Conquest lost its shape and purpose

[Ylliarus]

People in both conq threads are cheering about how they bring 30 chars+ to conq target now. All guilds on all top 10 boards on all servers are bringing at least 400% more conq. home than they used to.

 

That's great! People are enjoying themselves while playing the game and doing their own thing. People are cheering in both threads which means that the new Conquest system is appreciated and enjoyable. Your opinion is irrelevant and wasn't asked for, now move on and accept that people are tired of listening to you.

Edited May 13, 2020 by Ylliarus

[robertthebard]

When it comes to how " good" or " bad" (=efficient) conquest something is, time, effort and difficulty involved are the only ways to measure things.

 

False. 100% certifiably false, in fact. I look at whether or not I'm going to enjoy myself in content, and that's the primary concern, one might say, the only concern, that I have. I have never set foot in a WZ, because 1 2 3 GO isn't my idea of PvP. I don't begrudge anyone that likes it, it's all good, for them, but it's not for me. Therefore, way back in the golden days of conquest, when PvP had it's own week, I didn't make Conquest goals at all. Guess what, do a search and see how many threads I started claiming it needed to be removed from Conquest. I'll save you some time, the answer is 0. I just didn't make it that week, and I was fine with it.

 

When it was changed so that all earned xp went to Conquest, I made Conquest on accident, and was quite surprised to find that I had, and was concerned that maybe I'd been taking advantage of an exploit, until I did some reading up on it. But even then, I didn't know what the goals were, as I hadn't looked, and all I had done was play some content that I enjoy. There's that pesky "having fun playing a game" getting in the way of your narrative, again.

[Psychopyro]

If all activities and playstyles were even roughly equal, then why do something you dislike for conquest? Tie winning a match as part of earning good conquest(like it used to be) and this issue goes away almost entirely. Even if you speedrun through planetaries, they will provide you with content for 4 hours or something.We quite quickly approaching daily max. time spend online here for most ppl.

 

We had this back and forth once already, but again as you pointed out, if CQ gains is the path of least resistance, people WILL go there, even if they hate it. We already proved this when conquest first came out. People constantly just either AFKing or constant suicide to end the match as quickly as possible.

 

Also winning a match was also a losing proposition (remember it used to be win or nothing). Problem is PvP/GSF players will complain when they get stuck on teams with scrubs or worse having to fight the same 8 man guild queue sync group. And if they don't get on the same team they just leave the match. And if they get stuck together on a 4v4 they just win trade and die ASAP to get into the next match.

 

Everything they've done for CQ points in PvP has been an abysmal failure. Yet you sit here an ask for the same things they've tried expecting a different result... that's literally insanity.

Edited May 14, 2020 by Psychopyro

[Ylliarus]

When it comes to how " good" or " bad" (=efficient) conquest something is, time, effort and difficulty involved are the only ways to measure things.

 

Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. WRONG. It's YOUR method of measuring quality. It doesn't go up for anyone else EXCEPT YOU. Because I measure quality by the enjoyment I get out of doing the content. This is not some damn corporate scheme where numbers of efficiency matter, this is a game for crying out loud. The ONLY measure of quality that matters is whether you are having fun while playing. It doesn't matter if you put 5 minutes, 10 minutes, an hour or several days into something, all that matters is whether a player is having fun. Period.

 

What you do in 10 minutes time, someone else will smear out across the span of an hour. That already renders all your arguments null and void. You can speed run something, another will take the time to do it. The time spent on something in the game is subjective and unique to every single player. The amount of fun and enjoyment one had while playing is is all that matters.

[Stradlin]

YOUR[/b] method of measuring quality. It doesn't go up for anyone else EXCEPT YOU. Because I measure quality by the enjoyment I get out of doing the content. This is not some damn corporate scheme where numbers of efficiency matter' date=' this is a game for crying out loud. The [b']ONLY[/b]

 

I literally spelled out that it is efficiency we speak of here, when talking about " good and bad conquest" That is the context here. It says so in the part you quoted. We can have some much more subjective conversation about what we like or don't like doing, but that isn't what we are talking about here. When it comes to efficiency, you can easily measure and calculate things. It is far less subjective.

 

If entire conversation is all about content Y giving vastly superior conq when compared to content X, "But i like doing Y!!!!" is not something that contributes to that conversation.

 

 

 

What you do in 10 minutes time, someone else will smear out across the span of an hour.

This is why -potential conquest given by content- should be a huge part of the picture when balancing stuff out. This should have been looked at. It'd be important to evaluate how tough, easy, common or attainable it is to reach this potential: I can't actually play Sin all that well. I'm wearing starter level 306 gear, no set bonuses or good tacticals. Using a vanilla companion instead of Shae etc. Method I used likely isn't even the optimal way of touring the planetaries. I have a literal things-to-do list given by the game. I move through this list and game ticks boxes for me. Game gives me literal teleporter items that take me right to the next step of this list. Does reaching this potential feel somehow obscure or tricky or uncommon? Of course, one can always initiate to some sort of a race to the bottom here: " Well, I need 12 hours cause i like to RP walk around Voss for 11 hours before I start!" but when balancing stuff out, its bit more useful to consider the potential and what a normal player can reach. Normal player can reach 50k conq in 8-15 mins or so. Every week. Every day. By doing planetaries. And exclusively by doing planetaries.

 

In closing, I'd like to quote something you just said in another conq thread:

 

For years they (planetary missions) have been neglected up until the point that you rarely saw people doing that type of content. You know how empty the dailies areas were? It took a bug a few years prior to get people to start doing the dailies again. The moment the bug was fixed (even though the CXP/Renown points rewards were raised after that) the dailies died down again. But now, with this new Conquest system, the daily areas, heroics and planetary missions are finally being played again.

 

This is an extremely accurate example of the gravity I spoke of. (ctrl-F "gravity " from OP) Apparently we actually fully agree on this! Or you recon all these people just magically discovered how fun planetaries are at the same moment they start giving 400% more conq than anything else:D? They're just having fun, right? < - Not some rhetoric thing here and I can actually answer this question myself, that actually IS right.They ARE having fun: Give massive 400% increase to rewards of content Y and that is you literally making that content more rewarding. You elevate that content. Since its so much more rewarding, it feels satisfying and becomes fun.

 

Why so many here feel that soloable straightforward planetaries that need no other people to happen should somehow stand so far above everything else is puzzling.Bring rest of the playstyles to same ballpark.

 

if CQ gains is the path of least resistance, people WILL go there, even if they hate it.

This, once more underlines the gravity bit I spoke of. Its nice we can agree on that. If different playstyles are in the same ballpark in terms of conq they give, why would people opt in to do stuff they hate?

If Warzones gave 400% more conquest than anything else, then lots of people would start doing Warzones and many would without a doubt hate it. If Warzones give 120% or 80% of the conquest all the rest gives..then people who do like pvp would do Warzones.

 

Generous handful of various daily repeatable objectives for GSF and WZ would go long way towards fixing this situation. Tie it to winning and performance. Medals earned, objectives capped etc. Add these and ensure people spending 1 hour at this get something like 75%-125% of conquest you get by doing an hour of planetaries. Stuff would start making bit sense again.

 

Notion that soloable straightfoeward content is so vastly superior to everything else in terms of conq given is utterly ridiculous.

Edited May 14, 2020 by Stradlin

[DeannaVoyager]

There has been some great posts in this thread, explaining it all out, simply and easily. This guy just does not want to listen, his argumnets are just arguments for the sake of it, he keeps changing his posts & his mind. As someone said earlier, put him on ignore, and keep posting positive feedback.

 

I haven't read all of this, as he seems to ignore every reasonable comment there is, and keeps repeating himself until everyone gets bored enough to stop replying (and he can call himself a winner?), but it reminded me of an older thread with similar... "issues"

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=965535

 

Enjoy or suffer, your choice.

[ElZaguero]

I haven't read all of this, as he seems to ignore every reasonable comment there is, and keeps repeating himself until everyone gets bored enough to stop replying (and he can call himself a winner?), but it reminded me of an older thread with similar... "issues"

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=965535

 

Enjoy or suffer, your choice.

 

Seriously. If there was a kick vote on the forums, this guy would have hit the sidewalk so hard he'd bounce three times.

[Sarfux]

That's great! People are enjoying themselves while playing the game and doing their own thing. People are cheering in both threads which means that the new Conquest system is appreciated and enjoyable. Your opinion is irrelevant and wasn't asked for, now move on and accept that people are tired of listening to you.

 

I think the reason for the giant paragraph responses is because nobody agrees with him on this.....he's in the very small minority on this. Also I see it too that all of these guilds are on the list getting tons of points! that means LOTS of people are playing a lot more! It's great to see!

[xordevoreaux]

Seriously. If there was a kick vote on the forums, this guy would have hit the sidewalk so hard he'd bounce three times.

 

I envision a crater.

[Sarfux]

I envision a crater.

 

precise! just go to the positive thread and show your support over there for this GREAT change!!

[DarkestMicheal]

Seriously. If there was a kick vote on the forums, this guy would have hit the sidewalk so hard he'd bounce three times.

 

:D:D:D nearly fell of the chair laughing

[Stradlin]

 

Second video highlighting the current state of the new conq system. Decided I'd show how long it takes to get 50k conq in GSF. Here's eight back-to-back matches of Galactic Starfighter. Bit over 90 minutes of GSF. Got me about 56k conq. Planetary tourist gets about as much in 11 minutes.

 

I use stamp- sized version of my previous video mostly just to cover the chat window. However, it kinda helps driving the point across better than words could. 11 mins->57k video ends just before GSF pilot is done with his 1st match! Heh.

Edited May 16, 2020 by Stradlin

[juliushorst]

I think the reason for the giant paragraph responses is because nobody agrees with him on this.....he's in the very small minority on this. Also I see it too that all of these guilds are on the list getting tons of points! that means LOTS of people are playing a lot more! It's great to see!

 

This (a lot of responses and long responses) are actually a clever strategy. Someone reading this thread might get an impression that people are quite divided on the topic while in reality vast majority of us support and enjoy the new system.

[Stradlin]

while in reality vast majority of us support and enjoy the new system.

 

Might you be able to support and enjoy it while recognizing it has some massive imbalances going on?

 

All playstyles except running planetary missions operates within boundaries of Conq system that is similar (in terms numbers.How much&how fast) to what it used to be. This new, sick conquest? Menial bits and planetary missions got included. Everything else got left out.

 

There must have been some massive failures and oversights going during the testing phases of this. Which is understandable..March of 2020 was a terrible time to test anything.

Edited May 16, 2020 by Stradlin

[Psychopyro]

 

Second video highlighting the current state of the new conq system. Decided I'd show how long it takes to get 50k conq in GSF. Here's eight back-to-back matches of Galactic Starfighter. Bit over 90 minutes of GSF. Got me about 56k conq. Planetary tourist gets about as much in 11 minutes.

 

I use stamp- sized version of my previous video mostly just to cover the chat window. However, it kinda helps driving the point across better than words could. 11 mins->57k video ends just before GSF pilot is done with his 1st match! Heh.

 

Again, Planetary are DAILY... GSF you can do until you're blue in the face, and then do it some more.

 

And frankly, your "Planetary Tourist" slight is just as bad IMO as the old "PvE Heros" comments PvPers used to throw around. Insulting a person based on how they want to play is not making your point.

 

But lets add it all up for you.... And I'm sorry, basing your time on SPEED RUNS is not average.

 

To complete 1 quest on each planet which is 26 planets total (I'd argue 25 cause once you complete Quesh there are no daily quests there) is 130,000 CQ at MAX BONUS. 10k for the 1 daily heroic is 140k... Per day... that's it... ALL DONE! No more... zip, zilch, nada, none, zero.... Now, I'll also argue that on AVERAGE (not speed runs) it takes more than 5 min per planet, but I'll go low ball and say 5min per planet. That's 2h and 10min total to knock ALL of those out... And then they are done FOR THE DAY!

 

Now on to the math.... Because we don't have an average play time per player, we can only go by CQ gain per 24 hours....

 

Doing planetary quests is around 1000 per minute... a large amount for sure, but when you divide that by 24 hours (which is 1440 minutes) that lowers the time to 90.2 CQ/min. Which gives you a grand total of ....wait for it.... 130k per day.

 

Now your GSF time is 622 CQ/min... which is not bad... is not as much as the planetary quests... however... that 622 is infinite... which means over 24 hours you can gain 895,680 CQ.... Granted this hourly will drop slightly without the socialite and one times (you lose 20 CQ per minute)... So even at 602 CQ per minute it's still 892,800 per 24 hours.

 

So.... over the course of playtime who's getting the better deal? If anything an argument could be made that GSF and PvP are awarding way too much....

 

Now just in case you're wondering, that break point for when planetary quests =/= GSF, it's 3.5 hours.

 

Now yes there are one off's (like trash/amplifiers/etc) but those aren't specific to doing planetary quests... You could have done ALL of those while you were waiting for GSF to pop. Which you didn't do in your video. Also planetary kill counts will add significant time to complete.

 

In other words, your argument is not holding a lot of weight. All you did was provide me a way to prove GSF/PvP gave better rewards in the long run.....

 

[EDIT] For the record that's not even CLOSE to your claim of OMG 400% better...

Edited May 16, 2020 by Psychopyro

[Psychopyro]

BTW, if you want to argue that kill counts need added in, well it's 12,500 for BOTH per planet (75 kills total)... well 26 planet slayers is 325,000 CQ points... Plus the 140k previously is 465,000 CQ points or 322 CQ/min.... Which is still 300 LESS CQ/min then doing GSF...

 

If you really want to argue about who has the best deal, pick on crafters.... I wouldn't advise doing so, you never want to incur the wrath of a crafter...

 

A level 50 comp can make 10 level 1 components PER minute... x8 Companions is 80 per minute...

 

80x1440 is 115,200 components per 24 hours...

 

115,200/50 is a total of 2,304 times that the crafter CQ objective for 1500 points each time

 

1500*2304 is a WHOPPING 3,456,000 points PER 24 hours...

 

Which is 2400 CQ points PER MINUTE...... And this is without crits....

Edited May 16, 2020 by Psychopyro

[Stradlin]

Again, Planetary are DAILY... GSF you can do until you're blue in the face, and then do it some more.

 

This is pilot needing 90 mins in what tourist does in 11 mins. Let that sink in folks. Some shades of blue starting to show.

 

After that 90 mins, pilot(and pvp'er) gets hit hard by diminishing returns. Socialite II is gone now. You have nothing left but 4k repeataple(pvp) or 2ish k repeatable(GSF) to ding. There aren't enough hours in a day for anyone spamming infinitely repeatable pvp stuff to catch up with somebody who spends 3 -4 hours touring planetaries.

 

Tourist has some dimisnihing returns too. Still, he can earn 200k or so in 90 mins. Proilly 300-400k or more in 3 hrs. I'll find out! Tourist won't run out of dailies in hours. They are there daily. Just as you said. Every week.

 

All of this completely bypassing the very obvious iffy bits in what you are saying.: "Hey it don't matter tourist can do this almost 10 x faster, since pvper has them repeatables!" Like..we don't even have to go there.

 

 

And I'm sorry, basing your time on SPEED RUNS is not average.

Not much of a speedrun. That's just the thing. Conq sheet gives you a literal things to do list. You follow it. You get teleporters. There is nothing strage or obscure in the playstyle shown on video. Game literally gives you a roadmap and tools for it. And again, with disparity here being so huge, theres pleeenty of time to slowpoke around before the disparity shrinks from "obscenely massive" to being merely" way too big".

 

To complete 1 quest on each planet which is 26 planets total (I'd argue 25 cause once you complete Quesh there are no daily quests there) is 130,000 CQ at MAX BONUS. 10k for the 1 daily heroic is 140k... Per day... that's it... ALL DONE! No more... zip, zilch, nada, none, zero....

I know you know better. Incredibly generous slayer missions orbit the planetaries. Conq. from actual mission complete is 650 a pop. it all piles up real nice. How nice? Again, 90 mins is around 200k. Tried and timed it. That takes you halfway through the planets. I ran out of playtime when testing. In 90 mins, I did all vanilla planets and all 25 x slayers. I did CZ weekly and half of Ossus. Had all 50 x slayers left everywhere. Had Black Hole left. Ossus and CZ aside, had Makeb and all post Makeb planets entirely untouched.

 

 

Your averages include the juicy initial dings pal. (Pvp'er has socialites and 2 daily missions. )That's like counting average daily of tourist entirely based on what he achieves in 11 mins. Those 8 matches I did? Last one had Socialite II dinging. By then you are done with all the dailies you gonna see. Everything Between Match 9 and Match 9000 on that day gives 2125 conq. There is the number you can play with. 2125 from a match. We can agree matches are 10 mins each. Let's assume I do nice, casual brisk little GSF spree of 100 matches in 16.7 hours. Bit over 200k conq earned. NICEEEE. Add in the 56 k you got during your initial 90 mins. 17-18 hours of non stop GSF gives you 260k conq. Good stuff. Again,remember, 200k from 90 mins of planetaries.

 

Are we gonna have an argument about whether it is faster to do 2 hours of planetaries a day vs doing 18 hrs of GSF a day? I guess that'd be the logical next step here.

 

 

 

For the record that's not even CLOSE to your claim of OMG 400% better...

True. it was close to 10 x faster here. Not mere 400% All activities are frontloaded and since people don't usually play 3, 6 or 25 hours a day, what matters during those frontloaded minutes matters the most. I'm pretty sure we can agree that once we go past..6 hour mark or something, not much of it will matter. Few play that much/day.

Edited May 16, 2020 by Stradlin

[Psychopyro]

Again look at the math... I included the dings... anyway you slice it planetary one offs offer less per minute than PvP/GSF, which in turn offer less per minute than crafting.

 

Planetary (includes slayers) without quest turn ins is 320 CQ/min.

PvP/GSF (Not including daily quests or socialite) is 602 CQ/min. If you include daily/socialite it's about 622 CQ/min

Crafting can be as much as 2400 CQ/min...

 

You're cherry picking points and not looking at the whole thing. Granted I put it in 2 posts, but all the math is there. Yes each quest offers 650 CQ per completion, But to even approach the 600 CQ/min there would have to be 615 daily quests available (on top of the CQ objectives), and there just isn't that many.... And even if there was, no one is completing 1 quest every 2.3 minutes.

[Stradlin]

...Its all right there on the video dude. Check all by yourself how much conq I earn from 2nd match, for example. That is the conq pilot earns from - every- match aftter 8th one. It is NOT 600/ min.

In general, its easier and more purposeful to speak about matches, not minutes.

 

Also, the math I'm looking at seems to be crafted for people who literally play 24 hrs a day.

 

Honestly, it is pretty awesome you even try to fight on this hill. You have a vid where tourist needs 11 mins in what pilot does in 90 mins..and its all" well, actually.." Yeah, good luck with all that. You will need it.

Edited May 16, 2020 by Stradlin

[DarkGruffalo]

This (a lot of responses and long responses) are actually a clever strategy. Someone reading this thread might get an impression that people are quite divided on the topic while in reality vast majority of us support and enjoy the new system.

 

which is why, if everyone ignored a certain person, you'd see a better perspective . Just saying....

[Psychopyro]

...Its all right there on the video dude. Check all by yourself how much conq I earn from 2nd match, for example. That is the conq pilot earns from - every- match aftter 8th one. It is NOT 600/ min.

In general, its easier and more purposeful to speak about matches, not minutes.

 

Honestly, it is pretty awesome you even try to fight on this hill. You have a vid where tourist needs 11 mins in what pilot does in 90 mins..and its all" well, actually.." Yeah, good luck with all that.

 

You're not looking at the whole picture... You're taking 1 slice of the overall metric...

 

The only way to ACCURATELY measure gains is to pick 1 specific time period that applies to ALL of the objectives. The only one that applies to ALL is DAILY (as they reset every 24 hours). In this case, how many points could theoretically be gained before the system resets. It's the difference between perceived and actual amount....

 

When you look at OMG planetary quest gains are done in 10 mins, you're not taking into account the other 1430 minutes of the entire period available to gain points. Yea that first 10 min was fast but the next 10 are going to be slower and slower and slower each successive 10 minute period afterward because NOTHING repeats.

 

Now that person who takes 90 min to get there, their gains are more stable. While it takes them LONGER to gain the same amount, each successive 90 minutes will not see as large of a fall off especially because their gains are repeatable. Starfighter has a 1500 infinitely repeatable. That means once they pass that one off, they're still gaining 1500 per match (plus match completion) each time. Planetary quests have no such repeatable quest.

 

Now PvP has it a bit better because their repeatable is 2750 (plus match completion), but the caveat there is that it's 8 medals and some matches it's possible to NOT get 8 medals (think 4v4). Again, Planetary has no such repeatable.

 

As for your video, the last match you had you had 46,500 before you started... When you finished you had 56,750. You didn't gain a renown level, and you got 7,500 for completing the last socialite. So, 56,750 what you started with which was 46,500 leaves 10,250. Now you got 7,500 for socialite which leaves 2,750. You got 1,500 for doing the CQ goal and another 1,250 for the match....

 

So every match AFTER you finish your 1 off CQ goals you still get 2,750 PER MATCH. Planetary quests are not giving 2,750 points per completion. Even if you take your slice of time, 90 minutes.... that's 2750 points every 11.25 minutes. So let's use that number...

 

You can do 128 GSF matches in 1 day. That's 352,000 points.... Plus your 1 offs, and renown dings (3 I think right?) is 386,750... Just to be generous to you, we will subtract that 4,500 for renown ups... which leaves a grand total of....

 

382,250 points.... per day or 265 point's per minute

 

Now let's do Daily Mission (1 for each planet) plus each slayer, plus 26 quest turn ins...

 

481,250 points... per day or 334 points per minute

 

FOR A GRAND TOTAL OF 21% more points doing planetary quests [(481,250-382,250)/481,250] over 24 hours .... And that's using YOUR numbers. Again... Not even CLOSE to your 10x faster or 400% faster.

 

So you're literally arguing for an extra 300 points (give or take) PER GSF match... Now mind you BOTH of these point gains are going to be on the high end of the extremes. I would venture a guess that the averages they have fall closer to these 2 numbers being closer over a 24 hour period... I don't see most players even coming close to EVERY single planetary, heroic, slayer, etc in 24 hours... Just like I don't see someone doing 128 GSF matches....

 

Are there people that will do extremes, of course there are, that's why then numbers have to flesh out over 24 hours (each daily reset) as opposed to how fast a person finishes...

[Stradlin]

You can do 128 GSF matches in 1 day. That's 352,000 points.... Plus your 1 offs, and renown dings (3 I think right?) is 386,750... Just to be generous to you, we will subtract that 4,500 for renown ups... which leaves a grand total of....

 

382,250 points.... per day or 265 point's per minute

 

Now let's do Daily Mission (1 for each planet) plus each slayer, plus 26 quest turn ins...

 

481,250 points... per day or 334 points per minute

 

There's stuff in your reply that is inaccurate and we could cover( you can't use last match with weekly conq target ding when simulating the matches 9-191981 etc etc etc) But..we can't quite get that far.

 

One hand holds something like..4-5 hours worth of gameplay doing planetaries. Other hand holds entire day, 24 hours of non stop GSF. Then you compare these things as equals. That's actually your argument.

 

I pay Jim 10 bux an hour for answering phone. 8 hours a day kind of a job.

I pay John 3.3 bux an hour for answering my fan mail. This isn't exactly a union job, John can work as much as he likes. It might seem less than Jim makes,, but if John does this 24 hrs non stop, it is almost as much as Jim makes. Therefore, pay is equal. ?

Edited May 17, 2020 by Stradlin

[Ylliarus]

You're not looking at the whole picture... You're taking 1 slice of the overall metric...

 

The only way to ACCURATELY measure gains is to pick 1 specific time period that applies to ALL of the objectives. The only one that applies to ALL is DAILY (as they reset every 24 hours). In this case, how many points could theoretically be gained before the system resets. It's the difference between perceived and actual amount....

 

When you look at OMG planetary quest gains are done in 10 mins, you're not taking into account the other 1430 minutes of the entire period available to gain points. Yea that first 10 min was fast but the next 10 are going to be slower and slower and slower each successive 10 minute period afterward because NOTHING repeats.

 

Now that person who takes 90 min to get there, their gains are more stable. While it takes them LONGER to gain the same amount, each successive 90 minutes will not see as large of a fall off especially because their gains are repeatable. Starfighter has a 1500 infinitely repeatable. That means once they pass that one off, they're still gaining 1500 per match (plus match completion) each time. Planetary quests have no such repeatable quest.

 

Now PvP has it a bit better because their repeatable is 2750 (plus match completion), but the caveat there is that it's 8 medals and some matches it's possible to NOT get 8 medals (think 4v4). Again, Planetary has no such repeatable.

 

As for your video, the last match you had you had 46,500 before you started... When you finished you had 56,750. You didn't gain a renown level, and you got 7,500 for completing the last socialite. So, 56,750 what you started with which was 46,500 leaves 10,250. Now you got 7,500 for socialite which leaves 2,750. You got 1,500 for doing the CQ goal and another 1,250 for the match....

 

So every match AFTER you finish your 1 off CQ goals you still get 2,750 PER MATCH. Planetary quests are not giving 2,750 points per completion. Even if you take your slice of time, 90 minutes.... that's 2750 points every 11.25 minutes. So let's use that number...

 

You can do 128 GSF matches in 1 day. That's 352,000 points.... Plus your 1 offs, and renown dings (3 I think right?) is 386,750... Just to be generous to you, we will subtract that 4,500 for renown ups... which leaves a grand total of....

 

382,250 points.... per day or 265 point's per minute

 

Now let's do Daily Mission (1 for each planet) plus each slayer, plus 26 quest turn ins...

 

481,250 points... per day or 334 points per minute

 

FOR A GRAND TOTAL OF 21% more points doing planetary quests [(481,250-382,250)/481,250] over 24 hours .... And that's using YOUR numbers. Again... Not even CLOSE to your 10x faster or 400% faster.

 

So you're literally arguing for an extra 300 points (give or take) PER GSF match... Now mind you BOTH of these point gains are going to be on the high end of the extremes. I would venture a guess that the averages they have fall closer to these 2 numbers being closer over a 24 hour period... I don't see most players even coming close to EVERY single planetary, heroic, slayer, etc in 24 hours... Just like I don't see someone doing 128 GSF matches....

 

Are there people that will do extremes, of course there are, that's why then numbers have to flesh out over 24 hours (each daily reset) as opposed to how fast a person finishes...

 

As well-written as your post is, sadly it has been a waste of your time. Don't get me wrong, I agree with your assessment, but the OP of this thread will ignore everything you wrote down and repeat their nonsense again as if stuck on a loop. The OP doesn't care about debating this sensibly or rationally, OP just wants to spout their own opinion and nothing more. From his posts the OP has shown he has no regard for any other opinion, other than his own. It is quite sad really.

Edited May 17, 2020 by Ylliarus

[Psychopyro]

One hand holds something like..4-5 hours worth of gameplay doing planetaries. Other hand hold entire day, 24 hours of non stop GSF. Then you compare these things as equals. That's actually your argument. Can you imagine a single player to whom that's somehow meaningful? I talk about 90 min sessions, 11 min sessions. 60 min session. You speak of 24 hours of non stop GSF could almost get me what few hrs of planetaries does.

 

You cannot base point gains on what someone can do in 10 minutes vs 10 hours... you have to do it based on the same time period across ALL gains (not just planetary, PvP, GSF, Crafting, etc)

 

Let me give you an example of WHY you can't... People are creative and will figure out how to game a system, and I'll even use myself as an example...

 

When conquest first came out, it took me less than a minute to figure out I could stealth all the way to the last boss on Battle of Ilum, invite 3 other people, kill the last boss, finish that instance while another stealther was going to the end of another instance to reinvite those other 3 ppl I just finished with to do the same thing....

 

Devs have to be above that kind of thinking. Hence why it was nerfed... and then nerfed again.... and again...

 

Right now I can tell you that if you had a group of people go into GSF and mass suicide, they could EASILY outstrip the planetary gains right now. I'll bet they could easily get CQ in an hour just suiciding as fast as they could. I'll bet daily they could get CQ goal in less than 30 minutes (how long does it take 8 ppl to suicide 50 times)... I won't be a party to testing that theory, but I bet they could. Devs said long ago people were free to mass suicide in GSF and they won't do anything about it. If they made the gains any better, this would happen. Don't believe me, go look at past behavior.... IIRC people were popping 15 to 20 matches per hour in GSF just to do this. Same thing happened with PvP...

 

So again, the gains have to be measured around a time with people playing extremes... Right now they DON'T go into PvP and GSF to mass suicide or afk cause there is another alternative that gets them points just as fast as doing that over and over.

[Stradlin]

^All of this is completely irrelevant if they add performance based stuff. Infinitely repeatable objective that dings when you win is alone something that'd mostly fix things. Goes together perfectly with naure of pvp. Number of performance based objectives set as daily could supplement this. -> Presto, GSF would be alright conquest to those who like doing it.