Server Merge Discussion Thread

[DarthScruffy]

So long. Don't let the log-out screen hit you in the posterior on the way out.

 

That seems to be physically impossible.

[AscendingSky]

There are no RP servers anymore. I currently play on TEH purely because it's the #1 east coast server (and because rep side pvp qs aren't hopeless). TEH is not well populated at the moment; most group activity qs are long or nonexistant. If TEH doesn't get more source servers (not just JM) it will become the low pop East Coast server. When that happens ppl like me will leave it and it will be where BC is now if not much worse in very little time.

 

I don't know what fictional Ebon Hawk server you're playing on, but I've been playing on it for five straight years now and I don't have these issues. You can get PvP pops pretty much all day (regs at least, I don't play ranked because I'm too much of a PvP scrub). Even GSF pops regularly during prime time (and most of the day when it's highlighted in Galactic Command), which is something most servers can't claim! The only time I have really long wait times in the group finder is when I'm trying to queue a DPS character in the middle of the night.

 

Sounds to me like people saying queue pops are 'taking too long' on Ebon Hawk really mean 'don't pop within less than five minutes all day every day'. That's not a reasonable standard to hold every server to--especially an RP server, where a lot of people are, guess what, busy roleplaying during primetime and are therefore never going to be available as LFG fodder.

Edited June 11, 2017 by AscendingSky

[Ratajack]

Concur. Cross-server is more of a pipe dream than a reality. Meanwhile the servers that were once lakes are now small pools. Someone popping in to check on the games health will most likely arrive on a server with a very light population and right then and there know it's not worth re-subbing.

 

We hear a lot from the RP'ers on this thread but at one time there were other types like Progression Raiders and PVP Guilds. It would be a shame to think that their voice has gone out in the SWTOR Universe and that we are only making accommodations for the remaining subset.

 

Given that there are only three servers that really could be "very light population, specifically the old PVP servers, that would mean that new players have a greater than 50% chance, and almost a 66% chance of picking a server other than the old PVP servers.

 

How does a greater than 50% chance of not picking those old PVP servers equate to "new players will most likely arrive on a server with a very light population"?

[DenariusJay]

That seems to be physically impossible.

 

I sat on my monitor skin to screen and logged out. I suppose that's about as close as possible.

[Ratajack]

I don't know what fictional Ebon Hawk server you're playing on, but I've been playing on it for five straight years now and I don't have these issues. You can get PvP pops pretty much all day. Even GSF pops regularly during prime time (and most of the day when it's highlighted in Galactic Command), which is something most servers can't claim! The only time I have really long wait times in the group finder is when I'm trying to queue a DPS character in the middle of the night.

 

Sounds to me like people saying queue pops are 'taking too long' on Ebon Hawk really mean 'don't pop within less than five minutes all day every day'. That's not a reasonable standard to hold every server to--especially an RP server, where a lot of people are, guess what, busy roleplaying during primetime and are therefore never going to be available as LFG fodder.

 

I'm noticing that it seems to exclusively those advocating server merges that claim that they "never get pops" or "have to wait an eternity" for them, no matter what server is specifically being discussed.

 

Yet, we have plenty of people from almost every server who get frequent queue pops for most group activities, and have no problem doing the group content they choose to do.

 

I wonder why so many of those who demand server merges claim to have such a disparate experience with regards to the LFG tool.

 

It couldn't possibly be that they were over-exaggerating or being "less than honest" in a vain and not-too-subtle effort to justify their demands for server merges, could it? No, that couldn't be it. This is the internet where everyone is completely and totally honest, right?

[Ratajack]

That seems to be physically impossible.

 

Then I guess you don't have to worry about it, then.

 

You can just log out and move on as you claimed you would.

[MeNaCe-NZ]

So you are saying those of us who would be forced to merge are SOL? I don't quite think that's fair and I do believe that would hurt subscriptions even more. I honestly wouldn't want to deal with having to buy all those legacy cargo slots again, not to mention dropping 10+ mil on another yavin 4 stronghold, (and now there's talk of yet another stronghold in the works -_-)

 

Stop right there and read posts properly before you let your emotions get the better of you...

 

No, the problems should be sorted so people aren't put out via losses. Compensation just because "I didn't want to merge" though is just silly.

 

IF you actually did lose out on things then yes compensation or a fix should be put in.

 

This is the whole problem with a few posters in this thread, they aren't actually reading posts properly and they are running around with their hair in fore thinking everyone wants to merge them and stuff the consequences. Funny thing is - that's basely not true.

 

Stick to the facts people and stop the strawman nonsense that is becoming highly prevalent in this thread.

 

And btw they are ALWAYS going to break something. That's kinda silly and naive to think otherwise so no need to say anything .

 

No it's silly and naïve to use that as reasoning for not doing something that would benefit the game. I mean by that logic, as I mentioned, it would be as though you are saying they shouldn't ever do or try to improve anything because it might break something else - that's silly.

 

Also I get that this engine is a code nightmare, but WoW had the ability for cross server queueing and it is an older game. I'm willing to bet they can at least attempt to make a system that's capable of doing it. They've added quite alot as it is so I don't see how this would be an impossible system.

 

This is a server merge topic not a cross server topic - if cross server was a possibility still they would have pointed that out for discussion as opposed to merges.

[DarthScruffy]

You can just log out and move on as you claimed you would.

 

They need to have a population plan by the end of Gods or sooner.

 

They're on the clock.

[ivanhedgehog]

It's usually the fact that they won't want to pay to move. They could easily. It's only 90cc per character or about $1 per character. But say they have 50 characters for example. That would still be $50 or 4,500 cc.

 

or they have a 150million+ credit flagship

[ivanhedgehog]

I'm noticing that it seems to exclusively those advocating server merges that claim that they "never get pops" or "have to wait an eternity" for them, no matter what server is specifically being discussed.

 

Yet, we have plenty of people from almost every server who get frequent queue pops for most group activities, and have no problem doing the group content they choose to do.

 

I wonder why so many of those who demand server merges claim to have such a disparate experience with regards to the LFG tool.

 

It couldn't possibly be that they were over-exaggerating or being "less than honest" in a vain and not-too-subtle effort to justify their demands for server merges, could it? No, that couldn't be it. This is the internet where everyone is completely and totally honest, right?

I wonder how many of those people are on a lot of ignore lists.

[BlackSilverRoar]

I'm noticing that it seems to exclusively those advocating server merges that claim that they "never get pops" or "have to wait an eternity" for them, no matter what server is specifically being discussed.

 

Yet, we have plenty of people from almost every server who get frequent queue pops for most group activities, and have no problem doing the group content they choose to do.

 

I wonder why so many of those who demand server merges claim to have such a disparate experience with regards to the LFG tool.

 

It couldn't possibly be that they were over-exaggerating or being "less than honest" in a vain and not-too-subtle effort to justify their demands for server merges, could it? No, that couldn't be it. This is the internet where everyone is completely and totally honest, right?

 

^Ratajack nailed it again.

 

With all the holes in the Pro-merger argument, it can't walk when it's crucified.

Edited June 11, 2017 by Willjb

[fushnchips]

Also another reason why I say 5 RP servers instead of 6 is because of location. If you make just 1 RP server on the west coast, you are now affecting connection and lag for those on the east coast. And Vice versa for those on the west coast.

 

You have to take I to account player location. There are RPers outside of both NA and EU like Australia for example. So there needs to be RP servers kept in their current location. The only change I can see would be combining the two east RP servers I to one.

 

But if RPers feel they should be combined with a non RP server or even have a server just on the West or East they would know best.

 

Either way they should still be kept on their own server no matter what. No an instance won't help and not having them will not make much of a difference for non RPers on queue pops.

 

How can you do 5 RP servers when the current 3 are in a bad way Jung Ma is a wreck, BC hardly has anything, but Ebok hawk is alive and well and this is why merge all into The Ebon Hawk but 5 lol even for EU servers you would be lucky to even require 2 at most

 

Now before you try and use the ping excuse I play from New Zealand and everything can be done on any server with the ping I have so then that's not an issue and for an RP server even though some RP players do group content it's not going to do anything that will make it impossible to play that content end of the day the engine was outdated when the game was released and that's what can only fix most of the issues within SWTOR but this nonsense about requiring RP tell that to the community on Jung Ma and BC because it seems they never got the memo that RP servers are a must.

[Lecto]

As someone playing on a dead server (POT5), it is my opinion that one of four things need to happen: sever merges, mega servers, decreased sub prices for dead servers, or cross sever Que. Anything that does not fall into those categories will not be acceptable to my guild -- Tao Covenant. Honestly, we've debated filing a joint complaint with the BBB on multiple occasions. Unless we hear some kind of communication soon this option is till on the table.

 

As it stands, we cannot play half the game on our sever. PvP only pops once or twice a week for a couple hours when guilds make it pop, & GSF never pops -- ever. As a result, I can count the amount of times I've PvP'd this year on my hands....which is a shame because I used to PvP & GSF a great deal back in the day.

 

Bottom line, we shouldn't have to pay full price to play the game when we don't have full access to it on our server. I personally would have migrated long ago, but my guild refuses to leave our guild property (flagship, decos, bank, & etc). I don't care if I loose all my toon names.....I just want to be able to play the game again......please for the love of god do something. I've been here since Beta & all I do is raid log because I can't play the game the way I want anymore. I literally don't care about anything else this game does until sever populations are addressed in a meaningful way.

 

We needed sever mergers after the casual raiding crowd died after "Shadow of Revan", let alone now or during the travesty that was "story story story". I don't want to be a jerk, but it's EAs fault my server is that way it is, & asking me to pay to remedy the problem is offensive to say the least -- mismanagement.

Edited June 11, 2017 by Lecto
errors

[DWho]

I've read a few pages of this discussion and boy it's getting ugly here. Enhance your calm folks not worth getting all grrrrr over.

 

I do have a question that has plagued me. For all those pro merger people, why don't you just move to a server that serves your needs? Last time I checked, cost of transfer wasn't that pricey.

 

That question has never been answered by the pro server merge crowd in any clear way that I have seen. What I have heard are the following

 

1) My numerous characters are trapped on Server X and I can't move them because it costs too much.

 

easy fix here, free character transfers

 

2) My guild is stuck on Server X and can't transfer to a new server

 

same as above, free transfers should clear that up. Concern about guild assets is a legitimate concern but if the whole guild wants to move that should be less of a problem than a guild that does not want to move. And the same concern about guild assets would exist with a server merger.

 

3) I'll lose my character name if I voluntarily transfer

 

yes, and in a server merger, a lot more people will lose their name. Which is more valuable to you, being on a server that suits your needs or your character name.

 

4) the game looks dead to players logging in to the game for the first time

 

Another simple fix. Prevent initial character creation (first character created only) on any server but the "high" population server. Give said character 1 free transfer in case they decide they don't like playing on that server.

 

5) all the other servers are dead/dying/hurting

 

A subjective statement and what difference does it make to you if you are already on one of the servers you like. Bioware is the only one that should determine whether a server is viable since they are the only ones with all the necessary data.

 

This thread is about how to solve population issues. A server merger is only one way to do so. Why are alternatives not acceptable. If there are more concerns about voluntary transfers please let's discuss them.

[Ratajack]

They're on the clock.

 

As I expected, threats and posturing, but nothing of substance and no action to "back it up".

[Ratajack]

I wonder how many of those people are on a lot of ignore lists.

 

That is a point I have brought up many times.

 

Given the attitudes that many of those people show in the forums, I would not be surprised if they had made the ignore list of every person with whom they had been grouped. That would not leave a lot of people left with they could be randomly grouped, would it?

 

I'm also going to go out on a limb and guess that even if BW did merge servers, it would not be long at all before those same people would end up on the ignore lists of most of the incoming players as well, leaving them right back where they are now.

 

Of course, it will all be BW's fault, or the fault of all the other players, though.

[HuaRya]

Looks like Revelation Online knows the benefits of a larger merged server. Look what they announced yesterday. It follows the same logic SWTOR staff used back when the first mergers occurred.

 

The last few months have been exciting for Revelation Online and its community. We’ve added new features and continue to polish the game, we’re constantly looking to ensure a high-quality game play experience for our community. Recent upgrades to our servers and upcoming localization's of the game will be making population merges are necessary and a very positive event for the community. Merges will take place on June 14th!

 

Increased server capacity

 

We have made huge improvements into our server infrastructure to ensure stability and capacity. Our servers can now efficiently host many more players than they originally could. A large and well-populated server has the highest benefits for the community: It allows for more opportunities for old and new players to have more competitors in PvP content be that in Battlegrounds, Clan Wars, Guild Tournaments and even open-world PvP. Players who enjoy PvE content such as raids and dungeons will be able to find groups much more easily for larger and harder content such as the 20-man instances.

And their Q&A

 

Why was the decision to merge the servers made?

Opening new and merging old servers is a common practice in MMO games when a server’s population isn’t high enough to complete server-wide activities. It creates an additional incentive for the players, because they find themselves in a fresh game environment, where they can meet new friends and worthy opponents. We will continue to monitor the servers’ population and regularly merge them, as well as open new ones, keeping the players entertained.

 

What is a server merge?

Server merge is a process of transferring all the characters from one server to another. During the merge the characters from server servername1 will be transferred to server servername2.

 

What steps should the players take in preparation for the merge?

There aren’t any. All servers will go down for maintenance, after which servers Corral, Eventide, Muroc and Tusenwood will be removed from the list of available servers, and all the characters from that server will be transferred to their respective server which was previously mentioned within this article.

 

What will happen to Moonsea, Tidewater, Darkfall and Snowpine?

They will experience an influx of players. This may affect players’ rating, and also characters’ names, in cases where they will coincide with characters’ names from their previous server.

 

Will I keep all my characters from their original server?

You will get to keep all of your characters and they will be moved over with transfer which takes place during the server merge. This will include your character's level, experience, all other attributes, as well as all of their items and funds within their inventory.

Will I keep the items I have on the auction during the merge and the items and money I have in my mail?

Yes. All the mail will be transferred over, and all of the items that are currently on auction at the time of the merge will automatically be moved over to the auction on the merged server.

 

Will my Friends, Enemies, Journeyman Alliances, significant others be transferred?

Yes, all of the information from within the friends system will be transferred.

 

Will my guild, its progress and its membership be transferred?

Yes. All of the information within the guild system will be transferred.

 

Will rankings and guild rankings be reset?

Yes. Rankings and guild rankings will be reset.

 

Will guild alliances be transferred?

Yes. Guild alliances will be transferred.

 

Will conquered Territories for the week be transferred?

No. After the merge and until the next clan war battle all the territories will belong to no one.

 

Will Guild Tournament be reset?

Yes. The Guild Tournament will be reset.

 

What will happen to the Chronicle after the merge?

After the merge the server will use the main servers Chronicle and all of the characters transferred to the server will be able to play in accordance to that server’s progress as well. Progress will stack between servers. If Moonsea for example had 50 people on the Cultivation Seal, and Corral had 20, this will give a total of 70 on Moonsea once the merge takes

place.

 

Will I keep my achievements?

Yes, all of your achievements will be saved.

 

What will happen in cases where the character’s name coincide?

In cases where two character names from different servers have the same name, the character of higher level and experience will keep their name and the other character will be prompted to choose a new name upon first log-in. In cases where characters are of the same level, the character with more accumulated experience will get to keep their name, and if character have the same experience accumulated the person from the server which is being merged into the main server will be required to change their name.

Example: Person 1 from Moonsea has ‘Mute’ chosen as a name, Person 2 from Corral has the same name, with the same level and experience accumulated. The person from Corral will be requested to change their name as their server is being merged into Moonsea.

 

[AscendingSky]

Looks like Revelation Online knows the benefits of a larger merged server. Look what they announced yesterday. It follows the same logic SWTOR staff used back when the first mergers occurred.

 

 

And their Q&A

 

Why was the decision to merge the servers made?

Opening new and merging old servers is a common practice in MMO games when a server’s population isn’t high enough to complete server-wide activities. It creates an additional incentive for the players, because they find themselves in a fresh game environment, where they can meet new friends and worthy opponents. We will continue to monitor the servers’ population and regularly merge them, as well as open new ones, keeping the players entertained.

 

What is a server merge?

Server merge is a process of transferring all the characters from one server to another. During the merge the characters from server servername1 will be transferred to server servername2.

 

What steps should the players take in preparation for the merge?

There aren’t any. All servers will go down for maintenance, after which servers Corral, Eventide, Muroc and Tusenwood will be removed from the list of available servers, and all the characters from that server will be transferred to their respective server which was previously mentioned within this article.

 

What will happen to Moonsea, Tidewater, Darkfall and Snowpine?

They will experience an influx of players. This may affect players’ rating, and also characters’ names, in cases where they will coincide with characters’ names from their previous server.

 

Will I keep all my characters from their original server?

You will get to keep all of your characters and they will be moved over with transfer which takes place during the server merge. This will include your character's level, experience, all other attributes, as well as all of their items and funds within their inventory.

Will I keep the items I have on the auction during the merge and the items and money I have in my mail?

Yes. All the mail will be transferred over, and all of the items that are currently on auction at the time of the merge will automatically be moved over to the auction on the merged server.

 

Will my Friends, Enemies, Journeyman Alliances, significant others be transferred?

Yes, all of the information from within the friends system will be transferred.

 

Will my guild, its progress and its membership be transferred?

Yes. All of the information within the guild system will be transferred.

 

Will rankings and guild rankings be reset?

Yes. Rankings and guild rankings will be reset.

 

Will guild alliances be transferred?

Yes. Guild alliances will be transferred.

 

Will conquered Territories for the week be transferred?

No. After the merge and until the next clan war battle all the territories will belong to no one.

 

Will Guild Tournament be reset?

Yes. The Guild Tournament will be reset.

 

What will happen to the Chronicle after the merge?

After the merge the server will use the main servers Chronicle and all of the characters transferred to the server will be able to play in accordance to that server’s progress as well. Progress will stack between servers. If Moonsea for example had 50 people on the Cultivation Seal, and Corral had 20, this will give a total of 70 on Moonsea once the merge takes

place.

 

Will I keep my achievements?

Yes, all of your achievements will be saved.

 

What will happen in cases where the character’s name coincide?

In cases where two character names from different servers have the same name, the character of higher level and experience will keep their name and the other character will be prompted to choose a new name upon first log-in. In cases where characters are of the same level, the character with more accumulated experience will get to keep their name, and if character have the same experience accumulated the person from the server which is being merged into the main server will be required to change their name.

Example: Person 1 from Moonsea has ‘Mute’ chosen as a name, Person 2 from Corral has the same name, with the same level and experience accumulated. The person from Corral will be requested to change their name as their server is being merged into Moonsea.

 

From reading the part of their FAQ you posted... looks like RO is guaranteeing the maintenance of all character and guild assets save names. EAWare has not offered the same guarantees. Therefore, you are comparing apples to oranges. They both might be fruit that grow on trees, but that doesn't make them the same thing.

Edited June 12, 2017 by AscendingSky

[DownloadStarter]

Hey folks,

 

We recently removed a thread related to the topic of server merges. This thread was removed because of numerous rule violations contained within it. Since we know this conversation is important to you, I am remaking this as the centralized thread for that discussion. Although we don't have anything to discuss right now on this topic, we want to continue to get your feedback and thoughts on it. Please keep it coming!

 

A few rule reminders:

• Discussion of moderation is not permitted.
  
• Please remain respectful of other forum users. Disagreement and discussion is fine, personal attacks are not.
  

 

Thanks everyone.

 

-eric

 

Fix your login server issues first before deciding whether or not to merge anything, please. Thank you.

 

(By "fix" I mean "for more than two weeks".)

[bncsmom]

My thoughts are forget the "East Coast/West Coast" servers. I don't think they're really necessary. Combine both North American RP servers into one, combine the PvE servers into one, and the PvP servers into one. Then, do away with PvP instances of planets, bring back the old system of allowing us to flag ourselves on non PvP servers so that the PvP server can actually have a population.

[fushnchips]

From reading the part of their FAQ you posted... looks like RO is guaranteeing the maintenance of all character and guild assets save names. EAWare has not offered the same guarantees. Therefore, you are comparing apples to oranges. They both might be fruit that grow on trees, but that doesn't make them the same thing.

 

whats the big deal about losing a name ? I see nothing wrong with it because no matter what name I use it's still me as a player and guild mates know it's me.

[Kaveat]

Might help if this new data-center did not have more issues than Packard Bell (eMachines)...

 

been nothing but one issue after another since the move

[DWho]

whats the big deal about losing a name ? I see nothing wrong with it because no matter what name I use it's still me as a player and guild mates know it's me.

 

Losing names is by far the smallest issue that has been raised (important to some but probably not "deal breaking"). There are much higher priority issues that have been discussed.

[Regans]

As a senior officer in one of the larger Shadowlands Guilds we have many concerns about server merges.

 

I for one am all for merging smaller servers into larger ones - we are reaching low populations on many servers these days and lets face it, if we want to continue to have any pvp or pve group content we need merges.

 

That being said here are some of the prevailing issues:

 

Character names - who gets em

 

Guild names - should be less of an issue but if a pre-merger is announced someone could create and use guild names and then try and ransom the larger guilds who get merged in to a new server

 

Guild assets - we for example have unlocked both our Imp and Pub ships and have spent literally billions decorating and setting it up. I for one can tell you that we would simply give up if those assets are not transferred in their entirety to any new merged server.

 

Personal Assets - currently if you transfer a server your legacy goes with you but your unlocks for strongholds only transfer if you used CCs. Many of us have used credits - again like the guild assets if these are not unlocked and assets transferred in their entirety ppl will simply quit.

 

I am all for the merging of our shrinking player base to keep the lights on at this point, Bioware overall needs to wake up and realize that a boss every three or 4 months is not keeping folks, giving me old companions back is NOT new content, when old games like DDO put out full expansions with new raids and open areas on a game taht is twice as old as this one, when CCP is still pumping out nerfs and changes to their ever evolving space sage EvE - what do we get? a new cartel pack and a boss every 4 months. I have tried to be subbed since this game started....but even I am growing tired of the lack of new content. Merges will probably give this some more time but it will only matter in the long term if Bioware adds something exciting and new to the game, and gives regular significant content updates.

[AscendingSky]

whats the big deal about losing a name ? I see nothing wrong with it because no matter what name I use it's still me as a player and guild mates know it's me.

 

If you would kindly read what I actually posted you would see I was not complaining about a loss of names. I was saying RO was guaranteeing they would be preserving all character and guild assets in their merged servers except for names. Be more careful next time.