Rethink these Restrictions Bioware

[zOLtAm]

The UI restrictions are making the game unplayable... I was trying to get few friends into playing the F2P mode and as soon as they heard about the UI restrictions they said it's gonna be a waste of time downloading...

 

I was going to back as sub with some friends as f2p. But after 10min talking on ts about those UI and hide helmet/unify colors restrictions, they kind changed their mind about coming back.

 

Thats sad because I really like the game but I dont wanna play it again without my friends.

[Draekos]

Some players like to take their time, and smell the roses. But I think most people are more in a hurry. What happens when they end up getting to Taris, and find out they're two-three levels behind the curve?

 

They grind. You can still level off kills just fine.

[Draekos]

Yeah. Honestly, I would have been much more cool with SWTOR F2P, if they charged for all the planets after a player got their ship, and alternatively gave everyone unlimited warzones and flashpoints.

 

I actually agree, I would have sold the planets as quest packs and just offered the class story akin to LOTRO. Unfortunately I don't run EA and they decided to give away the entire story for free. As to WZs and FPs I would have sold those too as lifetime unlocks on an individual basis with some packages at a discount.

[WorldSecurities]

There are a few restrictions I believe shouldn't be there for Free To Play players. And this is me talking as a subscriber. This is just a list:

 

UI Needs to Be Fixed (Customization and more quickbars)

Unlimited access to all Operations, Flashpoints and Warzones (except on Section X DLCs and further content that can be paid for via Cartel Coins)

Sprint and Quick Travel need to be accessible

 

• The pre-1.5 UI should be the standard for subs and F2P. Keeps user instructions, customer service responses, and probably code changes simple. F2P to pay for hotbars 5 and 6. Why create problems with a non-standard interface?
  
• "Unlimited access to all Operations, Flashpoints and Warzones"; No, except give unlimited access to The Black Talon and The Esseles. You want the F2P customers hooked on Flashpoints; 'go ahead, the first one is free.'
  
• "Sprint and Quick Travel"; Yes. Why frustrate new players, into leaving? Or is Bioware mis-remembering how much fun the game was when you needed to be level 14(?) before you could Sprint?
  

 

Opinion - Not that this matters. Bioware/EA will likely follow their internal F2P plan ... until something breaks, or the level cap is raised.

[JefferyClark]

Honestly, they need to open up the Ops. It still requires a long time to get an Ops group together unless you are in a huge guild. Limiting the playerbase that we can take only makes it that much harder.

[finelinebob]

So, BW/EA should remove what incentives are there to get F2Per's to subscribe instead? The only stuff in the store should be vanity items, a few of which subs get for free or, even worse, can pay for with the free coins they get each month?

 

I don't think so.

 

I'm quite thankful that there is nothing in the store that I feel I need as a subscriber, and I'm quite happy to see stuff people think is needed to play available for F2Per's to purchase. That seems to be the fulcrum, the tipping point of the matter. If you don't like it, then subscribe or shut up or just leave. If you are F2P at this point, I doubt you'd be subscribed still if the game had not gone F2P anyways. The subscribed community and BW/EA lose nothing if you want to head out the Exit Door.

 

So please, former-subs-now-F2P, please take your Veruca Salt "I want an Oompa Loompa now!" whines to some other F2P game that will let you buy a Win button.

[PPPNolic]

My problem and many others in game that I have seen have been the UI restrictions for Tool bars and the hide helmet.

 

I feel that looking keys systems it not right for free players but locking content is fine like the passes is fine but looking tool bars and the helmet thing is childish at its best. The rest of the restrictions should be one time purchases such as character slots, races, and the equipment is fine to do. If they made the UI changes and added purchasable character slots and left alot of one off purchases and added credit amount increase and comidation increases to be one time pays they would be one of they better F2P systems. I mean they have alot of compatition right now with EQ2, VG, STO, DDO, LOTRO, DUCO and AoC plus many more that offer more to free players and even tho the games new putting this many restrictions in play just hurts them not the free players who will most likely not stick around.

[MaximusRex]

Why? What is so egregious about the game's F2P system that you think it will keep players away?

 

Firstly, I want F2P to be successful to hopefully get some needed content, mini-games and polish into TOR. I have seen how much it has changed DDO and LOTRO for the better, and since I really want this game to be a success I hope for the same to happen here.

 

In LOTRO you get access to all areas and to the main story line quest line for free, and all other content you need to pay for. There are restrictions, like a gold cap, and inventory space, that you can buy increases for, and removals for. Once you buy access to something, you can use it as much as you like, the idea is that they make good new content and people buy it.

 

I'm concerned that the TOR system is tight on silly things, like UI and maybe even hide helmet, and wants to basically charge recurring fees for Flashpoints and PvP, and that this will be more of a turn off than an encouragement for players to invest. I really feel like BioWare isn't making a viable ala carte system, but are trying to make it punitive enough that they force subs, subs that people didn't want in the first place aren't going to suddenly be more appealing. If they are serious about patches every 6 or so weeks, there should be a constant stream of new content to buy, so why risk driving people away over a couple of toolbars?

[PPPNolic]

I actually agree, I would have sold the planets as quest packs and just offered the class story akin to LOTRO. Unfortunately I don't run EA and they decided to give away the entire story for free. As to WZs and FPs I would have sold those too as lifetime unlocks on an individual basis with some packages at a discount.

 

This is not a bad idea sell each Flash Point, War Zone and Operation as a one time thing but give players the rest like it is minus the UI stuff and add other one time purchases like credit limit and Comidation limit. Maybe add other things like mounts and other ships to the store or even DLC like the Section X thing as one time buys and you got it good. Add character slots to even subbers would buy them I know I would like more toons at some time. And most F2P people dont want the whole game for free like most are saying but are willing to buy things piece meal to get what they want. But locking UI is not they way to go sorry.

[TwwIX]

I was thinking of returning to the game myself until i saw all of the restrictions. It's not worth my bandwidth even with the "Preferred Status". Restricting basic gameplay functions is a no no. If this game actually warranted a subscription fee, it wouldn't have bombed so miserably.

 

This just EA shooting themselves in the foot again. Good luck competing with all the other free to play MMO's!

[Darkfalconheart]

I was going to play again and maybe even spend some money on the game, but the restrictions are just stupid at this point.

 

-UI restrictions are terrible, I've never seen this in any F2P game and probably for good reason.

-Reduced experience rates. I noticed this on the new restrictions page, but no information has been given on what this is or how much, along with this being listed separate from no rested xp.

-No hide headslot or unify color options. There are many F2P games that allow the basic option of hiding a headslot or dye features without paying. I can live without the unify color since that was not in the game for a long time, but no hide headslot is just silly at this point.

 

The UI restirction may be annoying but can be bought off in a one time purchase. So it's not that bad. (I have been operating on only two Q-Bars for quite some time before adding a third.)

Reduced XP rates I think are fair - it gives the subscribers some advantage and boosts can be bought too.

Not hidiing your headslot and no unified colours are purely cosmetic and don't hinder your gameplay... so it's not a restriction at all. Because you do not suffer any ingame malus for not having them.

[unexpectedemon]

couple restrictions are crazy....like 2 quickslots, can't send mail, sprint at lvl 15,....hmm new player should get a least a bank like 20 slots or something... Edited November 16, 2012 by unexpectedemon

[Hardwear]

This whole f2p business was a bad idea to begin with imo.

 

I would have preferred EA/BioWare had just invested money into making meaningful content like off the rails space content, pod racing or fixing/expanding world pvp etc. instead of this sub/f2p hybrid.

 

The people allegedly advocating less restriction for the f2p people despite these restrictions being made clear for months will continue to nickel and dime the game until it's completely free and a subscription irrelevant.

 

The logic that people who left the game due to the sub fee who had full access to the game would somehow have a change of heart and come back under a "free" restricted capacity is got to be the dumbest thing I ever heard.

 

The people that left, left because they either didn't like the game or felt there wasn't sufficient or immersive enough content to invest their money.

 

I could be wrong though maybe this is an example of a very vocal entitlement minority maybe f2p will work out, but I fear that if it doesn't instead of addressing the real problem EA may have just created another one.

[eldefail]

Remove UI restrictions. Everything else is FINE. Limiting UI elements like action bars and stuff, though? That is just STUPID and may well push new players away. The gratuitous ability bloat present in this game (juggernaut anyone?) is enough to make even a single-player run through the leveling process unreasonably difficult, even for a 'free" experience.

 

NOBODY SHOULD HAVE TO PAY TO UNLOCK BASIC UI ELEMENTS. Enhancements? Sure. Certain gear choices? Sure. Warzones, operations, things like that? Sure, I can get behind that. But restricted access to QUICKSLOTS? No no no no no no no no no.

 

Before anybody whines, I'm a subscriber. I will remain a subscriber as long as I remain interested in this game (which will be for quite some time). I'm not interested in getting "something for free" or "freeloading" or anything. Restricting basic UI function is counterproductive and STUPID.

Edited November 16, 2012 by eldefail

[Kilikaa]

People need to calm down. We are on day ONE of this free to play model. It needs time to get sorted out. Nobody knows how things are going to look in 2-3 months. Nobody can say with 100% certainty that BW won't make adjustments to the restrictions they put in. So everyone just take a deep breath and let thing play out.

[finelinebob]

This whole f2p business was a bad idea to begin with imo.

...

I could be wrong though maybe this is an example of a very vocal entitlement minority maybe f2p will work out, but I fear that if it doesn't instead of addressing the real problem EA may have just created another one.

 

Yep, you're wrong (and right). Lots of people crying for attention, saying they want their cake FOR FREE, they want to eat it, too, and EA you can go ahead and scrape off the frosting flowers and sell them back to me (optionally) for some tokens I can pay for if I decide I like frosting flowers. You got that right. Saying that going F2P is bad is wrong ... even Forbes Online -- can you believe that Forbes has an online correspondent whose beat is Computer Gaming? -- says that F2P is the model that all MMOs will and should take.

 

One whine I haven't heard yet is "WoW's not going F2P so SWTOR fails." That's because it's likely that there is a substantial part of WoW's subscribed base that never or rarely log into the game anymore yet still pay for the sub every month. Why should WoW go F2P and cut off all that revenue? What percentage of active subs would WoW have to lose because they didn't go F2P before the revenue they would get back switching to F2P would make up for losing those ghost subscribers?

 

So, WoW has no incentive because they have a history and they have momentum and inertia going for them ... years and millions of subscriptions more than SWTOR ever had. The thing is this: the F2P model exists because it works. Games have converted to it and others have launched in it because companies make money using it. Do you really think that EA, of all companies, would choose a F2P model if, above all other concerns, they could NOT make more money doing it than staying in the subscription model? EA puts their profits ahead of EVERYTHING else. Why did they fire so many BW employees after the launch? Because it was for the good of the game or the player base? No, because it improved their bottom line.

 

The one thing you can be certain of, for the life of this game, is that any change made, anything added or taken away, is being done because EA believes it will make them more money than if it is not done.

 

Now, EA making more money doesn't mean the game won't "fail." You may learn to hate it, think that the gameplay is awful. But "fail" at making money? No. Not gonna happen. If it does, the game will be shut down, and faster than SWG was ... at least Sony allowed three swings at the plate (original, CU, NGE) to the dev team before LucasArts told them they wouldn't be allowed to play any longer.

 

Who knows? Maybe with Disney owning LA now, perhaps LA won't interfere with the game any longer. You hate space-on-rails? Blame LucasArts for that, not BW/EA.

[SpectralDragonJ]

I, myself, am a subscriber.

 

From a business standpoint, putting massive restrictions on F2P makes sense, however if you want to entice people to play the game in the first place you need to give them a feel for what they are missing.

 

I admit, I had trouble with the normal story late game when my gear was near normal levels. For F2P players this means they are forced to get help.

 

This game seems to primarily be about gear and customization, by removing that almost entirely it makes the game quite dull.

 

IMO the restrictions are a tad on the harsh side. 3 quick bars minimum is required for this game at high levels.

 

There are other things that bother me about F2P but to keep this short I think if enough people complain bioware will loosen the restrictions slightly.

[scooterus]

I don't understand where does all this hate for the F2P option/players comes from

 

 

You like the way things went for you so far, and are happy with your gameplay experience? keep subscribing, the option is still there and no one took anything from it, it's still the same

On what scale does this influence your gametime/gameplay/enjoyment?

I tell you, your game stays the same, nothing gained, nothing lost, just more people to be around at any given time and more cash for the developers. If you want to be a subscriber, the f2p option should not bother you at all

 

I think all this is just pure spite. something like: Hell, I paid monthly so why should they give anything away for free to others that didn't pay as much.

Because as it was, this game was going down, fast. And pretty soon you, the magnificent subscriber (with the tall white horse and all) would have found fewer and fewer people on the servers. And then your fun would have been diminished too

 

Some restrictions are just wrong (limited quickbars and no option to perm unlock warzones), others are just right

The age of monthly based subscription games is already coming to an end. Why pay every month, for the right to play something you already bought?

 

So my advice would be to just abstain from posting here if you don't intend to oneday go f2p.

Edited November 16, 2012 by scooterus

[hallucigenocide]

Remove UI restrictions. Everything else is FINE. Limiting UI elements like action bars and stuff, though? That is just STUPID and may well push new players away. The gratuitous ability bloat present in this game (juggernaut anyone?) is enough to make even a single-player run through the leveling process unreasonably difficult, even for a 'free" experience.

 

NOBODY SHOULD HAVE TO PAY TO UNLOCK BASIC UI ELEMENTS. Enhancements? Sure. Certain gear choices? Sure. Warzones, operations, things like that? Sure, I can get behind that. But restricted access to QUICKSLOTS? No no no no no no no no no.

 

Before anybody whines, I'm a subscriber. I will remain a subscriber as long as I remain interested in this game (which will be for quite some time). I'm not interested in getting "something for free" or "freeloading" or anything. Restricting basic UI function is counterproductive and STUPID.

 

yeah i agree.. there's nothing wrong with having restrictions for the f2p but the UI thing is just overkill

[Ungodlyomen]

People need to calm down. We are on day ONE of this free to play model. It needs time to get sorted out. Nobody knows how things are going to look in 2-3 months. Nobody can say with 100% certainty that BW won't make adjustments to the restrictions they put in. So everyone just take a deep breath and let thing play out.

 

Ur right. They wont do nothing if nothing said though either

[finelinebob]

Ur right. They wont do nothing if nothing said though either

 

Hehe ... and you expect people who play an MMO to say nothing if something went "wrong"? If BW could bank on anything about this patch, it's that people would have more than enough to talk about on the forums.

[eldefail]

Many of the complaints you see are from current active subscribers who will remain subscribed despite F2P, myself included.

 

Why are we complaining then since F2P doesn't affect us at all? Because we were hoping it would draw more people to the game and breathe new life into SWTOR. Some of these restrictions are already pushing new--yes NEW, not returning, but NEW--players away. Another person already mentioned it and I more or less already did, too, but you need at least 3 action bars. Sure you can buy them, but we simply don't feel that basic UI elements should be restricted.

 

People whining about warzones, flashpoints, end-game gear, and other things not necessary for the 1-50 grind do just need to get with the program and accept that F2P cannot be the full subscriber experience for free. However it is perfectly reasonable to expect basic UI function. The current model is deliberately set up so that at level 30-40 you realize you have too many abilities that you need to keep in regular rotation and nowhere to put them. A successful F2P model that brings more players to the game is a model that doesn't require you to make a single purchase to enjoy the basic game. The current model will pretty much require you to purchase additional quickslots just to properly level your characters without being totally awful at the game.

 

Many of us SUBSCRIBERS are complaining about the current F2P model because we simply do not feel that it will generate enough interest in the game, or encourage people to play long enough to get a real feel and liking for SWTOR and then spend money and sub. We fear that it will just insult them and push them away. Many people who brought new friends to the game today have already experienced it as their friends said "thanks but no thanks" and left after day 1.

 

We aren't whining because we aren't getting something, most of us are subscribers, I don't think F2P can even post on the forums. We're whining because we don't feel that it will generate money or interest in the game.

Edited November 16, 2012 by eldefail
Quoted the wrong person. Derp.

[Timarick]

Many of the complaints you see are from current active subscribers who will remain subscribed despite F2P, myself included.

 

Why are we complaining then since F2P doesn't affect us at all? Because we were hoping it would draw more people to the game and breathe new life into SWTOR. Some of these restrictions are already pushing new--yes NEW, not returning, but NEW--players away. Another person already mentioned it and I more or less already did, too, but you need at least 3 action bars. Sure you can buy them, but we simply don't feel that basic UI elements should be restricted.

 

People whining about warzones, flashpoints, end-game gear, and other things not necessary for the 1-50 grind do just need to get with the program and accept that F2P cannot be the full subscriber experience for free. However it is perfectly reasonable to expect basic UI function. The current model is deliberately set up so that at level 30-40 you realize you have too many abilities that you need to keep in regular rotation and nowhere to put them. A successful F2P model that brings more players to the game is a model that doesn't require you to make a single purchase to enjoy the basic game. The current model will pretty much require you to purchase additional quickslots just to properly level your characters without being totally awful at the game.

 

Many of us SUBSCRIBERS are complaining about the current F2P model because we simply do not feel that it will generate enough interest in the game, or encourage people to play long enough to get a real feel and liking for SWTOR and then spend money and sub. We fear that it will just insult them and push them away. Many people who brought new friends to the game today have already experienced it as their friends said "thanks but no thanks" and left after day 1.

 

We aren't whining because we aren't getting something, most of us are subscribers, I don't think F2P can even post on the forums. We're whining because we don't feel that it will generate money or interest in the game.

 

This. This. And more of this. Take this. Wrap it in this, and bake it in this set to 500 degrees. Serve it with toast and bacon and you get THIS!

 

We subbers actually CARE about our game and we WANT it to succeed. We also want our FRIENDS who DON'T want to pay to have a good time in on it. It's simple logic. When the UI is robbed, and you can't even show off your titles of accomplishment or even your last name or hide that ugly helmet without paying for it. Something is DANGEROUSLY WRONG.

[boxfetish]

There are a few restrictions I believe shouldn't be there for Free To Play players. And this is me talking as a subscriber. This is just a list:

 

UI Needs to Be Fixed (Customization and more quickbars)

Unlimited access to all Operations, Flashpoints and Warzones (except on Section X DLCs and further content that can be paid for via Cartel Coins)

Sprint and Quick Travel need to be accessible

 

Other than that, I believe it is completely fair for both camps. The gear option from Ops needs to be purchased as it gives subscribers a little something, something. No Cartel Coins should be earned in game (also a little nod to subscribers). All caps on money and banks should exist, but have a way of buying your way out via Cartel Coins. I believe this is the fairest system the game should go with to continue to have players come in (or back) and make this game the best it can be.

 

Another list of missing F2P features that, as usual, completely misses the point. Why? Because you can at least purchase those things with a few cartel coins to get them. Sprint, Quick Travel, and UI items just require one small purchase and then you have them.

 

The biggest eff-up on Bioware's part is the ridiculously low 200,000 credit cap for F2P players and 350,000 credit cap for preferred players. No way to unlock or purchase a larger credit cap. The game is completely unplayable once you hit level 20ish with such pitiful credit caps. Pure idiocy.

[Draekos]

Many of the complaints you see are from current active subscribers who will remain subscribed despite F2P, myself included.

 

Why are we complaining then since F2P doesn't affect us at all? Because we were hoping it would draw more people to the game and breathe new life into SWTOR. Some of these restrictions are already pushing new--yes NEW, not returning, but NEW--players away. Another person already mentioned it and I more or less already did, too, but you need at least 3 action bars. Sure you can buy them, but we simply don't feel that basic UI elements should be restricted.

 

People whining about warzones, flashpoints, end-game gear, and other things not necessary for the 1-50 grind do just need to get with the program and accept that F2P cannot be the full subscriber experience for free. However it is perfectly reasonable to expect basic UI function. The current model is deliberately set up so that at level 30-40 you realize you have too many abilities that you need to keep in regular rotation and nowhere to put them. A successful F2P model that brings more players to the game is a model that doesn't require you to make a single purchase to enjoy the basic game. The current model will pretty much require you to purchase additional quickslots just to properly level your characters without being totally awful at the game.

 

Many of us SUBSCRIBERS are complaining about the current F2P model because we simply do not feel that it will generate enough interest in the game, or encourage people to play long enough to get a real feel and liking for SWTOR and then spend money and sub. We fear that it will just insult them and push them away. Many people who brought new friends to the game today have already experienced it as their friends said "thanks but no thanks" and left after day 1.

 

We aren't whining because we aren't getting something, most of us are subscribers, I don't think F2P can even post on the forums. We're whining because we don't feel that it will generate money or interest in the game.

 

So agree. I get most of the model, but restricting basic UI functionality is terrible.

Edited November 16, 2012 by Draekos