Server Merge Discussion Thread

[Soljin]

Cross server Group finder would be great, I think the problem is that Bioware actually mentioned they are unable to manage Cross server queues.

 

The server merger suggestions are a result of the feedback from Bioware that cross server interactions are not possible.

 

I would gladly support cross server queues if that were to be put back on the table...But last I read it was never and option and would never be an option.

[Icykill_]

4 mega servers:

 

US East

US West

Central Europe

Australia

 

All servers have 3 instances, pve, PvP, and rp.

 

I'd love an APAC located server again. I would have shouted from the roof tops 18 months ago if there was an inkling they might do it.

But now the population couldn't support an APAC server locatated in Australia. It wouldn't be much better that some of the other servers.

 

I would support an APAC server based in the US that has artificial lag added to anyone playing on it under 140ms, basically bolstered Ping to 150ms as a starting point. This has been done in other games where they "said" it was a regionally located server, when in fact it was all in the same server farm in the US. This would give people a pretty equal footing in regards to Ping.

Once again this is a pipe dream because we don't have enough population. But I'd sure love to try it 😉

[Darkside]

I'd love an APAC located server again. I would have shouted from the roof tops 18 months ago if there was an inkling they might do it.

But now the population couldn't support an APAC server locatated in Australia. It wouldn't be much better that some of the other servers.

 

I would support an APAC server based in the US that has artificial lag added to anyone playing on it under 140ms, basically bolstered Ping to 150ms as a starting point. This has been done in other games where they "said" it was a regionally located server, when in fact it was all in the same server farm in the US. This would give people a pretty equal footing in regards to Ping.

Once again this is a pipe dream because we don't have enough population. But I'd sure love to try it 😉

 

Well if Keith continues to do things right, there is a chance that there may be need for one.

[Icykill_]

As someone else mentioned, the server status data needs to be added back to the server login screen so new people don't roll on a server that isn't going to have enough people to play group content.

This could be done in a weekly patch and I can't see why it couldn't happen in the next few weeks.

 

Returning subscriber players who find that their old server can no longer support enough group content should be given free server transfers from those servers. With the previso that they can't create new toons on that server for for a period of time, maybe 3-6 months.

 

As mentioned by myself and some others, introduce a feature to transfer a whole legacy, all characters and strongholds in one move. People who have lots of open slots for alts have already paid a lot of real money for those, so it's not unreasonable for this to be free.

 

Let people vote with their feet. Have "open" free character and legacy transfers for 2-4 weeks. Do not allow people who transfer a toon or legacy for free to then be able to roll new toons on the old server for a period of time. This would stop people from creating a tonne of alts just so they could move them all and not pay for more character slots.

 

After the month is up, re-evaluate the server status and activity. If nothing has changed then I guess mergers might need to happen to give the impression the game is healthy from an outside perspective and for new people coming to the game.

 

I don't think it's only a vocal minority asking for mergers, the same as I don't think it's a vocal minority against mergers.

I think we all love this game and don't want it to fail. I think there are probably just as many in both camps who feel that there are only two choices, Merger or don't Merge.

But there are lots of other things to try first. Remember this is about having healthy populations for every player to be able to enjoy all aspects of the game, no matter what they enjoy playing.

 

In one of the old threads I had a running post that I kept updating with ideas and solutions to problems we face. It's a shame that's gone because it would be easy to just post them all here 😢

[Icykill_]

Well if Keith continues to do things right, there is a chance that there may be need for one.

 

I'll change my official religion to Jedi if that happens 😊

[WelbyWars]

People would not have to lose names if the game took into account Legacy names too. Unless someone is very unfortunate enough to have the same First AND Legacy name!?

 

Guild names? umm,...no clue,...date of creation gets priority? Losers get a free name change.

 

EB has at least 100 in fleet at prime time,..I can imagine Harby is the same or more. Imagine more servers mixed in and we got 300+ people running around fleet,..lol.

 

Unless they do instances, like Fleet1, Fleet2.

[kodrac]

As far as I can tell, the only advocates of the idea that all servers must be merged into one are Veruca Salt types who want faster queue pops NOW NOW NOW, who don't care whose toons and accounts get royally kriffed up and how many players would lose billions of credits and hundreds of dollars of real money investment in the game as a result. They just want to shave a minute or two off their queue pop time, that's all they care about. All of their arguments come back to that central point.

 

I wonder if they'd be willing to give up all of THEIR stuff to move to another server to get those faster queue pops themselves... or if they're only willing to advocate for other people to make that sacrifice for their benefit?

 

The solution is not server merges. The solution is cross-server queuing. We should all be pushing EAWare towards finding a way to make that work, so no one has to sacrifice anything and we all can stay where we want to play.

 

/applaud

[TUXs]

No amount of cheap/free transfer service is going to counter act the damage done by the perception that the game is dead. As I've said earlier in thread the thread, the amount of new and returning players is more financially important to the health of the game than the few remaining hold outs on the dead servers.

I could not agree more. Perception is reality.

[DWho]

I would agree with what Icy has said. I see little or no harm to waiting as much as 6 months (maybe to Jan of 2018, after the next Star Wars movie comes out) for a server merge.

 

Its summer time in the US so play time diminishes somewhat naturally. In the meantime give people the ability to move whole legacies (which should be as a one time deal to minimize abuse - or maybe a second time if mergers are to occur and the servers are known) to whatever server they want to play on and work on the issues that have been brought up regarding server merges so that if it is necessary, the impact on everyone can be minimized. If the merger headaches are minimized (generally speaking, the issues will be greatest for the people that have been around the longest since they will have the most to lose) support (or at least a reduction in opposition) would likely change.

 

I would also favor testing out the merger mechanics on a small server (maybe give the people there something extra for their participation in the test) before attempting it on the larger servers.

[kodrac]

Agreed. It's basically the one guy who accuses everyone else of being a liar just because they don't agree with him. I've already put him on ignore.

 

Same. Did that yesterday and reading through this thread has been much easier since.

[Icykill_]

I would agree with what Icy has said. I see little or no harm to waiting as much as 6 months (maybe to Jan of 2018, after the next Star Wars movie comes out) for a server merge.

 

Its summer time in the US so play time diminishes somewhat naturally. In the meantime give people the ability to move whole legacies (which should be as a one time deal to minimize abuse - or maybe a second time if mergers are to occur and the servers are known) to whatever server they want to play on and work on the issues that have been brought up regarding server merges so that if it is necessary, the impact on everyone can be minimized. If the merger headaches are minimized (generally speaking, the issues will be greatest for the people that have been around the longest since they will have the most to lose) support (or at least a reduction in opposition) would likely change.

 

I would also favor testing out the merger mechanics on a small server (maybe give the people there something extra for their participation in the test) before attempting it on the larger servers.

 

I think 6 months would be too long. They should be able to tell within 6 weeks of finishing the moves. So realistically we would be looking at 12weeks from the start of them opening up free transfers till they can finish evaluating if it had enough of an impact.

If it works, then great, we dodge a bullet till this time next year when they should revisit game population again.

If it doesn't work and we wait 6 months and it just keeps getting worse, there will be no game in January, at least no playable group content for a majority of players left.

My idea is a bandaid at best to stem the the game bleeding out. It's something they can implement relatively easy if they have the will power to take a leap of faith. But the idea will not completely solve the issue because as others have pointed out, there is also a perception issue.

The easiest and cheapest solutions are usually the best path to start with because there is less risk and they can say it was a test. I can't understand why they always have to do things in such a complicated and convoluted manner that must take more time and resources to implement and it's still not right.

If they can slow down the bleed there is more time to go through all the problems and concerns and form a working solution, wether that is merged servers or not. At least they'll have time to "dot" the i's and cross the t's.

[Savej]

...

2) A vocal minority keeps shouting that server merges are needed, as long as everyone merges onto their server.

...

 

I assure you: most mmo players want to play on busy servers. Just about every game company in the industry knows this and has mega or x-server or both. Go back and read BW posts from Eric or BW devs before the first merges or before f2p. BW knows full well that busy servers are good and dead ones are bad.

Edited June 8, 2017 by Savej

[EzioMessi]

A vocal minority keeps shouting that server merges are needed, as long as everyone merges onto their server.

-- Kevin

 

If you play on a less populated server you are by the very definition of the word, a minority.

 

If you also say that because you personally prefer the less populated server, all new players who accidentally get on dead servers should be ignored, and all players unable to transfer should be ignored, then you're also by definition being vocal about your opinions.

 

So... who's the vocal minority again? The... large population? Or the one that's silently quitting?

 

Edited June 8, 2017 by EzioMessi

[casirabit]

If you play on a less populated server you are by the very definition of the word, a minority.

 

If you also say that because you personally prefer the less populated server, all new players who accidentally get on dead servers should be ignored, and all players unable to transfer should be ignored, then you're also by definition being vocal about your opinions.

 

So... who's the vocal minority again? The... large population? Or the one that's silently quitting?

 

 

I think it would depend on the server actually. Some of the people who want mergers want all servers merged into one. No thank you. Ebon Hawk does not need to be merged into Harbinger. While pvp servers have a problem and those need to look at not every server is like that but some posters do not see that or they are sticking fingers in their ears saying I don't hear you.

[HuaRya]

I assure you: most mmo players want to play on busy servers. Just about every game company in the industry knows this and has mega or x-server or botb. Go back and read BW posts from Eric or BW devs before the first merges or before f2p. BW knows full well that busy servers are good and dead ones are bad,.

 

Agreed. It seem like common sense. People like to go to parties with people in them. If walking past a row of restaurants you go past 5 that are empty and then one that is practically packed. People have tried to pick apart Fleet as an indicator of population but it is and probably always will be the hub for it has things that don't exist in other places that you have to pick up on a regular basis. Even if you only spend 30 seconds there.

 

Speaking of other games, Wildstar realized too late they needed a mega server.......

[casirabit]

Agreed. It seem like common sense. People like to go to parties with people in them. If walking past a row of restaurants you go past 5 that are empty and then one that is practically packed. People have tried to pick apart Fleet as an indicator of population but it is and probably always will be the hub for it has things that don't exist in other places that you have to pick up on a regular basis. Even if you only spend 30 seconds there.

 

Speaking of other games, Wildstar realized too late they needed a mega server.......

 

Sorry, your analogy is wrong. If I am going to restaurant I will choose the one with the less people. (1) Faster service (2) Better service as they are not jumping all over the place

[DWho]

I think 6 months would be too long. They should be able to tell within 6 weeks of finishing the moves. So realistically we would be looking at 12weeks from the start of them opening up free transfers till they can finish evaluating if it had enough of an impact.

If it works, then great, we dodge a bullet till this time next year when they should revisit game population again.

If it doesn't work and we wait 6 months and it just keeps getting worse, there will be no game in January, at least no playable group content for a majority of players left.

My idea is a bandaid at best to stem the the game bleeding out. It's something they can implement relatively easy if they have the will power to take a leap of faith. But the idea will not completely solve the issue because as others have pointed out, there is also a perception issue.

The easiest and cheapest solutions are usually the best path to start with because there is less risk and they can say it was a test. I can't understand why they always have to do things in such a complicated and convoluted manner that must take more time and resources to implement and it's still not right.

If they can slow down the bleed there is more time to go through all the problems and concerns and form a working solution, wether that is merged servers or not. At least they'll have time to "dot" the i's and cross the t's.

 

Fair enough. That would get us through the summer and allow the populations to build back up in the fall before making the decision. Once the decision was made to merge servers, I'd expect another couple of months for the systems to be in place to do the mergers, so I see your point about not waiting on the decision, since right now it doesn't appear there is anything in progress on server merges (not really like flipping a switch so I would expect it would take some time). I would still like to see a test of those systems before merging larger servers like JC and Shadowlands (assuming their populations don't drastically plummet - which I don't expect but could happen).

[Eshvara]

Sorry, your analogy is wrong. If I am going to restaurant I will choose the one with the less people. (1) Faster service (2) Better service as they are not jumping all over the place

 

I agree, why would anyone go to a busy restaurant! I don't agree with servers however. I like a big server with a lot of people. It has it's downsides too however.

[kodrac]

I recently thought about transferring to EH, but then I sat down and did some math. I have the 90cc but I have more then one character. I'll either need to purchase CCs or wait 3 months for my sub allotment to cover it. Add to that I will:

 

• lose some names. Not all, but a few. i'm clever enough I can come up with new names, but it's still a hassle I'd rather not deal with considering the rest of the list.
  
• Repurchase my strongholds. I didn't use CC on all of them so I'd spend credits doing this.
  
• Redecorate. O Lord ain't nobody got time fo dat. Furniture is part of your legacy no? If not I'll direct you to the furniture thread.
  
• lose some of my outfit slots. More credits down the drain. Not all since ones bought with CC are part of legacy. If incorrect I'll have to repurchase all of them.
  
• Repopulate the outfits. Luckily I keep the pieces in my bank so I don't think I'll lose any of them, but - more credits spent on the stamping and on any dyes I'd have to hunt down.
  

Basically it comes down to a giant pain in the *** time and credit sink. I'd have a new more populated server but I'd be so broke I couldn't do much of anything but grind credits afterwards. Something I'm so tired of doing already that my eyes start bleeding just seeing the words typed out. It's just not worth the hassle. And that's just for me. Multiply that by however many people it would affect and add their guild too.

 

Until the personal (and guild) assets are part of the transfer service I don't believe they'll be part of the merge process either. Fix that stuff first, then let's talk. Or, even better, fix the game's other problems *cough* gear grind *cough* stuff to do aka content *cough* and all this becomes less of an issue.

Edited June 8, 2017 by kodrac

[DWho]

I assure you: most mmo players want to play on busy servers. Just about every game company in the industry knows this and has mega or x-server or both. Go back and read BW posts from Eric or BW devs before the first merges or before f2p. BW knows full well that busy servers are good and dead ones are bad.

 

That would be true if this game was a full fledged MMO. From the start its focus was on the RPG part of MMORPG. Still the majority of the game is RPG. There are MMO elements that a lot of people play but it is still at its core an online RPG (otherwise why would they have spent all that money on voice acting and cinematics).

[EzioMessi]

I think it would depend on the server actually. Some of the people who want mergers want all servers merged into one. No thank you. Ebon Hawk does not need to be merged into Harbinger. While pvp servers have a problem and those need to look at not every server is like that but some posters do not see that or they are sticking fingers in their ears saying I don't hear you.

 

Oh no, merging all servers is a terrible idea. All it'd achieve is make the game a cesspool of spam, drive away RPers and drive away players who have to deal with the crappy lag (APAC players in particular will no longer be able to play anything that's ping sensitive).

 

I think the PvP servers just need to die, honestly. Every time a new PvPer comes to the game, they'll enter a PvP server, wonder why it's so dead, and leave. This happened to me as a returning player; I used to play on Jung Ma back when it had a decent population. Left the game for a year. Returned to (I'm not kidding) ONE player on fleet (me). At "peak" time there were 20 players on fleet. And before people say "they weren't on fleet they were out playing the game!" every planet in the game (KotFE or pre-KotFE), every group instance, evertything was empty. It was terrible. I would have left the game but just read up online about the 90CC transfers and immediately realized what had happened.

 

Merge PvP servers into their nearest high pop PvE server. Merge JC and Shadowlands maybe. For the love of god let the RPers be on their own server, and spend the money it takes to have a moderator there to deal with the filth who have fun by harassing other players. And do all this without nuking people's irl money and in-game effort during the mergers.

 

If they don't do ALL of the above, they will continue bleeding subs at the rate they have been so far, and even if it's a very slow rate, not bleeding subs is still the better option.

[DWho]

 

Merge PvP servers into their nearest high pop PvE server. Merge JC and Shadowlands maybe. For the love of god let the RPers be on their own server, and spend the money it takes to have a moderator there to deal with the filth who have fun by harassing other players. And do all this without nuking people's irl money and in-game effort during the mergers..

 

100% support this

[EzioMessi]

That would be true if this game was a full fledged MMO. From the start its focus was on the RPG part of MMORPG. Still the majority of the game is RPG. There are MMO elements that a lot of people play but it is still at its core an online RPG (otherwise why would they have spent all that money on voice acting and cinematics).

 

Yes, the focus during vanilla was the RPG element, and they lost more than half their subscribers in the first three months.

 

They brought some focus back to group content and the game stayed relatively healthy through RotHC and SoR, despite several slips and misses along the way.

 

They tried to focus on story with KotFE. They temporarily hit their highest sub numbers since 3 years before, their numbers finally matched the point where they had dropped to at the 3 months after launch point. Then the numbers promptly dropped within a couple of months, between chapter delays, bad sub rewards, and literally nothing through the entirety of KotFE and KotET could salvage them.

 

It's pretty clear at this point that salvaging the game by catering to story and solo players is not a profitable strategy. Every attempt they've made at that causes them to lose more and more players. Pray they don't make any more attempts, and start focusing on the MMO part alongside the story part.

[AscendingSky]

Oh no, merging all servers is a terrible idea. All it'd achieve is make the game a cesspool of spam, drive away RPers and drive away players who have to deal with the crappy lag (APAC players in particular will no longer be able to play anything that's ping sensitive).

 

I think the PvP servers just need to die, honestly. Every time a new PvPer comes to the game, they'll enter a PvP server, wonder why it's so dead, and leave. This happened to me as a returning player; I used to play on Jung Ma back when it had a decent population. Left the game for a year. Returned to (I'm not kidding) ONE player on fleet (me). At "peak" time there were 20 players on fleet. And before people say "they weren't on fleet they were out playing the game!" every planet in the game (KotFE or pre-KotFE), every group instance, evertything was empty. It was terrible. I would have left the game but just read up online about the 90CC transfers and immediately realized what had happened.

 

Merge PvP servers into their nearest high pop PvE server. Merge JC and Shadowlands maybe. For the love of god let the RPers be on their own server, and spend the money it takes to have a moderator there to deal with the filth who have fun by harassing other players. And do all this without nuking people's irl money and in-game effort during the mergers.

 

If they don't do ALL of the above, they will continue bleeding subs at the rate they have been so far, and even if it's a very slow rate, not bleeding subs is still the better option.

 

I've been very much against the idea of server mergers on this thread (at least until the time EAWare can 100% absolutely no exceptions guarantee the intact transfer of character and guild assets), and even I agree that something needs to be done about the old PvP servers. I never played on Jung Ma, for example, but I've talked to a lot of RP refugees from Jung Ma, and I've heard how dead that server is--to the extent that entire RP guilds voluntarily gave up everything they had to move wholesale to a server (Ebon Hawk, in this case) with a bigger and better RP community. I hate that they felt they had to do that, and I definitely think they deserve help and recompense as a result.

 

At the very least, EAWare needs to mark those servers as Very Low population so any new players don't roll on there, think the whole game is completely dead, and walk away. I think it would be better if new accounts were simply barred from rolling toons on those servers period, simply because of how poor an experience they may receive if they pick the wrong server to start off on. I'd also like to see any remaining players and guilds still on Jung Ma and other old PvP servers get personal CS attention and assistance in moving over guilds and guild assets... given the number of players on those servers are so low compared to all the rest of the active servers, I'd think this would be a more manageable task by far than trying to merge more populated servers together.

 

That all being said, I STILL believe cross-server queues are the far better long-term solution for our woes. Helping ease the transition for the players on the truly dead servers (not just 'all servers not named Harbinger') and marking those servers as very low population would be the immediate short-term solution that could be implemented without overcoming the technical hurdles that allegedly exist when it comes to this engine and cross-server queuing.

Edited June 8, 2017 by AscendingSky

[Cartiza]

What a potential server merge means to me:

• Potential loss of names
  
• Potential loss of Guilds
  
• Potential loss of Unlocks.
  
• Potential loss of Sanity due to more ignorance with open world mission objectives.
  
• Potential loss of Community.
  

What a potential server merge doesn't mean to me:

• Any chance whatsoever that I'll touch the abomination called GroupFinder.
  
• Any chance whatsoever that I'll queue for pvp.
  
• Anything positive in the "Why should I keep paying for this" balance sheet.
  

From a purely selfish and personal perspective, server merges are nothing but potential loss and deterrent to continued subscription. But I'm a stubborn arse, YMMV.

 

couldn't agree more.. I do not want to be on a crowded server where I cannot get anything done. I don't pay a monthly fee to stand around or fight to something only to have it taken out from under me. I already lost names due to the other merges and lost many others things as well. Non raiders and Non pvpers put in just a much time into the game believe it or not. I SHOULD NOT BE FORCED to play on a crowded server that I did not chose to play on when I picked my server. New players who are not even playing the game is a lame excuse to merge servers The people playing now and who have played for years are the ones that matter. New players can do there homework and pick the server pop they want.

 

I won't be the only one unsubbing if I am forced to lose everything again or stand around and wait because there are to many people to get anything done.