How I got pwned by BioWare OR a REAL reason to unsub

[chuixupu]

In wow the mail sits for 30 days, then goes back to the sender for another 30 days.

 

Mail goes back to the original sender in SWTOR too. But in the OP's case, mail coming back from the GTN has no where to go back to.

 

So you must have left it sit for that long.

 

Yeah, that's what happens when you play too many alts and forget about them, lol.

 

That being said Ive found Blizzard CS to be the best in the industry. And Ive played just about every title out there. The CS here isnt the worst, for sure, but its not that great either. They should have done SOMEthing for him....

 

M

 

My in-game CS experiences between wow and swtor have honestly been about the same. Blizzard is definitely much better over the phone, though.

[Athrandiel]

The odd thing here though is that items posted to you by Bioware remain in your mail folder seemingly forever and yet any item mailed by a player gets removed after 30 days.

 

As for people saying that it's the OPs fault for not removing items from GTN, get real.

We don't know the reasons why the OP was unable to play SWTOR within that 30 day period, but real life wins every time.

 

true..and what happened sux.. but 30 day mail deletion is here forever and also in other mmo's so u cant blame bioware... its a missfortune that he put it up just before going...

 

Also dont be mad but i dont believe the 30+ day trip was THAT urgent that did not have time to log on and cancel everything..u just havent remembered

[Shoogli]

I'll post the 4th and last ticket when I get home.

Regardless of the result I'll make screenies of all four and post them here afterwards.

I don't need to lie to get anything I want, but I certainly don't tolerate being had like this either.

 

If you have hit the unsub button maybe your 4th ticket will now go through in a more positive way for you am guessing...

 

Do tell us if it happens, am curious about it...

[AshlaBoga]

would it be possible to get more info on this? Such as the CSR name, ticket number, server, etc? If they are able to do it at will for some players, but refuse to for others, that is discrimination and a breach of T&C on Bioware's part.

 

I'll look into to it for you.

[Omisri]

I had a stack of those cartel market certificates completely vanish after I tried to ctrl-click an armor piece in my inventory that was slightly covered by the dressing room window. Unknowing that it had selected this stack of certs instead I also clicked into the distance to clear my current target. as I clicked I saw the items selected vanish. No "do you want to destroy these" message box... Just gone.

 

I filed a ticket askin if they could be restored and the first CS I got said "we have no record of you receiving these items, thanks for playing!

 

I filled another ticket and the second CS I got, within the hour, came back and said "We see that you had them and then our records show that they just vanished. We don't know where they ended up. We have refunded your" etc etc etc

 

Guess it depends who you end up speaking to. At my work place if you get through to my colleague they will forget you can pull a report from X and instead pull from Y on the database

[Kontraz]

Hey folks, if you want to complain, just do it. Trying to validate with your complaint with "I have been here since day 1" like that is supposed to add some seriousness to your complaint is stupid and not needed. Nobody cares if you were in the first beta or started last week.

 

This is not true. As someone that has worked customer service for a major corporation for six years, I can certainly tell you that it can help if they know you are a long loyal supporter. Taunting it and making entitled demands because of this will harm you, but saying something like "I've been shopping here for four years and this is the first problem I've had, isn't there anything that can be done?" can often make managers/supervisors decide to grant exceptions where normally they would not.

[Kontraz]

Do you know why the difference?

 

Because items sent to you by Bioware are not actually sent until you log in. Check it if you don't believe me. I have logged in a few characters after being dormant for many months and the special items form Bioware show up in my mail as just having arrived when I logged the character in.

 

 

I think the point the was making was that the mail bioware sends never actually expires.

 

For example:

http://i1156.photobucket.com/albums/p573/Kontraz/swtor2013-05-2116-02-47-28_zps495ecef5.jpg~original

[Andryah]

This is not true. As someone that has worked customer service for a major corporation for six years, I can certainly tell you that it can help if they know you are a long loyal supporter. Taunting it and making entitled demands because of this will harm you, but saying something like "I've been shopping here for four years and this is the first problem I've had, isn't there anything that can be done?" can often make managers/supervisors decide to grant exceptions where normally they would not.

 

Well, first this requires an assumption that what was posted by the OP is actually true. Personally, I am skeptical. But my skepticism is not even relevant, nor is posting this info by the OP in a forum thread even relevant to his claims with Customer Support. This thread is public complaining prior to exhausting efforts to work with customer support IMO.

 

In this particular case, it appears to be a question of how/if Customer Support are able to verify the customer claim from ingame log data. To do so, they need accurate information to use to pinpoint the log data. Until that is resolved, no amount of customer justification is going to matter much IMO.

 

In addition, the OP has a history of throwing hissies all the way back to January 2012... so it tempers my views on what he says/claims. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=1860328#post1860328 YRMV.

Edited May 21, 2013 by Andryah

[Kontraz]

Discrimination? You're REALLLLLLY reaching to pull that out of your helmet.

 

Not likely.

 

In terms of base legality, "discrimination" can be referred to as simply treating two individuals in identical situations differently.

 

Class discrimination (what you are probably referring to) is when it is against a group of people - ie racism, et al

[Kontraz]

Well, first this requires an assumption that what was posted by the OP is actually true. Personally, I am skeptical. But my skepticism is not even relevant, nor is posting this info by the OP in a forum thread even relevant to his claims with Customer Support. This thread is public complaining prior to exhausting efforts to work with customer support IMO.

 

In this particular case, it appears to be a question of how/if Customer Support are able to verify the customer claim from ingame log data. To do so, they need accurate information to use to pinpoint the log data. Until that is resolved, no amount of customer justification is going to matter much IMO.

 

In addition, the OP has a history of throwing hissies all the way back to January 2012... so it tempers my views on what he says/claims. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=1860328#post1860328 YRMV.

 

I wasn't arguing whether or not it was true (though I tend to grant benefit of doubt, but that's just me). I was responding to the other poster saying that making a claim of loyalty doesn't help, when it actually can.

[Andryah]

I wasn't arguing whether or not it was true (though I tend to grant benefit of doubt, but that's just me). I was responding to the other poster saying that making a claim of loyalty doesn't help, when it actually can.

 

I believe his point was making such claims in public general forum (which is to attract and discuss with other forum members) is not relevant.. and it smacks of entitlement in the context of a public discussion. The OP was not speaking to Customer Support, he was complaining to other forum members IMO.

 

I agree with you that a customer support team would/should take into account customer loyalty.

[Kontraz]

I believe his point was making such claims in public general forum (which is to attract and discuss with other forum members) is not relevant.. and it smacks of entitlement in the context of a public discussion. The OP was not speaking to Customer Support, he was complaining to other forum members IMO.

 

I agree with you that a customer support team would/should take into account customer loyalty.

 

ah, if that's the case, then no, it won't help you. Winning "us" over does virtually nothing. O_o

[JimG]

Well, first this requires an assumption that what was posted by the OP is actually true. Personally, I am skeptical. But my skepticism is not even relevant, nor is posting this info by the OP in a forum thread even relevant to his claims with Customer Support. This thread is public complaining prior to exhausting efforts to work with customer support IMO.

Yeah, in my experience, I've had several items restored through CS. Perhaps he called the CS phone number and spoke with someone unhelpful. I just direct email them and I've always gotten prompt resolutions to my inquiries. If they can restore items that have been RE'ed or destroyed, then certainly the OP's stuff could be restored and there are logs of the items.

[Darth_Moonshadow]

The odd thing here though is that items posted to you by Bioware remain in your mail folder seemingly forever and yet any item mailed by a player gets removed after 30 days.

 

It's to reduce the fullness of your mailbox if you leave for a short time.

 

Do you really want to come back after three months to see your mailbox full of credit spam mails?

[Kontraz]

It's to reduce the fullness of your mailbox if you leave for a short time.

 

Do you really want to come back after three months to see your mailbox full of credit spam mails?

 

I would rather that than important mail get deleted, yes. lol

[Thaed]

Do you know why the difference?

 

Because items sent to you by Bioware are not actually sent until you log in. Check it if you don't believe me. I have logged in a few characters after being dormant for many months and the special items form Bioware show up in my mail as just having arrived when I logged the character in.

 

Mail from Bioware stays for well over a month. On my main I still have the fireworks mail (with the item) at 141 days and the party Jawa mail (no item) at 181 days. CE mail is gone, though I believe that lasted around a year.

[DarkWyndre]

Thing is though... we have an extremely valuable and rare list of in game items.. all miraculously listed on the GTN at the same time, coupled with an alleged emergency exit of the country that precluded even logging into the game to clear the high value items from the GTN, coupled with customer support saying there are no logs of those items having been listed by that player on that account on the GTN.

 

So.. without attacking the OPs character or honesty in any way.... let me just expore with you that you are are making a giant leap of faith on behalf of a player you do not know, and condemning customer service.

 

Objectivity TUXs... none of us here know enough about what did/did-not happen to make any judgment on support or lack of it. None of us will ever know enough details to know who is in the wrong here. All we have is what the OP tells us... but you know what... what he does tell us makes for pause for the rest of us.. because it's just extreme enough to have been fabricated for all we know... OR NOT fabricated for all we know.

 

Is there a thread you don't show up in and spin on behalf of bioware? No wonder people think you're a company shill.

 

You mock the op by saying the items were "miraculously" listed on the GTN, as if that were a situation that wouldn't be common or usual, but simple logic shows that there would be nothing miraculous about it. Anyone who has a significant amount of wealth in SW:ToR and wants to deal in high end items on the GTN is working high margin, low frequency sales. It takes average and even above average players time to amass the kind of credits it takes to plop down 30,000,000 credits for a speeder (or 100,000,000 - 300,000,000 for a czerka crate).

 

People who work those high margin, low frequency sales are all about the uptime. Since deposit is refunded if there is no sale, there's zero opportunity cost to keeping an item up on the GTN as close to 100% of the time as possible. Anyone who works the high end of the GTN understands this and works it to their advantage. If that rich collector goes looking for a high margin item and you're slacking and yours isn't up, then either your competition gets the sale or the collector buys something they wanted less. Either way, keeping the maximum amount of potential profit on the GTN at all times is just about the most fundamental principle of properly profiting from the GTN.

 

So you come in here in your zeal to try and spin things in a pro-bioware/anti-complaining customer way (as you always do) and you make an illogical argument which strongly implies the OP is a liar, but simple experience and logic show that his statement matches up with what one would expect of a high end items dealer.

 

In other words, his statement is consistent, while you used innuendo and bad logic to try and defend bioware. There seems to be no reason for you to jump into this conversation. You had to make a poor argument and implicitly attack the OP. What dog do you have in this fight?

 

And you wonder why people are convinced you're a bioware exec or something.

[CosmicKat]

Mail from Bioware stays for well over a month. On my main I still have the fireworks mail (with the item) at 141 days and the party Jawa mail (no item) at 181 days. CE mail is gone, though I believe that lasted around a year.

 

Yep. They stay forever.

 

I have multiple space chickens and disco jawas collecting dust in my mail boxes.

[Halfadozen]

Is there a thread you don't show up in and spin on behalf of bioware? No wonder people think you're a company shill.

 

You mock the op by saying the items were "miraculously" listed on the GTN, as if that were a situation that wouldn't be common or usual, but simple logic shows that there would be nothing miraculous about it. Anyone who has a significant amount of wealth in SW:ToR and wants to deal in high end items on the GTN is working high margin, low frequency sales. It takes average and even above average players time to amass the kind of credits it takes to plop down 30,000,000 credits for a speeder (or 100,000,000 - 300,000,000 for a czerka crate).

 

People who work those high margin, low frequency sales are all about the uptime. Since deposit is refunded if there is no sale, there's zero opportunity cost to keeping an item up on the GTN as close to 100% of the time as possible. Anyone who works the high end of the GTN understands this and works it to their advantage. If that rich collector goes looking for a high margin item and you're slacking and yours isn't up, then either your competition gets the sale or the collector buys something they wanted less. Either way, keeping the maximum amount of potential profit on the GTN at all times is just about the most fundamental principle of properly profiting from the GTN.

 

So you come in here in your zeal to try and spin things in a pro-bioware/anti-complaining customer way (as you always do) and you make an illogical argument which strongly implies the OP is a liar, but simple experience and logic show that his statement matches up with what one would expect of a high end items dealer.

 

In other words, his statement is consistent, while you used innuendo and bad logic to try and defend bioware. There seems to be no reason for you to jump into this conversation. You had to make a poor argument and implicitly attack the OP. What dog do you have in this fight?

 

And you wonder why people are convinced you're a bioware exec or something.

 

Brilliant.

[Kilora]

In other words, his statement is consistent, while you used innuendo and bad logic to try and defend bioware. There seems to be no reason for you to jump into this conversation. You had to make a poor argument and implicitly attack the OP. What dog do you have in this fight?

 

And you wonder why people are convinced you're a bioware exec or something.

 

Guess what -- OP still hasn't returned with screenshots.

 

I'm not defending anyone, and it really doesn't appear Andryah is at the moment -- but there is this lovely thing called due dilligence.

 

OP has an extraordinary claim that he is making. Ontop of that -- there is conflicting information is his posts. He has yet to answer the questions presented to him, or provide a screenshot of the ticket showing the information in question.

 

Therefore, the assumption is that he is incorrect in what he is posting until evidence is provided.

[DarkWyndre]

Guess what -- OP still hasn't returned with screenshots.

 

I'm not defending anyone, and it really doesn't appear Andryah is at the moment -- but there is this lovely thing called due dilligence.

 

OP has an extraordinary claim that he is making. Ontop of that -- there is conflicting information is his posts. He has yet to answer the questions presented to him, or provide a screenshot of the ticket showing the information in question.

 

Therefore, the assumption is that he is incorrect in what he is posting until evidence is provided.

 

Andryah appears to be attacking the OP though, with very poor logic. By very definition, attacking one side is defending the other.

[TUXs]

Is there a thread you don't show up in and spin on behalf of bioware? No wonder people think you're a company shill.

 

You mock the op by saying the items were "miraculously" listed on the GTN, as if that were a situation that wouldn't be common or usual, but simple logic shows that there would be nothing miraculous about it. Anyone who has a significant amount of wealth in SW:ToR and wants to deal in high end items on the GTN is working high margin, low frequency sales. It takes average and even above average players time to amass the kind of credits it takes to plop down 30,000,000 credits for a speeder (or 100,000,000 - 300,000,000 for a czerka crate).

 

People who work those high margin, low frequency sales are all about the uptime. Since deposit is refunded if there is no sale, there's zero opportunity cost to keeping an item up on the GTN as close to 100% of the time as possible. Anyone who works the high end of the GTN understands this and works it to their advantage. If that rich collector goes looking for a high margin item and you're slacking and yours isn't up, then either your competition gets the sale or the collector buys something they wanted less. Either way, keeping the maximum amount of potential profit on the GTN at all times is just about the most fundamental principle of properly profiting from the GTN.

 

So you come in here in your zeal to try and spin things in a pro-bioware/anti-complaining customer way (as you always do) and you make an illogical argument which strongly implies the OP is a liar, but simple experience and logic show that his statement matches up with what one would expect of a high end items dealer.

 

In other words, his statement is consistent, while you used innuendo and bad logic to try and defend bioware. There seems to be no reason for you to jump into this conversation. You had to make a poor argument and implicitly attack the OP. What dog do you have in this fight?

 

And you wonder why people are convinced you're a bioware exec or something.

 

/hero

[Kilora]

Andryah appears to be attacking the OP though, with very poor logic. By very definition, attacking one side is defending the other.

 

Eh, I've seen her state the same ideas and logic that I have stated, although in a different manner.

 

My logic for questioning is not flawed or "poor" but maybe other logic was used that I didn't see.

 

While TUX is afraid to agree with me, because he doesn't want me to have another cookie, I think I could say that he agrees with my objectivity and logic behind questioning -- he just happens to be giving the OP benefit of the doubt.

 

And, if I had past experience with CS being poor, as TUX has, I would be in the same boat.

[LordArtemis]

Do you know why the difference?

 

Because items sent to you by Bioware are not actually sent until you log in. Check it if you don't believe me. I have logged in a few characters after being dormant for many months and the special items form Bioware show up in my mail as just having arrived when I logged the character in.

 

Actually this is only partially accurate. Any mail sent from Bioware that is not deleted has no expiration date. I still had old mail in my account....a few letters sent from quest NPCs, and one from when I purchased the digital edition months ago. It doesn't seem to expire. All of them had been opened and emptied already. It let me know how long I have been gone.

 

Which brings me to my next point...auction item mail is designed to delete itself the moment you draw out the contents as far as I understand. Same with items that get sent to players from other players. So the deletion could be a result of the system being on "delete hold" and having to clear the spool, so to speak after a certain amount of time to keep the database from getting overloaded.

 

You can have up to 50 items up for auction. Imagine all of those items coming off the GTN after expiring, and imagine just 2 percent of the current subs...around 500k, or 10k players....that's around 500k unique database items held in limbo. That's quite a bit of information storage.

 

It's just not feasible probably to keep it more than 30 days with the resources they have in place. At least that would be my guess.

Edited May 22, 2013 by LordArtemis

[Samoth_Nomad]

There are logs of everything. OP just got unlucky with his CS agent.

Back when the group finder had problems rewarding black hole comms, my guild mate ran into a CS agent just like the OP. Our guild ran the op through the gf, none of us were rewarded comms, so we all filed tickets. EVERY member of that raid was rewarded their comms EXCEPT 1. His CS experience was very different than the other 7 members. The CS agent basically said the same thing, "we don't have logs", "we can't verify"(even though the tickets were sent 2 minutes after finishing the raid, and contained exact details, raid members, times, etc.). My guild mate was basically called a liar by this CS agent. It was appalling. It's hit or miss with CS. I've had countless Items restored and have had nothing but good experiences with CS, but having seen the other side, I know there are some horrible CS agents in this game.