ETA on Advanced Class change?

[AlienEyeTX]

Except it takes 50-60 hours minimum to get to level 55, and most classes you need to be in mid 30 to even get a sense of how the class operates, and that is at least 20 some hours investment, and you may not like the out come. And for people who played many story lines, like me, the lowbie game play is a chore that I try to avoid at all costs. Not to mention that gearing up with augs and all cost close to 2 million credits. I want to roll a lethality ops, I really do, but I can't go through the lowbie leveling punishment anymore. Levels 0-30 are especially bad. I could switch my sniper, which is level 55 that I never play to ops and problem solved, but no... I have to go through the reroll chore.

 

So level-up your new character through PvP instead. It's surprisingly quick, if you haven't figured that out already.

[Ottoattack]

I guess you weren't around during beta when that research was done.

 

Who cares about what happened 3 years ago. Much about the game has changed since then, and the players taste as well. Let's test it now. BW should do a poll asking if people should be allowed and either keep things the way they are or allow people to change AC based on the poll result.

[Ratajack]

Except it takes 50-60 hours minimum to get to level 55, and most classes you need to be in mid 30 to even get a sense of how the class operates, and that is at least 20 some hours investment, and you may not like the out come. And for people who played many story lines, like me, the lowbie game play is a chore that I try to avoid at all costs. Not to mention that gearing up with augs and all cost close to 2 million credits. I want to roll a lethality ops, I really do, but I can't go through the lowbie leveling punishment anymore. Levels 0-30 are especially bad. I could switch my sniper, which is level 55 that I never play to ops and problem solved, but no... I have to go through the reroll chore.

 

You didn't level an operative. You leveled a sniper. Leveling a sniper does not entitle you to a max level operative. If you want an operative, then you will have to go through the "reroll chore".

 

I guess it really comes down to how much do you want to play an operative?

[Ottoattack]

So level-up your new character through PvP instead. It's surprisingly quick, if you haven't figured that out already.

 

I do not care what method you use. Aside from double XP, you need at least 50-60 hours to get to level 55. That is a huge investment in time, especially, if you have the same class at level 55, where the switch is a button press.

[Ottoattack]

You didn't level an operative. You leveled a sniper. Leveling a sniper does not entitle you to a max level operative. If you want an operative, then you will have to go through the "reroll chore".

 

I guess it really comes down to how much do you want to play an operative?

 

See that is the problem. I am not working or doing my homework. For someone who already been through most of end game PvP and PvE, lower leveling is completely devoted of any fun factor. The fact that it needs so much time makes it a huge burden to reroll a new AC. So why not make it an option for a minimum, people like me who have been legacy level 50 for a long time?

 

Playing the game is supposed to be fun. For someone experienced going through the entire leveling process is not.

[Sarfux]

As much as somebody would want this, I do not agree. Also BioWare won't do this. It's just part of the game. It goes with the lore. "Choose this, and you are in this program till you kick it or retire." It goes along with the Roleplay in Star Wars that once you start down a path forever will it dominate your destiny. Better that we didn't try to change a core element of the game.

 

I know some of you want it because you go "darnit! I should have went Guardian instead!" Well then role a character. And if it is at 55 that you say that and you want to change to another AC within that class, regardless of how far you are you will need to start a new character to change to a Guardian then. If you don't want to do that, I suppose you could adapt and train yourself to like the AC you have.

 

Also remember. Starting a new character all the time builds on your Legacy constantly. So say you start a new Jedi Knight just to be a Guardian instead of a Sentinel. You will have that character build upon your Legacy and in time the best part? You will have both a Guardian and a Sentinel! Look at it in a positive light.

 

That's just the way this game is and it's something you are going to have to live with. It's a core gameplay mechanic and a good one at that. Things set in stone are often the right way to go. I understand some want instant gratification of having that other Advanced Class but you know what? It's an even better feeling when you start working towards it and then get that goal of leveling it up. Nothing comes close to the feeling you get when you accomplish a long, hard, piece of work.

[LanceCorporalDan]

Except it takes 50-60 hours minimum to get to level 55, and most classes you need to be in mid 30 to even get a sense of how the class operates, and that is at least 20 some hours investment, and you may not like the out come. And for people who played many story lines, like me, the lowbie game play is a chore that I try to avoid at all costs. Not to mention that gearing up with augs and all cost close to 2 million credits. I want to roll a lethality ops, I really do, but I can't go through the lowbie leveling punishment anymore. Levels 0-30 are especially bad. I could switch my sniper, which is level 55 that I never play to ops and problem solved, but no... I have to go through the reroll chore.

 

Yes you have to re-roll. Two different classes require this to play them.

[Savej]

C

Yes you have to re-roll. Two different classes require this to play them.

 

But they aren't two different classes. They are the same class. Same stats, same gear (mostly), same race options, same companions, same CLASS story, many shared abilities, same CLASS NAME, etc.. Advanced class + class spec choice functions exactly like class specialization choice in other games. i'm sure many players here would be just as adamant against allowing class specialization changes in this game or others that they played before they were allowed. But. the fact is that allowing more choices and character flexibility did not hurt those games. I've got over 10 55s but i'm sentimental about one. If i could send his gear, some of which isn't available anymore, and his name/valor/rating/titles to an alt i would but too much of that isn't possible. And getting 2 characters to 100 valor is not simple (although i do have several in the 80+ range).

 

insert : < ancient quote from ex-devs saying "advanced classes are classes" during which a famous ex president starts arguing about the definition of "is" along with lots of downplay about those same devs/producers and at least one current one saying ac respecs were planned and/or likely> - RJ

 

The fact is that the word "class" is very subjective. If a dev wants to spin it to say swtor has 16 classes while he's trying to sell the game, it's impossible to refute him. But his definition doesn't matter to me. Compared to other games, using the word as they used it and as I use it, Swtor has 4 classes. There's nothing wrong with that if those four are distinct and fun and useful and they are. But it's a small number so marketing decided to initially play fast and loose with the definition of the word "class".

 

Those of you proclaiming AC respecs are invalid solely because they are "class" respecs are either trolling or were duped by BW marketing. I'm pretty sure that no one in this entire thread has seriously suggested (base) class changes nor would any suggest mages should be able to switch to druids in Wow (and no, guardian => sentinel is not a similar swap). The title of the thread involves "AC respec" and the implications of allowing them are exactly the same as allowing specialization tree respecs in other games as well as this one. Slippery slope? Would allowing AC respecs lead to base class swapping? No. I wouldn't argue for or against it, i wouldn't care, but base class swapping would require a lot more dev work and the outcry against it would be far more significant. And for the record, while i am against War in general I am all for Price Wars especially on items I'm looking to buy.

Edited February 10, 2014 by Savej

[Ratajack]

C

 

But they aren't two different classes. They are the same class. Same stats, same gear (mostly), same race options, same companions, same CLASS story, many shared abilities, same CLASS NAME, etc.. Advanced class + class spec choice functions exactly like class specialization choice in other games. i'm sure many players here would be just as adamant against allowing class specialization changes in this game or others that they played before they were allowed. But. the fact is that allowing more choices and character flexibility did not hurt those games. I've got over 10 55s but i'm sentimental about one. If i could send his gear, some of which isn't available anymore, and his name/valor/rating/titles to an alt i would but too much of that isn't possible. And getting 2 characters to 100 valor is not simple (although i do have several in the 80+ range).

 

insert : < ancient quote from ex-devs saying "advanced classes are classes" during which a famous ex president starts arguing about the definition of "is" along with lots of downplay about those same devs/producers and at least one current one saying ac respecs were planned and/or likely> - RJ

 

The fact is that the word "class" is very subjective. If a dev wants to spin it to say swtor has 16 classes while he's trying to sell the game, it's impossible to refute him. But his definition doesn't matter to me. Compared to other games, using the word as they used it and as I use it, Swtor has 4 classes. There's nothing wrong with that if those four are distinct and fun and useful and they are. But it's a small number so marketing decided to initially play fast and loose with the definition of the word "class".

 

Those of you proclaiming AC respecs are invalid solely because they are "class" respecs are either trolling or were duped by BW marketing. I'm pretty sure that no one in this entire thread has seriously suggested (base) class changes nor would any suggest mages should be able to switch to druids in Wow (and no, guardian => sentinel is not a similar swap). The title of the thread involves "AC respec" and the implications of allowing them are exactly the same as allowing specialization tree respecs in other games as well as this one. Slippery slope? Would allowing AC respecs lead to base class swapping? No. I wouldn't argue for or against it, i wouldn't care, but base class swapping would require a lot more dev work and the outcry against it would be far more significant. And for the record, while i am against War in general I am all for Price Wars especially on items I'm looking to buy.

 

You want to dismiss the devs' statements that AC's a fundamentally DIFFERENT CLASS designs, that they were treated as a FULL CLASS within the AC, and that the devs see them as DIFFERENT classes simply because those statements do not fit in with your desire to have an entirely new class handed to you?

 

Let's look at two classes-assassin and sorcerer.

 

Can an assassin heal? Can an assassin be effective from range? Assassin is melee DPS/ tank.

 

 

Can a sorcerer stealth? Can a sorcerer tank? Can a sorcerer use a double bladed light saber? Sorcerer is ranged DPS/heals.

 

 

Sorcerer is closer to a priest in WoW while assassin is closer to a rogue. Those happen to be DIFFERENT classes, btw.

 

Changing AC IS changing your class.

 

I do understand the desire to keep those items that are no longer obtainable in game, though. I have suggested that an AC change should reset a character's level to 10, reset all planetary quests and give a passive xp boost to offset the loss of XP from completed storyline quests. This would enable those players who have items no longer obtainable in game to keep those items, while at the same time addressing many of the concerns which those against allowing class changes have expressed. This suggestion has been dismissed by many of those who CLAIM to only want to keep those items no longer obtainable in game, leading me to believe that what they truly want is to be handed a new class.

[LanceCorporalDan]

C

 

But they aren't two different classes. They are the same class. Same stats, same gear (mostly), same race options, same companions, same CLASS story, many shared abilities, same CLASS NAME, etc.. Advanced class + class spec choice functions exactly like class specialization choice in other games. i'm sure many players here would be just as adamant against allowing class specialization changes in this game or others that they played before they were allowed. But. the fact is that allowing more choices and character flexibility did not hurt those games. I've got over 10 55s but i'm sentimental about one. If i could send his gear, some of which isn't available anymore, and his name/valor/rating/titles to an alt i would but too much of that isn't possible. And getting 2 characters to 100 valor is not simple (although i do have several in the 80+ range).

 

insert : < ancient quote from ex-devs saying "advanced classes are classes" during which a famous ex president starts arguing about the definition of "is" along with lots of downplay about those same devs/producers and at least one current one saying ac respecs were planned and/or likely> - RJ

 

The fact is that the word "class" is very subjective. If a dev wants to spin it to say swtor has 16 classes while he's trying to sell the game, it's impossible to refute him. But his definition doesn't matter to me. Compared to other games, using the word as they used it and as I use it, Swtor has 4 classes. There's nothing wrong with that if those four are distinct and fun and useful and they are. But it's a small number so marketing decided to initially play fast and loose with the definition of the word "class".

 

Those of you proclaiming AC respecs are invalid solely because they are "class" respecs are either trolling or were duped by BW marketing. I'm pretty sure that no one in this entire thread has seriously suggested (base) class changes nor would any suggest mages should be able to switch to druids in Wow (and no, guardian => sentinel is not a similar swap). The title of the thread involves "AC respec" and the implications of allowing them are exactly the same as allowing specialization tree respecs in other games as well as this one. Slippery slope? Would allowing AC respecs lead to base class swapping? No. I wouldn't argue for or against it, i wouldn't care, but base class swapping would require a lot more dev work and the outcry against it would be far more significant. And for the record, while i am against War in general I am all for Price Wars especially on items I'm looking to buy.

 

BW has already stated that advanced classes ARE essentially different classes. Hence the difference in say a sin that can tank or dps, and a sorc who can heal or dps. Two ENTIRELY different playstyles. Regardless of stats, etc... gameplay is what is the major factor here. As you said, the word "class" has different definitions, I define them by their roles/capabilities. I see this game as having 8.

[Savej]

BW has already stated that advanced classes ARE essentially different classes. Hence the difference in say a sin that can tank or dps, and a sorc who can heal or dps. Two ENTIRELY different playstyles. Regardless of stats, etc... gameplay is what is the major factor here. As you said, the word "class" has different definitions, I define them by their roles/capabilities. I see this game as having 8.

 

Who said it and when? The same people that said this game has 16 classes (2-3 years ago)? Or was it the same people that have said "yes we will have AC respeccing in game"? The game's documentation and in-game nomenclature does not use the word "Class" interchangeably with "Advanced Class".

Edited February 11, 2014 by Savej

[ScarletBlaze]

I truly hope they don't do this. I have leveled both a shadow and sage (not to mention others) because I knew from the beginning my choice was permanent choice. You should not be able to switch classes. When you make the choice it asks you if you are sure.

 

I may have could have understand the problem back at launch but not now. There is too much information on the classes so you can do your research on the one you would like to do. Yes it is time and I know I don't have a lot of time but I did take the time even prior to launch to look up each class and what they could do.

 

I think it should stay the way it is but that is my opinion.

[hadoken]

Who said it and when? The same people that said this game has 16 classes (2-3 years ago)? Or was it the same people that have said "yes we will have AC respeccing in game"? The game's documentation and in-game nomenclature does not use the word "Class" interchangeably with "Advanced Class".

 

Who said that?

[Savej]

Who said that?

Who said what?

 

http://www.swtor.com/holonet/classes

http://www.swtor.com/holonet/classes/jedi-knight

http://www.swtor.com/holonet/classes/jedi-knight/guardian

Edited February 11, 2014 by Savej

[LanceCorporalDan]

Who said it and when? The same people that said this game has 16 classes (2-3 years ago)? Or was it the same people that have said "yes we will have AC respeccing in game"? The game's documentation and in-game nomenclature does not use the word "Class" interchangeably with "Advanced Class".

 

Have you not seen the other threads where representatives state that they are different classes?

[hadoken]

Who said what?

 

I bolded the part of your post I was responding to. You seem to be making the claim that "someone" said we would have AC respecs. I certainly recall nothing official was ever hinted at that.

Edited February 11, 2014 by hadoken

[Savej]

I bolded the part of your post I was responding to. You seem to be making the claim that "someone" said we would have AC respecs. I certainly recall nothing official was ever hinted at that.

 

Ah:

 

5 mos before final release:

 

[fixed]

 

11/16/12

http://dulfy.net/2012/11/16/swtor-f2p-future-content-interview-with-damion-schubert/ #18 : last dev word on the subject. Note that some will say that was a long time ago but the devs saying "ACs are really classes" happened long before that.

Edited February 11, 2014 by Savej

[hadoken]

Ah:

 

5 mos before final release:

 

[fixed]

 

11/16/12

http://dulfy.net/2012/11/16/swtor-f2p-future-content-interview-with-damion-schubert/ #18 : last dev word on the subject. Note that some will say that was a long time ago but the devs saying "ACs are really classes" happened long before that.

 

Let me get this straight, you're harping over something that was said five months prior to the game's launch?

 

And here we are over 2 years later and it still hasn't happened. At what point do you understand the obvious?

[Savej]

Let me get this straight, you're harping over something that was said five months prior to the game's launch?

 

And here we are over 2 years later and it still hasn't happened. At what point do you understand the obvious?

 

And... the quote on Dulfy from a little over a year ago, yep. The game's now full of things that were intended at release but never made it and more are likely going to be added. But the youtube video just demonstrates that the creators of the game were far less convinced about ac distinctions than some of the more prolific posters on this board are. Do you know how long it took Wow to implement dual spec?

Edited February 11, 2014 by Savej

[hadoken]

Do you know how long it took Wow to implement dual spec?

 

5 years but that's pretty irrelevant since they still do not have class change, even as a pay feature. The field respec is what we have that's similar to dual spec, if you're looking to make a real comparison between two similar systems.

[Savej]

5 years but that's pretty irrelevant since they still do not have class change, even as a pay feature. The field respec is what we have that's similar to dual spec, if you're looking to make a real comparison between two similar systems.

 

Class spec swapping in wow = ac + spec swapping here (covered this earlier tonight). VERY RELEVANT insofar as the immediate argument involves changes to game mechanics and AC/Spec-changes made long after a game's release. But by all means, keep your fingers in your ears and scream "lalalaWowClass=RiftClass=SwtorAdvancedClass".

Edited February 11, 2014 by Savej

[LanceCorporalDan]

Class spec swapping in wow = ac + spec swapping here (covered this earlier tonight). VERY RELEVANT insofar as the immediate argument involves changes to game mechanics and AC/Spec-changes made long after a game's release. But by all means, keep your fingers in your ears and scream "lalalaWowClass=RiftClass=SwtorAdvancedClass".

 

field respec "lalalalal"

[Raansu]

Wow this thread is still alive somehow? If you want to play a different AC then level that damn AC. The choice is permanent for a reason.

[Jeweledleah]

field respec "lalalalal"

 

only 2 available specs to switch beteween in WoW, where if you want to play all other avaialbel specs - have to go to the trainer.

 

lalalala

 

Wow this thread is still alive somehow? If you want to play a different AC then level that damn AC. The choice is permanent for a reason.

 

and that reason would be? becasue the only reason i can see is "because developers said so in a beginning". that's not a reason, that's an excuse

[Ratajack]

Who said it and when? The same people that said this game has 16 classes (2-3 years ago)? Or was it the same people that have said "yes we will have AC respeccing in game"? The game's documentation and in-game nomenclature does not use the word "Class" interchangeably with "Advanced Class".

 

No dev said "yes we will have AC respeccing in game". The closest to that was a statement that AC changes would "likely happen" made over a year ago. That same statement also mentioned appearance and race changes would "likely happen" and those have been added. The fact that race changes have happened and class changes have not, despite both of them being mentioned in the same statement could indicate that the devs have decided not to allow class changes. It could also be interpreted as a "soft no" regarding class changes.

 

It should be noted that appearance and race changes are COSMETIC only and do not affect fundamental game play mechanics, which allowing class changes would do.