Petition: Retroactive For Dark Vs Light Event For Veteran Players and...

[peter_plankskull]

I have played since launch, since early release, in fact.

 

I am not pissed about this event.

 

I am reasonable and mature enough to recognize that I WAS rewarded when I got a character to level 50, to level 60, etc. The rewards were the the rewards in place AT THAT TIME. I do NOT expect to receive all FUTURE rewards RETROACTIVELY for something I did IN THE PAST.

 

When you receive a raise at work, do you go to your boss and demand to receive that raise RETROACTIVELY for the past umpteen years? If you do, let me know how that works out for you. If you do not, then why would you expect new rewards to be retroactively applied to PAST efforts and achievements in this game?

 

Entertainment in a video game does not equal real life, I realize others have made that comparison but it is under different circumstances and their fore irrelevant either way. It's not being more "mature" or "reasonable," its called being more accepting of the event at hand, that by itself doesn't automatically mean those two statements above are true. Half the time you simply dismiss any and all complaints anyway by either "throwing a temper tantrum" or being a "whiner," and I don't really call that being mature. I believe a mature person takes both side of the argument at hand without completely dismissing them, its okay to take sides and such and put down your reasoning for believing one side, but most of the time you utterly just immediately resort to saying "temper tantrum" for anyone with a negative view of this game. I realize sometimes its justified if they have a meltdown and just insult the devs left and right, but all to often you simply use that statement.

[Ratajack]

Entertainment in a video game does not equal real life, I realize others have made that comparison but it is under different circumstances and their fore irrelevant either way. It's not being more "mature" or "reasonable," its called being more accepting of the event at hand, that by itself doesn't automatically mean those two statements above are true. Half the time you simply dismiss any and all complaints anyway by either "throwing a temper tantrum" or being a "whiner," and I don't really call that being mature. I believe a mature person takes both side of the argument at hand without completely dismissing them, its okay to take sides and such and put down your reasoning for believing one side, but most of the time you utterly just immediately resort to saying "temper tantrum" for anyone with a negative view of this game. I realize sometimes its justified if they have a meltdown and just insult the devs left and right, but all to often you simply use that statement.

 

Where in my post did I even mention the words "temper tantrum"?

 

I simply noted that I was reasonable and mature enough NOT to expect to be rewarded in the PRESENT or FUTURE for something I did in the PAST, simply because the rewards have changed. I recognize that if I want the new rewards, I must do that task again.

 

 

The principles in game or in life are the same.

 

You can try to justify "aversion to effort" or entitled attitudes by saying "it's a game", but that does not change the truth.

[DaggerDX]

Signed!

[peter_plankskull]

Where in my post did I even mention the words "temper tantrum"?

 

I simply noted that I was reasonable and mature enough NOT to expect to be rewarded in the PRESENT or FUTURE for something I did in the PAST, simply because the rewards have changed. I recognize that if I want the new rewards, I must do that task again.

 

 

The principles in game or in life are the same.

 

You can try to justify "aversion to effort" or entitled attitudes by saying "it's a game", but that does not change the truth.

 

I forgot... another word you tend to throw around "entitled" and yes.... the "its just for entertainment purposes" does fly because you don't play video games to move on in life compared to a actual job... or... at least most people.

 

I think were arguing about different things anyway, I would like these rewards to be retroactive, but I would prefer for them instead to be able to completed on our main toons. I try to see things from both sides, but I really can't see how people would defend repeating the same content all for shinies with nothing changed at all, not in terms of difficulty, story, or anything. I know I would quit battlefield 4 or any other game in a heartbeat knowing I had to start all over on a new account to receive rewards for doing the same thing.

[Ratajack]

I forgot... another word you tend to throw around "entitled" and yes.... the "its just for entertainment purposes" does fly because you don't play video games to move on in life compared to a actual job... or... at least most people.

 

People can claim that "it's just for entertainment purposes" if that makes them feel better about themselves and their aversion to the effort required to actually EARN those NEW rewards, or about their entitled attitude, as if they should simply have everything handed to them in the present and future because they did something at some point in the PAST.

 

IMO, that is all this boils down to-- either an aversion to the effort required to EARN those NEW rewards or a false sense of entitlement that having done something in the past entitles the player to receive any and all NEW rewards without having to earn those new rewards.

 

I think were arguing about different things anyway, I would like these rewards to be retroactive, but I would prefer for them instead to be able to completed on our main toons. I try to see things from both sides, but I really can't see how people would defend repeating the same content all for shinies with nothing changed at all, not in terms of difficulty, story, or anything. I know I would quit battlefield 4 or any other game in a heartbeat knowing I had to start all over on a new account to receive rewards for doing the same thing.

 

We're talking about the same thing.

 

Some people are too averse to the effort required to earn those new rewards and some people feel that simply because they did something in the past, they are entitled to all future rewards for having done it in the past.

 

Some people are reasonable and mature people to recognize that having done something in the past does NOT entitle us to receive any NEW rewards for that task. If we want those new rewards, we must do what is necessary to earn them NOW, even if that means doing something we have already done in the PAST.

[Samurai_Dom]

/Signed

 

I can't do 4 years of work in 4 months.

 

I get why they are doing this; it's harder to get new players than to keep existing, but this is going too far to alienate your existing user base.

[MeNaCe-NZ]

/Signed

 

I can't do 4 years of work in 4 months.

 

I get why they are doing this; it's harder to get new players than to keep existing, but this is going too far to alienate your existing user base.

 

Yet overall player numbers are up ( per torstatus ) since this event started so overall it's a success thus far.

[Ratajack]

/Signed

 

I can't do 4 years of work in 4 months.

 

I get why they are doing this; it's harder to get new players than to keep existing, but this is going too far to alienate your existing user base.

 

But it's ok to expect new players to do that "4 years of work in 4 months" without all the advantages that veteran players have, with legacy boosts, etc?

[Transairion]

Chipping in despite being unsubbed for months (don't ask me why I can still post with 0 days remaining...), but yeah this event does nothing for me since I've literally done the Legendary requirements already (sans the impossible "Do the Chapter that isn't released yet"). I went through it all, checked, I've done a LOT in SWTOR so if it was retroactive it'd be all marked off.

 

I've got maybe 20+ characters and been at character cap (IE can only get more via unlocks) forever, I'm not doing it all again... let alone paying a sub to do it all again, or paying for more character slots. It's a little worrying some people are eating it up, to be honest... only new players really benefit, and they shouldn't be being encouraged to speedrun the game either.

 

In context a few months isn't that long at all, if you wanted it to be a lifetime thing for the game sure but... they added a LOT of achievements that are going to be impossible by next year because the event will be gone. And it really doesn't encourage any further faith in the game, if this was their much built up "new event": do it all again, or bum about on Fleet.

 

 

I'm not against people enjoying it, but an event that if retroactive can be pre-finished isn't a good event. It's just playing the game. And since that's all it is, and I've already done Legendary, I just won't bother playing since I won't get credit anyway. Certainly will have to do better to get me to resub, not tell me to enjoy the grind a few more times.

Edited July 11, 2016 by Transairion

[aceavenger]

Petition: Retroactive For Dark Vs Light Event For Veteran Players and players who have already done part of the achievements and allow people who fall short of legendary player to get it with currently active characters.

 

Also, make items inside the DarkvLight packs Bind on-equip not bind on-pickup as they are Cartel Market items.

 

It's fair to all. Sign below.

 

Side note: Surprised this petition hasn't been started.

 

Long time player here. Been here since beta, and I say NO

[vadess]

Signed.

 

This event is an insult to the veteran players, a cheap marketing strategy thats purely offensive to those of us who were faithfully playing this game and subscribing for the last 5 years. I have 18 Lvl65 characters and I'm not making more. In fact, odds are I will unsubscribe after this nonsense.

 

 

 

 

If you played this game since launch, you'd be pissed about this just as much as all the veterans are.

 

Actually, I played this since the beginning too, and I am not insulted by the event. Would appreciate it if you DID NOT SPEAK FOR ALL VETERAN PLAYERS!

 

The only reason I signed this petition was because I wanted to get rewards on new characters a week or so prior to its announcement. It had nothing to do with disgust, or being insulted. So no, I am not pissed about it and I am a veteran player.

[Jamtas]

As written I can't sign this. I'm a long time vet (obligatory beta/CE/never lapsed comment) but I understand the need to do these things during the event. However, what I would like to see happen:

 

1) since event requires at least 2 spots to earn/keep all rewards, additional 2 slots granted free of charge (not this bogus 25% off buying slots)

2) existing characters can participate in activities that do not require leveling (FPS, World Bosses, Operations, etc)

 

Any in game event should not require subscribers the possibility of having to pay extra to participate. It should also not exclude existing characters.

Edited July 11, 2016 by Jamtas

[Transcendent]

Petition: Retroactive For Dark Vs Light Event For Veteran Players and players who have already done part of the achievements and allow people who fall short of legendary player to get it with currently active characters.

 

Not signed. Work for the rewards.

 

Also, make items inside the DarkvLight packs Bind on-equip not bind on-pickup as they are Cartel Market items.

 

Not signed, make them Bind to Legacy so you can complete sets, seeing as BioWare decided to not provide the full armour set boxes and went with part armour sets (which is another issue with the rewards).

[KnightTyler]

I've been a subscriber since launch, purchased Collector's Edition, and have never stopped subscribing to this game. I've got all 16 Advanced Classes and they are all lvl 55 or greater. I've remained a subscriber all this time to support the game because I have a passion for the Star Wars franchise. I used to think of Bioware as a great game development company and I didn't mind supporting them because I had faith in their ability to make this game awe-inspiring. I've waited and waited through the good times and the bad, but it seems like we are at a point where they are only building this "road" an inch at a time instead of a mile like it should be.

 

The Star Wars IP should have all the funding and backing it needs to make this game extraordinarily amazing. The Star Wars name alone ensures success as long as people are happy with the content provided to us. They shouldn't have to focus on 1 part of the game at a time. They should have all the manpower available to have different teams working on different types of content. There should be a PvP team, PvE team, Galactic Starfighter team, etc... None of these areas of interest in the game should be lacking just to make one type of content. PvP shouldn't suffer because of story. Story shouldn't suffer because of PvE. I hate to see this game not be everything it could have been/can be if only they would devote the resources to making it better.

 

Quite frankly, I've just finally lost interest. It seems like this game just doesn't have the backing it should have. I'm still subscribed but I've found myself playing other games such as WoW, LOTRO, Rift, Riders of Icarus, and more. I'm just looking for something with more involvement you know? Look at WoW. I had never played it before this year and a buddy of mine kept recommending for me to try it and I finally did. It has its flaws but I feel like the community is much more involved. Developers REGULARLY comment and discuss with the community on their forums. I feel like the developers actually care about making the game better so they get right amongst the players to gather feedback and discuss it with us.

 

Here.. on the other hand... We get poor communication. Soon™. We have heard and keep hearing for years: "We'll work on communicating more clearly" but it just never happens. They act like them talking to us is a privilege that we should be grateful for. It is NOT. We, the players, are what puts "food on their table" so to speak. Hiding behind the fact that we had some crazypsycholunatic go so far as to threaten one of the dev's family shouldn't be reason for them to punish the rest of us. Hell I don't really ever remember a point in time where we truly ever had great communication with the developers so its not like that particular situation is what made them stop talking to us. What that psycho did was despicable but they should understand that 1 bad apple does not represent the rest of this community.

 

I understand this game is a business, but to make money a business has to provide a service or product that people enjoy. Don't get me wrong, I have enjoyed the KOTFE story. Bioware has always been good at storytelling but I feel somewhere along the way Bioware lost what it means to make a game feel fun and keep players wanting to play their game. Where are new operations? Flashpoints? PvP maps and game modes? Guild ship vs Guild ship combat similar to Battlefront 2 space combat? Swoop Racing? Pazaak? Light Side/Dark Side skill trees? ETC... I mean there is so much potential and stuff they could do with this game but they just don't. Don't let "engine limitations" stop you. Fix those limitations. If man made it then man can fix it. We need to see some involvement and effort on your part Bioware.

 

Look at Class Development... we should have a dedicated Bioware developer for each and every class that can ensure ALL voices are heard. This one sided crap is ridiculous. Class balancing should be happening constantly! Not just at the end of a PvP season to avoid hurting little Johnny's rating. Let little Johnny adapt to playing the class the way it is meant to be played during the season instead of letting him play the class broken until the season is over. If the class isn't playing right why let people get used to playing it the wrong way? All that does is hurt everyone, both PvE and PvP.

 

I love the way Blizzard is doing class balance for Legion. They are starting by looking at the core theme/fantasy of each specialization, then implementing things that fit the theme/fantasy of each specialization, all the while discussing it all with the players of each specialization who have a passion for the respective specializations that they play. Man if Bioware did something like this I wouldn't know what to think. Class Balancing is an ongoing process that needs to be done at all times. Discuss changes with the community, gather feedback, discuss feedback, put changes on PTS, gather more feedback, make appropriate changes from feedback, release changes on live, rinse, repeat... It doesn't have to be this mystery world where everything remains hidden from us. Don't be scared of making changes! Players can adapt quickly and they will enjoy the classes they play even more if you use feedback that they provide.

 

Sadly, this post will fall on deaf ears. I've stuck it out a long time but if we don't start getting more content and involvement within this community, I will have to finally end my subscription and say goodbye.

 

This event, while great for newcomers, is simply an insult to the veterans of this game who have long supported it and have helped keep it afloat. I've tried to be a 'completionist' within this game but I haven't even bothered to participate in this event because I am just wore out from doing the same content over and over. Its like everything I've done over the years doesn't matter.

 

So, in conclusion... Eric Musco, if you or anyone on the team does so happen to read this, it is your job as Community Manager to relay the opinions of the players back to the game's developers. I would ask Eric, if you have any passion about making this game greater to respectfully forward our concerns to the appropriate persons. If you have to show these forums to someone higher up in Bioware/EA/Disney or whoever it may be, do whatever you have to do to get this game whatever it needs to become greater. If you need funding, permission, more developers, or whatever resources you need to make this game great then Eric I implore you to seek the ones who can give you the resources and show them these forums. They need to see how the playerbase feels. If the resources are put into making this game better I am positive that a profit will be turned to cover all expenses +plus. Invest in the game so that more players will come back to the game, new players will sign up, and veterans players such as myself will continue to spend more money.

 

Don't just be the MMO that "survives" using the Star Wars name as a crutch. Instead, THRIVE being known as "THE BEST MMO." DON'T JUST SURVIVE, THRIVE!

 

Below I have listed some recommendations that will hopefully be considered so that we can get this community and game back on track. I'm sure there are tons of other ideas from other people. I don't want to see this game die.

 

 

• Assign a dedicated Developer/Bioware Representative for each advanced class to introduce themselves on the forums. Maybe tell us why they enjoy the class, tell us a bit about themselves, etc... These developers will have 1 extra task alongside their development job. They will be responsible for making sure each class' voice is being heard. They will frequent the respective forum thread for the class they oversee as to help foster discussion and gather/provide feedback regarding their respective class. These developers will also create a new Sticky Thread under their respective class sub-forum which outlies the details about the design, theme/fantasy, and mechanics of their respective class and each discipline. This Sticky Thread will help give players insight into the design intentions of each class so that we can offer better and more appropriate feedback/suggestions regarding our classes.
   
   
  
• Eric, your role as the Community Manager should be to make sure that communication is fostered between the community and developers. Make sure that the developers are communicating. Players will get involved, we just need an effort on your parts. You should talk about general content Eric, maybe new systems, things being worked on, etc... Talk about events both in-game and out of game, Guild Conquests, stream, talk about new content, I mean there is tons of stuff you can talk about.
   
   
  
• Assign someone to talk about PvE content, i.e. Operations, Flashpoints, Story (could have its own representative), etc...
   
   
  
• Assign someone to talk about PvP content, i.e. New Maps, New Game Modes, New Seasons, World PvP, etc...
   
   
  
• Assign someone to talk about Galactic Starfighter content. This could additionally branch out to Guild Ship vs Guild Ship battles and any other future content that could revolve around GSF. New Maps, new modes, etc..

[RTCBrad]

I agree up to the point of having retroactive achieves, I don't however agree that the gear should be BoE, it should stay BoP.

[CrutchCricket]

Yeah the management of this event is atrocious, even if the idea is not fundementally flawed. And the focus on "you create character nao!" is more than a tad shady. I agree with this petition and strongly recommend they reconsider some form of retroactivity. Having vets insta-complete everything based on past achievements may not be the best thing, but there is zero reason why low level characters created before the start date can't participate, or even max level characters who haven't completed some of the higher tier achievements.

 

For example I've pretty much ignored crafting, have never done any OPs apart from DF/DP because Oricon forced me and never PVP'd. I have 9 65s and a few 55s. Since returing I've ran 4 FPs, 3 tacticals and an HM on my original operative simply because it's fun. Why can I not get credit for that? If/when I do run this event I'll just recreate her, and my other characters. Why are you making this needlessly obtuse Bioware?

 

Characters who are eligible to complete the objectives (i.e haven't yet completed them) should absolutely be able to, regardless of creation date. As for the packs, I get why the items are BoP, but not having the boxes themselves BoL is beyond headdesk.

[josephxp]

Well im a veteran player and im now 41% completed through the event, have 3 more lv 50 classes to make, done with the crew skills, just have to finish the WB's ops, and HM flash points up and wait for the next bounty week and rakghoul event to come along. (And chapter 16 which comes out later this month)

 

So for all the other veterans you could have this much done or more if you were not complaining about having achievements retroactive and hoping you will get them (Which may not happen) and be almost done with this event aside from waiting on Chapter 16 to come out and the events.

 

I don't mind the achievements not being retroactive i just get them done

[TheSeventhJedi]

Well im a veteran player and im now 41% completed through the event, have 3 more lv 50 classes to make, done with the crew skills, just have to finish the WB's ops, and HM flash points up and wait for the next bounty week and rakghoul event to come along. (And chapter 16 which comes out later this month)

 

So for all the other veterans you could have this much done or more if you were not complaining about having achievements retroactive and hoping you will get them (Which may not happen) and be almost done with this event aside from waiting on Chapter 16 to come out and the events.

 

I don't mind the achievements not being retroactive i just get them done

 

I have these pesky things like a job, wife, kids, and most inconveniently, a life, that prevent me from getting as much done as you say you have. I have maybe an hour a day for video games, and I don't always spend it on SWTOR.

[Quraswren]

I'd sign this.

 

I'm not a fan of a 5 year celebration event that basically says everything I've done in the last 5 years means nothing in the actual celebration.

 

Sorry no. Thats about as anticlimactic of a celebration as you can get and comes across as second grade busy work while the teacher sneaks out for a smoke.

 

REDO the last 5 years celebration because nostalgia.

[josephxp]

I have these pesky things like a job, wife, kids, and most inconveniently, a life, that prevent me from getting as much done as you say you have. I have maybe an hour a day for video games, and I don't always spend it on SWTOR.

 

I have a job, college, a girlfriend, and a life i only get 2-3 hours a day usually so im in a similar boat.

[CrutchCricket]

I have a job, college, a girlfriend, and a life i only get 2-3 hours a day usually so im in a similar boat.

Yet you're wasting them here when you could be getting DvL achievements!

[kapitanmichal]

Signed!

[Kreyd]

signed

[Rob_Knight]

Petition: Retroactive For Dark Vs Light Event For Veteran Players and players who have already done part of the achievements and allow people who fall short of legendary player to get it with currently active characters.

 

Also, make items inside the DarkvLight packs Bind on-equip not bind on-pickup as they are Cartel Market items.

 

It's fair to all. Sign below.

 

Side note: Surprised this petition hasn't been started.

 

They may or may not have started a petition already but there have already been threads and many, many complaints about it. HOWEVER, they have already answered you:

[We have worked hard in the past year to try to offer rewards to veteran players and subscribers such as Legendary Status, monthly sub rewards, etc. This event is meant to be something different from that. As we are heading into our 5-year anniversary we really wanted to celebrate and offer new rewards to players for simply creating a new character and playing through the game. That is the overall focus of this event. We have no plans at this time to make rewards retroactive]

 

whether or not i agree with it, there is nothing wrong with trying to get players, even old players like my self to play the game from start to finish..... again. That is how they chose to CELEBRATE the game. BUT it is still a poorly implemented and aspects of it were neglected, such as those who already have MAXED server slots.

 

What they could have done was provided the end result rewards to those who did complete the achievements already such as the mounts, titles, armors, which would have been waaaaaaaay more than we have received free for previous years rewards in my opinions..... anyone remember the fireworks?. BUT they packs and the companions should be left for those that decide to "participate" in the "event" in order to keep the event relevant.

 

And to the guy who said 130 hours for veteran.... done with all that can be done at this time . True veterans make quick work of this. Also a lot of long nights lol and friend to do stuff with.

 

i appreciate you try to get things changed and some things do need to be changed (pack bind of legacy) but not everything needs to be changed. i can recognize the event for the BS and intended purpose, and accept.

 

PS > your still playing right? Are you participating in the event? must not be to mad. If they don't change are you going to quit or just say you' ll quit like all the other all talk people?

[JourrnoRush]

I have these pesky things like a job, wife, kids, and most inconveniently, a life, that prevent me from getting as much done as you say you have. I have maybe an hour a day for video games, and I don't always spend it on SWTOR.

 

Why do people who have these things use them as excuses? So what you are saying, is that it should be retroactive not because it is the right thing to do, but because YOU have kids, wife, etc.

 

I have a girlfriend, job, school, no kids. I obviously have more time than you, but I wouldn't expect BW to make it easier because there are people who made life decisions that impact their time. I choose to do other things besides SWTOR and I'm still able to knock out most of the achievements in the few hours I have every other day.

 

Some of you are just making any excuse to not redo the content

Edited July 11, 2016 by JourrnoRush