Changes to Gearing in 7.0 from PTS Feedback

[ZUHFB]

But they really didn't listen. Look at the feed back they got when first PTS came out on how they butchered Guardian/Juggernaut and Sentinel/Marauder. They didn't adjust anything for those classes. We told them that non moddable gear was a mistake. They didn't listen. Sometime they need to be put in their place with HARSH and negative comments. If they can't take it then maybe they need to change professions. Granted some people are beyond harsh, and those comments should be removed. But generally speaking it comes with the territory. Heck toddlers listen better on feedback better then the DEVs have here on the current PTS builds.

 

To be quite honest: the devs SHOULDN'T listen to everybodys feedback, some people just have idea about balancing and just complain they lose maddash or reflect all day and say how it is unfair, while it is an absolutely fine change. Everybody wants their personal class to be strong! Furthermore non modable gear won't be a problem for anyone, its not like the theory crafters calculated the stat distribution correctly until new augs came - but that is a different story.

All I am saying is that for the large majority of players, most things won't change and that things change for a new expansion is good, it keeps the game fresh. I wouldn't disagree that the expansion will be disappointing at most since there is 'only' balance changes coming. People seem to forget that they scaled all ops to 80 which already takes great efford and listening to feedback is not as easy as it sounds.

 

Anyway, if you are mad about 7.0 CLASS changes (not weapon designer literally everybody dislikes it being delayed or if you're a merc) you really have no reason to complain, however a right to do so

[BallisticKaine]

To be quite honest: the devs SHOULDN'T listen to everybodys feedback, some people just have idea about balancing and just complain they lose maddash or reflect all day and say how it is unfair, while it is an absolutely fine change. Everybody wants their personal class to be strong! Furthermore non modable gear won't be a problem for anyone, its not like the theory crafters calculated the stat distribution correctly until new augs came - but that is a different story.

All I am saying is that for the large majority of players, most things won't change and that things change for a new expansion is good, it keeps the game fresh. I wouldn't disagree that the expansion will be disappointing at most since there is 'only' balance changes coming. People seem to forget that they scaled all ops to 80 which already takes great efford and listening to feedback is not as easy as it sounds.

 

Anyway, if you are mad about 7.0 CLASS changes (not weapon designer literally everybody dislikes it being delayed or if you're a merc) you really have no reason to complain, however a right to do so

 

Sure you may think the changes to the classes are fine, let alone the ONLY tactical to get changed in game was Grit Teeth. BUT GOD FRICKING FORBID THEY TOUCH THE OPERATIVE! Heck they even boosted both DPS specs of Operative. Talk about unwarranted unbalance. Only reason Juggernaut/Guardian was touched was because of Grit Teeth and Force Bound, then they decided to slap us even more with the changes to survivability to the class and specs.

[Isteralsolo]

Here's my take on this as an older beta tester to other games.

Bioware, you are going to send this game down the route of LOTRO. You are trying to seem creative but youre pulling from outmoded sources and its going to damage your bottom line just like what happened after Westfold release. For them it was also a modding aspect to stats - skill trees- for you its the fact your dev team has been too Lazy to make mod gear and crafting more relevant.

 

Theres no reason you couldnt have done this update in a less convoluted way. I dont pay recurring subs for the very reason youre deciding to go this route. I do limited sub so that i play my way and yall dont get more of my money than i want to give.

 

There are pros and cons to this update but your cons are going to easily outway the pros of a continued sub. Id only continue subbing for my guild because they need ppl who can run ops n fps. Point in fact they are still paygating these two things. So you have to be sub to play just a reminder.

 

Later.

[Pricia]

 

Adding in the additional gear sets--WHY??? Just optimize the stats on the pieces you're going to release, for God's sake. It's not like you don't know what the heck those numbers are. I did the mix-and-match of gear sets on PTS to try to get to 110% accuracy. It was IMPOSSIBLE at 318 and 320, even with taking EVERY accuracy-granting piece and left side items and using a max stim. I needed augments to get to 110%.

 

I disagree there. This change is good (compared to PTS). It gives us more options. Healers can get rid of accuracy altogether, for example.

 

My main worry here is that I'm not completely sure that BW is aware of what stats are actually best for each spec, considering that they don't even make 110% accuracy the norm in the first place.. but at least we can still mix and match sets and accessories to get the accuracy/alacrity/crit that we want.

Edited January 28, 2022 by Pricia

[codydmaan]

 

My main worry here is that I'm not completely sure that BW is aware of what stats are actually best for each spec, considering that they don't even make 110% accuracy the norm in the first place.. but at least we can still mix and match sets and accessories to get the accuracy/alacrity/crit that we want.

 

Plot twist r4 anomaly raid will require 115% accuracy.

 

Lol how awful would that be.

 

Your right tho. Here's the problem the team responsible for making the gear probably don't play themselves, and if they do play the game they don't play the endgame NIMs and if they do then they were carried since their devs.

 

Since they don't have a full understanding about the stat thresholds of every class like most of us here do we experience gearing issues w new gear.

 

Its obvious someone on the team is pushing hard for the non modable gear. Most likely since it's "easier" for the general basic players to not even think about it. The stress is gone.

 

However all most everyone here has wanted MODABLE gear. So it's like hey Bioware please listen to everyone around you instead of ur one boss smashing basic gear it your face at the meetings in the morning. Listen to the players.

 

Fact is tho if their boss js telling them they want non mod gear that what they'll get. Not a issue w the devs just whoevers leading the team. It's outta their hands

[Pricia]

Plot twist r4 anomaly raid will require 115% accuracy.

 

Lol how awful would that be.

 

Your right tho. Here's the problem the team responsible for making the gear probably don't play themselves, and if they do play the game they don't play the endgame NIMs and if they do then they were carried since their devs.

 

Since they don't have a full understanding about the stat thresholds of every class like most of us here do we experience gearing issues w new gear.

 

Its obvious someone on the team is pushing hard for the non modable gear. Most likely since it's "easier" for the general basic players to not even think about it. The stress is gone.

 

However all most everyone here has wanted MODABLE gear. So it's like hey Bioware please listen to everyone around you instead of ur one boss smashing basic gear it your face at the meetings in the morning. Listen to the players.

 

Fact is tho if their boss js telling them they want non mod gear that what they'll get. Not a issue w the devs just whoevers leading the team. It's outta their hands

 

They want to make the game "easier" for new players. I kinda get that, mods are really overwhelming for new players and in all the games I've played, one spec = one set of gear, period (with some generic pieces here and there). So they want to streamline it. Fine.

 

I just really don't want to miss on level 80 mobs because someone doesn't know how game mechanics work (I mean, just look at the bonuses we get from legendaries and all the useless sets that were released in 6.0, it does make me wonder if they play their own game too).

[Exly]

Well, the update is coming out in 3 weeks, I'd think it would take much longer to scrap their idea and start over.

 

So we got a compromise. Which is better than what's on PTS right now.

 

And yeah, still hoping that we'll get moddable gear eventually.

 

But people are mentioning that they didn't listen to feedback regarding combat changes, but how do they know? This post was about gear. Now, they could give us more updates for sure, but people complaining about the lack of updates in an update thread is just annoying.

 

Ok, so you are annoyed, but complaints about the 7.0 gearing system have been around for months. They are not new complaints that are only being brought up with less than 3 weeks before launch. That annoys me.

 

In addition to that, I have not played pvp like I used to because of changes that they made during 6.0 to exclude losses towards the advancement of the pvp weekly mission. The fact that they continue to hold fast to their positon that only wins should count annoys me.

 

Then there are the changes to conquest. The changes announced for 7.0 to increase the points needed, and nerfing the availability and repeatability of objectives annoy me.

 

Why is it wrong for me to complain about what they are doing? how do you think they will know that I'm not happy with their decisions if I don't let them know? Why should I use weak or non-critical statements when voicing my frustrations?

 

In real life I have been on the receiving end of a significant amount of feedback due to the fact that what I have done is provide services to customers who mattered to me. In my review of that feedback, I found no use for praise, and instead focused on criticism to help me to improve my operation. I appreciated criticism no matter how spirited the person giving it was in voicing their opinion. I know that there are things that I have done that have been frustrating to those that I served, and hearing what I did wrong made it possible for me to do better. I am grateful to those who helped me in my quest to be better.

 

So now, tell me again why I shouldn't be critical of changes that annoy me.

Edited January 28, 2022 by Exly

[Master_Neaj]

Ok, I'm just an average player that does not have the elite playing style as many of my friends and fellow players do. Keeping that in mind and thinking of new players, there's a lot of stuff going on and a lot for new players to learn just out the doors... For me, I have a slight disability and have had to hone my playing a certain way in order to play with friends that are much more skilled and experienced so that I can learn and I think of others that may have disabilities and such and wonder just how difficult it may be for them to find their playing style and what enhancements they may use to play that may take them a little more time and/or could lose interest because it gets a little tough for them. Now I'm not boohooing, because I will eventually learn to adapt and somehow come to understand all this but there are some that I think got left out of the equation as players.

 

Let alone you can't keep your abilities within your bars as you change that I think sucks!!! I hate playing and then go to try the other class I picked and have to stop and reset everything, in the way I have adapted to play each time...

[Pricia]

Ok, so you are annoyed, but complaints about the 7.0 gearing system have been around for months. They are not new complaints that are only being brought up with less than 3 weeks before launch. That annoys me.

 

In addition to that, I have not played pvp like I used to because of changes that they made during 6.0 to exclude losses towards the advancement of the pvp weekly mission. The fact that they continue to hold fast to their positon that only wins should count annoys me.

 

Then there are the changes to conquest. The changes announced for 7.0 to increase the points needed, and nerfing the availability and repeatability of objectives annoy me.

 

Why is it wrong for me to complain about what they are doing? how do you think they will know that I'm not happy with their decisions if I don't let them know? Why shouldn't I use weak or non-critical statements when voicing my frustrations?

 

In real life I have been on the receiving end of a significant amount of feedback due to the fact that what I have done in provides services to customers who mattered to me. In my review of that feedback, I found no use for praise, and instead focused on criticism to help me to improve my operation. I appreciated criticism no matter how spirited the person giving it was in voicing their opinion. I know that there are things that I have done that have been frustrating to those that I served, and hearing what I did wrong made it possible for me to do better. I am grateful to those who helped me in my quest to be better.

 

So now, tell me again why I shouldn't be critical of changes that annoy me.

 

Oh gosh no you should be complaining about what you don't like. That's the point of feedback.

 

But this thread are about changes to gearing from PTS. So coming here to complain about pvp or operatives or conquest is just not the best place for it - you will probably be heard better if you post those in the appropriate thread (saying a general "you" here). I know that I've been guilty of it when replying to people though.

 

Also... People need to stop assuming that they are not listening to feedback about something specific just because they don't acknowledge it. I'm sure some things have been changed, and we'll find out in 3 weeks or sooner. Either way, there's nothing constructive about complaining that the devs don't listen. They do. I'm the one who was complaining the most (I think) about solo players not getting gear drops at all. I was infinitely grateful to see that they DID listen to me. People just need to be patient and give them a chance. That's how feedback works - you give your opinion, you see what actually changes, then you give your opinion again.

 

Ok I'm done ranting now.

[Exly]

They want to make the game "easier" for new players. I kinda get that, mods are really overwhelming for new players and in all the games I've played, one spec = one set of gear, period (with some generic pieces here and there). So they want to streamline it. Fine.

 

I just really don't want to miss on level 80 mobs because someone doesn't know how game mechanics work (I mean, just look at the bonuses we get from legendaries and all the useless sets that were released in 6.0, it does make me wonder if they play their own game too).

 

End game is easier when top rated gear is easier to get. How does limiting the access of good gear to the people with the most skill help new or less skilled players?

 

As far as mods and the way they may be confusing to new players, I think that there are plenty of people willing to work with them to help them with their gearing questions. That is probably the best reason to join a guild and get to know the people that they play with.

 

So, instead of making things worse for everyone so that some people are less confused, maybe they should concentrate more on providing tutorials and instructional videos for people who don't want to join a guild and might need a little help in order to understand how the system works.

[TheVoyant]

Too little, too late.

 

Glad to see some semblance of acknowledgement on the issues... But you guys still promised an epic 10 year anniversary...

 

This is "well we'll try not to break too much" still.

 

Like I keep saying short of being upfront, honest, and apologetic will still see you guys as trying to pull fast ones on your player base.

 

The "Unhype" damage has been done, to quote a fellow former swtor player.

 

Subs still set to expire after 7.0 launches, and most of my guild/community is switching to games that deliver on their promises like Lost Ark/Warframe/Monster Hunter, etc. Waiting in hopes Massive can finally give us a decent Star Wars game this century.

 

No hate to the SWtor community though, I genuinely hope they fix this stuff so you guys can have fun. I just hate seeing bad business moves and wanted to vocalize it incase one of their higher ups looks for reasons as to why the player count is dropping.

[Sarova]

Omnishambles

You win! /applause

[TrixxieTriss]

Listen to the players.

 

Fact is tho if their boss js telling them they want non mod gear that what they'll get. Not a issue w the devs just whoevers leading the team. It's outta their hands

 

Yes, it’s most likely poor leadership and a handful of people or 1 person with an agenda to make the game in their image and the players be damned. The rest of the dev team don’t really have a choice.

[JattaGin]

Dear BW,

 

I give you the worst feedback I can give as a player:

 

I don't care anymore.

 

With your complete botching of your 10 years anniversary and the outlook of a Swtor 7 which is so obviously made to not be for me and my playing style, I finally managed to mentally distanciate me from this game in which I've been heavily invested since 2009 (the early forums).

 

I guess I should thank you for it. It will free up many hours per month for other activities. My sub ran out at the beginning of January. After 7 got delayed, I excitedly and happily added 2 non-recurring months. At the beginning of March I will become a preferred player for the first time ever. That's a done deal now, as my main points of complaint got ignored or dismissed.

 

I feel kind of relieved and positive about it. I made peace with the fact that this relationship is ending. Maybe if I don't pay anymore for this game, I feel easier about it and find a way to enjoy 7 despite so far despising almost everything about it. If not, then I'm also fine with uninstalling for good. I'm currently tying up loose ends and preparing my legacy's transition to preferred.

 

Regarding your changes mentioned in this thread: whatever.

[Anyaka_Jedi]

Dear BW,

 

I give you the worst feedback I can give as a player:

 

I don't care anymore.

 

With your complete botching of your 10 years anniversary and the outlook of a Swtor 7 which is so obviously made to not be for me and my playing style, I finally managed to mentally distanciate me from this game in which I've been heavily invested since 2009 (the early forums).

 

I guess I should thank you for it. It will free up many hours per month for other activities. My sub ran out at the beginning of January. After 7 got delayed, I excitedly and happily added 2 non-recurring months. At the beginning of March I will become a preferred player for the first time ever. That's a done deal now, as my main points of complaint got ignored or dismissed.

 

I feel kind of relieved and positive about it. I made peace with the fact that this relationship is ending. Maybe if I don't pay anymore for this game, I feel easier about it and find a way to enjoy 7 despite so far despising almost everything about it. If not, then I'm also fine with uninstalling for good. I'm currently tying up loose ends and preparing my legacy's transition to preferred.

 

Regarding your changes mentioned in this thread: whatever.

 

Can i have your stuff?

[ExarSun]

Imagine thinking limiting players from using cartel market weapons at highest level and thus limiting your sales is a great idea..... This is an excelent business decision..Me and some friends are still laughing...

[Exly]

I have been patient for years now, and that has gotten me nowhere. Being vocal might not have any tangible effect, but I will not remain silent and just be patient as they continue to whittle away at the game to make it into a less fun version of what it could and should be.

[bigpoppared]

Idk, I feel like from what I've played and seen from the dev post yesterday regarding just pushing all of this to live. This game update is basically forcing every player into a grind, buggy, construction zone. If people can't use the weapons they paid for in higher level content or modify them to use in combat in a proper manner it will put a very negative light on the game but this time from potentially media outlets.

[LordCamTheGreat]

If people can't use the weapons they paid for in higher level content or modify them to use in combat in a proper manner it will put a very negative light on the game but this time from potentially media outlets.

 

The one saving grace is the fact that weapons are being added to outfitter, so it doesn't matter what weapon you actually have equipped - moddable or not. However, that won't even be available when 7.0 goes live...

[bigpoppared]

The one saving grace is the fact that weapons are being added to outfitter, so it doesn't matter what weapon you actually have equipped - moddable or not. However, that won't even be available when 7.0 goes live...

 

Yeah, that's the silver lining, but the only issue is we're looking at a March, April, May, window of custom weapons in outfitter depending on how long it will take to release 7.1

[JaeOnasi]

My main worry here is that I'm not completely sure that BW is aware of what stats are actually best for each spec, considering that they don't even make 110% accuracy the norm in the first place.. but at least we can still mix and match sets and accessories to get the accuracy/alacrity/crit that we want.

I guarantee you that BioWare does know--the formulas are in the code, after all, and at least one of the devs is very familiar with theorycrafting.

 

I did mix and match while testing, and even with every piece available (mixed Force Lord and Targeters, and all left side Accuracy), and the max proficient stim, it wasn't enough for me to reach 110% without having to do an augment or two. And of course, using all that accuracy meant I had, what, 4 or 5 pieces left spread between alacrity and crit, so you can imagine how low those were at 318 and 320. Ugh. The thought of having to augment gear I'm going to throw away at the vendor for an upgrade is making me gnash my teeth in frustration. I can't even save it for an alt, for heaven's sake.

 

I didn't get a chance to see the very latest gear before the PTS went down. Maybe they made it a little better?

[TrixxieTriss]

Can i have your stuff?

 

He said he was going preferred. Not leaving. He’s just going to stop giving BioWare money.

[TrixxieTriss]

The one saving grace is the fact that weapons are being added to outfitter, so it doesn't matter what weapon you actually have equipped - moddable or not. However, that won't even be available when 7.0 goes live...

 

Don’t count your cookies before you get them. It may never be available because they started this process back in the 5.0 era. You can go read how they were having trouble. Then they were going to do it in 6.0. Now they say they can’t do it in 7.0. So I would take what they are saying with a large grain of salt and scepticism if you think it will be ready for 7.1. That way you won’t be disappointed, again!

Edited January 29, 2022 by TrixxieTriss

[TrixxieTriss]

 

I didn't get a chance to see the very latest gear before the PTS went down. Maybe they made it a little better?

 

They didn’t 🥺

[NikeKnight]

Small improvements to the grind aspect, but overall this is exactly the same convulted mess it's been from start and all of the core issues players had were left untouched. So yeah I guess thanks to listening to 5% of the feedback, the most important 95% remains ignored.

 

I agree. The larger audience (myself - a 10 year subscriber - being one of those quiet, in the corner types) may be disgruntled by "lowering" the amount of gear in drops, and renown chests... making it more difficult to gear up, and the frustration may be what drives subscribers away from the game...

 

Why fix something that is "not broken?" As a member of the silent majority, I see changes based on nothing I have a complaint about - I like the game as it has progressed to 6.#

 

Something to think about. Making dramatic, significant changes based on the vocal few sometimes results in a negative result - that result being lost subscribers!