New PvP rewards system is horrible

[Raansu]

This change fixes nothing and causes new problems. People who support it? I feel sorry for them and hope they get help.

 

Could say the same about those who are against it. Heaven forbid you try in a match an earn your daily.

[BlackSilverFire]

Before, pretty much in a single session I could get daily and some progress to weeklies no matter what. This evening I went 3L and 1W. The loosing teams I was with were hopeless. The team I was with that won was OP and would have won without me. Getting stuck with new folks with poor armor didn't really bother me with challenge and rewards system, but now it feels like a waste of time. Now the game is reduced to seeing what side of the premade I will be on.

 

I really am struggling to see the point of PvPing right now -- feels like wasted evening.

 

Well, you're right: the new pvp changes are a complete waste of time as it's firewalling many pvpers who just try to scrap out a weekly, while discouraging newer pvpers from attempting to get better at pvp (ranked and unranked). The result is so absurdly obvious that I'm shocked BioWare sunk this low on b0nehead moves - the pvp population will be a shell and only the few premades elite will thrive.

 

<The pvp team is completely out of touch and out to lunch>. RIP pvp.

 

 

PS: take the 20 wz requirement off the Major Pierce alliance alert - pve'ers shouldn't be forced to do this (pvp) nonsense.

Edited July 31, 2020 by BlackSilverFire

[translucentwolf]

Easy fix. Don't PvP.

[DaZeeZee]

Could say the same about those who are against it. Heaven forbid you try in a match an earn your daily.

 

Of course I try, always tried. Wins would reward double no reason at all not to.

 

the fact you think you're right despite logical proof the opposite is true is sad.

[DaZeeZee]

Easy fix. Don't PvP.

 

This is why its an awful change. people just stop bothering. queues take even longer.

 

PS: take the 20 wz requirement off the Major Pierce alliance alert - pve'ers shouldn't be forced to do this (pvp) nonsense.

 

No this change is far worse than the pvp recruiting Comps. with those I could get them in a day win or lose, it was no problem at all.

 

Not rewarding participation is a brain dead easy thing to see is a problem. people who think you should ONLY be rewarded for winning in an online game should not be allowed to play. would make it much better for the adults who can reason beyond their own selfish ideas.

Edited July 31, 2020 by DaZeeZee

[tummiswtor]

I left Huttball match becouse I dont like and now i got ban for Wazrones, really? Good work, really...

[Raansu]

I left Huttball match becouse I dont like and now i got ban for Wazrones, really? Good work, really...

 

Next time don't leave.

[DarkTergon]

I left Huttball match becouse I dont like and now i got ban for Wazrones, really? Good work, really...

 

it's not a ban, it's a 15 min timeout. Huttball was one of the reasons I stopped PvP'ing...lol (Well the two new maps, the original was ok, no issues...lol)

[omaan]

Before, pretty much in a single session I could get daily and some progress to weeklies no matter what. This evening I went 3L and 1W. The loosing teams I was with were hopeless. The team I was with that won was OP and would have won without me. Getting stuck with new folks with poor armor didn't really bother me with challenge and rewards system, but now it feels like a waste of time. Now the game is reduced to seeing what side of the premade I will be on.

 

I really am struggling to see the point of PvPing right now -- feels like wasted evening.

 

They should have just return back the old quests from season 10 which worked PERFECTLY then. I don't know why they are trying to invent a bicycle while we had good example of quests before. Team ranked is still dead by the way...only wintraders there

Edited August 1, 2020 by omaan

[stoopicus]

So, generally I am a fan of the concept of this change, just not the execution of the changes. Incentivizing winning is definitely good (and it used to be, just not as extreme). But doing it to the extent they did is just a brute force, blunt hammering of the issue.

 

I think they broke things too. I was running a new toon through lowbies last night and first match was a loss. And the loss didn't complete the noob "intro to PvP" quest you get on fleet.

 

This may be a separate bug or another issue I am not aware of, but I LOLed at the time.

 

On the plus side, for my first round back after resubbing, I got Voidstar. I was sure it would be Quesh Huttball given usual luck.

[TrixxieTriss]

So, generally I am a fan of the concept of this change, just not the execution of the changes. Incentivizing winning is definitely good (and it used to be, just not as extreme). But doing it to the extent they did is just a brute force, blunt hammering of the issue.

 

I think they broke things too. I was running a new toon through lowbies last night and first match was a loss. And the loss didn't complete the noob "intro to PvP" quest you get on fleet.

 

This may be a separate bug or another issue I am not aware of, but I LOLed at the time.

 

On the plus side, for my first round back after resubbing, I got Voidstar. I was sure it would be Quesh Huttball given usual luck.

 

Agreed. It’s the method as a stand alone fix that’s wrong. More consultations with the community have come up with some better methods

Edited August 1, 2020 by TrixxieTriss

[Sundown]

Next time don't leave.

It is supposed to be a fun game, now, not a job, right?

You can‘t select the maptypes to queue for and you don‘t see the actually drawn map before entering, so what choice do you have? After huttball #x suffer through #x+1?

 

I understand that people leaving are a problem. But if the cure is worse than the desease, you shouldn‘t apply it.

 

I still have no idea how someone can think it is a good idea to only reward winning in a team-game of randomly chosen players against opposition? I mean, ok, only if you beat a boss, I can understand. But of 2 teams one will not get the mission done or progressed for that matter at all. The logical consequence is to either not queue or chose a premade to increase your odds, at least if you are not just casually playing a bit.

[stoopicus]

*Only* rewarding wins is indeed a bad plan. It should just go back to the points system where wins got you more.

[JattaGin]

So, let me just summarise this situation:

 

A couple of years ago, PvP on most servers (if you're new, we once had many more servers than just the 5 we have now) was very much in decline, and the PvP community was extremely toxic. Premades roflstomped pugs was normal business day in, day out.

 

BW looked at their metrics and draw several conclusions. At the end, they decided to take away the pressure of winning in PvP, in order to encourage more people to engage in PvP and to relieve some of the most toxic stressful situations.

 

As a result, PvP got much more active again and has, until recently, popped regularly on all the servers that are left, at least in the level 75 bracket.

 

One issue that was happening were quitters and AFKers.

 

The solution that BW introduced now for this issue is to GO BACK to the old system. The system which BW's metrics proved bad. The system that made players not wanting to PvP. The system that drove many players away to other games. The system which led to toxicity, bad behaviour and bad feelings.

 

I'm at a loss here. Why did they think that this is a good idea? Who makes such decisions? Mr. Kanneg, can you explain to me what you think you will achieve with going back to a state that had HURT this game badly? You know exactly (or maybe you don't?) that we lost a lot of players due to the PvP issues back in the days.

 

I'm not entering any PvP games as long as it might be that I play 10 hours without getting my weekly - or even daily - done.

 

BW is going in circles, and surprisingly it always leads to the same outcomes.

[stoopicus]

That's a pretty good summary JattaGin.

 

What I would add is that there *were* ways to incentivize winning for the Weekly before, and it's not rocket science here. Most other games with PvP offer a weekly system where wins advance faster than losses towards the goal, but losses still advance. SWTOR used to do this as well. It works fine. Making it an all/nothing thing is a definite step back to what you describe.

 

Well, at least with lowbies you still get pretty decent XP and alignment gains. Took about 10 minutes to pop for me last night on SF for a L28.

Edited August 1, 2020 by stoopicus

[DarkTergon]

 

BW is going in circles, and surprisingly it always leads to the same outcomes.

 

 

I don't think any of the people who make the decisions actually play the game, and whatever information they are relying on is skewered. They don't seem to listen to the players either. Sometimes it feels like someone is in the background deliberately trying to sabotage the game

[tummiswtor]

Bring back old system + if You leave huttball for example - You're banned for this maptype 15 minutes. Seems like best option for me

[Ardrossan]

So, let me just summarise this situation:

 

A couple of years ago, PvP on most servers (if you're new, we once had many more servers than just the 5 we have now) was very much in decline, and the PvP community was extremely toxic. Premades roflstomped pugs was normal business day in, day out.

 

BW looked at their metrics and draw several conclusions. At the end, they decided to take away the pressure of winning in PvP, in order to encourage more people to engage in PvP and to relieve some of the most toxic stressful situations.

 

As a result, PvP got much more active again and has, until recently, popped regularly on all the servers that are left, at least in the level 75 bracket.

 

One issue that was happening were quitters and AFKers.

 

The solution that BW introduced now for this issue is to GO BACK to the old system. The system which BW's metrics proved bad. The system that made players not wanting to PvP. The system that drove many players away to other games. The system which led to toxicity, bad behaviour and bad feelings.

 

I'm at a loss here. Why did they think that this is a good idea? Who makes such decisions? Mr. Kanneg, can you explain to me what you think you will achieve with going back to a state that had HURT this game badly? You know exactly (or maybe you don't?) that we lost a lot of players due to the PvP issues back in the days.

 

I'm not entering any PvP games as long as it might be that I play 10 hours without getting my weekly - or even daily - done.

 

BW is going in circles, and surprisingly it always leads to the same outcomes.

 

good post. Now, that's a good critique of the change from points to wins, but what about the deserter lockout? We didn't have that before.

[Raansu]

So, let me just summarise this situation:

 

A couple of years ago, PvP on most servers (if you're new, we once had many more servers than just the 5 we have now) was very much in decline, and the PvP community was extremely toxic. Premades roflstomped pugs was normal business day in, day out.

 

BW looked at their metrics and draw several conclusions. At the end, they decided to take away the pressure of winning in PvP, in order to encourage more people to engage in PvP and to relieve some of the most toxic stressful situations.

 

As a result, PvP got much more active again and has, until recently, popped regularly on all the servers that are left, at least in the level 75 bracket.

 

One issue that was happening were quitters and AFKers.

 

The solution that BW introduced now for this issue is to GO BACK to the old system. The system which BW's metrics proved bad. The system that made players not wanting to PvP. The system that drove many players away to other games. The system which led to toxicity, bad behaviour and bad feelings.

 

I'm at a loss here. Why did they think that this is a good idea? Who makes such decisions? Mr. Kanneg, can you explain to me what you think you will achieve with going back to a state that had HURT this game badly? You know exactly (or maybe you don't?) that we lost a lot of players due to the PvP issues back in the days.

 

I'm not entering any PvP games as long as it might be that I play 10 hours without getting my weekly - or even daily - done.

 

BW is going in circles, and surprisingly it always leads to the same outcomes.

 

This is only telling half the story. It wasn't a problem on the populated servers. They were doing just fine. The problem was BW opened too many servers and they didn't want to close down servers so they put in as many delay tactics as they could. Some servers literally had 2-3 people online during prime time on the fleet. If they had not panicked at launch and let the queues calm down after the hype of launch instead of opening over 100 servers they would have never ran into those problems.

 

Their metrics had nothing to do with it and the current daily only reguires 1 win. The original daily required 3 wins. So get over it.

Edited August 1, 2020 by Raansu

[TrixxieTriss]

I already felt there weren’t enough missions for pvp. And this new system only makes it worse by reducing the number of wins required.

 

Now I’m also not a fan of “only” wins counting towards the missions. I think if you lose it should partially count towards the daily.

 

I would like see at least one other daily added (to all lvl brackets) and the current one win daily increased to 3 wins.

But they should rework it so that 9 losses would also finish the daily. Ie, 1 win = 3 points. 1 loss = 1 point

 

The “new” daily in additional to the first two current dailies (at lvl 75) would be 5 wins. They could add this 5 win daily to the lowbie and Mids bracket too (currently only 1 daily for lowbie brackets)

 

They could then add a new weekly to the one we already have. So we would have two weeklies. One would be to complete the weekly we already have and the second would be to complete the “new daily” 3 times in the week.

Edited August 2, 2020 by TrixxieTriss

[DariusCalera]

So I'm a returning player that's been enjoying SWTOR on and off since right after it came out. I know that I'm not the best PvPer but I can hold my own usually and contribute. Yea, I'm pretty much just a casual that enjoys the game and PvP. I've been back about a month now and the first couple of weeks was just regearing. Two weeks ago I decided to jump back into to WZs and see how it was going.

 

I can honestly say that I am not a fan of the "only wins count" system that is in use now. It's been two weeks of WZs at different times and two weeks of losses. If it takes someone weeks to complete a daily then there are issues that need to be addressed.

[EllieAnne]

Heaven forbid you try in a match an earn your daily.

 

Do you understand how team sports work? If 6 try hard and 2 are stupid, do nothing, or actively work for the other team and your TEAM gets stomped; then what did that "trying" earn the 6? I'll give you a hint. Nothing.

[TyrFoge]

I'm not going to make claim that the new reward system is perfect nor am I going to even claim that it is great but what I don't understand about the complaints is how anyone can say that doing PvP content is pointless or "you don't get anything" if you you lose when you gain 6K CQ points (I know. I am making the assumption here that the majority of the complaints are regarding Unranked) just for getting your 10 medals? That means that on any given week if you queue for 10 matches win or lose you are guaranteed to have more than enough CQ points on that character for completion. This does not sound like a "complete waste of time" to me... Edited December 21, 2020 by TyrFoge

[BarbarikDave]

I stopped PvP because of this. Once I found out I had to win to get anything I said screw it because 9/10 it's me and maybe one other person trying and the rest are too busy hunting down the enemy and ignoring the objectives. Pair that with the fact that I myself am not the greatest and have likely reached the pique of my abilities and there is 0 reason for me to queue anymore.

 

I just hope they leave GSF alone. Even with a team that's lacking it's still worth the time put in.

[DarkTergon]

I'm not going to make claim that the new reward system is perfect nor am I going to even claim that it is great but what I don't understand about the complaints is how anyone can say that doing PvP content is pointless or "you don't get anything" if you you lose when you gain 6K CQ points (I know. I am making the assumption here that the majority of the complaints are regarding Unranked) just for getting your 10 medals? That means that on any given week if you queue for 10 matches win or lose you are guaranteed to have more than enough CQ points on that character for completion. This does not sound like a "complete waste of time" to me...

 

Except, if you don't care about CQ, what does 6k mean, it doesn't complete your weekly, or daily, or anything, except help with cq....And if you don't give a fig about CQ, yes, it is a complete waste of time,

 

 

BTW: There are far easier ways to getting 6k CQ points, then spending time in a wz losing.

Edited December 21, 2020 by DarkTergon