread if they want to see the discussion, I won’t rehash it). But in that thread I was told over and over that you “can’t” RP in pvp or people “don’t” RP in pvp.

So my question to people who say RP is important in pvp is, “do people actually RP in pvp”, because you all can’t have it both ways and switch back and forth to suit your own RP agenda.

Also, RPers don’t need to pvp to get the most out of the game. Pvpers need pops and cross faction more than RPs need it to stay as it is. I would say the majority of people who pvp, want cross faction, it certainly seems that way I. This thread.

[omaan]

There are some people like you, true. But you are wrong about the rest. I CAN exactly "float everything in one bucket ignoring classic stories". You can see many people (if you learn to recognize people's alts) switching to the currently winning faction after losing more than twice in a row.

I personally couldn't care less if a scoundrel is walking beside me to help me stealth-cap from a jugg, or if it is an operative with me and we go versus jedi. Truly. Don't. Care. There are many people like me, more than there are like you, I suspect, and we include more factors when we ask for cross-faction than RP.

If rep queue dies, it will only be because all reps are now playing imp beside you, and are mingled in your team when you get imp vs imp and all "real imps" might be on the opposing side. There is absolutely no reason that if I want to get the achievement for rank 300 consular it would be harder and slower doing it through PVP, than it would be doing it with my inquisitor.

 

The STORY of this game broke RP. If story is allowed to do it, PVP constraints such as bad distribution in number of players will not be limited by it. And I assure you, half the people who left rep queue simply because they got less pops will return there soon as faction will have no factor in the rate of pops (aka when cross-faction is implemented).

 

As for the servers you don't know which I am talking about, refer to Trixxie above, and be more observant in the PVP forums in general. I don't personally play in the problematic times, and neither do you, apperantly, but at least I am aware of the problem.

 

You may not care but there are many who CARE. Those who switched to play imp whatever the reason why they did it doesn't matter. The made THEIr CHOICE. The fact they have alts on both factions MEANS nothing because they still choose when and why to play certain faction. I like how imperial classes look, how their abilities shine, and i hate republic classes. You can call it faction racism but i dont care At All. Almost all mmo is factions vs factions, and everyone chooses the faction he likes more. In wow many players like alliance races, cities so they choose this faction to play and vice versa. You have other opinion, you can have it but i will write what I WANT to play.

 

I didnt had any problems with pops on servers i played. And i queued in different times (mostly day and night but not in the morning). If server merges didnt helped one of the servers to have constant pops ON BOTH FACTIONS it means that this server is dying, and nothing will save it. In prospect it will die sooner than other servers. I mostly playing on darth malgus and tulak hord and the pops are pretty good during different times. And on Tulak hord the pops on rep side are even better than on imp side because reps dominate there (however, imps also not having any problems with pops).

 

I WANT this game to be faction based as star wars must be. Republic vs empire, sith vs jedi is a core of this game. Without it star wars wont be star wars. Devs you should make more non-cross faction warzones. It's time you respect both opinions. We already had two last wrzs (yavin and odessen to be cross-faction). Next two must be non-cross faction. Fair balance please

[Rafiknoll]

I WANT this game to be faction based as star wars must be. Republic vs empire, sith vs jedi is a core of this game.

 

Too late for that. It was too late since 3.0 with Shadow of Revan uniting the factions versus the same enemies and experience 95% same story (different scenes but the idea is same), and KOFTE-KOTET made 100% similar scenes for whatever faction and class (besides companion encounters), reduced the war between the republic and empire to a weak broken cold war and focused on the eternal empire, and now they try to leak the boots of the Eternal Alliance commander, who commands a force more powerful than both factions, and doesn't answer to either. This is what SWTOR is now, like it or not, and the PVP follows the story. The results are positive in terms of faction queue-time balance and therefore we need this phenomenon increased, not reduced.

 

Should the game take a U-turn and start focusing on the old factions again, somehow stripping the player of his power and making him return to serving his old faction, then PVP considerations would have to be RP (which will then favor cross-faction) versus the general health of PVP (which will always favor cross-faction because diversity is good), and that would still leave room for a debate which is more important (and you have my opinion that PVP health > RP when concerning PVP...). But currently, the RP, as far as the devs are concerned, is also cross-faction (the Eternal Alliance), so even considering RP, we SHOULD get cross-faction.

If you don't like cross-faction for RP reasons, you should focus your efforts on first changing the direction in which RP currently goes and if and when you succeed, come back here and debate whether should PVP development consider RP. Currently all factors lean toward cross-faction besides the personal preferences of some players, this is just not enough to have weight...