344 gear... why?

[TheRandomno]

The livestream announced that the max item rating will be raised to 344. As far as I can remember, every new tier of gear has accompanied new content for that gear. For example, 340 gear for R4, 258 gear for Gods from the Machine MM, or 186 gear for Dread Fortress/Dread Palace NiM.

One option would have been to make 340 gear more accessible. Raising the item level again will make Master Mode operations even more undertuned, having already had the cap raised from 330 to 340, and boss HP nerfed.

[juanmf]

Hopefully they'll make 340 more accessible like they did with what was it, 336 Nefra farm?

[OlBuzzard]

Regardless of what the new level is ... I just want it to be more accessible!

[xxSHOONYxx]

1 hour ago, TheRandomno said:

The livestream announced that the max item rating will be raised to 344. As far as I can remember, every new tier of gear has accompanied new content for that gear. For example, 340 gear for R4, 258 gear for Gods from the Machine MM, or 186 gear for Dread Fortress/Dread Palace NiM.

One option would have been to make 340 gear more accessible. Raising the item level again will make Master Mode operations even more undertuned, having already had the cap raised from 330 to 340, and boss HP nerfed.

It's because it makes no sense whatsoever at all. This gear bump was would have made sense if r4 nim would have been out but they already gave the middle finger about r4.

"Get your new shiny gear!!!! ohh how to obtain it you ask? R4 nightm... wait nvm forgot we already said it was cancelled *god it's amazing how this suckers still believed us after all our broken promises LMAO*... hmmm well just do the same thing you have done a million times! You know... NEFRA FARM! LET'S GO!!!! And don't worry we know it will make everything easier, less off a challenge and will go one step forward after hp nerf on what you accomplish with the new gear will mean nothing but we don't care. Just go and get busy, we have to pump those players counts up with providing nothing for it other than higher numbers on your gear, the treadmill must go on! *wow i'm the smartest dev of the industry*"

[Andertyne]

1 hour ago, OlBuzzard said:

Regardless of what the new level is ... I just want it to be more accessible!

The level is not changing. Level increases come with expansions.

[VegaMist]

Not excited about this one since it changes nothing except for restarting a hamster wheel. They said Rakata gear will become more accessible (we''ll have to wait and see what it means). I'd much rather see a simplified gearing system rather than all of these gradations, at least half of which are pretty meaningless at this point.

[Darcmoon]

36 minutes ago, Andertyne said:

The level is not changing. Level increases come with expansions.

He’s talking about gear ilevel not player levels. 

[TrixxieTriss]

1 hour ago, xxSHOONYxx said:

It's because it makes no sense whatsoever at all. This gear bump was would have made sense if r4 nim would have been out but they already gave the middle finger about r4.

"Get your new shiny gear!!!! ohh how to obtain it you ask? R4 nightm... wait nvm forgot we already said it was cancelled *god it's amazing how this suckers still believed us after all our broken promises LMAO*... hmmm well just do the same thing you have done a million times! You know... NEFRA FARM! LET'S GO!!!! And don't worry we know it will make everything easier, less off a challenge and will go one step forward after hp nerf on what you accomplish with the new gear will mean nothing but we don't care. Just go and get busy, we have to pump those players counts up with providing nothing for it other than higher numbers on your gear, the treadmill must go on! *wow i'm the smartest dev of the industry*"

If you don’t want things to get super easy, you could just choose not to jump on their gearing merry-go-round again 🤷🏻‍♀️

You actually hit the nail on the head with no nightmare mode for R4 being added. Without harder content being added, what’s even the point of farming the new armor lvl in old ops that everyone can already breeze through with the current highest armor? Because all it will do is make pve end game super easy & will have zero effect in PvP. 

[xxSHOONYxx]

12 minutes ago, TrixxieTriss said:

If you don’t want things to get super easy, you could just choose not to jump on their gearing merry-go-round again 🤷🏻‍♀️

You actually hit the nail on the head with no nightmare mode for R4 being added. Without harder content being added, what’s even the point of farming the new armor lvl in old ops that everyone can already breeze through with the current highest armor? Because all it will do is make pve end game super easy & will have zero effect in PvP. 

I won't, the only times i log on the game is when a friend that is still missing some op achievements needs a fill for a group they are in. 

[psikofunkster]

Why? because MMOs are about grinding gear all year long however swtor is the exception with no new content for that gear (we all know why at this point), take it or leave it.

[Lord_Malganus]

If your at 80 and 340, is it worth grinding to go up a meager 4 ilvs that only matters in level 80 content? 

[meddani]

4 hours ago, TheRandomno said:

One option would have been to make 340 gear more accessible. 

it's the same like it is right now with 336 gear, just upgrade your current rakata gear to 340, done.

same with the hide and zeek mods, just upgrade one purple 340 and on blue 340 gear piece and deconstruct them.

[meddani]

also this feels like mid 5.X expansion again, no new content just gear and augment lvl increase....

[xxSHOONYxx]

14 minutes ago, Lord_Malganus said:

If your at 80 and 340, is it worth grinding to go up a meager 4 ilvs that only matters in level 80 content? 

It wasn't even needed to go above 330, especially with the hp and damage reduction from bosses nim ops received. 

[TrixxieTriss]

20 minutes ago, Lord_Malganus said:

If your at 80 and 340, is it worth grinding to go up a meager 4 ilvs that only matters in level 80 content? 

Probably not. Especially if you’ve already min-maxed that gear. Higher gear at this point is only going to help those who are struggling to complete content in 340 gear. For anyone else, it will just make other content super easy again 😞

[Char_Ell]

22 minutes ago, meddani said:

also this feels like mid 5.X expansion again, no new content just gear and augment lvl increase....

If you feel that way then OK.  The notable difference is 5.10 came with two new gear tiers plus master mode Gods From The Machine followed by Geonosian Queen single boss op/lair boss a few months later.  As others have stated it would make more sense to add new gear tier if the devs were adding master mode R-4.  However that is not the case so upgraded gear is for those that want to grind for the sake of getting better gear or getting that extra advantage in HM/MM operations and/or PvP.

Edited October 19, 2023 by Char_Ell
correction

[Lord_Malganus]

33 minutes ago, xxSHOONYxx said:

It wasn't even needed to go above 330, especially with the hp and damage reduction from bosses nim ops received. 

This ^.

Just another example of pointless changes getting priority over so many other things that desperately need attention.

[arunav]

I don't welcome the new tiers of gear, because PVE content that's already feeling easy at 336 worse. 

In PVP, even if it doesn't matter as much, it does sometimes affect who gets targeted first in arenas. 

Also, anyone coming back to the game will see a longer grind, potentially deal with a certain type of irrational iRating gatekeeper (I think everyone's come across the type - even if you don't need the highest rating, they demand it to join a group). 

[GeneralGyro]

i dont even know how you gear up anymore

[Arsq]

9 hours ago, TheRandomno said:

The livestream announced that the max item rating will be raised to 344. As far as I can remember, every new tier of gear has accompanied new content for that gear. For example, 340 gear for R4, 258 gear for Gods from the Machine MM, or 186 gear for Dread Fortress/Dread Palace NiM.

One option would have been to make 340 gear more accessible. Raising the item level again will make Master Mode operations even more undertuned, having already had the cap raised from 330 to 340, and boss HP nerfed.

100% this. Vertical gear progression only really works, if new content is introduced with it, 2.0 being the prime example: S&V/TFB HM (168) -> S&V/TFB NiM (174), DF/DP HM (180) and DF/DP NiM (186).

344 gear will absolutely demolish most master mode encounters. Already boss kill times are 20% faster than 6.3 for example. You'll reach a point, where players need to hard-stop DPS on certain fights (Master and Veteran mode Apex Vanguard for example, where you already bring fewer DPS to deal with the bad tuning), so they don't break the mechanics. Besides, almost all MM encounters have already been cleared without any healers at all, so the tuning is extremely bad to begin with.

The issue with making operations trivial? It's not a rewarding feeling and it doesn't feel accomplishing when you clear an operation that has a storymode flashpoint -tier difficulty. The GAME does not feel rewarding, even if you get yet another shiny mount from 10 years ago.

Almost any group can already progress through the legacy operations on any difficulty within weeks, earlier it would've taken months for most groups, due to the tight DPS checks. Now they can do it without even really knowing how to play the game, and operations are supposed to be the most difficulty PvE content.

The solo game is already trivially easy (has been since 4.0), to a point where you can basic attack your way through all open world and story content, or just let your companion do it for you. Outside of PvP (RIP ranked), operations have been the only piece of interesting or even remotely challenging content in the game. You have three difficulty tiers for exactly that reason: Provide a challenge for those who want it.

@BryantWood If you want to go back to 6.3 gearing accessibility-wise, that's fine. If everyone wants to rock 340s, go for it. Just don't increase the ceiling any more, or if you do, at least revert the 7.1 nerfs to bosses. 344 gear is a bad idea, please don't do it.

Edited October 19, 2023 by Arsq
Added a tag.

[arunav]

28 minutes ago, Arsq said:

344 gear is a bad idea, please don't do it.

It's not only NiM-Operation teams that deal with this. 

Easier group PVE content like Flashpoints, even in MM, already breeze by in 336 gear. I played a couple of Vet FPs yesterday for a season objective, and my character barely got to engage in its rotation to finish off the 3 bosses in each one. MM FPs aren't that much different, other than it's unreliable to wait for a match in Group Finder.

Also, I'm not sure it adds much of a 'grind' for players - for folks who use Hyde and Zeek, many already have enough currency to upgrade to the new max, or aren't far off from it. 

[DeannaVoyager]

Getting 340 mods would have been enough. Adding 344 gear not really needed. 

I have a stash of vet mode tokens from R-4 and if those are needed for 344 I will upgrade, but I won't go back to R-4 for yet another gear grind. Besides, that will make the moddable 340 just as pointless as moddable 336 is now. Mods need to be the highest possible iRating to make them worth buying for alts.  
 

[Pirana]

The answer should be obvious. With another gear grind, which this game is known to do, they once again hope this will have a net positive on player retention. Another gear grind keeps players engaged in content, keeps players subscribed and ultimately they make more money, this is simple business. This goes all the way back to the very beginning of the game and has yet to waver, this is part of their mantra, in other words, nothing out of the ordinary. 

 

[juliushorst]

8 hours ago, xxSHOONYxx said:

ohh how to obtain it you ask? R4 nightm... wait nvm forgot we already said it was cancelled *god it's amazing how this suckers still believed us after all our broken promises LMAO*... hmmm well just do the same thing you have done a million times!

They tried to make the  game more raiding-focused in 7.0 and it was a catastrophe. I can't blame them for abandoning the idea of making content that will be enjoyed by a very small portion of their playerbase. You don't see many players with gear going above 336 which means even VM isn't very popular.

[Arsq]

33 minutes ago, juliushorst said:

They tried to make the  game more raiding-focused in 7.0 and it was a catastrophe. I can't blame them for abandoning the idea of making content that will be enjoyed by a very small portion of their playerbase. You don't see many players with gear going above 336 which means even VM isn't very popular.

7.0 was the most fun I've had in VM operations since 2.0 & 3.0, but 7.0 certainly wasn't perfect. Many classes underperformed severely, while some select classes could push enough to pass the checks on master mode, which seemed to be tuned for 340 gear. One of the biggest issues was the delaying of R-4, which would've brought 340 gear and the game would've balanced out.

Edited October 19, 2023 by Arsq