nsaucdiv Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 As an aside, I'm actually impressed that this thread has remained (mostly, mind you) a fairly logical and reasoned discussion. I thought we'd be knee deep in troll droppings by now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonzodagreat Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 well we can already respec between our roles in our AC thus it must be about respecing between AC's as the op did not say that the cost of respecing in ones AC is cost prohibitive respec and dual spec are 2 different concepts Respec costs a set amount that exponentially increases everytime its performed Dual Spec is having a second spec set up and saved, and able to be switch to without have to pay a respec cost. Remember your "spec" is not your advanced class, your "spec" is based on what talent trees your skill points are spent into. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) Dual Spec very much hurts people. OH i rolled need for my offspec Agrument starts, group falls apart, now your back to the beginning needing to find more people. Different specs use pretty much the same gear in this game, outside of the highest end-game content where master loot is used anyway. Untrue, it doesn't help advanced classes that have only one possible role to fulfill ( Gunslinger, Sentinel, their imp. counterparts) and will only make it even harder for people who don't want to tank or heal to get into groups. No it actually makes it easier because there are more tanks and healers to go around. Edited January 19, 2012 by Caelrie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterSaucy Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Please no, if you think about this: It will be WoW all over again, at least here on the forums. Where everyone will whine about "<X class> needed <Y item> for his/her off-spec!" Also, it doesn't cost much to respec in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted January 19, 2012 Author Share Posted January 19, 2012 As an aside, I'm actually impressed that this thread has remained (mostly, mind you) a fairly logical and reasoned discussion. I thought we'd be knee deep in troll droppings by now. That's the last thing i want to see. I would love to get real recognition on this post.. flaming and trolling is pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted January 19, 2012 Author Share Posted January 19, 2012 Please no, if you think about this: It will be WoW all over again, at least here on the forums. Where everyone will whine about "<X class> needed <Y item> for his/her off-spec!" Also, it doesn't cost much to respec in this game. That can still happen. invalid point Yes it does get costly to respec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Please no, if you think about this: It will be WoW all over again, at least here on the forums. Where everyone will whine about "<X class> needed <Y item> for his/her off-spec!" Also, it doesn't cost much to respec in this game. Stop with the gear excuse, please. Your primary stat in this game affects damage, healing and indirectly mitigation, no matter what spec you are. A tank jugg in your flashpoint rolls on the same gear as the DPS Jugg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nsaucdiv Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Please no, if you think about this: It will be WoW all over again, at least here on the forums. Where everyone will whine about "<X class> needed <Y item> for his/her off-spec!" Also, it doesn't cost much to respec in this game. The first part of your post already happens. People need for offspec and for companions. I call these people ******s. Sadly, there's not much to be done except to not group with them again. And while one or two respecs costs very little, if you're doing it consistently (IE without ever having a week in between for the cost to reset) it DOES cost a lot to respec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moosedog Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Like ui customization, there is absolutely no reason to not implement this. It doesn't affect anyone else play experience. You could make the argument that people will role need for their off spec, but people could already do that just as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonzodagreat Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Please no, if you think about this: It will be WoW all over again, at least here on the forums. Where everyone will whine about "<X class> needed <Y item> for his/her off-spec!" Also, it doesn't cost much to respec in this game. Umm, considering that after the 5th respec i think it is it hits 54k, then after that it jumps to 99k, I'd say thats pretty expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiggaMcGee Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 When you play a single spec/class/AC you know your class. Your gear is the best you have. Once you take into account a 2nd spec, more then likely your offspec gear is lacking, which means the group as a whole will be gimped. This happened so often in WOW that it was ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nsaucdiv Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Stop with the gear excuse, please. Your primary stat in this game affects damage, healing and indirectly mitigation, no matter what spec you are. A tank jugg in your flashpoint rolls on the same gear as the DPS Jugg. How do you figure? Yes, you still use the same stats, but the prioritization is different. Tank and DPS gear is definitely not the same. the endurance vs willpower/aim/str balance is different, and one will have power/crit/surge/etc whereas the other will have defense/absorption/accuracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 When you play a single spec/class/AC you know your class. Your gear is the best you have. Once you take into account a 2nd spec, more then likely your offspec gear is lacking, which means the group as a whole will be gimped. This happened so often in WOW that it was ridiculous. Do you guys even play this game? This doesn't happen in SWTOR except at the very endgame content, where it's irrelevant to this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nsaucdiv Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 When you play a single spec/class/AC you know your class. Your gear is the best you have. Once you take into account a 2nd spec, more then likely your offspec gear is lacking, which means the group as a whole will be gimped. This happened so often in WOW that it was ridiculous. But again, this is already happening NOW. In fact, I would argue that people who are respeccing constantly have WORSE gear than someone would if dual specced, as they could more easily do encounters as their secondary spec to get gear for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted January 19, 2012 Author Share Posted January 19, 2012 When you play a single spec/class/AC you know your class. Your gear is the best you have. Once you take into account a 2nd spec, more then likely your offspec gear is lacking, which means the group as a whole will be gimped. This happened so often in WOW that it was ridiculous. But remember you can "respec" normaly and still be in the same situation. Now on the flip side somebody can be just as geared and skilled to never notice what their "real" spec is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Victus Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I support dual spec, but only if your second spec is still in the same AC as your primary choice. This should not be a problem as nearly all AC's can do either tank/dps or dps/heal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonzodagreat Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 How do you figure? Yes, you still use the same stats, but the prioritization is different. Tank and DPS gear is definitely not the same. the endurance vs willpower/aim/str balance is different, and one will have power/crit/surge/etc whereas the other will have defense/absorption/accuracy. actually dps jugg should have accuracy too. 110% main hand accuracy before stacking anything else Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 How do you figure? Yes, you still use the same stats, but the prioritization is different. Tank and DPS gear is definitely not the same. the endurance vs willpower/aim/str balance is different, and one will have power/crit/surge/etc whereas the other will have defense/absorption/accuracy. Stats like crit/surge/power are minimally available outside Operations gear. Plus, tanks are figuring out that stacking endurance is a no-no, so that's not even a factor. In an Operation, master looting means this isn't an issue. That gear isn't needed to tank your flashpoint. The gear is a LOT more similar than it was in WoW (except in the case of feral druids, where it's a pretty similar concept). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raidyr Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Dual spec /= respec. Yes, we can respec within our AC. We do NOT currently have dual spec within that AC. That's what this thread is about. This happens irrespective of dual-speccing, and in fact has happened to me a couple times already. As for dual-specs, definitely needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slightlycampana Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Or.... You can stop being lazy and just roll another toon. Problem solved. It's an MMO, and to be only rolling 1 character is a mistake on your part. I have a DPS, a Tank, and a healer. I switch characters according to the groups needs. Like others have said, Dual spec will reduce the diversity in character classes. At the moment, 90% of the game content is focused on levelling, and you want to be able to switch roles during this process too, not just at max level. I don't see why an abstract like "diversity" should triumph over giving people the option to increase both specialisation and flexibility in their class. If you have the option of more than one spec, I think you would be tempted to experiment more. The current trinity doesn't increase diversity it just pigeonholes people in a very artificial way. Anyway, 70% of people on this forum support dual speccing (see link in my sig). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodachi Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Solution.. Get in a good guild.. you can run with your own people and not have any of these issues. Boom. Fixed. Would dual spec be nice, sure. But needed, not by a long shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draylore Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 play the spec you want, not the spec you want and a backup spec just cause. In a perfect world perhaps. But when ...for example a 4 person group...you just need 1 tank and 1 healer.....once those spots are filled ...you have just excluded a large portion of the population from being able to fill the two remaining slots unless they are willing to spend alot of credits every day. Gets even worse as the group size increases....i.e raids/OS where the ratio of tanks/healers to 'other' gets even more out of proportion. If the game were designed such that a 4 man group with 2 tanks wasnt immediately gimped it would be a difference story but TOR is no different than most other MMOs....carrying a 2nd tank in group is a liability. I still say that for all its faults......Rift did the best at eliminating this issue. That said, I don't want to be able to switch my AC. As a Sith Jugg I would just like to be able to be able to swap to a Veng/Rage spec, etc spec when I am grouped with friends or whatever and one of them wants to tank....at least that way I would not be a liability. I have been doing that via paying for reset but that has become impossible to afford on a consistent basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raeln Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 It might be useful for folks that want one spec for PvP and a different one for PvE, but it won't make a difference to the number of healers or tanks there are. People don't switch roles with dual spec. Yes they do. Frequently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calimwulf Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Anyway, 70% of people on this forum support dual speccing (see link in my sig). And less than 10% of the folks that play, come to the forums at all and even fewer than that ever post. 60% of the posters are PvP'ers and less than 5% of the player base PvP. Heck, dual spec is useful. I'm not saying it isn't, but it isn't 'needed'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Solution.. Get in a good guild.. you can run with your own people and not have any of these issues. Boom. Fixed. Would dual spec be nice, sure. But needed, not by a long shot. A guild doesn't fix the desire for dual specs at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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