CM items vs actually playing the game.

[Asuka]

Hey Philastra!

 

One thing I did want point out is that I know sometimes there may be a misconception that because we are releasing new items into the Cartel Market, that we are not producing other content. Just to make everyone aware that our Cartel Market and content development teams are two very different things internally.

 

That is to say, us producing new items for the Cartel Market does not adversely mean we are not producing content. We are always doing both of these things and they are released accordingly.

 

I am not sure if that directly addresses any of your concerns, but I thought this would be a good place to make mention of that. Also, as you can imagine our "content developers" are pretty busy with Rise of the Hutt Cartel and Game Update 2.0. I did attempt to address some of the other concerns that you raised in one of my other posts as well, you can see that here (I think you saw it already but just in case).

 

-eric

 

Question is, where are the regular updates to the CE vendor that Georg Zoeller had said himself a year+ ago that vendor would be getting and has yet to get an update 14 months later? As well as here in response to the same question: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=3086446#post3086446 .

[AshlaBoga]

Hey Philastra!

 

One thing I did want point out is that I know sometimes there may be a misconception that because we are releasing new items into the Cartel Market, that we are not producing other content. Just to make everyone aware that our Cartel Market and content development teams are two very different things internally.

 

That is to say, us producing new items for the Cartel Market does not adversely mean we are not producing content. We are always doing both of these things and they are released accordingly.

 

I am not sure if that directly addresses any of your concerns, but I thought this would be a good place to make mention of that. Also, as you can imagine our "content developers" are pretty busy with Rise of the Hutt Cartel and Game Update 2.0. I did attempt to address some of the other concerns that you raised in one of my other posts as well, you can see that here (I think you saw it already but just in case).

 

-eric

 

 

Eric,

 

I'm curious why we have a reputation grind attached the packs. I'm fine with CM specific vanity gear, but attaching a reputation grind to the packs just seems a bity tacky. Any comment?

[CelCawdro]

They also never said or promised when any of it was coming except that it was down the road in the future. People tend to forget that the game has only been out just a bit over a year. The only thing where they can be really held accountable for would be the CE vendor which they stated would absolutely get regular updates per GZ which it hasn't seen anything new.

 

I've very aware that the game has been out for a year, thank you very much. And a year, even considering the whole table flip with the free-to-play model, has been ample time to implement many, if not all, of those features. In fact, a couple of them were supposed to be in at launch. "It's only launch" was the rationale at launch. "It's only been a year" is the rationale now. When does it stop? Where is the line you draw?

[Vandicus]

Question is, where are the regular updates to the CE vendor that Georg Zoeller had said himself a year+ ago that vendor would be getting and has yet to get an update 14 months later? As well as here in response to the same question: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=3086446#post3086446 .

 

Your information is about 14 months out of date. We received an addition to the CE vendor when 1.2 hit, and we received one today.

[CelCawdro]

They tend to always throw in the fine print that anything is subject to change just like when they mention anything they have planned, one has to assume it's not confirmed until they announce it officially and not just talk or post about it.

 

Immaterial response. You stated that they never promised that Makeb would be free. They did. Subject to change, sure, but that does not change the fact that Makeb was promoted as free during its announcement.

[CelCawdro]

Your information is about 14 months out of date. We received an addition to the CE vendor when 1.2 hit, and we received one today.

 

Oh, which did it start dynamically updating itself to help us to differentiate ourselves from other players through the leveling experience and beyond with unique armour and weapons?

[Blackavaar]

Your information is about 14 months out of date. We received an addition to the CE vendor when 1.2 hit, and we received one today.

 

Yeah, we received a pet that turned out to be a reskin of something that everyone else got for free. Yay!

 

And today we received another reskin of something that everyone can get from a CM pack. Whoopee!

 

Keep going, Twiddle Dee.

 

[Vandicus]

Yeah, we received a pet that turned out to be a reskin of something that everyone else got for free. Yay!

 

And today we received another reskin of something that everyone can get from a CM pack. Whoopee!

 

Keep going, Twiddle Dee.

 

 

There's a disturbing hatred for accuracy on this forums. No update is not the equivalent of two updates.

 

0 does not equal 2

 

If we can't be honest in our discourse, how can you expect anyone to treat us seriously?

[CelCawdro]

There's a disturbing hatred for accuracy on this forums. No update is not the equivalent of two updates.

 

0 does not equal 2

 

If we can't be honest in our discourse, how can you expect anyone to treat us seriously?

 

There's a middle ground here - technically, what was expected (due to developer comment) from the vendor was a (1) dynamic and (2) regularly (3) updated vendor that included (4) weapons and (5) armour. Thus far, only 3 and 5 have been made good on. Yes, it has been updated, and yes, it has armour on it. However, there are no weapons to speak of, the updates have been irregular at best, and the word "dynamic" cannot be applied.

[VigDiath]

The items on the Cartel Market for the most part are only for looks. I'm willing to pay for looks. The stuff that helps you progress in Flash Points, War Zones and Operations is not obtainable in the Cartel Market. You actually have to play the game to get those mods, armorings, etc. Or pay for it on the GTN which is costly.

 

That being said. NOTHING on the Cartel Market will help you become a better player. That only comes through playing the game and earning the top end gear.

[Vandicus]

There's a middle ground here - technically, what was expected (due to developer comment) from the vendor was a (1) dynamic and (2) regularly (3) updated vendor that included (4) weapons and (5) armour. Thus far, only 3 and 5 have been made good on. Yes, it has been updated, and yes, it has armour on it. However, there are no weapons to speak of, the updates have been irregular at best, and the word "dynamic" cannot be applied.

 

I have never disputed the insufficient number and unsatisfactory level of the updates we've gotten, I just tend to correct errors when I see them. When a person representing a request for additional, more regular, of higher quality, what have you, CE updates states something that is known to be a lie as part of the appeal, it makes all such requests look disreputable(fair or not) and will generally lower the esteem of readers.

[CelCawdro]

I have never disputed the insufficient number and unsatisfactory level of the updates we've gotten, I just tend to correct errors when I see them. When a person representing a request for additional, more regular, of higher quality, what have you, CE updates states something that is known to be a lie as part of the appeal, it makes all such requests look disreputable(fair or not) and will generally lower the esteem of readers.

 

Understandable. I, too, tire of polarized arguments that ultimately accomplish nothing as both sides completely distort the issue. In all facets of life, really.

[Philastra]

This thread is about the fact that they have stepped across the line with the CM. Being able to buy your way to the top of any ingame system is a complete step in the wrong direction. In game systems should not be bought with RL cash, the rewards should reflect time spent in game, not money spent in the CM. I know for myself I am waiting to see the returns from the CM reflected in the game to add more to it for ppl who play (subs) not just ppl who pay RL money. Hopefully 2.0 and beyond shows that from the BW team.

 

BUT please do not make any other ingame systems winnable/completed or obtainable with RL cash. It just cheapens a subs time spent on playing the in game systems. The rep system imo was a good idea but now that it can be obtained through the CM not so much.

Edited March 13, 2013 by Philastra

[jedimessiah]

The items on the Cartel Market for the most part are only for looks. I'm willing to pay for looks. The stuff that helps you progress in Flash Points, War Zones and Operations is not obtainable in the Cartel Market. You actually have to play the game to get those mods, armorings, etc. Or pay for it on the GTN which is costly.

 

That being said. NOTHING on the Cartel Market will help you become a better player. That only comes through playing the game and earning the top end gear.

 

I think you posted in the wrong thread bro. This discussion is not about if the CM isPay2Win, it's about the CM getting tons of love and new items while the rest of the game is mostly ignored. Like crafting and the CE vendor.

 

& This "This thread is about the fact that they have stepped across the line with the CM. Being able to buy your way to the top of any ingame system is a complete step in the wrong direction. In game systems should not be bought with RL cash, the rewards should reflect time spent in game, not money spent in the CM. I know for myself I am waiting to see the returns from the CM reflected in the game to add more to it for ppl who play (subs) not just ppl who pay RL money. Hopefully 2.0 and beyond shows that from the BW team."

Edited March 12, 2013 by jedimessiah

[-Archadius-]

Hey Philastra!

 

One thing I did want point out is that I know sometimes there may be a misconception that because we are releasing new items into the Cartel Market, that we are not producing other content. Just to make everyone aware that our Cartel Market and content development teams are two very different things internally.

 

That is to say, us producing new items for the Cartel Market does not adversely mean we are not producing content. We are always doing both of these things and they are released accordingly.

 

I am not sure if that directly addresses any of your concerns, but I thought this would be a good place to make mention of that. Also, as you can imagine our "content developers" are pretty busy with Rise of the Hutt Cartel and Game Update 2.0. I did attempt to address some of the other concerns that you raised in one of my other posts as well, you can see that here (I think you saw it already but just in case).

 

-eric

 

Excuse me? I haven't said anything up until this point, because I wanted to see how bad it actually gets. But that is a blatant lie. There has been numerous post by developers about how X feature was put on hold for the free-to-play launch (IE making cash on cartel market).

Things like character transfer, character name change, the chat bug, the camera reset when zone bug, the inability to turn of the onscreen message spam (someone dies it pops on screen, companion returns it pops on screen to block your view while in a pvp match etc) the forever load screen bug, log in and action bars default to unlocked bug, the game crash at end of several FP's bug, and many more I'm sure many people could add to this list ..NEED TO BE ADDRESSED.

And what irritates me is when I see someone ask on this forum, what ever happened to X feature ( IE ranked pvp) We get a response of "the free-to-play launch (ie making cash on cartel market) set us back"....

 

Near every patch there are more items to buy on the cartel market, yet we cant get some bug fixes that have been there since launch??? Sounds to me like there are far to many devs on the cartel market team and not enough on the lets fix the bugs team.

Please correct this lie, or shall i dig up some old posts from devs as proof?

[Avatarless]

Hey Philastra!

 

One thing I did want point out is that I know sometimes there may be a misconception that because we are releasing new items into the Cartel Market, that we are not producing other content. Just to make everyone aware that our Cartel Market and content development teams are two very different things internally.

 

That is to say, us producing new items for the Cartel Market does not adversely mean we are not producing content. We are always doing both of these things and they are released accordingly.

 

I am not sure if that directly addresses any of your concerns, but I thought this would be a good place to make mention of that. Also, as you can imagine our "content developers" are pretty busy with Rise of the Hutt Cartel and Game Update 2.0. I did attempt to address some of the other concerns that you raised in one of my other posts as well, you can see that here (I think you saw it already but just in case).

 

-eric

 

I think it's great that there seems to be an attempt at opening up communication with the players, which is never a bad thing.. but.. the only thing I thought of when I read this statement was

 

'Yeah but, imagine how much actual game content could be getting pumped out if you just combined those two teams into one GINORMICUS content development machine instead of using them for the CM"

 

But I do realise that now the game is.. sort of.. F2P, there needs to be people working on generating things to keep the income flowing.

[-Archadius-]

 

But I do realise that now the game is.. sort of.. F2P, there needs to be people working on generating things to keep the income flowing.

 

How many subs did they have a launch? 2 million?

How many would they have kept if they fixed bugs as fast as they can dish out CM items?

 

Edit:

How many are they going to lose because bugs aren't being fixed?

They will lose this one if the current issue persists.

Edited March 13, 2013 by -Archadius-
Added a question~

[Overmannus]

Hey Philastra!

 

One thing I did want point out is that I know sometimes there may be a misconception that because we are releasing new items into the Cartel Market, that we are not producing other content. Just to make everyone aware that our Cartel Market and content development teams are two very different things internally.

 

That is to say, us producing new items for the Cartel Market does not adversely mean we are not producing content. We are always doing both of these things and they are released accordingly.

 

I am not sure if that directly addresses any of your concerns, but I thought this would be a good place to make mention of that. Also, as you can imagine our "content developers" are pretty busy with Rise of the Hutt Cartel and Game Update 2.0. I did attempt to address some of the other concerns that you raised in one of my other posts as well, you can see that here (I think you saw it already but just in case).

 

-eric

 

The problem is you're introducing Cartel Market content and bug fixes at vastly faster rate than normal content. Patch notes as of lately have 70% to with Cartel market and not so much with actual game.

 

So players get the feeling all you do has to do with Cartel Market.

 

Even if cartel market has it's own team i doubt you hired new people exclusively for cartel market. Most likey you thined down the existing team and moved a bunch of people to cartel market team.

 

So please don't tell us that cartel market doasn't come at expense of regular content.

 

*EVRYTHING* cool is from cartel market almost exclusively as of late and not regular content.

 

p.s. Excuse my poor English please.

Edited March 13, 2013 by Overmannus

[Taulbeeeast]

People need to stop qq'ing all day long. They just brought Gree back and we know 2.0 is coming soon. Sure BW is trying to make money with the CM but if people are willing to spend real $$ on reskinned gear that provides no benefit beyond cosmetic then who can blame BW for taking the $$? The people who complain about no new content are the ones who when new content is put out, stay on the game 24/7 until they clear the new content so they can come back to forums and complain about how only the CM is being expanded.

 

Not to mention: how long do you think it takes to "develop" the gear that is being added to the CM? It is mostly the same gear already in the game except a different color and available to more classes. Food for thought (and most likely ridicule)

[manchusabre]

Recovered Hero outfit finally in the game almost 2 years after the knight progression video. I had been looking for that color scheme since seeing the video. Yes, this is so turning into all about the cartel market and microtransactions.

[Eldriq]

QQ all day long this is like the 5th thread on the Rep Grind think. The Rep you can earn and buy is for and from the Cartel Packs. It will not affect the Gree event, Voss or any of the other stuff it only affects the the Cartel Market and really why should you be able to earn Rep for the Cartel Market any other way? If you want the shiny speeder you have to consume the content in this case it is Cartel Market stuff.

 

As for the rest.

1:Yes they said coming soon and a lot of stuff is not out some of it will not be as they have said other projects have come up or the original idea is just unfeasible currently i.e. Space Project.

2: Cartel Items do get a lot of updates which I actually like as you get to see some new looks.

3: Crafting for low levels rarely if ever changes this is just a fact it would be like redoing the voice overs that content is done and over. They would have to recalculate all the crafting all over again that is just not happening. You want new crafting it is at end game.

4: It is probably a ton easier to crank out new outfits as most of these were probably already done and were just waiting to be put out. They are not going to add them to loot for raids as it would make those things unobtainable for a lot of users by having it as pay for it or go to the GTN it makes it available to everyone. You want to get it then get it, seems ultra fair to me.

5: Cartel Market is not pay to win thought I would just give a shout out with very few exceptions there is nothing in the market that will increase your power all of it is cosmetic those few exceptions are not ground breaking.

6: Bugs are very difficult to get rid of and you do see them working on these they may not be the ones you want fixed but they are working on them. You see it in the notes section all the time, don'f freak out you do not know how difficult that bug is to get out and I think in some cases impossible to get out without major overhaul of the system.

7: Server transfers may never happen.....there I said it. They have discussed the problem with them before and there stance just like cross server pvp ques. Time to realize that it may never happen at the least it is not on the horizon so if that is a deal breaker then I am sorry.

8: Dual spec may never happen especially as you can get the Legacy perk of field spec. Given that they have this ability out there my guess is duel spec is dead. And yes I understand it is not the same thing.

9: Romance options have been expanded in a way with Makeb as for the rewriting of existing content that will not happen again it would take a huge effort and an overhaul of the existing content. I just do not see that.

 

Most of these are pet peeves I get that they annoy you and or you really want them. Some of them will happen others won't but hoping for things without thinking about if they even are feasible or not realizing that things like this change just lead to nerd rage.

 

Eric thank you again for the post and I appreciate your continued willingness to get flamed and insulted. You sir are a masochist after my own heart

[Amyas]

All in game items should be earnable in game to subbers

[Blackavaar]

There's a middle ground here - technically, what was expected (due to developer comment) from the vendor was a (1) dynamic and (2) regularly (3) updated vendor that included unique (4) weapons and (5) armour. Thus far, only 3 and 5 have been made good on. Yes, it has been updated, and yes, it has armour on it. However, there are no weapons to speak of, the updates have been irregular at best, and the word "dynamic" cannot be applied.

 

You forgot the most important part. Unique. He said unique.

 

And a paint job does not make something unique.

 

[CelCawdro]

You forgot the most important part. Unique. He said unique.

 

And a paint job does not make something unique.

 

 

True enough.

[KhamG]

That is to say, us producing new items for the Cartel Market does not adversely mean we are not producing content. We are always doing both of these things and they are released accordingly.

 

Your patch notes say otherwise.