Premades are ruining non-ranked warzones

[t-darko]

Round and round we go. What ranked are we talking about? Since it got removed from the game i take it you mean arena? In which case why don't you join the solo queue for that?

 

See what i did there?

 

There are no ranked objective warzones in the game mate. They got removed for this 4v4 stuff that i dont particularly care for much.

 

I play whatever mode i like = whom i do it with or not as the case maybe is entirely down to me as an individual. I don't see why you have a problem with that? Why are you so angry about people playing the game? That's what I am doing, I just happen to not be terrible at it. I don't think I should be punished for that, but for some reason you do = you think i should be forced to play ranked arena for some reason.

Who says I don't Queue for ranked?

 

And then we finally agree on something - Arenas aren't fun, but to each it's own - And why we got Arenas in my opinion you all ready know.

 

I find a good play of Huttball the most competitive there is, and the most dynamic of them all. there now, remember, to each it's own ! And I want my Ranked 8 vs 8 back. I don't wanna play my WZ's in unranked.

 

So you want ranked WZ's back? So do you want hard, even bouts, or the ones where the most heavily geared team wins?

Do we agree on that the not yet good PvPers should be able to experience PvP for the first time, without having you, me or any other who have done this a very long time, in their face? 'Cos That, my Friend, is what the intended design was for unranked!! That the not yet good players can hone their skills and progress, without going thru a WZ where as the wining team got 200 -300 kills between them and the losing barley make 12?

 

And yes for a fully geared 55er that likes WZ there is no where else to go, and that is now what all the 'anti-premade' threads are about, they don't want us there, period, premade or 'good' players alike. They want a own playground to play in and they're fighting hard to get it, And again WHY doesn't the 'good' PvP players in the community fight as furiously to get their own playground, with WZ and all. Why is there a general acceptance of Arenas as the only ranked??

 

I want a ranked season of Hutball, to top that, I would like to see a cross server play off. Live feeds both ingame and out. I want giant ingame posters on Coruscant, Hutta, Nar shaada of the top ten ranked players and/or teams!!

[Joesixxpack]

I thought about responding to your post but after reading this I have no will to educate some kid. I do it enough at work... and I get paid for it.

 

As for the rest of you aguing against my little idea, shame on you. As I said there will be some of you who will balk at this because your singular accomplishment is in a game. Sadly, for the most part, it looks like I am right.

 

For this reason I hope BW does incorporate this idea. It will force some of you to realize there is more to life than just a game. It will also generate more revenue for BW so maybe they can fix their engine and introduce a better concept for pvp... like open world pvp or rvr.

 

"Patronizing putz" isn't a point of view likely to gain much support.

 

Neither are your rationales, they're ridiculous.

[Marrius]

Man this plogreen character is still at it eh? nice of him to give so much though about my personality. I guess I have a fan. lol.

 

Anyways as most of you can see this 6k+ thread leads alot (ALOT) of evidence that people are not happy with the status quote of the current WZ's and if by putting more voice to these concerns I am damned by some nitt whitt because he can't find something legitimate to criticize me about.. so be it.

 

The proof, as they say, will be in the pudding. If enough people want change then change is what they will get. The ideas posted on this thread (some good, others not so good) may be considered by the devs or perhaps the devs will come up with their own ideas. And no matter how much the minority gripe over potential change, change will happen because the majority want it that way.

I just hope it will be for the better.

 

Pug stomping is unfair to the new player and if we chase away the new player then we have no new blood to keep the game going. So either we learn to live with change (which will help our game) or lose our game and move on and take advantage of the game mechanics in the next 'wow killer'.

 

If you think I am wrong thats fine but time will tell and history (of other mmos) have proven me right so far.

(i.e. Blizzard's stand on pug stomping; equating it to cheating.)

 

Likely there will be no conclusion to this debate (or insults as Plogreen would have it) until something is done and even then there will be unhappy threads about what is done. But the threat of never making people happy is a poor excuse to argue for no change at all.

 

Wasn't it our favorite poiny eared alien that once quoted the phrase 'nature abhors a vaccuum'? I think change is good, no matter if it is bad. It shows willingness to grow and that is the only way SWTOR will survive.

Edited December 5, 2013 by Marrius

[PloGreen]

Who says I don't Queue for ranked?

 

And then we finally agree on something - Arenas aren't fun, but to each it's own - And why we got Arenas in my opinion you all ready know.

 

I find a good play of Huttball the most competitive there is, and the most dynamic of them all. there now, remember, to each it's own ! And I want my Ranked 8 vs 8 back. I don't wanna play my WZ's in unranked.

 

So you want ranked WZ's back? So do you want hard, even bouts, or the ones where the most heavily geared team wins?

Do we agree on that the not yet good PvPers should be able to experience PvP for the first time, without having you, me or any other who have done this a very long time, in their face? 'Cos That, my Friend, is what the intended design was for unranked!! That the not yet good players can hone their skills and progress, without going thru a WZ where as the wining team got 200 -300 kills between them and the losing barley make 12?

 

And yes for a fully geared 55er that likes WZ there is no where else to go, and that is now what all the 'anti-premade' threads are about, they don't want us there, period, premade or 'good' players alike. They want a own playground to play in and they're fighting hard to get it, And again WHY doesn't the 'good' PvP players in the community fight as furiously to get their own playground, with WZ and all. Why is there a general acceptance of Arenas as the only ranked??

 

I want a ranked season of Hutball, to top that, I would like to see a cross server play off. Live feeds both ingame and out. I want giant ingame posters on Coruscant, Hutta, Nar shaada of the top ten ranked players and/or teams!!

 

I would love 8v8 ranked back rather than this 4v4 arenas we have got but I just don't see that happening unfortunately. I would rather they made ranked huttball than any other mode simply because its the best thing about this game from a pvp stand point. Arenas are not really my thing at all.

 

I can honestly say I have no problem with undergeared or new players in an unranked warzone, you have to start somewhere but I just never will agree to removing groups from unranked, it's always been this way and I still gear alts solo with this going on. I would only advocate better match making but without cross server queues I can't see that being an easy solution.

Edited December 5, 2013 by PloGreen

[Marrius]

Deleted because I had second thoughts on feeding the trolls. Edited December 5, 2013 by Marrius
No point in feeding the trolls

[cycao]

Deleted because I had second thoughts on feeding the trolls.

 

weak.

[PloGreen]

Man this plogreen character is still at it eh? nice of him to give so much though about my personality. I guess I have a fan. lol.

 

Anyways as most of you can see this 6k+ thread leads alot (ALOT) of evidence that people are not happy with the status quote of the current WZ's and if by putting more voice to these concerns I am damned by some nitt whitt because he can't find something legitimate to criticize me about.. so be it.

 

The proof, as they say, will be in the pudding. If enough people want change then change is what they will get. The ideas posted on this thread (some good, others not so good) may be considered by the devs or perhaps the devs will come up with their own ideas. And no matter how much the minority gripe over potential change, change will happen because the majority want it that way.

I just hope it will be for the better.

 

Pug stomping is unfair to the new player and if we chase away the new player then we have no new blood to keep the game going. So either we learn to live with change (which will help our game) or lose our game and move on and take advantage of the game mechanics in the next 'wow killer'.

 

If you think I am wrong thats fine but time will tell and history (of other mmos) have proven me right so far.

(i.e. Blizzard's stand on pug stomping; equating it to cheating.)

 

Likely there will be no conclusion to this debate (or insults as Plogreen would have it) until something is done and even then there will be unhappy threads about what is done. But the threat of never making people happy is a poor excuse to argue for no change at all.

 

Wasn't it our favorite poiny eared alien that once quoted the phrase 'nature abhors a vaccuum'? I think change is good, no matter if it is bad. It shows willingness to grow and that is the only way SWTOR will survive.

 

It's a forum and im entitled to my opinions - that you disagree with them is not my problem. Neither is it my fault you take things so bloody personally in a computer game.

[Marrius]

I would love 8v8 ranked back rather than this 4v4 arenas we have got but I just don't see that happening unfortunately. I would rather they made ranked huttball than any other mode simply because its the best thing about this game from a pvp stand point. Arenas are not really my thing at all.

 

I can honestly say I have no problem with undergeared or new players in an unranked warzone, you have to start somewhere but I just never will agree to removing groups from unranked, it's always been this way and I still gear alts solo with this going on. I would only advocate better match making but without cross server queues I can't see that being an easy solution.

 

So basically we have the same mind on trying to solve an issue. I guess you just don't like me that much... oh well I'm not in it for a popularity contest anyways lol. As long as something is done, and by something; if they do matched groups and x-servers I think it will go a long way in revitalizing our dwindling numbers and long que's

[Marrius]

It's a forum and im entitled to my opinions - that you disagree with them is not my problem. Neither is it my fault you take things so bloody personally in a computer game.

 

Not taking it personal at all. In fact I have enjoyed the banter. I just have to remind myself not to let it get too off topic because this post is not about me, its about something that many think is bad for the game.

 

And we all have opinions, just like we all have buttholes... so why would I take it personal? hmmm?

[Jadescythe]

I just did some checking and in fact "Premades are ruining non-ranked warzones" is the largest singular post. I have no way to reference your claim of a post being restarted all I see is what is there. So this is not a tiny post at all, far from it.

 

I think its a shame that those balking at the idea of making wz's fair will resort to spreading missinformation to try and water down the topic. I guess they are feeling the pains of guilt and through it the despration that comes with the writing being on the wall. BW will do something about this, of that I am certain. What they do we can only wait and see.

 

"I have no way to validate what I'm saying, so clearly I'm right."

 

You only read the parts of threads that you feel like responding to, don't you? Obviously you couldn't take the facts given to you by someone who has been posting since early access (not counting beta), if you don't know about it then it couldn't have happened.

 

You fail to realize that your complaint is invalid and it has been proven that premades are not the problem since the changes to queues were made. In the Solo ranked queue, what is the biggest complaint that the devs have responded to? Shocking, it's the matchmaking system not working! http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=699743

 

Not only would queuing solo not balance the matches, it would further separate an already diminishing un-ranked queue. Matchmaking is and always has been the problem with SWTOR. People who aren't good, or to be PC, "casuals", don't have fun playing people who are good, "hardcores". And a lack of job or social life isn't a prerequisite to being good seeing as I manage to work 50 hours a week, spend time with my GF, family, and friends, as well as be better than 95% of the people playing this game.

 

But as I've said, I have no problem with people being bad, I just want them to play other bad people REGARDLESS of if they are grouping.

[Marrius]

"I have no way to validate what I'm saying, so clearly I'm right.".

 

You must be talking about yourself because you have yet to provide evidence showing that this is not the largest thread. but hey don't be so hard on yourself.

 

You only read the parts of threads that you feel like responding to, don't you? Obviously you couldn't take the facts given to you by someone who has been posting since early access (not counting beta), if you don't know about it then it couldn't have happened..

 

Or.. in actuallity, why respond to something that I don't feel I need to respond to? Not everything you or others say is disagreeable to me nor is it that moving.

 

You fail to realize that your complaint is invalid and it has been proven that premades are not the problem since the changes to queues were made. In the Solo ranked queue, what is the biggest complaint that the devs have responded to? Shocking, it's the matchmaking system not working! http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=699743.

I fail to see your logic here, though I agree with the matchmaking issue, the OP's topic (not mine) is what I am concerned with (that and the very real posibility of not having a SWTOR to play because some people refuse to think about the rest of the population.)

 

Not only would queuing solo not balance the matches, it would further separate an already diminishing un-ranked queue. Matchmaking is and always has been the problem with SWTOR. People who aren't good, or to be PC, "casuals", don't have fun playing people who are good, "hardcores". And a lack of job or social life isn't a prerequisite to being good seeing as I manage to work 50 hours a week, spend time with my GF, family, and friends, as well as be better than 95% of the people playing this game..

 

Ok so you feel a need to justify yourself... have at it.

 

 

 

But as I've said, I have no problem with people being bad, I just want them to play other bad people REGARDLESS of if they are grouping.

 

I am not the president and I support this message

Edited December 5, 2013 by Marrius

[cycao]

You must be talking about yourself because you have yet to provide evidence showing that this is not the largest thread. but hey don't be so hard on yourself.

 

The size of this thread has no real merit outside of all the mouth breathers that used to play this game.

[Jadescythe]

You must be talking about yourself because you have yet to provide evidence showing that this is not the largest thread. but hey don't be so hard on yourself.

 

 

 

Or.. in actuallity, why respond to something that I don't feel I need to respond to? Not everything you or others say is disagreeable to me nor is it that moving.

 

 

I fail to see your logic here, though I agree with the matchmaking issue, the OP's topic (not mine) is what I am concerned with (that and the very real posibility of not having a SWTOR to play because some people refuse to think about the rest of the population.)

 

 

 

Ok so you feel a need to justify yourself... have at it.

 

 

 

 

 

I am not the president and I support this message

 

Perhaps you should re-read the OP:

 

Less and less people are pvp'ing now, sometimes it takes 45-60 mins for a pop to happen.... I've noticed a trend on certain servers you get a few PvP guilds that do nothing but make up 4 man premades and ruin all the fun for people who just want jump into a quick warzone... What happens is you can go against a fully geared out premade who's on vent/mumble/team speak and they pretty much just own everyone...

 

Bioware you need to add a PUG only warzone option, this will level the playing field more and allow people to just have fun.... If not, less and less people are going to pvp due to frustration with the situation..

 

If you agree with my last statement, then you disagree with the OP that premades should not be in queue with PUGs.

 

Side note:

This is what I mean by threads having to be remade for hitting post threshold: http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=4584950&postcount=3

[Uber_the_Goober]

I am on Jung Ma and there are at least two guilds that frequently pugstomp. So much so that when they log on many people just quit the wz. (not me though I'll take the 1 point for my daily at least)

 

When this happens, I just turn on auto-run and then browse the net. Auto run ensures I'll always be entering the battle, and all I have to do is click the rez button when I get owned

 

Playing against spawn camping idjits is the least fun thing ever, and I won't participate in it. But I still want the credit towards the weekly...

[shednik]

I can't believe this thread is still going on

[Marrius]

 

 

If you agree with my last statement, then you disagree with the OP that premades should not be in queue with PUGs.

 

 

If I were a one trick pony I might abide by your reasoning. But I can have multiple ideas that can compliment or even challenge themselves. This is part of what it means to have a creative mind.

 

If somehow BW were able to only put casual players together, and premades together; If they could ensure that team balance was fair (i.e. 1 healer per 4 people); If the que times were not too long... then why would I not agree with any idea that might incorporate all of this? it would make the game better and that is all I want. That and a million bucks but I am sure BW won't give me that.

Edited December 6, 2013 by Marrius

[Marrius]

When this happens, I just turn on auto-run and then browse the net. Auto run ensures I'll always be entering the battle, and all I have to do is click the rez button when I get owned

 

Playing against spawn camping idjits is the least fun thing ever, and I won't participate in it. But I still want the credit towards the weekly...

 

I do similar if the wz gets too out of hand. My main is a tankasin so i just stealth and turn on autorun then go grab a smoke.

[Marrius]

Bumping to support the thread

[cycao]

Since this is obviously a hot topic again for some reason I know Bioware has posted several times on this pressing matter. For your convenience I will list what they have stated below.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I know it's a long read but it's worth it.

Edited December 6, 2013 by cycao

[helloder]

Since this is obviously a hot topic again for some reason I know Bioware has posted several times on this pressing matter. For your convenience I will list what they have stated below.

 

 

 

 

I know it's a long read but it's worth it.

 

Doubt they ever will, cause there is no logic arguments to support current situation.

Edited December 6, 2013 by helloder

[shednik]

Since this is obviously a hot topic again for some reason I know Bioware has posted several times on this pressing matter. For your convenience I will list what they have stated below.

 

 

 

I know it's a long read but it's worth it.

 

Solid read 10/10 would read again! Glad to see cycao is back

[Jadescythe]

Since this is obviously a hot topic again for some reason I know Bioware has posted several times on this pressing matter. For your convenience I will list what they have stated below.

 

 

I know it's a long read but it's worth it.

 

Both riveting and insightful. A masterpiece of the human mind.

[Vodrin]

Doubt they ever will, cause there is no logic arguments to support current situation.

 

Sure there is: It's what they are reliably able to code with the resources they are willing to devote to it.

[Jadescythe]

Bumping to support the thread

 

I'm still waiting on any actual facts you'd like to present on behalf of your cause.

 

If premades are the big, bad problem, why are there still problems in the solo queue when the matchmaking element doesn't work as expected?

 

How do you explain premades losing in warzones to full PUGs?

 

How would you keep queue times low without a mixed queue?

 

How do you differentiate between two people grouping or 3? or 4?

 

How do you prevent queue syncing in an 8v8, solo queue match?

 

I have multiple videos that I've posted in this thread before that show both me, in a full pug, beating a 4-man premade as well as me, in a pug, showing up late to an ACW and managing to ninja a node through good teamwork with someone I've never met... twice to beat a premade. I have factual evidence to prove premades are not the problem, all you've given me is your opinion. Perhaps it's time to shift your opinion to match the facts.

[Uber_the_Goober]

I have multiple videos that I've posted in this thread before that show both me, in a full pug, beating a 4-man premade as well as me, in a pug, showing up late to an ACW and managing to ninja a node through good teamwork with someone I've never met... twice to beat a premade. I have factual evidence to prove premades are not the problem, all you've given me is your opinion. Perhaps it's time to shift your opinion to match the facts.

 

I love rolling up to a node in stealth, with another friendly stealther nearby, and each of us being able to predict what the other will do simply by our relative position on the map and the nearby turret/enemy. BAM, node taken. Words spoken, 0.

 

No speaking necessary. Just not sucking.

 

Premades are not the problem, and this is why Bioware will not acknowledge this "issue". There is not enough of a population to support dividing the queue between premade and solo, and they've said cross-server queues aren't possible with the current tech/software they run (though, I haven't seen the statement myself, just repeating what other forum users have said)