"Addons are stupid and WoW is easy."

[ScartStorm]

Always been my experience that addons cover up bad play. You can train a monkey to run heroics in WoW with the right addons. Anyone can be a master raider with the addons, no matter how much you suck at it.

 

So addons make an average player put out world class DPS and survivability? Damn, I need to get me some of that.

 

Newsflash for you: most of the average players don't know when to run out of fire. Who has any idea about WoW raiding, will understand the meaning of that phrase.

[Solaufein]

Lots of people that are complaining are missing the facts.

 

Newsflash! Addons are not in the game. The "complainers" are the pro-addon crew. It's a stretch to suggest the leave it as it is, or be careful crowd are complaining. Other way round, dude. Just sayin'

 

[Steelyeye]

So addons make an average player put out world class DPS and survivability? Damn, I need to get me some of that.

 

Newsflash for you: most of the average players don't know when to run out of fire. Who has any idea about WoW raiding, will understand the meaning of that phrase.

 

They dont make an addon to tell you to not stand in the fire, which is my theory as to why players do it.

 

Relying on addons dulls your gaming intelligence.

Edited January 4, 2012 by Steelyeye

[Shaetun]

They dont make an addon to tell you to not stand in the fire, which is my theory as to why players do it.

 

Relying on addons dulls your gaming intelligence.

 

Yes they do but people still do it anyway.

 

UI needs customization even if mods aren't allowed. Let me move around target and for the love of god put a target of target frame.

[Cyphen]

Addons make the game easier. WoW is not easy until bosses are nerfed, not always true though.

 

DBM is stupid and Addons like that hopefully wont make it into TOR, makes the game so much easier.

[Beardwalker]

To anyone who would seriously cdonsider ditching a sub because they need mods to give them numbers... i sorta wish we dont get mods because it is such a nieve and stupid argument. If you want it to be WoW just go back to it.

 

I am mostly happy with TOR as it is... target of target and a battlelog would do me... its enough

 

Go be an accountant if you live for numbers

[BawssMcgee]

We need simple addons such as threat meters.

 

we NEED. Yes I said need.

[BawssMcgee]

To anyone who would seriously cdonsider ditching a sub because they need mods to give them numbers... i sorta wish we dont get mods because it is such a nieve and stupid argument. If you want it to be WoW just go back to it.

 

I am mostly happy with TOR as it is... target of target and a battlelog would do me... its enough

 

Go be an accountant if you live for numbers

 

You obviously aren't raiding. Some things are required on some bosses. Such as threat meters.

[DoctorDank]

Why do I care. Because, in WoW, eventually the game designers were designing content with the use of those addon resources in mind. Try Heroic raids without any addons. Hmmm?

 

I'm not for spoiling anyone else's fun, but prefer game development to remain exclusively in the hands of Bioware / EA and not addon developers.

 

That said - I'm all for resources that make the information more readily available for dissection, e.g. combat logs etc. I think most of us that are against addons are just super-cautious that this new game we've fallen for doesn't end up like WoW.

 

Nothing against the hardcore gaming community - I'm more casual btw - just don't want the general community flooded with wannabee hardcore gamers. Those that think they're great and take every opportunity to devalue the whole experience for the rest of us.

 

Case of who do I trust? Bioware or addon developers. Caution is all this is.

 

Molten core (the second 40 man raid implemented) was far more difficult than Dragon Soul. WoW was built around the idea of difficult raids.

 

Even so, the game has implemented features such as raid finder difficulty (similiarly to normal difficulty operations.)

 

Also, dont say things such as "Try Heroic raids without any addons. Hmmm?". You read as flamboyant and asinine.

[DoctorDank]

Addons make the game easier. WoW is not easy until bosses are nerfed, not always true though.

 

DBM is stupid and Addons like that hopefully wont make it into TOR, makes the game so much easier.

 

The fact that a boss casts something- to which you have no idea of the effect, isn't difficult, it's uninformative and unfair. DBM doesn't say "Kill the green slime! Press 1 2 1 1 2 and then use intercept on ____". It says something like "Green Slime Incoming", just to alert you as to what is happening. It doesnt make the game easier, It just takes out the wikihassle.

[Serious_Business]

My god, what people actually think addons in WoW are capable of doing...have any of you guys actually played the game? At all? Addons can not automate anything. There was quite a bit of gray area back in Vanilla WoW with addons like the old Decursive, but addons have not been able to do conditional actions like they used to be able to since TBC. Anything that really deviated from that, such as AVR back in ICC or that one rogue addon that switched weapon set when you Envenomed, the name escapes me at the moment, was quickly broken. Addons increase the amount of information available to the player, or lets the player customize his UI to his liking, but they DO NOT play the character for you. They can tell you when a boss is about to use an ability, but it's still up to the player to dodge it at the end of the day.

 

If you're going to criticize addons, then you should at least know what they can and can not do. Many of you are just coming off as crazed lunatics, ready to defend SWTOR to the death and bash WoW at a moment's notice, no matter how legitimate a complaint or comparison is. It's quite amusing really.

 

Personally, I'd like some basic UI customization. Target of target at least (How it is not already in game is beyond me), a way to further tweak the Op frames, to at least let me see what buffs/debuff people actually have (they're insanely tiny as is). Personally I'd actually really like damage meters, if only out of curiosity (plus I love to compete), but I'm not that picky. At the end of the day though I don't expect Bioware to implement any mod support or real customization of any sort, and I do think this will be a huge detriment to the game.

[Crunchie]

err. I don't like most addons. but all i really want is simple ui addons to custimize my own interface .. thats all.

 

An addon for the galactic market (ah) is VERY appreciated. I really look forward to such addon since i dont really like the search function that much.

 

I am a former user of xpearl in wow, and i really like it, it would be very nice to see it later.

I really love the interface style.

[QQJEDIQQ]

The reason why Bioware will not allow addons or combat logs, is because a combat log will reveal just how unbalanced the classes are. Basically, they are hoping for blissful ignorance amongst the playerbase. If there is no combat log, then the players won't complain that so-and-so class does 50% more dps than theirs.

 

It makes sense, really. Since they don't have to worry about players complaining about class balance, they don't have to spend money paying programmers and designers to balance the classes.

 

It's a win-win situation: they save money by not fixing imbalances, and the n00bs in the game feel like they're contributing in boss fights (even though they are not).

[Theadan]

this is tor not wow

So plz finish to speak about wow.

I'm bored to read in wow...

Do you like wow, play wow.

If they don't want addon or customization may be they have their GOOD reason.

(sorry for my terrible english).

^^

[Affics]

Where's your heroic -anything- kill?

 

WoWs heroic endgame is still one of the most difficult challenges in the gaming world. SWTOR is pathetic in comparison. However, in terms of questing and solo play, SWTOR is much more challenging and I feel you really learn how to play your class to it's SOLO potential through doing the difficult elite story quests.

 

Also, no addons/customizing? Watch this game go the way of AoC in a few months. If you are truly a casual player, THEN WHY DO YOU CARE IF HARDCORE GAMERS USE ADDONS. How does someone elses customization ruin YOUR play?

 

If you say because they harass you for being bad by linking meters, I have bad news for you. You are actually bad, and someone pointed it out to you after carrying you through that content.

 

If someone use addons - i need to use them too, coz its advantage. I dont want to be some meter-padding whore, like in wow. So we dont need addons at all.

Edited January 4, 2012 by Affics

[CastorKrieg]

Where's your heroic -anything- kill?

 

WoWs heroic endgame is still one of the most difficult challenges in the gaming world. SWTOR is pathetic in comparison.

 

Just to comment on difficulty - I hope Normal mode raids will be very easy. I'm paying the same as you, and I am entitled to see all the content.

Edited January 4, 2012 by CastorKrieg

[FuzzPop]

It is a way to stop Elitism. You are saying someone is bad based on how much damage they do. I would get groups in WoW where they would castigate one player out of the group if they weren't doing a certain amount of dps.

 

If your group is wiping repeatedly on a boss enrage timer, or when multiple healers are going OOM, long before the boss' HP goes low, you start to wonder why.

 

So let's picture that damage meters are never implemented, due to combat log either never being accessible, or not parse-able. The raid will be sitting around wondering why this isn't working, with no clues as to why.

 

WITH meters, you can clearly see who is not pulling their weight. It might even be as simple as the player not having trained X skill or doing the wrong rotation and/or using the wrong abilities. Or it could be, the reason your healers are OOMing, is because one or more of the healers is AFK half the fight.

 

Without addons, how is your raid supposed to determine any of these things?

[Amscray]

I used to love healing hard modes mod free.

 

Then I would start drinking and just click on the bars that changed colour the fastest.

 

Man it was hard

[Affics]

If your group is wiping repeatedly on a boss enrage timer, or when multiple healers are going OOM, long before the boss' HP goes low, you start to wonder why.

 

So let's picture that damage meters are never implemented, due to combat log either never being accessible, or not parse-able. The raid will be sitting around wondering why this isn't working, with no clues as to why.

 

WITH meters, you can clearly see who is not pulling their weight. It might even be as simple as the player not having trained X skill or doing the wrong rotation and/or using the wrong abilities. Or it could be, the reason your healers are OOMing, is because one or more of the healers is AFK half the fight.

 

Without addons, how is your raid supposed to determine any of these things?

Solution is - some sort of warzone results at the end of the fight, so no addons.

[devilbcn]

I really like tor, it's much better than WoW in many ways, but:

 

Why do you think addons make the game easyer?? they don't.

 

There are many addon classes, so an UI addon doesn't change game difficult. I agree that addons like thread meters are not necessary, but most of them only make the game more customizable for players and even give developers new ideas (WoW actually have many features that began as an addon and don't change game difficulty).

 

Second, i think addons are a good idea cause allow developers to focus in making new content, fix bugs or improve game balance while comunity does the "dirty job" like changing UI or improving many minor features.

 

I totally agree that one main reason for not having a combat log is cause bad game balance will be shown and players will start complaining about it.

 

Cya,

[Blazehound]

Because addons make the game too easy.

 

When I don't have to press any buttons and my computer plays the game, It is no longer fun. Addons make competitive play become that.

[FuzzPop]

Because addons make the game too easy.

 

When I don't have to press any buttons and my computer plays the game, It is no longer fun. Addons make competitive play become that.

 

addons don't play the game for you. you are still required to press all the buttons. the addon could be screaming at you to step out of the fire, but YOU as the player have to do that, not the addon.

 

should still support at the minimum dps and healing meters

[DarthHendo]

Because addons make the game too easy.

 

When I don't have to press any buttons and my computer plays the game, It is no longer fun. Addons make competitive play become that.

 

Please point me in the direction of these addons... Link or something. Back up that post with some fact, not just hot air.

[Fryseboks]

Solution is - some sort of warzone results at the end of the fight, so no addons.

 

How is that in any way different from a damage/healing meter?

 

You would still find out who is underperforming, and either teach the guy what to do differently, or if that's not possible boot him from the group.

 

Assuming conditional mods (i.e a mod automatically dispelling stuff without the player initiating the spell) are not allowed, all mods do is give the player more information and ability to customize the UI to his liking. I've played WoW on and off since 2005, and with varying levels of addon use. Performance was the same if I went without any addons, or if I had them. The only difference with them was that I was able to improve my own gameplay more, observe what other people might do wrong and help them, or change things about the UI I found annoying.

 

Never done any hardcore raiding, but my casual guild still progressed relatively good because the people in it weren't completely bad and could actually figure out stuff on an elementary level, such as basic math and common sense on how to do acceptable damage/healing, and from real life experiences deduct that standing in fire might be bad. Some players used many addons, others none.

Edited January 4, 2012 by Fryseboks

[ookywooky]

Let me tell you a little story of something that happened on 2nd of January 2012 in one of our 4-man-groups:

 

We entered some 4-player-heroes-area and fought our way through the republican enemies. As it must be

 

One of our damage dealers had the problem, that he got too much aggro every time he fought. After some time he complained that he needs some add on - like in WOW - that shows him the actual aggro-level. He thinks it is important to know the aggro-level, because he then can stop fighting and wait to loose his aggro.

 

...

 

I say: NO! It's fun to play without addon. It's fun to use your own skills. The player's skills. This is what divides the "skilled" players from the "poorly" skilled players.

 

...

 

I must admit that I know WoW from the early days on. I've played the early beta, beta and the game itself about 3 years. And I quit playing when the addons became mandatory for each raid. It was NO fun any more always looking on the aggro-bars and numbers and timing your actions only because this number raise or drop.

 

---

 

I say: NO! to such addons. Lets have addons for the GUI. Let's have it for customizing some other things - but please do not allow anyone to use addons to get advantages while playing.