Requimo Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I honestly think changing Merc's class name to "Turret" wouldn't sound too ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demarcc Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Personally the Tracer spam dont bother me too much. LoS it or interupt it. I do however have great fun running upto BH's and saying "Dont trace me bro!" For the rest of the game they tend to focus all thier efforts on killing me and me alone. Its like having a 100% taunt Apparently its a raw nerve for some heh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exothermix Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Not played either of these classes yet... ...but... Are you saying the abils are OP because they deal insane damage with repectively low energy/mechanic cost and cooldown... ...or because the class is 'too simple' to play? If the latter, then just worry about your own class, if you want an easier class yourself, just reroll - as there are bigger issues to be dealing with in regards to PvP than "omg he just spams 1 abil". If the former then I haven't noticed it myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeloDaoC Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I like when you interrupt Tracer Missile/Grav Round and the person just stands still not using any skills. When you interupt a bh/trooper, skills go on on GCD, they cant use any skills, that is probably what you see. Ive also had the problem with me beeing interupted, i jam another skill, but nothing happens, until i move and use another skill, its like tracer/grav is still "going of" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bamsmacked Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 How the tracer missile spammer was born 1: 1 point into tracer Missile: "reduces armor by 4% for 15s, stacks up to 5 times!""Might as well shoot it 5x then right?" 2. Spam spam spam, wow that last one just hit for 2.5k another for 2.3k! (target dies) Oh look my heat lvls are still low! More tracer missile!!! 3. 2 points into Power barrier: Tracer Missile 100% chance to generate a Power barrier reduces dmg up to 2% for 15s....guess what...stacks 5x!!... More Tracer Missile!! 4. 1 point into Lightem up and Tracer lock: Tracer Missile adds heat signature...tracer missile grants target lock: grants 6% increased dmg to next Rail shot, and low and behold...stacks 5x!!!...tracer mayhem!!! This is how it went in my head atleast lol. And i love it when i see tracer missiles vs tracer missile. lol cracks me up Ahahahaha. That was funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DervimNorth Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Not played either of these classes yet... ...but... Are you saying the abils are OP because they deal insane damage with repectively low energy/mechanic cost and cooldown... ...or because the class is 'too simple' to play? If the latter, then just worry about your own class, if you want an easier class yourself, just reroll - as there are bigger issues to be dealing with in regards to PvP than "omg he just spams 1 abil". If the former then I haven't noticed it myself. Neither, actually. To put it simply, OP don't want to be the only ones getting nerf, so they complain about mercs while hoping their sorc alts will be left alone. Then there are simpletons who see TM flying at them, but completely ignore Heatseeker+Railshot firing at them right after TM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rukks Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I like when you interrupt Tracer Missile/Grav Round and the person just stands still not using any skills. This is pure truth and hilarious, it also goes for 90% of Merc's/Commando's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niquity Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 No, good BH's say that they just need 3 tracers to get the +5 so they can nuke. That's why people think that every BH are tracer spammers. The real problem is that the entire arsenal spec need those tracer missile stacking. So a COOLDOWN on tracer would definitely DESTROY the spec. (I know that many of you just want to destroy every class but yours but that's not the point in balancing things) If and only if BH/commandos would need a nerf it would be definitely an exchange of tracer damage for some other kind of dps tool for arsenal spec. On the other hand its funny how people cry about BHs when they're so easily countered; stuns, INTERRUPTS or knockbacks definitely screw tracer spamming. I believe that in most cases, people just need to learn how to pvp. meh if it did get nerfed a simple alter to the stacking TM buff to fix the new change to TM. so if something like 5 sec CD was added just fix the stack to flow fair with this change not hard stuff to do here......but ..................................it in Bioware Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihateyouall Posted January 30, 2012 Author Share Posted January 30, 2012 184 Expertise, and the 50 bracket. hehe, still came 2nd in damage in the 50 bracket now, and a reasonable amount of medals to go with it... I dunno, the skill may not be overpowered, but it's pretty silly. Why not add some flavour to the class. I think a change would be welcomed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deviltreh Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Obsfucate has 6 second cooldown and puts Tracer Missle on a 4 second lockout. Poor Troopers/BHs get confused and just don't know what to use without their tracer missile, rofl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonFire Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I wish the BH tree was actually something to hang in the Xmas tree but yes, it's all built around Tracer Missile. It's dumb not to use it but it's due to design that we need to overuse it. Both Power Shot and Rail Shot (bar from being usable while moving) are basically completely useless. I'd suggest that Power Shot would get a higher crit rating (to match Tracer Missile) and put Tracer on a longer CD (not much but perhaps 4-6 seconds) to deter "spam". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinnedWill Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I'll agree that tracer missile is NEEDED for mercs almost exactly the way it is, but it should probably have its damage value reduced simply for the fact that it gives buffs and armorbreak effect. If they reduced its damage but maintained everything else about it (spammable, debuffs, buffs, relatively low heat cost), then it should function more appropriately as intended. I can't think of any other skill in-game that can function as beneficially to its user and still dish out comparable values of damage at the same time. If tracer's base damage is reduced, mercs will still tracer-spam initially (as well they're supposed to), but it'll result in the mercs to use it more strategically, rather than being able to spam it to get a potentially guaranteed kill without having to use other abilities. I'm not saying to cut the damage it deals too insanely, but cutting its damage by 25% wouldn't be too terrible. This won't result in a drastic change in how a good merc plays right now, but it would definitely force those less skilled mercs that only use tracer missile in pvp to change their tactics. That's my 2 cents. So, please, lets not gimp the class - but maybe put it in line with its damage potential to be comparable to say a jugg's armorbreaks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SinnedWill Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 When you interupt a bh/trooper, skills go on on GCD, they cant use any skills, that is probably what you see. Ive also had the problem with me beeing interupted, i jam another skill, but nothing happens, until i move and use another skill, its like tracer/grav is still "going of" This is some sort of bug, and it seems to apply to every class, not just Merc/Van but I'm not 100% certain as to what the cause of it happens to be - usually when I interrupt a Merc/Van that's spamming tracer/grav, they'll use a different skill within 1 second of the interrupt (provided that they're not one of those silly people that only hotkey tracer/grav and assume the skill to be their "I win!" button and run around like a chicken with their head cut off until the disrupt effect ends). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osirus Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Op l2p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eayle Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Heaven forbid one of these "Tracer is OP" players roll a sniper and make a vid of them sitting in 1 spot spamming a properly talented snipe skill over and over.. *edit* just noticed the OP says he is a Sniper... LOL ... so he could do the above AND duck down in cover between his 1.5 second spammable skill AND deal more damage than a tracer spammer from longer range. you have no clue of what you are talking about. hint : energy management / damage mitigation (white damage) / cover bug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidenPryde Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Lower the damage to 800 on Tracer missile. Tracer Missile is meant to be stacked so that it improves your Railshot etc damage. Basically it builds up to increase a finisher's damage. But it hits too hard for that. Problem solved. It would be the same with Juggernaut DPS if our Sunder Armor ability hit for 2k. We'd spam that ability too (even though it has a longer cooldown than Tracer Missile lol). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RycheMykola Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Lower the damage to 800 on Tracer missile. Tracer Missile is meant to be stacked so that it improves your Railshot etc damage. Basically it builds up to increase a finisher's damage. But it hits too hard for that. Problem solved. It would be the same with Juggernaut DPS if our Sunder Armor ability hit for 2k. We'd spam that ability too (even though it has a longer cooldown than Tracer Missile lol). Sunder armor is also an instant attack. Tracer Missile has a 1.5 second cast time. Personally, if Tracer Missile's damage was reduced, had the same CD but was an instant attack, it would actually be a huge improvement. The buff and debuff time would need to be extended though to make up for the CD time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bovinity Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Lower the damage on Tracer, up the damage on Rail Shot/Unload. OR make Tracer weapon damage and Rail Shot tech damage. Better yet, just make Tracer less visually and audibly obvious, so people don't complain about it so much. Ever notice how the super visible things are what people whine about? =D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bushranger Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Both Power Shot and Rail Shot (bar from being usable while moving) are basically completely useless. If you think this you truly have NO IDEA how to play BH... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delavager Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Why does this thread exist. There are at least 10 other threads about this topic in existence already. Everything that can be said has been said about this topic. Stop creating new threads, use the EXISTING threads. ...and no I'm not a commando/Merc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AidenPryde Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Sunder armor is also an instant attack. Tracer Missile has a 1.5 second cast time. Personally, if Tracer Missile's damage was reduced, had the same CD but was an instant attack, it would actually be a huge improvement. The buff and debuff time would need to be extended though to make up for the CD time. But has a longer Cooldown than tracer, which balances out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gadrak Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 l2P arsenal mercenaries are utter trash on 1v1,if someone is shooting missiles at you and you are not interrupting him LOS him you DESERVE to die,if tracer missile gets a CD it will destroy our spec,every single ability of arsenal is reliant on tracer,by nerfing tracer you dont just nerf the ability you nerf our entire spec our only defensive cd is a knockback,we dont have any lolwut sprint,no snare,and we are the only class without interrupts wanna nerf our dps?fine but i demand an huge increase of survivability because with heavy armor that in this game doesnt matter anything with all that armor penetrations talent around there and with a crappy shield with 2min CD i dont want to lose my single utility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spicycookie Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I lose 1 vs 1 as a BH every single time unless the other dude doesn't know how to interrupt and severely underpowered. My Rotation is 3x Tracer 1 Unload 1 Heartseeker 1 Railshot... repeat again... This only works when I am on range with no one on me of course. Mechanics are fine and it's not OP. I only became OP when i reached 9-10% Expertise. I use to do 1k crits.. now 3k crits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWImara Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 A solution to this could be lowering the damage output of Tracer/Grav (it really was obviously meant to be for armor debuff stacking) while also dramatically changing the ability tree and gear bonuses. What people sometimes don't get is that there is a reason for the tracer spamming, it is a rather high skill chain in the DPS tree and gear further buffs its damage. To make matters worse on a commando what is (I think) supposed to be the class' main damage ability has its damage reduced by 1/3 if the player is hit once. I'm not sure this is working as intended atm but Full Auto is really risky to pop when one could instead fire a grav round to do a significant if lesser amount of damage. I am sure some would complain if Tracer/Grav were nerfed, but so long as other skills were fixed and or buffed people would adapt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWImara Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Lower the damage on Tracer, up the damage on Rail Shot/Unload. OR make Tracer weapon damage and Rail Shot tech damage. Better yet, just make Tracer less visually and audibly obvious, so people don't complain about it so much. Ever notice how the super visible things are what people whine about? =D Yep, I made this argument a while back. One of the reasons stealth classes always get hit first is that people cannot help but notice when they get stunned and then taken apart. I figure Tracer/Grav and Sith Lightning will be next less due to their effectiveness than due to the fact that everyone notices them and is aware that they're being pwnt by them. One of the things that makes Knight/Warrior so great is that people have typically no clue *** hit them for so much damage in the chaos of melee combat. It is definitely worth noting though that the nerf train tends to go roughly the same way in every game. First its stealth classes, then it is CC heavy classes then ranged DPS classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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