Vader vs Revan

[BrandonSM]

Wookieepedia isn't Canon. He was also a master of all but one Saber form. "Sith sorcerer" and such is only gameplay mechanics. Sidious studied both Dark and Light side teachings. He learned from the light side and twisted light techniques and got them to work for the dark side. Sidious was one of the best saber duelists and most knowledgeable in the force. He's also displayed the highest mastery of force lightning (by the simple fact that it killed Vader so quickly. The guy who has the best sith lightning resistance of any star wars character.)

 

As stated, people keep throwing around "he's master of both light/dark!" Revan reborn didn't draw on the dark side of the force. Only the light. So his knowledge of the dark doesn't matter much. He only uses one side.

 

Sith Sorcerer isn't game-play mechanics, there numerous Sith that were called Sorcerers. Sith Warrior on the other hand, I have yet to witness a Sith Lord be called a Sith Warrior. And thank you for stating the only use of one side. The both sides were Game Mechanics and that deflection that he did in the novel was just... deflection. No call on The Dark Side. If that was a Dark Side move then, Yoda was using that same move against Count Dooku.

[WildfireReborn]

Vader lost much of his power when he lost the majority of his limbs, so Revan would definately kick his butt, even though he is cool.

[tlang]

As stated, people keep throwing around "he's master of both light/dark!" Revan reborn didn't draw on the dark side of the force. Only the light. So his knowledge of the dark doesn't matter much. He only uses one side.

 

SWTOR: Revan pg. 275 "...he opened up to the Force, letting both light and the dark side flow through him"

[shinyelf]

The fact that you decide to rip on the fact that i used the Warrior title really gets to me, i mean seriously, it was meant to describe their capabilities and personalities.

Vader prefers direct combat, and uses the force directly (push and choke), whereas Sidius prefers to act behind the scenes and use the force in the same way.

And while it is correct that wookieepedia is not cannon it refers to cannon.

I would also like to comment on the statement of Revan not being ablæe to use both sides, as the poster above me states it is actually mentioned in a novel, and even if Revan was not capable of doing so he would still hold great knowledge of both sides, something useful considering that Vader only knows Jedi or Sith, something Revan has moved beyond (Anakin was by the way not a true jedi master, according to the movies Sidius forced them to make him a master, which kinda cheapens it a bit, and also sows doubt about wether or not he had the masterry of the light as required from a true jedi master )

[Wolfninjajedi]

The fact that you decide to rip on the fact that i used the Warrior title really gets to me, i mean seriously, it was meant to describe their capabilities and personalities.

Vader prefers direct combat, and uses the force directly (push and choke), whereas Sidius prefers to act behind the scenes and use the force in the same way.

And while it is correct that wookieepedia is not cannon it refers to cannon.

I would also like to comment on the statement of Revan not being ablæe to use both sides, as the poster above me states it is actually mentioned in a novel, and even if Revan was not capable of doing so he would still hold great knowledge of both sides, something useful considering that Vader only knows Jedi or Sith, something Revan has moved beyond (Anakin was by the way not a true jedi master, according to the movies Sidius forced them to make him a master, which kinda cheapens it a bit, and also sows doubt about wether or not he had the masterry of the light as required from a true jedi master )

 

Anakin was never made a master, Sidious only forced them to make him to have a seat on the council but he was no master. He may have not held the title of jedi master, but Anakin had the skills of one so in his own right(not the jedi order's) he was indeed a jedi master.

[Battletalon]

I hope Vader . Because he's the chosen 1. The 1 who wil bring peace to the Galaxy.

 

People say chosen one... banes rule of 2 in my mind weakened the foce threw it off balance. I think anakin w was chosen to hit the rest button. Old republic was a healthier time, with 2 equally powerful force factions.

 

Vader is good revan was better.

[Battletalon]

 

 

On a more comical note:

 

Vader's wants: His Mommy, His dead girlfriend, and the death of a wrinkly old man

Revan's wants: A Basilisk War Droid.

 

LOL!!!

 

... I want a basilisk war droid!

 

That would be a BA idea for an epic mount!!!

[Noih]

its ovbious revan would win kreia said in kotor 2 that ancient sith could destroy a sith of that time imagine how much better the sith and jedi from the old republic would be compared to vaders time

[Wolfninjajedi]

its ovbious revan would win kreia said in kotor 2 that ancient sith could destroy a sith of that time imagine how much better the sith and jedi from the old republic would be compared to vaders time

 

What? If you said an ancient sith can kill a sith/jedi of the KOTOR era time, how does that make them better then the jedi/sith of the clone wars/GCW era?

[Rhyltran]

SWTOR: Revan pg. 275 "...he opened up to the Force, letting both light and the dark side flow through him"

 

Which is followed by him using a technique that is known to be lightside in nature. (Force Absorption.) It doesn't matter. People use the "He can use light/dark!!11!!1!11" as if this makes him inherently better than other characters. Yet using both the light/dark didn't allow him to defeat the Emperor.

 

So it can't be used to claim "He's better." considering the Emperor is pure dark side and won.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Rhyltran

[tlang]

Which is followed by him using a technique that is known to be lightside in nature. (Force Absorption.) It doesn't matter. People use the "He can use light/dark!!11!!1!11" as if this makes him inherently better than other characters. Yet using both the light/dark didn't allow him to defeat the Emperor.

 

So it can't be used to claim "He's better." considering the Emperor is pure dark side and won.

 

No, Doesn't make him better.

 

But you said

 

Revan reborn didn't draw on the dark side of the force. Only the light. So his knowledge of the dark doesn't matter much. He only uses one side.

 

Argue your points better. It only makes you look like you don't know what your talking about.

Edited December 27, 2011 by tlang

[Bgiffo]

Darth Vader was beaten by a young Boba Fett. Boba Fett, presumably in his prime, was beaten by a blind guy with a stick. I'll let you guys do the math.

[Deathforged]

The RoT didn't mean that the new master was stronger than the previous one. Didn't sidious kill his master in his sleep? Sidious was sneaky, he was powerful enough in that way to blot out Yodas ability to see the future. Sidious probably was the strongest sith when it came to stealth and subterfuge. Doesn't mean he could straight up beat his master in combat, in fact it implies he couldn't.

 

Reven was around when Jedi and Sith empires were both much stronger and fought in those wars. Vader fought droids.

 

Also I don't really care or buy what GL says especially when the best parts of "his" universe weren't written by him. Star wars is beyond GL and his opinions don't hold any weight.

[BrandonSM]

The RoT didn't mean that the new master was stronger than the previous one. Didn't sidious kill his master in his sleep? Sidious was sneaky, he was powerful enough in that way to blot out Yodas ability to see the future. Sidious probably was the strongest sith when it came to stealth and subterfuge. Doesn't mean he could straight up beat his master in combat, in fact it implies he couldn't.

 

Reven was around when Jedi and Sith empires were both much stronger and fought in those wars. Vader fought droids.

 

Also I don't really care or buy what GL says especially when the best parts of "his" universe weren't written by him. Star wars is beyond GL and his opinions don't hold any weight.

 

 

You didn't attack Vader, what you are saying is that Revan could defeat Sidious...

 

 

Sidious destroyed fleets with his mind. Could make a force storm that can consume planets and make them a ball of Dark Side Power. Without any trinkets.

[Bountykingjan]

You didn't attack Vader, what you are saying is that Revan could defeat Sidious...

 

 

Sidious destroyed fleets with his mind. Could make a force storm that can consume planets and make them a ball of Dark Side Power. Without any trinkets.

 

*shakes head in agreement* yup sidious is the most powerful sith and second most powerful force user.

[BrandonSM]

*shakes head in agreement* yup sidious is the most powerful sith and second most powerful force user.

 

Abeloth holds 2nd or 1st. I'm not sure if Abeloth is more powerful than Luke in the Force. Sidious comes 3rd.

 

 

Becaus Luke is the most powerful mortal in the galaxy. Abeloth is immortal. So... their battling for first in my mind.

[Bountykingjan]

Abeloth holds 2nd or 1st. I'm not sure if Abeloth is more powerful than Luke in the Force. Sidious comes 3rd.

 

 

Becaus Luke is the most powerful mortal in the galaxy. Abeloth is immortal. So... their battling for first in my mind.

 

well still Revan would defenitly die against Sidious, but back to Revan vs Vader.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Bountykingjan

[Proctor]

You kill Revan in SWTOR. Your character is not recognized as being important enough to earn a place in SW history, no matter how cool it may be. Your accomplishments go only as far in the SW plot-line as this game continues, and no mention is or ever will be made in the subsequent timeline.

 

From this, we are forced to conclude that Revan is not as strong in combat as your character. Again, your character is not important enough to be remembered in SW history, and therefore not a fighter of such note that entire storyline arcs are devoted to you. Revan was a marvelous tactician, an inspiring leader, a pupil with almost unparalleled desire for knowledge, and above average at combat itself. He never went further than above average, as will be even more apparent as people in this game put him on farm status as nothing more than a loot dropper in a Heroic (4 man boss, feels bad man).

 

A character is more than how big their numbers are in a fight; Revan was one of the most influential characters in the SW universe, and nothing can change that. Not even the fact that his rebirth got rofl-stomped by an entire generation of players whose combat skills rank far above Revan's, but whose influence on the SW galaxy will never come close.

 

That being said, Vader was only ever defeated by people so important that they have series of books in EU dedicated to them.

 

Vader would kick Revan's **** in, sit down fanboys.

 

EDIT: For anyone who would like to bring up canon regarding Revan, do recall that he is Bioware's character, and they made him killable by our historically irrelevant characters.

Edited December 27, 2011 by Proctor

[Arnokar]

Haven't read all the responses but do any of you know how anikan came to be?

 

He was bred to be THE MOST powerful sith EVER...

 

He was ALWAYS supposed to be an apprentice....just not to Sidious..

 

Therefor Vader would OWN Revan. And im a huge Revan fan.

[Darth-Malice]

Who cares? This boils down to one group of fanboys versus another.

[Rhyltran]

The RoT didn't mean that the new master was stronger than the previous one. Didn't sidious kill his master in his sleep? Sidious was sneaky, he was powerful enough in that way to blot out Yodas ability to see the future. Sidious probably was the strongest sith when it came to stealth and subterfuge. Doesn't mean he could straight up beat his master in combat, in fact it implies he couldn't.

 

Reven was around when Jedi and Sith empires were both much stronger and fought in those wars. Vader fought droids.

 

Also I don't really care or buy what GL says especially when the best parts of "his" universe weren't written by him. Star wars is beyond GL and his opinions don't hold any weight.

 

Yes Sidious can. Sidious only slew his master when he had the skill and power to do so as worded by Leland chee. Sidious is the type of person who's careful. Sure, he was more powerful than Plagueis. However, even if you're more powerful than someone fighting them isn't without risk. I can be more skilled and powerful than someone else but other factors can lead to defeat or at least serious injury. Assassination didn't put the rule of two at risk.

 

 

Argue your points better. It only makes you look like you don't know what your talking about.

 

I'll admit that I didn't remember that line but it doesn't change the fact that the power he used was one that is known to be a light side technique. Perhaps he strengthened it by using "both sides of the force." but many people act as if he throws around dark and light powers at will when this isn't shown to be the case. Not only that but it doesn't seem to give him an extreme edge nor is there any proof that it's superior to using one side or the other. There's too many variables to even bring it up as an advantage.

 

Also, I never claimed Vader would "destroy" Revan. Not to my knowledge anyway. I do refute the posts stating Revan would stomp Vader into the ground. The main reasons why people claim Revan would destroy Vader is through examples that aren't really valid enough to use as comparison. The common ones people cite are..

 

"Revan uses light and dark." we don't know how much stronger this makes him. We also know he still lost to the Emperor who devoted himself fully to the dark side. Many have actually stated in this thread "Vader can't win because he's not a master of both sides." it's shown in the novel one doesn't need to be in order to defeat Revan.

 

The second one is.. "Revan uses force lightning and it'd fry Vader's life support." This one is debunked as well. Vader's suit was built to provide resistance against force lightning. Vader has endured under prolonged exposure from the strongest force lightning described. We don't know how strong Revan's force lightning is in comparison to Galen Marek's. There hasn't been an accurate description. Nor do we know if Revan would actually even use force lightning.

 

Those are the two biggest that people cite.

Edited December 27, 2011 by Rhyltran

[Acks]

If you read the book Revan holds his own against the Sith Emperor who arguably is the strongest force user revealed to date. The guy devoured an entire planet to add to already crazy power.

 

So in the end Revan>Vader post Mustafar. If Anakin remained Anakin he would have eventually became more powerful than any force user in history.

[shinyelf]

The point about Vader being bred to be "The ultimate Sith/force user" is, as far ia i see it, irrelevant. I say that because it was clearly not the intention to have Vader cut into pieces, and robbed of a great deal of potential(no líghtning unless you are holding an incredibly powerful object of the force).

There have also been posters concluding that Vitatae (Correct spelling?) was weakeer the Sidius since he had to use trinkets and the power of other sith to achieve true immortality (which Sidius never did), while that is true it also proves that it was not just Revan against a dark force user, it was a battle between Revan and a man that lived longer that anyone i have ever heard of in the SW univers, and also someone who wielded several potetn artifacts of the force.

Vader has none of the above qualities, something that might serve to put them on equal ground, but as it has been pointed out in several books (no referance here, but its the one where Luke instructs the apprentices on the force) the force is about willpower, something both Revan and Vader possed immense amounts of, but unlike Revan, Vader never stood between the two sides of the force, he was either sith or jedi, whereas Revan evolved and stood between them (drawing on both the light and dark side) and even united them, this must require a degree of willpower that i dont think Vader ever achieved, and a mastery unlike any i have ever read about.

[Dabtwothousand]

I killed revan solo on the foundry with my bounty hunter. Nuff said.

[BrandonSM]

The point about Vader being bred to be "The ultimate Sith/force user" is, as far ia i see it, irrelevant. I say that because it was clearly not the intention to have Vader cut into pieces, and robbed of a great deal of potential(no líghtning unless you are holding an incredibly powerful object of the force).

There have also been posters concluding that Vitatae (Correct spelling?) was weakeer the Sidius since he had to use trinkets and the power of other sith to achieve true immortality (which Sidius never did), while that is true it also proves that it was not just Revan against a dark force user, it was a battle between Revan and a man that lived longer that anyone i have ever heard of in the SW univers, and also someone who wielded several potetn artifacts of the force.

Vader has none of the above qualities, something that might serve to put them on equal ground, but as it has been pointed out in several books (no referance here, but its the one where Luke instructs the apprentices on the force) the force is about willpower, something both Revan and Vader possed immense amounts of, but unlike Revan, Vader never stood between the two sides of the force, he was either sith or jedi, whereas Revan evolved and stood between them (drawing on both the light and dark side) and even united them, this must require a degree of willpower that i dont think Vader ever achieved, and a mastery unlike any i have ever read about.

 

 

Yeah.... you act like Revan won against Vitate. He managed a knockback and then got pulverized.

 

 

Vitate was weaker than Sidious even with trinkets. Immortality and Power are not equal. Sidious did what Vitate did and more. He could create a Force Storm could consume a planet and make a wormhole. He destroyed fleets with his mind. Could transfer his very essence to another body, which basically is similar to immortality just in a different way.