Why did Jeff Hickman lie to subscribers about the future of the game?

[Andryah]

He said "future game updates." You can't enjoy most of 2.1 without spending extra money on top of your sub.

 

Umm.. enjoying it quite well actually AND not spending extra money either. So maybe, speak for yourself, and not for everyone.

 

You could go the route of spending extra money I guess... but why would you??

Edited May 17, 2013 by Andryah

[Andryah]

Although EULA's are notoriously tricky creatures in a court of law (and which court of law? The game is played and advertised in a number of jurisdictions), EA/Bioware can in fact basically mislead the player with statements like this with little or no real ramification.

 

EULAs for MMOs are constructed such that the company has sole descretion over content. Period. Game, set, match. MMO players really should know this by now.

 

EULA also takes legal precedence over anything a game developer might say in an interview, on a blog, drunk in a bar at 1:00AM, etc. etc.

 

Players don't have to like it, but it's the way it is.

Edited May 17, 2013 by Andryah

[Stryges]

EULAs for MMOs are constructed such that the company has sole descretion over content. Period. Game, set, match. MMO players really should know this by now.

 

EULA also takes legal precedence over anything a game developer might say in an interview, on a blog, drunk in a bar at 1:00AM, etc. etc.

 

Players don't have to like it, but it's the way it is.

 

Isn't that what I said?

 

Anyways, that's enough for me. Have fun everyone.

[RazerCannon]

6 months ago I told my mom I was planning on going to school to get an MBA. Now I changed my mind and don't think its worth the money. Does that make me a liar?

 

If you took money from her for that six months under the pretense that you were going to business school, yes it does. Under the common law it's called "fraud in the inducement." Mom could sue you - and you'd be easy to serve, seeing as you live in her basement.

[hobrogaming]

Although EULA's are notoriously tricky creatures in a court of law (and which court of law? The game is played and advertised in a number of jurisdictions), EA/Bioware can in fact basically mislead the player with statements like this with little or no real ramification.

 

They can argue the definition of content, they can cite the existence of the stipend, they could retroactively apply a moratorium to the statement, or any number of other things.

 

Is it illegal? Not particularly. Is it a great way to alienate some of your customers and create quite a wave of bad publicity? Hells yes it is. The qualities that were going to make this game unique (player choice, class stories, equipment customization, epic feeling for individual action) are, in my opinion, slowly falling by the wayside. Bioware sees that the CM is the most lucrative part of the game, hence, they are going to concentrate on that to the detriment of the rest of the game. They will try to hide it behind double speak and conditional promises to keep their pool subscribers of up, but it is not going to change the trend.

 

There are some who are fine with this, although having read the forums it seems they almost view getting their own money's worth as part of the game as well, i.e. wringing enjoyment out of the restrictive system is part of the fun and anyone who is either too stupid/lazy to do this doesn't deserve to complain about it. That's fine, rock on. If you are not o.k. as a player, there is nothing you can do about it. Except un-sub. My subscription (my first non-6 month subscription) runs out in a couple days. I will not be resubbing for a number of reasons (CM cost for barbershop, delay of free character name change, change in policy for legacy/guild name changes and so on). Bioware doesn't care, you don't care, but there is no point in giving them more money.

 

Yep. While EA/BioWare can't be held accountable for their lies, bait and switch, and scams that they have committed with this game and other games such as Mass Effect 3, they will continue to win worst company of the year which they deserve. At this point they probably don't care any more that they are hated by the majority.

[QuiDonJorn]

I am by no means a defender of EAWare, never have been. I played the game because I liked it, couldn't care less who developed or published it. But I am right there with all of you after this patch, and all of you have been instumental in bringing the evil wrongdoers into the light for all to see..

So, err, what'd you want me to do?

[hippiechick]

6 months ago I told my mom I was planning on going to school to get an MBA. Now I changed my mind and don't think its worth the money. Does that make me a liar?

 

It does if you went out and solicited money from people on the basis that you were going to get an MBA then didnt. Absolutely.

 

M

[hobrogaming]

I am by no means a defender of EAWare, never have been. I played the game because I liked it, couldn't care less who developed or published it. But I am right there with all of you after this patch, and all of you have been instumental in bringing the evil wrongdoers into the light for all to see..

So, err, what'd you want me to do?

 

You cant do anything really. You can hit them where they actually care - they wallet, but in order for that to be effective it has to be a known boycott and alot of people would have to do it then they will for sure change their mind. Pretty much no chance of that happening really so all we can really do is complain on the forums

[hippiechick]

Its fun watching the fan bois twist everything to make this out to be ok. Really, BW/EA has lied to us since the start and will continue to do so. I am unsubbing over several issues but I already did once before so no big deal. I suggest you either put your money where your mouth is or shut it. If you dont like it unsub. Simple as that. Enough of us do it and maybe they will stop the lies.

 

M

[Darth_Wicked]

Its fun watching the fan bois twist everything to make this out to be ok. Really, BW/EA has lied to us since the start and will continue to do so. I am unsubbing over several issues but I already did once before so no big deal. I suggest you either put your money where your mouth is or shut it. If you dont like it unsub. Simple as that. Enough of us do it and maybe they will stop the lies.

 

M

 

All mighty wallet vote shall prevail. Ride forth victoriously.

[jankiel]

Meh the same thing with the Collector edidtion vendor. They promissed this and they gave that. Nothing new on the front of the galactic struggle.

 

The fact is they don't care.

[Laerian]

I usually don't pay attention to who say what. But in this case the OP quote is very clear,

 

Anyways, quote or not quote, if this game were really f2p plus subcription model, subscribers should have unlimited access to every game feature as part of their subscription. All the cartel market stuff should be "Bind on Pickup" world drops , rare but available, and subscribers have a CC stipend.

 

The stipend, that subscribers get now, can't even pay one full customization per month. Also, the current design encourage subscribers to pay unlocks in CC because it is very expensive using credits. We all know how these "tricks" work. One day the droprates are reduced or the prices are increased then people have to spend extra in boosts and other stuff.

[QuiDonJorn]

no chance of that happening really so all we can really do is complain on the forums

Uhh...well, ..that sounds pretty....pointless.

 

I suggest you either put your money where your mouth is or shut it. If you dont like it unsub. Simple as that.

Well, frankly I haven't given them anything more than my 15$ a month with the exception of the 10 bucks for Makeb.

Just bought game time cards for the year and 3 months I've been playing.

Unsub? Nah, this game is horrible trying to play F2P.

 

Enough of us do it and maybe they will stop the lies

Yeah, kay. Good luck with that.

[TripleMe]

Umm.. enjoying it quite well actually AND not spending extra money either. So maybe, speak for yourself, and not for everyone.

 

You could go the route of spending extra money I guess... but why would you??

 

Forget 2.1, is 2.0 is a game update ? And I have to pay extra for it.

 

EULAs for MMOs are constructed such that the company has sole descretion over content. Period. Game, set, match. MMO players really should know this by now.

 

EULA also takes legal precedence over anything a game developer might say in an interview, on a blog, drunk in a bar at 1:00AM, etc. etc.

 

Players don't have to like it, but it's the way it is.

 

You know what trumps EULAs ? Law of the land. You may want to look up the various Consumer Protection Acts of different countries, you will be pleasantly surprised. Also see misrepresentation.

 

EULAs are quite often not worth the paper they are printed on. See the recent Oracle case in EU for a high profile example.

[Alec_Fortescue]

Forget 2.1, is 2.0 is a game update ? And I have to pay extra for it.

 

 

 

You know what trumps EULAs ? Law of the land. You may want to look up the various Consumer Protection Acts of different countries, you will be pleasantly surprised. Also see misrepresentation.

 

EULAs are quite often not worth the paper they are printed on. See the recent Oracle case in EU for a high profile example.

 

Yeah, things like waiving right to sue after accepting the eula are illegal in certain countries i can think of.

[lorddakar]

Your cell phone provider sells you a phone, you sign a contract. Cell phone provider tells you all future updates are free, update comes out and costs you money.

 

Would you not care? If so, you're an idiot.

 

It's much different than some twerp telling mommy he is going to school.

 

I dont recall signing a contract with this game.

[Aries_cz]

And exactly what features do you feel you do not have unlimitied access to? Or what game updates (Patches)?

You get your 500+ coins monthly stipend, you can save it up to buy some thing you really want. For example, all knew that Cathar are coming with 2.1, and that they will cost 600CCs, almost two months ahead. So if you really want to play as a cat, you could have saved up...

[Feztonio]

6 months ago I told my mom I was planning on going to school to get an MBA. Now I changed my mind and don't think its worth the money. Does that make me a liar?

 

yes. you said one thing and are doing another.

[Aries_cz]

Forget 2.1, is 2.0 is a game update ? And I have to pay extra for it.

You did not have to pay for 2.0, 2.0 is free for all. You have to pay for the RotHC content (level, planet, ops, gsi, seeker, binoculars, etc), that is a Expansion pack.

[TripleMe]

I dont recall signing a contract with this game.

 

You did, look up the EULA

 

You did not have to pay for 2.0, 2.0 is free for all. You have to pay for the RotHC content (level, planet, ops, gsi, seeker, binoculars, etc), that is a Expansion pack.

 

Expansion pack is not a "Game Update" ?

[Feztonio]

See, now you're just confused. If you subscribe, you give BW money every month based on a promise. You pay $15/month based on the promise that in exchange for that money you will receive one month of service in exchange.

 

What you are defending is no different than if you paid $15 for one month of service on May 1st, and on May 15th, they emailed you and said, "We changed our minds, you'll need to pay us another $15 for the rest of the month."

 

If you are comfortable with a business "changing their minds" after they have already taken your money. Then that's your business. But that's not okay with me. A financial exchange is a contract. And when a multi-billion dollar company promises a customer a given service for his money, then they need to own up to the promised exchange of valued goods; i.e. their product/service as promised in exchange for my currency.

 

this! I don't understand how the defenders of all things Bioware could not see how selling you one thing, then changing what they're selling you after you've paid is a fu**ed up thing. it's mind boggling

[CosmicKat]

this! I don't understand how the defenders of all things Bioware could not see how selling you one thing, then changing what they're selling you after you've paid is a fu**ed up thing. it's mind boggling

 

They reject reality and substitute it with their own.

[Nyaara]

Jeff Hickman has lied like James Olhen did too. It´s not an opinion, is a fact.

 

About Jeff, he announced that subscribers wouldnt be charged for future content and 2.1, is a patch with content (bluff or not is content) is not free for suscribers. That a subscriber can get the content if saved enough CC DOESNT MEAN is free cos is not.

 

James lied when said that F2P was under discussion but the current model (monthly pay) would stay for a time yet. And they announced that content like Cathar, Hk-51, Maked etc would be FREE updates and even released a video. He knew that it was a lie cos F2P was already decided.

 

It´s rainning over wet ground and it is cos old subscribers are angry. They are tired about lies, lies, lies everytime.

Edited May 17, 2013 by Nyaara

[Thaed]

Meh, it technically still holds true to me as I've not spent any money on cartel coins.

 

The second you can buy a combat advantage with CCs, though, and I'm out. (Also, 'the second' for a bunch of other stuff, but still, that's not for a while yet).

[Aries_cz]

Expansion pack is not a "Game Update" ?

It is, but you got Game Update 2.0: Scum and Villainy for free, just like everyone did.

You paid a discounted price for access to expansion pack content. You can freely enjoy the contents, changes and features of Patch 2.0 and all subsequent patches without RotHC, unless they require you to have level 51+ or to go to Makeb.