Leave space combat alone!

[Zanshin-]

people don't grasp optional features do they?

 

Unfortunately not.

[Jxspyder]

people don't grasp optional features do they?

 

When you have finite resources, optional features take away from other features. A lot of people think there are more important optional fetaures that need to be worked on and added to.

 

Unless of course Bioware/LucasArts is going to spin off a largely seperate studio to handle this content, while maintaining content updates to the main game. Until then it's unlikely to ever be what a lot of people seem to be expecting.

Edited February 7, 2012 by Jxspyder

[AJediKnight]

The space combat is terrible. Absolutely terrible.

[osuaaron]

The space combat is terrible. Absolutely terrible.

 

This. Galaga was cool in the 80's. Not now.

 

I suppose freely flying to obscure asteroids and unmarked planets, landing, and gathering resources is completely insane to some people.

[Galius]

When you have finite resources, optional features take away from other features. A lot of people think there are more important optional fetaures that need to be worked on and added to.

 

Unless of course Bioware/LucasArts is going to spin off a largely seperate studio to handle this content, while maintaining content updates to the main game. Until then it's unlikely to ever be what a lot of people seem to be expecting.

 

Except it WAS a different studio that made this craptastic shooter that was headed by a guy that only made iOS apps before this. Totally stupid move on their part.

 

Would the ground game be better as a House of the Dead style shooter? No. So why do the same thing to space? They have the resources to make this better and I really hope they do.

[ZORG]

I want a flight stick or at the very least a xbox 360 gamepad.. I want planets outside of the normal travel system. I want totally wild and untamed planets with tribal forces and perhaps even WITCHES and mystics and such to go exploring. Perhaps even mine for crafting resources and such.

 

I would like the crafted ship upgrades mean something. If one could be attacked by NPCs while in transit to another planet perhaps it would. Ide like the ability to have others on my smuglers ship with me so they could man the turrets while i fly.

[forsee]

The space combat is terrible. Absolutely terrible.

 

And that's why BW - in my opinion - should update it asap with free space mode and pvp content. Shouldn't take so long as it is just "another" pvp game then, and much more fun to play. OK, in my wet dreams I think about a class story line build around a pilot character to lvl up doing space combat, I confess :-)

 

Oh yea, the rest of the game rocks bigtime ofc.

[Kourage]

I'd rather they spend their time and resources expanding ground content. Add creature mounts. More zones. More Warzones & Flashpoints. Give me a GTN that isn't a pain to use. Make a LFG tool that lets us filter results to show only those who meets our needs for the group. Instead of writing in a box what we want to do, put in check boxes. Give us more armor variety and colors. Cooler weapons. High res textures!

[Ramurdyne]

I dont like it very much, change it.

[MathigNihilcehk]

Without reading the pages here... OP totally missed the point behind off rails. Most likely, because he didn't play any decent off rails systems. Some want it complex, some want it simple... I will now compare this game's current space with SWG, a non-existing game that had great free-form off rails space.

1: Crafting the make-ups were different. In SWG you had to craft the chassis using SWG craft system, and had multiple options. You also had the SWG craft system to make the items that go in the slots. In SWTOR you have the SWTOR system to craft items, and have no choice in ships.

Note: This would not change in a off-rails transition.

 

2: SWG had pretty much only one, maybe two options in abilities(excluding auto-fire), SWTOR has 5.

Note: This would not change in a off-rails transition.

 

3: SWG allowed you to tab to target ships in or out of range. SWTOR does this for you.

Note: This would not change in a off-rails transition.

 

4: In SWG when you moved your ship turned in that direction. In SWTOR when you moved your ship moved toward that direction a limited space.

Note: This would change in a off-rails transition.

 

5: In SWG NPC ships would "come after" when you aggro-ed them. Very similar to ground-combat, in the sense the enemies ships are computer controlled. In SWTOR NPC ships are on a flight path and never deviate from it. One of the hardest parts for the developers to design, but if SWG did it with less of a budget, SWTOR can do it with more members and a much larger budget, and 5 years more technology.

Note: This would change in a off-rails transition

 

6: Shields in SWG would regenerate regardless, but you had to manage your reactor which controlled both your shields and your blasters. Shields only recharged when you stopped firing your blasters.

Note: This would not change in a off-rails transition.

 

7...: Minor features like Follow, etc. are in SWG and would only be used in SWTOR if it was off-rails. Additionally minor details such as item slots, gun count etc. would not need to change if the transition were to take place. Giving players multi-person ships would be entirely different from off-rails. Most likely after off-rails but possibly on rails.(Halo Reach helicopter path to get to the Spire)

 

So lets review, shall we.

1-3,6 would not change, so ignore those. 4 is instead of moving your ship around your box, your actually turning your ship. This requires more skill, and less complexity. (It is more complex to be moving within a box that is turning, then just turning) 5 is NPC ships that are more dynamic then on rails themselves. This is more complex, but makes each fight new, instead of the EXACT SAME FIGHT with rails. 7 is the minor details.

 

If Bioware added 4, and 5, the space-flight would become simpler more dynamic, and more fun. Using a joy-stick is not required. In-fact, you could probably use a joy-stick for the current space and have better results if Bioware let you, so joy-sticks are not dependent of space. I say the space in SWG is and was better than all of SWTOR. I stand by this now. If Bioware were to simple add 4 and 5, I would modify that to SWTOR is infinitely better than SWG.

[ROSS-]

Without reading the pages here... OP totally missed the point behind off rails. Most likely, because he didn't play any decent off rails systems. Some want it complex, some want it simple... I will now compare this game's current space with SWG, a non-existing game that had great free-form off rails space.

1: Crafting the make-ups were different. In SWG you had to craft the chassis using SWG craft system, and had multiple options. You also had the SWG craft system to make the items that go in the slots. In SWTOR you have the SWTOR system to craft items, and have no choice in ships.

Note: This would not change in a off-rails transition.

 

2: SWG had pretty much only one, maybe two options in abilities(excluding auto-fire), SWTOR has 5.

Note: This would not change in a off-rails transition.

 

3: SWG allowed you to tab to target ships in or out of range. SWTOR does this for you.

Note: This would not change in a off-rails transition.

 

4: In SWG when you moved your ship turned in that direction. In SWTOR when you moved your ship moved toward that direction a limited space.

Note: This would change in a off-rails transition.

 

5: In SWG NPC ships would "come after" when you aggro-ed them. Very similar to ground-combat, in the sense the enemies ships are computer controlled. In SWTOR NPC ships are on a flight path and never deviate from it. One of the hardest parts for the developers to design, but if SWG did it with less of a budget, SWTOR can do it with more members and a much larger budget, and 5 years more technology.

Note: This would change in a off-rails transition

 

6: Shields in SWG would regenerate regardless, but you had to manage your reactor which controlled both your shields and your blasters. Shields only recharged when you stopped firing your blasters.

Note: This would not change in a off-rails transition.

 

7...: Minor features like Follow, etc. are in SWG and would only be used in SWTOR if it was off-rails. Additionally minor details such as item slots, gun count etc. would not need to change if the transition were to take place. Giving players multi-person ships would be entirely different from off-rails. Most likely after off-rails but possibly on rails.(Halo Reach helicopter path to get to the Spire)

 

So lets review, shall we.

1-3,6 would not change, so ignore those. 4 is instead of moving your ship around your box, your actually turning your ship. This requires more skill, and less complexity. (It is more complex to be moving within a box that is turning, then just turning) 5 is NPC ships that are more dynamic then on rails themselves. This is more complex, but makes each fight new, instead of the EXACT SAME FIGHT with rails. 7 is the minor details.

 

If Bioware added 4, and 5, the space-flight would become simpler more dynamic, and more fun. Using a joy-stick is not required. In-fact, you could probably use a joy-stick for the current space and have better results if Bioware let you, so joy-sticks are not dependent of space. I say the space in SWG is and was better than all of SWTOR. I stand by this now. If Bioware were to simple add 4 and 5, I would modify that to SWTOR is infinitely better than SWG.

 

I was one of those early purchasers of SWG and suffered through the space expansion. It flopped.

[itekazzawrrlic]

So that would be yes, you've never actually sat down and watched the movies. Thank you.

 

That is the lamest comeback.

 

Destruction of the death star I and II... in space.

 

Emperor killed in space.

 

Rebel Alliance wins in space.

 

 

 

The name of the movie is STAR WARS.

 

To so say the space aspect is just a fluke is just plain crazy.

[itekazzawrrlic]

If you say that space combat isn't a big part of star wars, well frankly... you're an idiot.

 

 

When people remember Star Wars they remember the death star....

 

Red 5 standing by....

 

That's no moon... it's a SPACE station.

 

Lock S foils in attack position.

 

IT'S A TRAP!!!

 

The only memorable line on the ground was, Sruffy nerfherder.

[itekazzawrrlic]

Without reading the pages here... OP totally missed the point behind off rails. Most likely, because he didn't play any decent off rails systems. Some want it complex, some want it simple... I will now compare this game's current space with SWG, a non-existing game that had great free-form off rails space.

1: Crafting the make-ups were different. In SWG you had to craft the chassis using SWG craft system, and had multiple options. You also had the SWG craft system to make the items that go in the slots. In SWTOR you have the SWTOR system to craft items, and have no choice in ships.

Note: This would not change in a off-rails transition.

 

2: SWG had pretty much only one, maybe two options in abilities(excluding auto-fire), SWTOR has 5.

Note: This would not change in a off-rails transition.

 

3: SWG allowed you to tab to target ships in or out of range. SWTOR does this for you.

Note: This would not change in a off-rails transition.

 

4: In SWG when you moved your ship turned in that direction. In SWTOR when you moved your ship moved toward that direction a limited space.

Note: This would change in a off-rails transition.

 

5: In SWG NPC ships would "come after" when you aggro-ed them. Very similar to ground-combat, in the sense the enemies ships are computer controlled. In SWTOR NPC ships are on a flight path and never deviate from it. One of the hardest parts for the developers to design, but if SWG did it with less of a budget, SWTOR can do it with more members and a much larger budget, and 5 years more technology.

Note: This would change in a off-rails transition

 

6: Shields in SWG would regenerate regardless, but you had to manage your reactor which controlled both your shields and your blasters. Shields only recharged when you stopped firing your blasters.

Note: This would not change in a off-rails transition.

 

7...: Minor features like Follow, etc. are in SWG and would only be used in SWTOR if it was off-rails. Additionally minor details such as item slots, gun count etc. would not need to change if the transition were to take place. Giving players multi-person ships would be entirely different from off-rails. Most likely after off-rails but possibly on rails.(Halo Reach helicopter path to get to the Spire)

 

So lets review, shall we.

1-3,6 would not change, so ignore those. 4 is instead of moving your ship around your box, your actually turning your ship. This requires more skill, and less complexity. (It is more complex to be moving within a box that is turning, then just turning) 5 is NPC ships that are more dynamic then on rails themselves. This is more complex, but makes each fight new, instead of the EXACT SAME FIGHT with rails. 7 is the minor details.

 

If Bioware added 4, and 5, the space-flight would become simpler more dynamic, and more fun. Using a joy-stick is not required. In-fact, you could probably use a joy-stick for the current space and have better results if Bioware let you, so joy-sticks are not dependent of space. I say the space in SWG is and was better than all of SWTOR. I stand by this now. If Bioware were to simple add 4 and 5, I would modify that to SWTOR is infinitely better than SWG.

 

They used the Xwing Vs Tie Fighter engine as a base. I think they should do it again.

[itekazzawrrlic]

I was one of those early purchasers of SWG and suffered through the space expansion. It flopped.

 

You're crazy.. it was what kept me in the game... On the ground i was just a vendor, in space, i was king.

[Imadian]

You're crazy.. it was what kept me in the game... On the ground i was just a vendor, in space, i was king.

 

Oh come on now, I had a blast sitting in front of the spaceports selling buffs and watching people duel all day

[DarthKhaos]

If you say that space combat isn't a big part of star wars, well frankly... you're an idiot.

 

 

When people remember Star Wars they remember the death star....

 

Red 5 standing by....

 

That's no moon... it's a SPACE station.

 

Lock S foils in attack position.

 

IT'S A TRAP!!!

 

The only memorable line on the ground was, Sruffy nerfherder.

I'd have to disagree with you. The space combat in the Star Wars movies look kinda like the mini game we have now. Let's look at the atk on the Death Star. Can't get more rails than in the corridor they were flying down. Why did they have to fly down that corridor with turrets shooting at them. I'd come in from above the exhaust port get into range fire and fly back up. Episode 3 they were flying towards the goal of Doku's flag ship and alot of crap was going around them. You didn't see them going off on their own and engaging in 1v1 combat.

 

The movies had a lot of ground stuff. Escape from the Death Star, Darth Vader .vs. Luke in the Carbonite chamber, Battle on Naboo, Tatoine, huge battle in that Arena in the Clone Wars Movie, the list goes on.

 

When people think star wars the first thing they think of is either light sabers or someone who wields one. They think Han Solo, they think R2D2 & C3PO because they associate the characters to the movies. To get the attachment to the character you need to see the character somewhere else other than a ship. Wedge was a great pilot who was there for the destruction of 2 Death Stars and he was a footnote.

 

Now I'm not saying don't do a better space combat. What I am saying is ... wait for it ... WE CAN HAVE BOTH!!! Leave the current one for those who like it and add the free flight one. Comes down to MOAR content. You don't see other games taking out a mini game because they implemented something new.

[Trenchfeeder]

The only thing that needs to be done with space combat is

 

Make it give WAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYY LESS xp. It's pretty ridiculous doing a few space missions and leveling up, even at higher levels

 

and

 

Make the commendations worth something, as of now the fleet commendation vendor has nothing but a bunch of garbage items.

 

 

All the space combat is, is a minigame, it should be treated as such.

[Jxspyder]

That is the lamest comeback.

 

Destruction of the death star I and II... in space.

 

Emperor killed in space.

 

Rebel Alliance wins in space.

No, actually, the lamest comeback would be attempting to claim that such pivotal moments in the Star Wars movie series, Luke meeting Obi-Wan, meeting Yoda and becoming a Jedi Knight, the duel between Vader and Luke with Vader telling Luke that he is Luke's father, Han's capture and rescue, Luke confronting Jabba, the battle on the Moon of Endor and Luke's redemption of Vader and Vader destroying the Emperor.....are not turning points in the story.

 

The Emperor didn't die in a space battle. The destruction of the second Death Star, that entire scene, is background action to the battle on Endor's surface, and the battle going on inside the Death Star itself. The only point that even remotely supports your whole attemted arguement, is that of the first Death Star's destruction. Because the first movie, Episode 4, is the only movie that makes space combat forefront. For all the others, it's largely secondary.

 

And again, the PT only makes this even more abundantly clear.

 

The name of the movie is STAR WARS.

 

To so say the space aspect is just a fluke is just plain crazy.

 

I take it back...THIS is the lamest comeback. Yes, it's called Star Wars. Yet oddly enough, it's a story straight out of traditional fantasy, set in the future.

[daemian]

I take it back...THIS is the lamest comeback. Yes, it's called Star Wars. Yet oddly enough, it's a story straight out of traditional fantasy, set in the future.

 

Actually, it's set in the past. Quite a long time ago. In a galaxy far far away. Not that it matters. The people who don't care for the 'space' aspect of Star Wars have been trying to convince those of us who do that it isn't important ever since I've been reading these forums. It doesn't work.

Edited February 8, 2012 by daemian

[Jxspyder]

If you say that space combat isn't a big part of star wars, well frankly... you're an idiot.

 

 

When people remember Star Wars they remember the death star....

 

Red 5 standing by....

 

That's no moon... it's a SPACE station.

 

Lock S foils in attack position.

 

IT'S A TRAP!!!

 

The only memorable line on the ground was, Sruffy nerfherder.

 

Actually, the most memorable line in the entire Star Wars saga, which is also arguably the most misquoted line in movie history, is "No, I am your father." It's also one of the greatest twists in movie history. Guess what, it's not said during combat in space.

 

As for people remembering Star Wars, they tend to remember Darth Vader and Lightsabers first and foremost. Which would be why Vader is recognized as one of the greatest villians in movie history, at least according to most polls on the subject.

 

But feel free to continue pretending that your own opinion is somehow meaningful beyond it being your opinion.

[dipstik]

all i want is x-wing vs. tie fighter or battlefront II space combat in a completely unrelated engine.

[Jxspyder]

Actually, it's set in the past. Quite a long time ago. In a galaxy far far away. Not that it matters. The people who don't care for the 'space' aspect of Star Wars have been trying to convince those of us who do that it isn't important ever since I've been reading these forums. It doesn't work.

 

That's because it's largely not important. At least, not the space combat part of it. And for the rest, the examples given pretty much show why it's not important. All those scenes that occure "in space" that keep getting brought up. The "that's not a space station" line, the stuff with Han and Leia in Episode 5, the death of the Emperor. The battle going on around them isn't the central part of those scenes. The conversation going on inside the ship is. How is that represented in-game? Your holo-terminal.

 

Everything about space from the movies is accurately portrayed in the game. Down to mimicking the visual appearance of combat.

[Galius]

That's because it's largely not important. At least, not the space combat part of it. And for the rest, the examples given pretty much show why it's not important. All those scenes that occure "in space" that keep getting brought up. The "that's not a space station" line, the stuff with Han and Leia in Episode 5, the death of the Emperor. The battle going on around them isn't the central part of those scenes. The conversation going on inside the ship is. How is that represented in-game? Your holo-terminal.

 

Everything about space from the movies is accurately portrayed in the game. Down to mimicking the visual appearance of combat.

 

Visual appearance perhaps but not the feeling. The current system does not feel like space combat. It feels like a shooting gallery with pretty explosions.

 

If we were to follow the logic that it only needs to look like the movies in order to be good then we should change the ground combat to a Dragons Lair style play as that would increase the movie quality of the gameplay.

 

We don't have that though because it is not the best was to involve the player, same as the current space combat.

[daemian]

That's because it's largely not important. At least, not the space combat part of it. And for the rest, the examples given pretty much show why it's not important. All those scenes that occure "in space" that keep getting brought up. The "that's not a space station" line, the stuff with Han and Leia in Episode 5, the death of the Emperor. The battle going on around them isn't the central part of those scenes. The conversation going on inside the ship is. How is that represented in-game? Your holo-terminal.

 

Everything about space from the movies is accurately portrayed in the game. Down to mimicking the visual appearance of combat.

 

You've completely changed my mind.

 

Not really, I'm being sarcastic. Despite what you might personally think, the space scenes, ships and battles are some of my favourite things about Star Wars, and I'd love to be able to experience that in a game like TOR.

 

Luke wasn't on rails whether he was on the ground, on a speeder, or in his ship.

Edited February 9, 2012 by daemian