Surge nerf > holy ****

[Turando]

A power/crit enhancement does exist talk to an arti.

 

Incorrect. They are called the Reflective enhancements, but they also have a +glance rating. Unless this a datamining error and never made it into the game.

 

http://www.torhead.com/items/catg/3/subcatg/4/power/gt/0/and/crit/gt/0/and

Edited February 14, 2012 by Turando

[Dracosz]

Incorrect. They are called the Reflective enhancements, but they also have a +glance rating. Unless this a datamining error and never made it into the game.

 

http://www.torhead.com/items/catg/3/subcatg/4/power/gt/0/and/crit/gt/0/and

 

After some testing (as a vengeance juggernaut, not lolragesmash) here's what I've managed to do to keep my damage more or less the same.

 

A) Keep surge at 75%, this is effectively the point at which surge gains experience MASSIVE cutbacks.

 

B) Drop Crit/Surge for Power surge and power/accuracy

 

C) Drop the power BM relic for the BM crit surge relic whilst using the power adrenal, you don't experience DR with this.

 

Current stats (self buffed w/ rakata stim)

 

428 bonus damage

24.3% crit

75.15% surge

 

when I pop the adrenal + relic, my surge % shoots to 91% and my crit to 34% and my bonus damage shoots to 534, before with both power ones it shot to something around 590, so the net gain (given power's diminishing returns is the same).

 

TLDR, I can burst just as hard, I just have to move around stat priorities... again

Edited February 14, 2012 by Dracosz

[CuriousK]

Here's an idea, prove to me mathematically how this statement is even remotely true. All dps classes use surge. That 600k bounty hunter damage screen shot you just linked .. SURGE ... yup he was stacking surge ... shocking I know. In fact because all dps (and healing) classes were using it profusely, they nerfed it ... go figure.

 

First off, ill state my position on this, surge needed a nerf to bring it in line with other secondary stats in terms of stacking. Every sane person knew it was going to happen, no stat with that much bang for the item budget was going to stay as is.

 

Now surge is more consistent with other secondary stats (other than alacrity/accuracy, whole different thread for that one )

 

Moving on.

 

Its easy to see how other posters point about the surge change affecting some classes more dramatically than others.

 

Some classes have either auto crit, or talents that greatly improve the chance of certain attacks to crit (juggs/guardians, ops/scoundrels, shadows/assasins) Since the ability to autocrit or have a very high chance to crit is factored into their sustained damage, its logical to assume that classes with better sustained (non crit) damage are not affected as much by the surge changes, as those that rely more heavily on crits for damage.

 

eg.

• http://knotor.com/abilities/504190-element-of-surprise
  
• http://knotor.com/abilities/228447-particle-acceleration
  
• http://knotor.com/abilities/294159-felling-blow
  

 

Classes without these sorts of increased crit, or autocrit abilities should theoretically be able to do similar damage when specced for DPS compared to the high crit classes, since they dont rely on crits and have a lower incidence of crits, this change affects them less than those that do.

 

TLDR; Classes with better sustained (non crit) damage are not affected by this change as much as those that rely on crits.

 

PS. I make no comment on all at the relative strength/viability of any class, simply that this change DOES affect some classes more than others. Id love to hear your rationale as to why you think it affects all classes equally.

Edited February 14, 2012 by CuriousK

[Torn]

If I want to stack power, I'm forced to stack Surge

If I want to stack Crit, I'm forced to stack surge

 

>_<

 

No alternative...

 

^^ This - Who is in this thread being an idiot saying people are complaining for no reason? The nerf is fine - Heck I was tired of getting hit with those smash hits for huge crits - but right now I dont see any other thing to stack if I want power - my stats after the nerf go like so:

 

Cunning > Power > Crit > Surge

 

But any gear that has a good amount of power has surge....You dont see crit/power enhancements

 

Does anyone know what the surge cap is now? I was only at 76% before the nerf and I will be at work until late - just curious

[copasetic]

Incorrect. They are called the Reflective enhancements, but they also have a +glance rating. Unless this a datamining error and never made it into the game.

 

http://www.torhead.com/items/catg/3/subcatg/4/power/gt/0/and/crit/gt/0/and

 

I'm pretty sure these aren't in the game considering I have never seen any item or buff with any mention of "Glancing" on it. It is very interesting though. I wonder why they removed the Glancing stat?

[jdnyc]

But any gear that has a good amount of power has surge....You dont see crit/power enhancements

 

Artificers can apparently make a crit/power one. Saw it mentioned in another thread. Not sure if that's true or not.

 

Regardless, I doubled down on power already - so I'm good.

[Tierce]

OMGZ, I can't stack a stat to it's 100% hard cap on a completely linear scale with 4 pieces of gear. It now has diminishing returns JUST LIKE EVERYTHING ELSE, NO FAIR!

[lexiekaboom]

MMO players are the best. Honestly, love you guys so much

 

HEY LOOK ... there are 8 stats. 7 of them act exactly like you would expect and identical to one another, providing diminishing returns like every stat in every MMO ever.

 

One doesn't

 

CLEARLY I should invest all my time in farming this stat, because if I know anything, it's that I should in no way ever expect this stat to be made just like all the others.

 

Anyone who has played an MMO for more then a week saw this coming day one and isn't surprised at all.

 

Also, anyone who has played a MMO for more then a week knowns exacty where the power / crit mods and enhancements are.

 

 

THEY ARE IN THE NEXT GAME UPDATE, SO THAT YOU HAVE A REASON TO GO TO THE NEW ZONES.

 

 

QQ away!

Edited February 14, 2012 by lexiekaboom

[TechMaestro]

Now Bioware just needs to fix accuracy and alacrity. While I am not sure how they can fix accuracy, they can fix alacrity by making it not only reduce the GCD but also increase energy/ammo/force regen in the same proportion so peope will actually have a reason to stack alacrity without running out of energy/ammo faster.

[Rodobson]

Everyone needs to recognize that these changes are to help improve the game as a whole. It doesn't matter what the numbers were. This doesn't break the game, people just need to adapt.

 

Wasn't Power supposed to be the offensive stat that didn't have diminishing returns? What happened to that?

 

Alacrity, and most of all, Presence, need to be looked at next.

Edited February 14, 2012 by Rodobson

[hoax_]

Pretty much, when I went over 115% (+30% talent) and half lifing people with one ability in 10-49 bracket.... my first thoughts were why this hasnt been nerfed.

 

maybe it wasn't nerfed because nobody cares about 10-49. Plus, nearly every class has those +30% talents.

[SeloDaoC]

i had 90% and now have 77%

 

im fine with that, but theres no option. Its either crit curge or pow surge. So now im basicly wasting stats becouse theres no options

[EternalFinality]

MMO players are the best. Honestly, love you guys so much

 

HEY LOOK ... there are 8 stats. 7 of them act exactly like you would expect and identical to one another, providing diminishing returns like every stat in every MMO ever.

 

One doesn't

 

CLEARLY I should invest all my time in farming this stat, because if I know anything, it's that I should in no way ever expect this stat to be made just like all the others.

 

Anyone who has played an MMO for more then a week saw this coming day one and isn't surprised at all.

 

Also, anyone who has played a MMO for more then a week knowns exacty where the power / crit mods and enhancements are.

 

 

THEY ARE IN THE NEXT GAME UPDATE, SO THAT YOU HAVE A REASON TO GO TO THE NEW ZONES.

 

 

QQ away!

 

Hey, smart guy, not only did they adjust the diminishing returns to bring it "in line" with other stats, but they added a 10% nerf on top of that.

 

Did you even read the notes?

[Panzerbase]

Game is truly a WoW clone, gear like this and only use these talents, it makes our lives easier in our offices. Sad way to do business.

[DestyOwn]

MMO players are the best. Honestly, love you guys so much

 

HEY LOOK ... there are 8 stats. 7 of them act exactly like you would expect and identical to one another, providing diminishing returns like every stat in every MMO ever.

 

One doesn't

 

CLEARLY I should invest all my time in farming this stat, because if I know anything, it's that I should in no way ever expect this stat to be made just like all the others.

 

Anyone who has played an MMO for more then a week saw this coming day one and isn't surprised at all.

 

Also, anyone who has played a MMO for more then a week knowns exacty where the power / crit mods and enhancements are.

 

 

THEY ARE IN THE NEXT GAME UPDATE, SO THAT YOU HAVE A REASON TO GO TO THE NEW ZONES.

 

 

QQ away!

 

Power doesnt have DR, it always stays the same

[Frostbyt]

stack power

 

srsly...some people acting like big number RNG is the only thing to do in this game.

 

How about stack your main stat, push for maxing out power, then look to crit and surge.

 

RNG shouldn't be a guaranteed thing every time. The problem is how often the crit procs, so the amount it does is substantial (the surge.) They could either reduce the amount you crit or how much you crit for.

 

This is a universal nerf. Everyone is affected and this change in my opinion requires more play with more strategy.

 

It deters the play-style of running around spamming that one instant to look at big numbers and think you're awesome.

 

It requires people to have more skill and I think that's a good thing.

 

idiot

[Rheeling]

I'm kind of lost... People complain about other players hitting them too hard. That is a direct result of surge, along with a little setup. So now, from all the complaints about the surge nerf, this is what I've gathered:

 

"Every class hits me way too hard, so nerf the crap out of their damage. Oh, but leave mine, because I want to hit them harder than they can hit me."

 

and

 

"Omg BioWare you suc***k! You've implemented a change that will help improve some abilities hitting too hard that I've been complaining about! But it affects me too :mad:"

[idipper]

stack power

 

srsly...some people acting like big number rng is the only thing to do in this game.

 

How about stack your main stat, push for maxing out power, then look to crit and surge.

 

Rng shouldn't be a guaranteed thing every time. The problem is how often the crit procs, so the amount it does is substantial (the surge.) they could either reduce the amount you crit or how much you crit for.

 

This is a universal nerf. Everyone is affected and this change in my opinion requires more play with more strategy.

 

It deters the play-style of running around spamming that one instant to look at big numbers and think you're awesome.

 

It requires people to have more skill and i think that's a good thing.

 

power in medium values, and paired with either really high surge (fairly useless past 250) and alacrity (fairly useless).

 

We as sorcs are still stuck with battle or adept enhancements, and still forced to push surge way past dr - because alacrity has yet to be reworked and the stat spread on enhancements don't allow us to stack power without inordinate amounts of surge -

 

 

As is, even if we did want to stack power, its at the expense of really harshly diminished Surge Rating or trashy Alacrity.

 

Did we not know this? Did this game just come out?

Edited February 14, 2012 by idipper

[EternalFinality]

I'm kind of lost... People complain about other players hitting them too hard. That is a direct result of surge, along with a little setup. So now, from all the complaints about the surge nerf, this is what I've gathered:

 

"Every class hits me way too hard, so nerf the crap out of their damage. Oh, but leave mine, because I want to hit them harder than they can hit me."

 

and

 

"Omg BioWare you suc***k! You've implemented a change that will help improve some abilities hitting too hard that I've been complaining about! But it affects me too :mad:"

 

This nerfs everyone in PvE. Was THAT their intention?

[Evuke]

I'm kind of lost... People complain about other players hitting them too hard. That is a direct result of surge, along with a little setup. So now, from all the complaints about the surge nerf, this is what I've gathered:

 

"Every class hits me way too hard, so nerf the crap out of their damage. Oh, but leave mine, because I want to hit them harder than they can hit me."

 

and

 

"Omg BioWare you suc***k! You've implemented a change that will help improve some abilities hitting too hard that I've been complaining about! But it affects me too :mad:"

 

people don't want THEIR class nerfed, just the ones that can kill them.

[Choppaman]

You mean "Think of it as the second part of HEALERS ARE NEVER GOING TO DIE"?

 

Except surge affects critical heals which are important to at least one of the healer classes.

[Rhazesx]

I for one Hail our new tank specced overlords walking the ball to endzone and passing to his 3 other tank friends when needed.

[Mcleavestein]

I don't mind the Nerf in theory, but I play a rage Mara, and we weren't exactly OP as it was. Maybe give us a slight sustained dps buff. Since dealing damage as fast as possible, is the only thing we can do, even a 5% overall damage nerf is huge.

[maradigamer]

Hey, I have a great idea to help with this super surviving healer situation. Team leaders in pug games could actually mark those healers and teams could then focus fire them down.

 

Try it, you'll like it.

[glenbruton]

the surge nerf = less burst, I would think the tracer missile whiners would appreciate this.

 

LOL no. They only want other people nerfed. Not themselves.