The Scam/Not a Scam debate storyline

[LordArtemis]

As has been suggested by others (most recently LordArtemis), it would be great if sellers could be allowed to input a price-per-unit that they wish to sell their goods at. This price could then be rounded to the nearest whole number when the items are actually made available for sale.

 

That would be a side benefit...having the ability to place items for sale by price per unit instead of whole price (which would still be an option) would display that whole price per unit price when sorting. It would remove most of the fractional price clutter IMO, since I expect sellers would use it more than simply whole price.

[Andrellma]

Thank you Mr Musco. Here are the suggestions so far...I see them as QoL changes that would be nice to have. If you see any you think might be relevant and wish to pass them on, I appreciate it.

 

1) The ability to ignore a character name on the GTN, so the items sold by that character are not shown in searches.

2) The ability to place a red flag on sellers you do not like, green flag on ones you prefer, and a sort function to move red flags to the bottom of a search, green flags to the top. Only you would see the flags you apply.

3) Remove the ability for the system to display fractional currency.

4) Have the formatting right justified instead of left justified.

5) Have the ignore list also apply to the GTN.

6) Change total price to price per unit, or just add a price per unit option for posting items for sale.

 

Any of them would be welcome changes IMO.

 

I would personally love to see the ability to price per unit when placing a sale, and having a flag system so I could flag sellers based on how I rate them...for my eyes only. The flag with a sort function would be very convenient.

 

Of these, number 5 is the only one I support, but even then, not as a result of this alleged "scam." I simply believe that ignore should apply to all aspects of the game. If I ignore you, you're dead to me. I don't ever want to see your name in game again.

[Andryah]

A lot of people here defend this pricing scam, but if it's allowed to continue, the problem will multiply. Short of that, my only other recommendation to prevent abuse would be implementation of an upfront non-refundable deposit on GTN sales.

 

I don't think anyone is defending the practice. That's deflection rhetoric IMO. Personally I am not defending the carelessness of the buyer either.

 

My reason for replying to you though is that I disagree that the behavior will get worse. People will learn, or should learn, and not make the same careless mistake a second time. I guess I give human beings more credit for being able to take care of themselves then you do.

[midianlord]

Yeh, right. I lose 50 million (3 months of work!) to scammers, cs puts me on hold for a week and then, at the end, i get threats about getting banned if I will persist asking for help in this issue. Please, Eric. :l

 

Except that you didn't get scammed. In any way whatsoever.

 

You paid the price (weak pun intended, because it's still early and Coffee-Barrage hasn't proc'ed yet) for inattention. Fullstop/end-of.

 

Next!

 

You know, you could try taking responsibility for your own actions, and making an actual effort to be more careful next time.

Edited November 10, 2014 by midianlord

[wainot-keel]

Thank you Mr Musco. Here are the suggestions so far...I see them as QoL changes that would be nice to have. If you see any you think might be relevant and wish to pass them on, I appreciate it.

 

3) Remove the ability for the system to display fractional currency.

4) Have the formatting right justified instead of left justified.

 

 

These two very simple things would help a lot and would prevent many mistakes from happening. Everybody would still be able to put any price they want. Only difference it'll more clear to read.

[Daxy]

These hysterics regarding "banning sellers" and "policing". ***?

I realize swtor is a game but if this is the response many people have in real life no wonder our constitutional republic is crumbling

 

Take responsibility for your own actions people

You bought something without totally paying attention; it happens everyday; become a better buyer and our entire economy benefits

Calling on authority to provide recompense is a recipe for total disaster

[LordArtemis]

And if they're going to make a change, it would be nice if it was a change that could benefit a lot of people--not just the folks who...*cough*....seem to have difficulty paying attention.

 

I am hoping at least the option to post items by price per item makes it to the devs. Perhaps something good will come out of this silly back and forth over this issue.

[Alec_Fortescue]

Except that you didn't get scammed. In any way whatsoever.

 

You paid the price (weak pun intended, because it's still early and Coffee-Barrage hasn't proc'ed yet) for inattention. Fullstop/end-of.

 

Next!

 

You know, you could try taking responsibility for your own actions, and making an actual effort to be more careful next time.

wasn't a gtn scam, but "For starters, we definitely don't want to see any players scammed out of their hard earned credits and we will work to stop those situations wherever possible" this line seriously annoyed me after my cs experience

Edited November 10, 2014 by Alec_Fortescue

[Lotharofxev]

As I said on another thread, people who say WoW is "dumbed down" have not seen these forums.

[LordArtemis]

Of these, number 5 is the only one I support, but even then, not as a result of this alleged "scam." I simply believe that ignore should apply to all aspects of the game. If I ignore you, you're dead to me. I don't ever want to see your name in game again.

 

You would not support the option of posting items for sale at a price per unit instead of a whole price? The whole price option would still be there...it would simply be another option.

[OddballEasyEight]

These hysterics regarding "banning sellers" and "policing". ***?

I realize swtor is a game but if this is the response many people have in real life no wonder our constitutional republic is crumbling

 

Take responsibility for your own actions people

You bought something without totally paying attention; it happens everyday; become a better buyer and our entire economy benefits

Calling on authority to provide recompense is a recipe for total disaster

 

BUT!

 

I spilled my coffee in my lap. And it was piping hot.

That must be someone elses fault, like the person who sold me the coffee!

 

I should sue for fifty million, because it's CLEARLY not my own fault, it's the sellers fault.

[Jadescythe]

TL;DR stop being a *******

[OddballEasyEight]

wasn't a gtn scam, but "For starters, we definitely don't want to see any players scammed out of their hard earned credits and we will work to stop those situations wherever possible" this line seriously annoyed me after my cs experience

 

So, again, how exactly did you lose those 50 mil?

Or don't you want to tell us because it's very obviously your own fault, but you really don't want to admit that?

[azudelphi]

wasn't a gtn scam, but "For starters, we definitely don't want to see any players scammed out of their hard earned credits and we will work to stop those situations wherever possible" this line seriously annoyed me after my cs experience

 

So, after the first time you lost X million to whatever silly thing you are losing money to that isn't the GTN, didn't you think... "Boy, I shouldn't do that again?"

 

I mean, how do you get "scammed" out of 50 mil... I am genuinely curious what shenanigans you are up to, lol

[Quraswren]

SNIp...

 

You know, you could try taking responsibility for your own actions, and making an actual effort to be more careful next time.

 

They could but this is not the day and age of taking responsibility for your own actions.

 

So I doubt they will and we still still see threads about how someone who didn't pay attention not only once, but twice bought an over priced item. All because they couldn't be bothered to read a little and take just an extra few seconds to see what they are paying.

 

So, after the first time you lost X million to whatever silly thing you are losing money to that isn't the GTN, didn't you think... "Boy, I shouldn't do that again?"

 

I mean, how do you get "scammed" out of 50 mil... I am genuinely curious what shenanigans you are up to, lol

 

There is a reason the phrase, "A fool and their money will soon be parted" It has stuck around for a long time because it true.

Edited November 10, 2014 by Quraswren

[TheNahash]

As I said on another thread, people who say WoW is "dumbed down" have not seen these forums.

 

They have.

They're just busy complaining that the new disciplines system will be what dumbs the game down.

[Beranzen]

I'd like to point out that nowhere did they comment on whether or not these were scams. They said that they would be unable to tell the difference, or in other terms a waste of CS time, not that none are scams.

 

There has been a lot of chatter this weekend in General Discussion around how players are posting on the GTN, specifically around use of decimals/commas, and whether we feel it is an exploit or not. For starters, we definitely don't want to see any players scammed out of their hard earned credits and we will work to stop those situations wherever possible. Unfortunately, this is not one of those scenarios.

To be fair it's my interpretation of the above quote, that has me saying the official response for this GTN practice is not a scam.

[TUXs]

Watch what you're buying then.

Your fault.

You're right, it is his fault...but he was scammed...scammers actively look for ways to trick people. I believe it is on Bioware to police these types of things when it's intentional (and you can tell when it's intentional) and refund $ if something goes wrong...hell, even a 1-hour sell back would be fine...the credits don't transfer for 1-hour, make the item refundable for that length of time too.

[OddballEasyEight]

I don't think anyone is defending the practice. That's deflection rhetoric IMO. Personally I am not defending the carelessness of the buyer either.

 

Yup. Alot of people here seem to view the world in black and white.

Either you are with them or you are the enemy.

 

Nobody is defending the people putting things up for sale at those prices.

But it's not a scam.

You can clearly see the price if you're paying attention.

It's unethical behaviour, sure, but there are no rules being broken here.

Just scumbags being scumbags and idiots being idiots.

 

And I'm saying that as someone who actually fell for this once.

[CmdrShpd]

BUT!

 

I spilled my coffee in my lap. And it was piping hot.

That must be someone elses fault, like the person who sold me the coffee!

 

I should sue for fifty million, because it's CLEARLY not my own fault, it's the sellers fault.

 

Ugh.

 

[begin Rant]

 

I really hate it when people use this example as if the famous lawsuit was somehow frivolous. The coffee in question was way, WAY, WAAAAAY too hot. The person it spilled on received third-degree burns and had to have skin grafts applied to her mutilated genitals. Please use a different example, because in this particular case the lawsuit was completely justified.

 

[End Rant]

[Jadescythe]

BUT!

 

I spilled my coffee in my lap. And it was piping hot.

That must be someone elses fault, like the person who sold me the coffee!

 

I should sue for fifty million, because it's CLEARLY not my own fault, it's the sellers fault.

 

Considering the case in question was actually because the company selling the coffee was keeping the coffee at a piping hot 180–190 °F (82–88 °C) and caused 3rd degree burns requiring multiple years of medical treatment, I think it was legitimate. At no point was anyone rewarded for the spilling of coffee

[LordArtemis]

There has been a lot of chatter this weekend in General Discussion around how players are posting on the GTN, specifically around use of decimals/commas, and whether we feel it is an exploit or not. For starters, we definitely don't want to see any players scammed out of their hard earned credits and we will work to stop those situations wherever possible. Unfortunately, this is not one of those scenarios.

To be fair it's my interpretation of the above quote, that has me saying the official response for this GTN practice is not a scam.

 

I think that is a fair interpretation. It is "gaming" the market, something normal in economics. Sellers will ALWAYS try to buy low and sell high.

 

That doesn't mean some of the proposed changes would not be good for all. There is no way that sellers would be harmed by any of the changes proposed IMO...they would still be able to post any price they wish.

[TheWookiee]

What is really going to suck is, in the past there were probably on a small hand full of players using the decimal deception. But after today and this weekend, I am willing to bet there will be 10 fold as many people doing this and I can also guarantee they will succeed in ripping off a bunch of people not paying attention and the forums will flood daily with it.

 

Now I am a realist. The fault for this issue lies mostly in the buyer. I have been taken for almost 5 mil credits from this and I accept most of the blame and can spout all of the excuses of being tired, sorting issues, etc. but in the end, it is on me. That being said, I will no longer purchase resources form the GTN. I have enough toons with multiple gathering skills to the point that I don't really need to. Instead of my supporting the player economy thorough resource purchases (which I would spend anywhere form 100k to 1mil a week for crafting purposes) I now become self supportive, the 12x XP helps this also. I am sure I am not the only one that has come to this solution. While I agree the fault lies with the buyer, this issue has the ability to seriously hurt the GTN resource market for everyone. I personally would rather the Devs cater to the "Careless Players" on this issue and remove decimals than see the GTN flooded with decimal scammers and risk the resource market tank.

[KyaniteD]

In real life, mindless bargain hunting kills people (Black Friday). People should be glad that all they lost in their haste to score a deal is virtual currency that's rather quick and easy to replace.

[Daxy]

BUT!

 

I spilled my coffee in my lap. And it was piping hot.

That must be someone elses fault, like the person who sold me the coffee!

 

I should sue for fifty million, because it's CLEARLY not my own fault, it's the sellers fault.

 

Lol- it's funny you bring this up because a friend and I backtracked to a point where things turned for the worse in our society and we agreed on that mcdonalds customer winning this ridiculous lawsuit and the vermin trial attorneys who troll for these types of cases to be one of the primary examples