The 6.0 Expansion has been confirmed!

[JediToadstool]

The vagueness surrounding a kill option for Theron, which to me sounded like a 'yes', leaves me uneasy. Yet another LI who'll bite the dust and become likely to vanish from future content. I really wish they'd quit doing that.

Yeahhhhh, that didn't sound like a "yes" at all. Or a "no." Or even a "maybe." That was a very clear "we don't want to say one way or the other because that could easily lead to story spoilers for people." It's my job to answer stuff like that every day (I work in community as well) and that was incredibly neutral. They aren't telling people one way or the other.

 

That said, if we have the choice to kill him, I'm going to be extremely upset if that means he vanishes from future content. I've had enough LIs die/vanish. I'm out.

Edited March 31, 2018 by JediToadstool

[drug_cartel]

If we're going back to Imp vs Pub, then I hope there are faction swap opportunities at the end of the Alliance. I want to be able to follow my favorite companions, and I've already chosen to turn against my original faction on certain characters.

 

I like the Merc/Trooper gameplay, and all my friends are Imperial, but the Assault Cannon looks about a million times cooler than the pistols. I say Tavus was right, Havok got betrayed by the Republic, and I'm jumping ship to join the Empire.

[Eshvara]

If we're going back to Imp vs Pub, then I hope there are faction swap opportunities at the end of the Alliance. I want to be able to follow my favorite companions, and I've already chosen to turn against my original faction on certain characters.

 

I like the Merc/Trooper gameplay, and all my friends are Imperial, but the Assault Cannon looks about a million times cooler than the pistols. I say Tavus was right, Havok got betrayed by the Republic, and I'm jumping ship to join the Empire.

 

If that were to happen, what about all your friends, guild, etc?

[Dracofish]

I feel like slavery and racism are kinda important differences though.

 

Not wanting to get into the "who is better or worse" debate because they both have issues, but...it is pretty obviously stated in the "Annihilation" novel that the Republic tends to turn a blind eye to slavery as long as it's kept behind closed doors and doesn't involve POW's...so yeah...they're not innocent either. In fact, if I remember correctly, there are a couple side-quests on the Pub side that address that same concept.

 

ANYWAYS....

 

About the development...I don't see how this could be done without an excessive amount of hand-waving. Theron goes and works for Imperial Intelligence? Hardly. I just...don't see it. I see him sticking with an Imp-sided character out of loyalty and love...but I don't see him wanting to actively take a roll in wanting to crush the Republic, no matter how many times he's said that the Republic he loved and fought for is gone.

 

And the Alliance...it's still a thing...even without the Eternal Fleet (which I think it should be kind of obvious that the Fleet is going buh-byes)...but even without, the Alliance is still a force. Can I see the Commander just going back and towing the line for whoever is in charge of the Republic or Empire? No way. I don't see how they could possibly swing that, especially for a Sith. I really, really hope we stay with the Alliance and are just throwing our lot in...because all that Zakuulan technology (and Skytroopers) is definitely something.

Edited March 31, 2018 by Dracofish

[annabethchase]

...because all that Zakuulan technology (and Skytroopers) is definitely something.

 

A bad dream perhaps from hibernation sickness?

[Dracofish]

A bad dream perhaps from hibernation sickness?

 

Honestly, I was joking with a friend not too long ago that the only "out" of this corner they've painted themselves into with Zakuul is pulling the "it was all a dream" card, lol.

[JennyFlynn]

Yeahhhhh, that didn't sound like a "yes" at all. Or a "no." Or even a "maybe." That was a very clear "we don't want to say one way or the other because that could easily lead to story spoilers for people." It's my job to answer stuff like that every day (I work in community as well) and that was incredibly neutral. They aren't telling people one way or the other.

 

That said, if we have the choice to kill him, I'm going to be extremely upset if that means he vanishes from future content. I've had enough LIs die/vanish. I'm out.

Charles followed his "We don't want to say" up with the following comment;

 

C: I don't feel I can answer that question without creating spoilers so I'm not going to say.

C: ... Letting you kill a lot of people lately so odds are the story would be one where, if you feel like you would need to, you probably could. *laughs*

 

The ... is because I missed the start of that sentence because Sam was talking at the same time.

 

Anyway, he basically said it's been a trend to kill companions and if the story is one where you feel like you should be able to kill them, then you can. In my eyes, that's a yes to the "Killable Theron?" question.

 

I could be wrong and I'd like to be. Perhaps the conclusion of the story will turn out to be one where it won't feel like you should be able to kill him and therefore, you won't get the option but... the above just feels more likely.

[JediToadstool]

Charles followed his "We don't want to say" up with the following comment;

 

C: I don't feel I can answer that question without creating spoilers so I'm not going to say.

C: ... Letting you kill a lot of people lately so odds are the story would be one where, if you feel like you would need to, you probably could. *laughs*

 

The ... is because I missed the start of that sentence because Sam was talking at the same time.

 

Anyway, he basically said it's been a trend to kill companions and if the story is one where you feel like you should be able to kill them, then you can. In my eyes, that's a yes to the "Killable Theron?" question.

 

I could be wrong and I'd like to be. Perhaps the conclusion of the story will turn out to be one where it won't feel like you should be able to kill him and therefore, you won't get the option but... the above just feels more likely.

 

(Bold my emphasis.) Yes, that's what I think that means.

[Suzsi]

I suppose it depends if he really is fed up with the Republic's s*** enough to work with the empire, more to the point would Lana wanna work against the Empire? I can only assume we'll either be working with whichever faction to deal with a greater threat (ala the Revan DLC) so it won't be too much of an issue OR everyone is going to go back to their respective factions and perhaps we'll call on them occasionally as contacts.

 

Lana at least has shown signs to the contrary even right back in the SoR prelude when you speak to her in the cantina and she mentions that at one point she considered joining the revenites. She also stated outright that the empire needed fixing and had planned on trying to do that from within. Unlike many in the empire Lana has no real drive to grab for power so with her I never thought it was as big a stretch that she would work with the republic then I did Theron working with the empire. I can see that he might remain with a LS char to try and repair or better the empire but I just couldnt see him at all staying with a DS character with a thrist for power. Lana sits on the edge between dark and light, Theron has limits to what he will do.

[Loadsamonie]

Anyone else think it's time to add some more Datacrons to hunt? Either that, or make the Datacron stat bonuses cross-faction, so that Pub toons get the bonuses from Imp-side Datacrons and vice versa. That will balance out the increase in stats to come with 6.0.

[JennyFlynn]

(Bold my emphasis.) Yes, that's what I think that means.

Well, in that case, I pray you're right. I would be ecstatic.

[Dracofish]

Lana at least has shown signs to the contrary even right back in the SoR prelude when you speak to her in the cantina and she mentions that at one point she considered joining the revenites. She also stated outright that the empire needed fixing and had planned on trying to do that from within. Unlike many in the empire Lana has no real drive to grab for power so with her I never thought it was as big a stretch that she would work with the republic then I did Theron working with the empire. I can see that he might remain with a LS char to try and repair or better the empire but I just couldnt see him at all staying with a DS character with a thrist for power. Lana sits on the edge between dark and light, Theron has limits to what he will do.

 

Theron has a dark side that I think a lot of people miss, especially if they haven't read his companion media. Hell, he's willing to kill his father for the Outlander. Does that mean he's all out for throwing severed heads from the rooftops? No. But still, he's not afraid to get his hands dirty...and he has a lot of blood on them.

 

And it is possible to be a moderately dark Sith and still be pragmatic and not be a power-grabbing monster. Just look at Marr. He in no way wanted to be emperor. In many ways, my canon Outlander, a Darth Nox, is very much like him. She's not afraid to make light-sided choices if it seems right...and she's also not afraid to dial things to eleven if needbe to get the job done.

 

That being said, I still don't see either of them (Lana or Theron) being overly interested in crushing their respective former factions into the dirt (or even their new ones...they've grown beyond that). And I hope it doesn't come to that. I hope we keep the Alliance and we're just following through with the decision that was made on Iokath. Because my Sith are so not bowing down to Acina. Nope, nope, nopers.

Edited March 31, 2018 by Dracofish

[Neulwen]

I'm SOOOO happy they are finally going back to Rep vs Imp! That is something I was hoping for. I always hated this Alliance and Eternal stuff and to me it never happened. Thank you!!!

 

So then we will hopefully get a separate story for Imps and Reps. I really wish they would go back to class-specific stories as well. Or at least put in enough variations so that for instance Force users get to do Force stuff (like Force jump) in the story, and non-Force users get to use tech. The latest stories are so streamlined that they make all our chars look like noobs. I want to see my characters be awesome again.

 

I agree that bringing back expertise seems counter-productive.

 

And I agree that it is high time for new datacrons, but only vanilla/Makeb style crons :].

 

Also I hope they add a new warzone. Perhaps a king of the hill type map, or objective escort, or a second horizontal huttball.

 

And 8v8 ranked might be back omg niiice!

Edited March 31, 2018 by Neulwen

[StormForceDax]

I still think that if its Sith vs Jedi again (Republic vs Imperial) it's like taking a step backwards and just going over old ground. I wonder how they will sort out companions if that happens? Still it's good that a 6.0 is being talked about now by BW. Not that it will stop the game is dying threads going forward. Probably be a new one by Monday morning. Edited March 31, 2018 by StormForceDax

[Farferello]

Ugh. Oh joy, Republic v Empire.

 

So what are my Imp's who sided with the Republic supposed to do? Forget Iokath ever happened? Pretend it was a dream? At least one of the three would refuse to have anything to do with the Empire again, so I guess I'll just throw him in the trash heap.

[Cawyden]

I think the best way to solve this is to not disband the alliance but to keep it - we already sided with Rep or Imp in Iokath. We can still have Rep vs. Imp by keeping the alliance. The alliance will then fight with the Rep or Imp side against the other faction.

 

But this would prevent a lot of problems that would otherwise come up for example for players who support not their original faction and companions who are faction specific (like Elara or Quinn).

[Eanelinea]

This is why I have no love for those who kill companions. Because sometimes you'll never hear from them in the story for those who never killed them or they make their appearance slight.

 

I didn't kill any love interests, so hopefully, Bioware if you're watching this thread, please include our romanced companions and don't forget them. I'll take small scenes like what we got in KOTFE and KOTET with Theron, Jorgan and Torian. (I don't know about the females because I tend to romance men, on male and female characters)

[AngFour]

I don't want Iokath to be the qualifier because my characters tried to remain neutral throughout and gave/sided with both. How were THEY supposed to know that Jace and Acina were going to be the ones holding the Idiot Ball on Iokath, thus getting them killed? My agent sided with the Empire THAT ONE TIME. (And had I known what the Empire did to Vector and the Killks I wouldn't have chosen them, wanting to see if things turned out differently from my JK's play through be dammed.)

 

Honestly, I think the other person should also die to level the playing field. And then, going forward, the plot will present ANOTHER Iokath type situation and THAT one will determine which side you're on now.

 

That would be awesome, so Bioware won't do it. But seriously, why can't they implement a "Betrayal Quest" of sorts, thus allowing our characters to switch to that faction? Nobody knew that Iokath would turn out the way it did and it would be unfair of Bioware to be like, "Hey, remember that choice we forced you into well over a year ago? Well we just pulled a new story out of our rear ends and that arbitrary choice is the sticking point. Doesn't matter that we railroaded you into the Red or Blue choice, or that you've helped both sides up to that point, now you have to suffer the consequences. Because Choices Matter™ even though WE wren't sure where we were going with the story!"

 

That would be much more palatable.

[Cawyden]

Regarding Theron kill option:

 

I do have the impression that there is no kill option. Charles thinks that if he tells us that we can kill or not kill Theron that this would give us information about the story.

 

Let's say there is no kill option. It could of course mean that he is going to be killed regardless and the player has no choice about that. But as Theron is a LI and companion I don't see that happening. Other reason that feels more likely in my opinion is that there is no need to kill him because he wasn't working against the alliance.

 

I think if Charles had just confirmed a kill option it would not give something about the story away. Because even if Theron is not a traitor people would maybe still like to kill him for not telling the Commander about his plans. So a kill option does not mean he is a traitor or that he is not a traitor so not really giving the story away.

 

So saying there is no kill option would be more of a spoiler compared to no kill option.

 

Of course, that does not mean there is no kill option - it is just the impression I got while watching the stream.

[Eanelinea]

I don't want Iokath to be the qualifier because my characters tried to remain neutral throughout and gave/sided with both. How were THEY supposed to know that Jace and Acina were going to be the ones holding the Idiot Ball on Iokath, thus getting them killed? My agent sided with the Empire THAT ONE TIME. (And had I known what the Empire did to Vector and the Killks I wouldn't have chosen them, wanting to see if things turned out differently from my JK's play through be dammed.)

 

Honestly, I think the other person should also die to level the playing field. And then, going forward, the plot will present ANOTHER Iokath type situation and THAT one will determine which side you're on now.

 

That would be awesome, so Bioware won't do it. But seriously, why can't they implement a "Betrayal Quest" of sorts, thus allowing our characters to switch to that faction? Nobody knew that Iokath would turn out the way it did and it would be unfair of Bioware to be like, "Hey, remember that choice we forced you into well over a year ago? Well we just pulled a new story out of our rear ends and that arbitrary choice is the sticking point. Doesn't matter that we railroaded you into the Red or Blue choice, or that you've helped both sides up to that point, now you have to suffer the consequences. Because Choices Matter™ even though WE wren't sure where we were going with the story!"

 

That would be much more palatable.

 

I tend to agree. Although, for me personally, I chose the side they were JUST in case it affected my romanced companions returning to me. So my Smuggler, JK, JC and Trooper stuck with the Republic, and my SW, SI, Agent, and BH stuck with the Empire side.

 

Though, they probably will have you have to side with whatever faction you chose during Iokath. So if someone took their SW through Iokath and sided with the Republic, they might be stuck with the Republic from here on out. On one hand that makes sense, on the other it kind of doesn't.

 

But I've learned, especially since doing KOTFE, KOTET, and Iokath, any and all decisions WILL be remembered and WILL affect your future play style.

 

So for anyone who thinks/thought their decisions don't/didn't matter, BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU CHOOSE FROM THE DIALOGUE WHEEL. Because it seems ever since KOTFE, the game and companions/npcs WILL remember everything you do.

[AngFour]

I tend to agree. Although, for me personally, I chose the side they were JUST in case it affected my romanced companions returning to me. So my Smuggler, JK, JC and Trooper stuck with the Republic, and my SW, SI, Agent, and BH stuck with the Empire side.

 

 

The ONLY reason why my Agent sided with the Empire is because I, as the player, didn't trust Bioware enough and thought that they would completely disregard Vector's general light sided attitude and just go, "Imperial companions for Imperial players, we don't care about their characterizations." I thought this because Charles, way back when Iokath was announced, mentioned that someone like Felix Irreso would be upset if you joined the Empire.

 

But now that Vector pretty much gave the Empire the bird and declared himself and the remaining Killiks for the Commander only (thus a neutral faction), I feel gypped and really, REALLY wish that I had chosen the Republic now that I know that Vector wouldn't actually care (or matter in the story as a whole seeing as he's only available for the Agents).

 

Part of me hopes/wishes that Vector returning only for Agents and 6.0 moving back to Imp vs. Pub allows for Agents to choose the opposing faction, if they wished to, without losing their vanilla love interest. So I have this vague wish that there will be another option.

 

I mean, I can live with the Empire, I suppose. If my agent were a real person she'd figure, "Better an enemy I know." She knows where she stands in the Empire, whereas with the Republic she would never, ever be trusted no matter how many light sided points she had. It's not a deal breaker for me, I just wish/hope they provide an elegant solution other than just relying on the Iokath choice.

[Eanelinea]

The ONLY reason why my Agent sided with the Empire is because I, as the player, didn't trust Bioware enough and thought that they would completely disregard Vector's general light sided attitude and just go, "Imperial companions for Imperial players, we don't care about their characterizations." I thought this because Charles, way back when Iokath was announced, mentioned that someone like Felix Irreso would be upset if you joined the Empire.

 

But now that Vector pretty much gave the Empire the bird and declared himself and the remaining Killiks for the Commander only (thus a neutral faction), I feel gypped and really, REALLY wish that I had chosen the Republic now that I know that Vector wouldn't actually care (or matter in the story as a whole seeing as he's only available for the Agents).

 

Part of me hopes/wishes that Vector returning only for Agents and 6.0 moving back to Imp vs. Pub allows for Agents to choose the opposing faction, if they wished to, without losing their vanilla love interest. So I have this vague wish that there will be another option.

 

I mean, I can live with the Empire, I suppose. If my agent were a real person she'd figure, "Better an enemy I know." She knows where she stands in the Empire, whereas with the Republic she would never, ever be trusted no matter how many light sided points she had. It's not a deal breaker for me, I just wish/hope they provide an elegant solution other than just relying on the Iokath choice.

 

I hear you. Hell, technically, I wanted my pub toons to side with the Empire because the entire family is more loyal to the empire than to the republic. But game play wise, I chose what they were in vanilla because I didn't know if my companions and/or love interests would come back if I'd chosen the opposite faction. Look at Dorne. If you're a trooper, good or bad, and sided with the Empire, whether as you being a female, or her husband, she will drop kick your *** to the curb for siding with the Empire. Or if you're dark and killed jorgan and maybe some other things, but sided with the republic, she still drop kicks you to the curb.

 

I didn't want that happening to me. So I understand why you chose Empire for your Agent, I had the same fears and wanted my agent's husband back. My smuggler chose Republic because Corso doesn't like the Empire. But I as the player, didn't know if he'd still come back or if he'd dump me for choosing to side with the Empire.

 

I would say, just for future consideration, if you're not sure how your normal companions or love interest would react, try to remember how they were in the story, how they acted with your being light/dark, and that anything relating to KOTFE and after, is now remembered. It's not like in Vanilla where you could cuss out your companions, or kill everything and be dark 20 million and the companion/LI would stay with you. Now companions can and could leave you.

 

Look at Koth. Look at Dorne. I'd say look at Quinn, but he'll leave the Empire if you are a SW and side with the Republic whether you romance him or not.

[Paulsutherland]

Okay, rethinking this ...

 

(spoiler boxes to avoid a wall of text)

 

6.0

 

 

Yay ... more content!

 

 

Imp vs Pub

 

 

There have been two opportunities from the start of KOTFE up until now to do something Imp vs Pub themed.

 

* The First, during Chapter 4 of KOTFE, Lana says the Imps and Pubs are still fighting one another while Arcann does nothing. You could of had a plot on the side that focused on Imp vs Pub while the KOTFE stuff was going on.

 

* The next on Iokath, you could of done a full out war for Iokath, but instead it got pushed aside for Theron's arc and some giant robots. (All the cool stuff is being referenced by Theron and Lana at the start of the Theron Flashpoints.)

 

You've also created a scenario where the opposing faction is having a resource and leadership crises ( Republic ), so, if we're going to war, the opposing faction is going to be at a major disadvantage against your allied faction and the Alliance. (announcement during the Copero flashpoint)

 

Is this new war going to be flashpoints with alternated imperial ore republic npcs depending on your faction choice? (or if your in a group, the group leaders choice?)

 

 

5.9

 

 

I don't see how you're going to finish this arc with a single flashpoint, you've got a lot of unanswered questions from KOTFE/ET and Iokath.

 

-Why did Theron betray us?

-Why didn't he tell us his plan?

-What is Zildrog?

-What's on Nathema?

-What is the goal of the Order of Zildrog?

-Why did they start a war between the Alliance, Empire & Republic?

-Why did he give the location of a super weapon to the Zildrog nutjobs?

 

 

Theron Shan

 

 

You've put this character into his own grave ... unless he's got a really good answer for his actions, I want that kill option!

 

- Uprisings: It's implied in one of the lore entries that a person with cybernetic implants fed information to one of the rogue groups attacking the Alliance (can't recall which one this is) ... So Theron gave them information that got Alliance personnel killed?

 

- War for Iokath: Theron helped start a war on Iokath between the three main factions? I'm assuming on the instructions from the Zildrog guys so they could operate unopposed. They nearly killed us? Had it not of been for the fleet we would have died. Not to mention he's caused more deaths to the Alliance and it's allied faction.

 

- Umbara: Theron tried to kill us and Lana by causing the train to crash? In doing so causing bad relations between the Umbarans and the Alliance. Then at the end is welcomed into the order ... okay ... so if he's welcomed I guess that means he's not being forced by them?

 

- Copero: This one signed his death certificate for me. Not only did he cause tension between the Chiss Ascendency and the Alliance, he also gave the location of another 'super weapon' to the Zildrog Order ... Why? By the way the dialog from the masked figure was delivered, they didn't even know where it was?! So I assume Theron needs this 'super weapon' for reasons unknown and the Order is in a position to acquire it for him?

 

- Motive: I still think there is something wrong with the player, and somehow Theron became aware of it ... If not ... then why hasn't he told us?

 

- Death Option: Every killable companion has died for less than what Theron has just done ... so ... again ... if he lacks a good reason ... his body will be going over the corpse balcony.

 

(He can have a 'get out of jail' card if he brings back Darth Marr and or Vaylin.)

 

 

Returning Companions

 

 

If we're going back to Imp vs Pub, is that going to effect certain companions? Like Zenith who is very anti-empire? or Kira? etc

 

 

Lana Beniko

 

 

If she turns out to be part of this plot and has been working with Theron from the start ... She can join Theron in death or exile!

 

 

Eternal Alliance

 

 

As I said in one of my grumpy posts at the start of this thread, I really couldn't care less about another Imp vs Pub conflict. I'm hoping we'll have the option to stay with the Alliance and leave the Empire and Republic to fight it out.

 

Even without the Eternal Fleet, the Alliance has sufficient forces to sustain itself without getting involved in another galactic conflict.

 

Edited March 31, 2018 by Paulsutherland

[AngFour]

 

I would say, just for future consideration, if you're not sure how your normal companions or love interest would react, try to remember how they were in the story, how they acted with your being light/dark, and that anything relating to KOTFE and after, is now remembered. It's not like in Vanilla where you could cuss out your companions, or kill everything and be dark 20 million and the companion/LI would stay with you. Now companions can and could leave you.

 

 

I know how Vector would have reacted. He would have been fine had I chosen the Republic (8 agents played. I'm pretty positive I know Vector better than any other companion). *I* know, but the writers for this game barely know how our characters work (look at the whole Ashara fiasco. Not a fan of killing companions, but a D5 Inquisitor would NEVER allow her to just walk away after claiming she was just as powerful as the Inquisitor).

 

It comes down to the writers not doing right by our characters OR the vanilla companions. There is no trust there, not from me anyway. So I toed the faction line to be on the safe side instead of organically making choices my character would have made. The Iokath choice kind of broke immersion for me because of my lack of trust in the writing team.

 

As I said the Iokath choice isn't a deal breaker for me. I just hope a different and better opportunity presents itself that's a bit more elegant than Iokath, which was a complete dumpster fire.

[Eshvara]

- Death Option: Every killable companion has died for less than what Theron has just done ... so ... again ... if he lacks a good reason ...

[/Quote]

This is a good point. What's a good reason to you?